Debates of 18 Jul 2018

MR SPEAKER
PRAYERS 11:10 a.m.
VOTES AND PROCEEDINGS AND THE OFFICIAL REPORT 11:10 a.m.
Mr Speaker 11:10 a.m.
Hon Members, item listed 3 on the Order Paper -- Correction of Votes and Proceedings of Tuesday, 17th July,
2018.
Page 1… 14 --
rose
Mr Banda 11:10 a.m.
Mr Speaker, line 4 of item numbered 14 on page 14 should read:
“… any other contact details…''
‘‘There is an omission of the letter “s''.
rose
Mr Speaker 11:10 a.m.
Yes, Hon Member?
Mr Alalzuuga 11:10 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I was here yesterday, but my name did not appear on the list of Hon Members who were present.
Mr Speaker 11:10 a.m.
Hon Member, it is noted.
Hon Members, is there any other?
Pages 14… 24 --
Mr Osei Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 11:10 a.m.
Mr Speaker, the Hon Minister has sounded that he is on his way here. He has been caught up in traffic, but he would be with us a few moments from now.
Mr Speaker, that being the case, I would want to apply to you to vary the order of Business for the time being for us to accommodate the Statement that you have admitted.
I have to begin with the Statement in the name of the Hon Francisca Oteng Mensah.
Mr Speaker 11:10 a.m.
Yes, Hon Minority Leader?
Mr Haruna Iddrisu 11:10 a.m.
Mr Speaker, the Hon Majority Leader has requested for a variation of Business. We should have no difficulty with it, except to continue to anticipate the arrival of the Hon Minister for Railways Development to respond to the Questions.
Mr Speaker, this House by its Standing Orders, as you have emphasised, punctuality is for 10.00 a.m. so if at 11.20 a.m. -- Unless he came and left. We would wait to for him.
We can do other Business and when he arrives, we would draw your attention so that we would do the Questions. We have seen correspondence from him even deferring answering this Question a number of times.
Mr Speaker, we can rearrange the order of Business to suit the request of the Hon Majority Leader, but he should be in charge and make sure that his Ministers are here. He is the Leader of Government Business, not just the Hon Majority Leader.
Mr Osei Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 11:20 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I must put on record that the Hon Minister responsible for Railways Development was here in the House at 10 o'clock prompt, and because of our own development in other matters, he had to leave to see to a few things back at the Ministry and he sounded that he was coming back. It must be stated for the records.
Mr Speaker 11:20 a.m.
Hon Francisca Oteng Mensah?
STATEMENTS 11:20 a.m.
Ms Francisca Oteng Mensah (NPP -- Kwabre East) 11:20 a.m.
Thank you, Mr Speaker, for the opportunity to make this Statement on the Official Launch of the Kwabre Anwenie Festival.
The Kwabre East Municipality is one of the districts in the Ashanti Region that was recently elevated from district to Municipal Status.
I would like to take this opportunity to thank the President, His Excellency Nana Addo Dankwa Akufo- Addo for doing the constituency that honour.
Mr Speaker, the municipality has a population of about 136,000 with 42 communities, 31 electoral areas, 171 polling stations, and one Member of Parliament.
Until the beginning of the decentralisation process, which created recent administrative boundaries, a lot of communities in the Ashanti Region were part of Kwabre, especially those around Kumasi, the Regional capital.
Traditionally, Kwabre shares boundaries with Sekyere, Atwima and Asante Akim. The Kwabre land stretches from Asonomaso to Kejetia, where it shares a boundary with Atwima. Therefore, communities such as Tafo, Suame, Asafo, Ejisu and Kodie were all part of the greater Kwabre.
Mr Speaker, kente weaving, adinkra designing, bead making and wood carving (akuaba/stool) are the predo- minant traditional occupation of the people of Kwabre. A large number of the citizens are engaged in these vocations, either as producers, traders or as players in the value chain.
Kente from communities such as Adanwomase, Abira, Wonoo, Sarfo, Kasaam, Asonomaso, Bamang, Amanpe as well as adinkra from Ntonso were traditionally exclusive for the royals.
Wood carving (Akuaba/Stool) has also been the traditional occupation for the people of Ahwiaa. They are indeed the traditional carvers of the Otumfuo and most of the paramount chiefs in the Ashanti Region and beyond.
They represent the very fabric of Ghanaian cultural history and crafts- manship. They are also symbols of the African Socio-cultural heritage and value of our people.

