Debates of 25 Nov 2015

MR FIRST DEPUTY SPEAKER
Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:35 p.m.
Hon Members, we have had a meeting with the Leadership and a few issues had been trashed out. We would want to get the Hon Deputy Minister for Finance to make
Mr Cassiel Ato Baah Forson 12:35 p.m.
Thank you Mr Speaker.
I rise to bring to the attention of the House, that on the day that the Hon Minister for Finance read the Budget Statement on the 13th November, 2015, he did indeed, read the verbatim version of the budget, which we normally call Budget “speech” and laid the Budget Statement before the House.
Mr Speaker, the Budget Statement that he laid was printed from the computer and we also printed and distributed twenty copies. After that, we sent the soft copy to the printers for them to print a good number of that to be distributed to Hon Members, and a number to be distributed to other stakeholders.
Mr Speaker, we noticed after the printers had done their work, that they have indeed, made some mistakes in arranging the pages. Mr Speaker, what we did was to withdraw that immediately and then ensure that they actually printed what the Hon Minister for Finance laid before Parliament.
Mr Speaker, what the Hon Minister for Finance laid before the House has not changed. What we have redistributed is what the Hon Minister for Finance laid before this House.
I would wish to bring to your attention that there is no error, bearing in mind that what the Hon Minister for Finance laid was the same document that we have distributed to the House.
Thank you.
rose
Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:35 p.m.
Yes, Hon Member?
Dr A. A. Osei 12:35 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I have no reason to disbelieve the Hon Deputy Minister.
Today, this House has adopted the official proceedings of what the Hon Minister was to have presented. This is it. So, if there is an error in there --
Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:35 p.m.
No! The error is not in there -- If you listened to what he said --
Just hold your breath.
If you listened to what he said, what was laid by the Hon Minister has been captured by the Hansard. He gave a summary, if you would remember. That one was laid before the House.
In the course of printing what was laid, some errors were made in the printing, so, they made the correction. That is why some Hon Members have two versions of it. It is to make Hon Members aware.
Dr A. A. Osei 12:35 p.m.
Mr Speaker, it would be good if the Hon Deputy Minister told us which pages. Otherwise, it means we would have to read all the old ones.
The reason I am saying this is that, as you would recall -- I pointed this out to the other Deputy Minister. On the budget on education for example, the amount given in the text does not correspond to what is in the Appendix and the reason is obvious; the Ghana Education Trust Fund (GETFund) amount was left out.
So, if someone reads the text and he or she is not inclined to go to the Appendix, he or she would think the budget allocation to education is GH¢6.5 billion, when it is actually GH¢7.5 billion. That
rose
Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:35 p.m.
Hon Member, are you up on a point of order against him? He is on the floor and you also rose up. So, I did not know what to do. I thought the Hon Deputy Minister would listen and then if you have any comments --
Yes, Hon Deputy Minister?
Mr Forson 12:35 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I rise to confirm that what the Hon Minister for Finance laid before the House is not different from the new copies that we distributed.
Mr Speaker, the Hon Ranking Member for Finance raised the issue of the education sector. Mr Speaker, if you read the budget carefully, the narrative talks about the Ministry of Education but the Appendix that the Hon Member is making reference to, Appendix 205, talks about the sector.
That is why, Mr Speaker, you would notice that, the Ministry of Education's allocation of GH¢6.5 billion is different from what would go to GETFund. The GETFund is different from the Ministry of Education.
So, Mr Speaker, under that Appendix, on page 205, the number you see under “Other Government Obligation” is going to GETFund and not the Ministry. So, what we would do is to add the Ministry of Education plus other Government obligation and that would give us the total amount going to the sector. That should not necessarily mean that the total amount there is going to the Ministry of Education.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.
Yes, Hon Member?
Dr A. A. Osei 1:50 p.m.
Mr Speaker, for these simple matters, we have to be careful.
If you read from the table and you want to find out the total disbursements to the Ministry of Education, as the Hon Deputy Minister referred to, you would see GH¢7.5 billion, not GH¢6.5 billion -- [Interruption.] I know how it is added up.
If you go across the line, which talks about social sector, total amount going to the Ministry of Education, it will show GH¢7.5 billion.
But when you read the text, it says Ministry of Education is 6.5 per cent. I know the difference but you cannot say that because it is going to GETFund, therefore -- There is no footnote here. So, an untutored person would look at 6.5 and 7.5 and that is not proper.
Mr James K. Avedzi — rose --
Mr First Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.
Chairman of the Committee, I will not want us to drag this matter too far.
Can we hear you?
Mr Avedzi 1:50 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I think the issue here is that, we are confusing both the Ministry of Education and the education sector. They are two different things. If you look at page -- [Interruption] -- Wait and let me finish.

Mr Speaker, if you look at page 205, the allocation for Ministry of Education, which is an MDA -- [Interruption]-- If you look at the column for the Ministry of Education, the total is 6.5 and that is the MDAs total -- Look at the heading. Then we add other Government Obligations to get the grand total for the education sector. So, he should pick it from there; do not confuse the two. -- [Interruption.]