The Kwabre craftsmanship has been passed on from generation to generation, creating the memories of a perfect vocation that produces matchless artefacts with wide variety of choice.

Kente, Adinkra and Beads as traditional cloths and jewelleries, respectively enjoy wide usage in Ghana and beyond. Each design of the cloth has its symbolic name and meaning. These days Kente and Adinkra are used for all occasions. Indeed, the Kente and the Adinkra symbols are used as decorations in our Parliament House and some offices at the United Nations Headquarters in New York.

Mr Speaker, at most public occasions, especially during festivals, people use kente, adinkra and beads as traditional cloths and jewelleries during the celebration to make them more colourful. However, the producers do not have any major platform to showcase what they produce.

The industry is dying for lack of market and promotion of the products. Majority of the producers are very old and it gives little or no motivation to attract the younger generation. A time may come when the craft would be no more and therefore, we need to do something to salvage the industry.

It is against this background that the Municipal Chief Executive, Hon Nana Osei Asibey Bonsu and myself, after coming into office in 2017, decided to collaborate with Nananom and the Assembly with the approval of Otumfuo Osei Tutu II, the Asantehene, to institute a festival called “Anwenie Festival” to be celebrated annually.

The main objectives for the festival are:

a) To dispaly the traditional handicrafts to promote tourism, job creation and improve the income of the citizens;

b) To create a common platform to bring the chiefs and people of Kwabre together; and

c) To solicit for funds and other resources for the development of the constituency.

The festival is timely and more appropriate for the people of Kwabre, the Ashanti Region and Ghana at large. It would be celebrated annually in September from 24th - 30th.

The maiden festival will be launched at the Centre for National Culture, Kumasi, on Sunday, 22nd July, 2018.

We shall learn from the success stories of some of the major traditional festivals in the country that have brought unity and development to their people. The Anwenie Festival will hopefully be unique and devoid of all the insecurities that are characterised with some festivals in Ghana.

We hope that this new festival would come to stay and stand the test of time to fulfil its main objectives of uniting the people and developing the handicraft industry in the constituency.

I would take this opportunity to invite all Hon Members for the launch of ‘Anwenie' Festival, and on this note, each Hon Member will get a kente muffler made from Kwabre today.

LONG LIVE Anwenie Festival
LONG LIVE GHANA 11:20 a.m.
Mr Speaker 11:20 a.m.
Hon Member, thank you very much for this generous Statement including your intended gifts.
One from each Side and Hon Leaders may please assist accordingly. I can see two ladies. There is female solidarity. I see them just coming up.
Ms Laadi Ayamba (NDC -- Pusiga) 11:30 a.m.
Mr Speaker thank you very much for the opportunity.
First of all, let me commend the Hon Member for a very important Statement that has been ably made towards the celebration of the Anwenie Festival, which comes off on 24th September, 2018, as she has mentioned.
Mr Speaker, I wish to congratulate her more because this is one of such Statements which we really need to support our forward march in Ghana.
It is very good that we cherish our own cloths that we make; not only the ones that we produce from the factories but the ones that are locally made by our people which are very good, of high quality, not only in the southern sector but also in the northern sector.
Mr Speaker, these materials which we tend to think are very expensive are durable, beautiful with different designs of high quality and are such that we can get different colours to match very different occasions.

Mr Speaker, many a time, it is the women in the north who do the weaving of the yarn and eventually, it is used to sew the fugu that our men and women wear.

We need the support of the Hon Minister for Procurement, who is also a woman. She is the one who is supposed to lead and ensure that her Office supports women who are into such businesses with her 30 per cent discount or 30 per cent allocation of whatever resources that she gets.

She should not only limit it to the southern sector because there are many more in the northern sector.

Mr Speaker, in my own constituency, we have more than 500 women who are in this business.

Mr Speaker, we should not politicise this particular activity or initiative in any way when it is brought up. When we talk about jobs, we may be looking at only white collar jobs but that is not the situation. We have a lot of our mothers as well as our sisters and daughters there who are into weaving and they need just the threads to do the weaving.

Mr Speaker, they need to be put in groups and given the opportunity to show what they know. Mr Speaker, maybe because they simply do not have about
Ms Laadi Ayamba (NDC -- Pusiga) 11:30 a.m.


GH¢500.00 to buy the thread or even GH¢200.00 to buy a machine to work, they are not able to do what is expected of them.

Mr Speaker, we should make all wedding gowns in kente produced from either the northern sector or the southern sector. I have seen a few pictures which are very beautiful and they are designed in such a way that -- [Interruption] --

Mr Speaker, I would not praise myself but if I was being wedded this morning, my husband would say that I am beautiful because of the kente I am wearing. Why can we not encourage our young ones?

We cannot continue to go outside and buy already-made long dresses and so on which are worn only on the wedding days after which they are put away. Let us use our local materials, give employment to our women; and the men should ensure that they support us so that we come up in this business.

Mr Speaker, I believe that you would use your good Office to help our female Hon Member who just made this Statement and also support the leader of the Female Caucus of Parliament, Hon Sarah Adwoa Safo, to ensure that this initiative comes out very well for us to all benefit from it. It would go a long way to help us all.

Mr Speaker, there are other Hon Members who would contribute but I want to say thumbs up to the Hon Member who made the Statement. She has done well and I wish all of us, all the best.

Mr Speaker, I hope that we would not regret making this Statement on the floor

of the House. This should not be a nine- day wonder, let us ensure that it happens.

Mr Speaker, I thank you for the opportunity.
Mr Speaker 11:30 a.m.
Hon Member, thank you very much except that there would not be many Hon Members who would contribute. We have already said this and sometimes I feel uncomfortable when I appear not to have been heard.
Naana Eyiah (NPP - Gomoa Central): Mr Speaker, I beg to support the Statement made by the Hon Member for Kwabre East and I also commend her for this initiative.
Mr Speaker, the tourism industry is one area that we should pay close attention to, because to us, it has the tendency to generate revenue for the country. We need to cultivate the habit of protecting our cultural heritage for the next generation.
Mr Speaker, we always say that Africans use our culture -- what I am wearing is an African cloth -- It makes us look real, unique and good and when we wear them any man who sees us admits that we are beautiful.
Mr Speaker, I am encouraging our African women to use our culture as we are doing now to show that we are women.
Mr Speaker, thank you for giving me this opportunity.
Mr Speaker 11:30 a.m.
Thank you very much.
We have a Statement on the 70 th Anniversary of the State of Israel by Hon Rev John Ntim Fordjour.
Solidarity with the State of Israel on the Occasion of the 70th
Anniversary of Israel
Rev John Ntim Fordjour (NPP -- Assin South): Thank you, Mr Speaker, for the opportunity granted me to make this all-important commemorative Statement in solidarity with the State of Israel on the occasion of its 70th Anniversary.
Mr Speaker, some 70 years ago, on 14th May, 1948 (5 Iyar 5708, according to the Hebrew Calendar), the world witnessed the formal declaration of the establishment of the State of Israel by David Ben-Gurion, the first Prime Minister of Israel.
This declaration saw the establishment of a Jewish State in Eretz-Israel to be known as the State of Israel which came into effect upon the termination of the British mandate at midnight of the 14th of May, 1948.
This historic event has since been celebrated annually in Israel with a National Independence Day on 5 Iyar of every year according to the Hebrew Calendar, which fell on 19th April, this year.
Mr Speaker, not only is Israel renowned in the world for their economic prowess, high technological advancement and agricultural exploits, it also eminently provides home for the most prestigious and sacred monumental Judaist, Christian and Islamic heritage.
Undoubtedly, the Temple Mount in Jerusalem, the City of Truth, is touted among the topmost sacred and prestigious holy sites for the 2.3 billion Christians and 1.8 billion Muslims across the world. Every street, hill and waters of Jerusalem, Tel Aviv, Galilee, and Bethlehem present a unique proof of Biblical significance.
Mr Speaker, according to the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD) Report 2015,
Israel is recognised as the country with the highest gross domestic spending as a percentage of the GDP (i.e. 4.3 per cent) on Research and Development (R&D) as against second placed South Korea's 4.23 per cent.
In 2017, Israel's technology companies raised an all- time record of US$4.8 billion in venture capital. It therefore came as no surprise when renowned journalists, Dan Senor and Saul Singer, were moved to write their 2009 bestseller, “Start-Up Nation: The Story of Israel's Economic Miracle”.
Aside the United States and China, Israel has the most companies listed on the tech-focused NASDAQ stock exchange. Israel as a state and the Jews as a people have a unique history, essential geography and tenacious geopolitical narrative which survived centuries of diverse challenges.
Therefore, to me as a friend of Israel, the celebration of the 70th Anniversary of the State of Israel resonates a significant milestone which is worth solidarising with.
In my view, there could not be a more opportune time for the world to stand in solidarity with the State of Israel.
Mr Speaker, Israel has a tenable story worth upholding. Unfortunately, the narrative of Israel has seldom come to the fore and hardly found expression in global media reportage.
Perhaps, if the world would incline towards Israel's narrative, we would appreciate even the more, the challenges of the people of Israel and the fact that they have the right to exist and to live in peace just like every other people.
Mr Speaker, I wish to reiterate my greatest regard for the United Nations
Mr Speaker 11:30 a.m.