Mr Speaker, there is no figure of 7.54 for the Ministry of Education at page 204 -- There is nothing like that.
Dr A. A. Osei 1:50 p.m.
Mr Speaker, it is here in the Official Report.
Mr Avedzi 1:50 p.m.
Mr Speaker, let me take you through page 204 that he mentioned.
Dr A. A. Osei 1:50 p.m.
Mr Speaker, let him read that number; do not just take us through; read the number.
Mr Avedzi 1:50 p.m.
All right. Let me read --
Mr First Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.
Hon Members, can we take our time later to look at these details because if we should sit here and expect that we would be able to go through all of these, it would be ad infinitum.
Dr A. A. Osei 1:50 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I am advising the Deputy Minister that, it would be easier for us if he makes reference to the specific errors, so that we take that and go on. Otherwise, he is forcing us to go and read both and find errors that he would have to relay.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.
No! It is not a question of withdrawing and relaying. The original one has no problem.
Hon Members, the original which was laid by the Hon Minister has no problem; it is the printing of the original one which has problems. And that is why we are trying to resolve it this way.
Yes, Hon Deputy Minority Leader?
Mr Nitiwul 1:50 p.m.
Mr Speaker, the reasons the Hon Ranking Member of Finance advised the Hon Minister to point out the pages is that, there could be a possibility that somebody may hold an old one that may not have problems with the pages.
Mr Speaker, I have just decided to look at the old one that I signed. The new one, I have not signed it. So, you will see my signature on the old one. I have gone through it page by page to look at the numbering and there is no mistake.
Mr Speaker, for example, if you go to page 190 of the old one, you would see that at the bottom, there is no page 190 but at the side of it, there is 190. That is what they have done. In some pages, instead of putting it at the bottom, they have put it at the side. So, it is all correct and he should point out --
Mr First Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.
Very well.
Hon Members, can I intercede?
Mr Nitiwul 1:50 p.m.
So, Mr Speaker, let him point out the pages where there are mistakes in the numbering. This is because I do not see a single mistake here in the numbering. They are all correct.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.
Hon Members, can I intercede? As I said earlier, we cannot sit here and go through all of these.
But after adjournment, the Hon Minister and his staff, together with the Hon Chairman and the Hon Ranking Member, will go through this exercise and find out specifically where the anomalies are, so that tomorrow morning, God willing, we can go through that exercise. But if
Mr First Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.
Yes, Hon Member?
Dr Assibey-Yeboah 1:50 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I have an old version of the Budget Statement. This is what I have been working with all weekend and I was ready to debate with this old version of the Budget Statement. Unknown to me, the Ministry of Finance had withdrawn the old one and asked that Hon Members go for a new version of the Budget Statement.
They were saying that we were not ready to debate. Meanwhile, they had a different version of the budget they were going to debate with. How can we go ahead with the debate tomorrow when I have worked with the old budget all this while?
Mr Speaker, if there are errors in the old version of the budget, for which the Ministry has withdrawn it, it would be proper for the Hon Minister to advert our minds to where the errors are in the budget.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.
You are speaking the same language with me. We are saying the same thing. If the differences are not substantial, I do not think we have any problem. If they are, that is why I am asking you to go through this exercise after adjournment, so that we would know where we stand.
So, Hon Members, I think that is where we stand as far as the Budget Statement itself is concerned.
Now, we have one or two other issues -- [Pause] --Yes, but we have a problem.
Now, Hon Deputy Majority Leader, can we hear from you the way forward?
Mr Agbesi 1:50 p.m.
Mr Speaker, having resolved the issue of the Budget Statement, we met Mr Speaker and the Second Deputy Speaker and agreed that, debate can commence tomorrow and after adjournment, there should be a joint caucus meeting, where issues that are affecting the working of Parliament will be taken on board.

The debate will commence tomorrow and after adjournment, there will be a joint caucus meeting.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.
Yes, Hon Deputy Minority Leader?
Mr Nitiwul 1:50 p.m.
Mr Speaker, the agreement is that, the debate should commence tomorrow, hoping only that, we do not find genuine mistakes in the old one that led to the changes. This is because, the assurance we got from the Hon Deputy Minister is that, it is about pages. If there are no substantial mistakes and it is only the devil's advocate, we can continue tomorrow. If there are, then I am afraid that it might not be possible.
But Mr Speaker, as he said, we also agreed to hold a joint caucus meeting tomorrow to thrash out other issues which you all know affect what the President said because Mr Speaker, you were here. You know that for the past one week or more, this side of the House has been in Parliament working. When the Majority
side were having their primaries, understandably, they were on the field working during their primaries, trying to get themselves re-elected, we were here working for Parliament, passing Bills -- [Interruption.] Yes, I understand that is how Parliament should work.
When we the Minority side were having our primaries, the Majority side was working and when the Majority side was having their primaries, we the Minority side were working and that is how Parliament should work. We kept working and ordinarily, this is Government Business but we were doing it.
Then the President says, we are sleeping. Our people are very hurt; our constituents are very hurt. Meanwhile, we have been working all along. So, this issue should be addressed tomorrow in the joint caucus.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.
Very well.
I remember that when this was raised, the Rt Hon Speaker decided that he would deal with it together with the Leadership. Unfortunately, he together with the other Hon Members of the Leadership are out of the country on an official assignment. So, when they return, they would handle this matter and we would see the end of it.
So now, Hon Deputy Majority Leader, we are in your hands. [Pause.] Looking at the time of the day, it is within my powers to adjourn the House.
Accordingly, I direct that the House be adjourned till tomorrow at 10.00 o'clock in the forenoon.
Thank you very much.
ADJOURNMENT 1:50 p.m.