Security Council (UNSC) Resolution 1397 adopted on March 12, 2002 by the UN Security Council calling for a two-state solution to the Israel-Palestine conflict.

The UN Security Council Resolution 1397 was principally anchored, among other things, on a vision of a region where two states, Israel and Palestine, live side by side within secure and recognised borders, stressing the need for all concerned to ensure the safety of civilians, while maintaining respect for the universally accepted norms and International Humanitarian Law.

Accordingly, I wish to single out for recognition the eminent role played by the venerable Ghanaian diplomat, Mr Kofi Annan, the then Secretary-General of the United Nations, in charting the path towards the peaceful resolution of the Israel-Palestine conflict.

Mr Speaker, prior to the adoption of the UNSC Resolution 1397, Mr Kofi Annan had called on Palestinians to end the “morally repugnant” acts of terror and suicide bombings.

In utter defiance of this noble call, Israel continues to suffer various forms of terrorist attacks and rocket attacks by Palestine.

An article authored by Callum Paton, as published in the Newsweek on Friday, October 20, 2017, alleged that the Leader of Hamas in the Gaza Strip, Yahya Sinwar, had made inflammatory statements that the Islamist group is focused on wiping out the State of Israel and has no intention of disarming.

The leader of Hamas is further quoted to have said, “Over is the time Hamas spent discussing recognising Israel. Now Hamas will discuss, even when we will wipe out Israel.''

Mr Speaker, subsequent to these inflammatory statements by the leader of Hamas, a total of 302 rockets and mortars have been fired into Israel from Gaza Strip within the space of three months, between May 29 and July 14 this year.

To appreciate the trauma and the state of fear suffered by residents of Kibbutz communities in Israel in proximity to the Gaza border is to know that amidst the 302 rocket attacks launched on them in the space of just three months, a resident has only 15 seconds to run into shelter to seek protection whenever a rocket is fired.

Mr Speaker, contrary to the entrenched position and regrettable actions of Hamas against the State of Israel, I appeal to the UN, the African Union and Ghana, in particular, to arise in solidarity with Israel to recognise the State of Israel and uphold that, indeed, the good people of Israel have the right to exist and to live in peace.

While I convey my sincerest felici- tations to the good people of Israel on the occasion of their 70th Anniversary Celebrations, may I, Mr Speaker, assure them that we stand in solidarity with them and it is our earnest prayer that someday, the Israel-Palestine conflict will see a lasting solution and sustained peaceful coexistence in the region.

Happy 70th Anniversary to the State of Israel.

God bless Israel, God bless Ghana.

Mr Speaker, 1 am indeed grateful.

Thank you.
Mr Speaker 11:40 p.m.
Thank you very much, Hon Member, for this ably made Statement. I would take one contribution from each Side.
Mr Emmanuel Armah-Kofi Buah (NDC -- Ellembele) 11:40 p.m.
Thank you, Mr Speaker, for the opportunity.
Mr Speaker, let me thank the Hon (Rev.) Fordjour for the very important Statement in solidarity with the State of Israel on their 70th anniversary. Israel is the bastion of the world's major religions of Judaism, Christianity and Islam.
As we celebrate its 70th anniversary, let me also reiterate the progress that Israel has made. They have made a lot of progress if you consider their circum- stances; where they are located and the challenges they face on a daily basis, the progress they have made in agriculture and technology, and how they have lifted their people from poverty. There is a lot to celebrate for in the State of Israel.
As we celebrate Israel, we must take note of the very important Resolution that was passed by the United Nations; the UNSC Resolution 1397 that was adopted in the year 2002 whcih called for the two- state solution.
Indeed, Israel is not going anywhere. Israel would be where it is for a long time. This is historical. They have gone through so much and they have survived. This Resolution's intent was to ensure that the people of Palestine and Israel would live together peacefully.
If you look at events in the last few weeks, what it tells us is that we have really not made progress and not achieved the intent of that Resolution.
As we speak, ordinary people of Palestine continue to challenge Israel; and Israel, with high level of technology continues to fight back and it results into loss of lives on a daily basis. You watch television and see women and children on a daily basis — This has gone on for so long.
I believe it is time for us to go back to the drawing board, look at the intent of the Resolution. And the leadership of the people of Palestine must accept the reality that the only solution and the only hope for the children of Palestine is to find a peaceful coexistence with the people of Israel. I believe that is what Israel seeks.
Mr Speaker, even as they celebrate the 70th anniversary, it is important we also talk about this Resolution and the role of the eminent Ghanaian as has been noted. We cannot talk about the UNSC Resolution 1397 without talking about the role H. E. Kofi Annan played.
He had a lot of challenges at the time. People even doubted his loyalty to bringing about peace and whether he was for Israel, yet he stood his grounds at the time and that Resolution provided the basis for the peace we seek for the people of Israel.
Mr Speaker, even as we talk about this 70th anniversary, let me also talk about the role that Israel played for our country. They continue to work and assist us in agriculture.
They play a very important role. On their 70th anniversary, we use the opportunity to thank the Government and people of Israel for the very important friendship we have and hope that, in the coming years, we would strengthen our relationship and deepen our friendship.
Mr Speaker 11:40 p.m.
Thank you very much.
Dr Bernard Okoe Boye (NPP -- Ledzokuku) 11:40 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I beg to commend the Hon Member who made the Statement and to mention that just as Mecca is very dear as a holy place for those who practise Islam, some of us who practise Christianity also have a lot of admiration and love for the State of Israel.
Mr Speaker, anyone who practises the Christian religion knows that one key ingredient is showing love and being patient in our dealings. Inasmuch as I admire the State of Israel greatly, it is my desire that there would be a way for the State of Israel to live in a very peaceful environment with their neighbours.
Anyone who has been involved in conflict or has studied conflict resolution mechanisms knows that when two parties insist on having what they demanded from the beginning to the very end, it is difficult to have positive peace.
One may ask what positive peace is and, for that matter, what negative peace also is. I am going to refer to the statement of Dr Martin Luther King, a civil right
activist, who mentioned that negative peace is the absence of violence but positive peace has to do with the presence of justice. The players in a particular situation must be convinced that they are all dealing with themselves in an honest and very fair manner.
So it is very necessary for us to call on those who support Israel to continue to do so, and even as they do so, they should also be interested in events and ways to ensure that dialogue is constant and it is encouraged until all parties involved get positive peace and not negative peace, if that is the situation.
Mr Speaker, I would like to visit Israel one day, just like my brothers, the Muslims visit Mecca, to have a feel of the holy land and to pray that the Lord himself would help me, and for that matter all of us, to enjoy the blessings coming from the Almighty.
In fact, it is very interesting. Those who practise this faith would tell you that we normally refer to God as the God of Israel, and that tells you how thematic and central the State is.
It is also very important that right on earth, we want to see that particular State becoming the true reflection of absolute peace. I believe strongly that no matter is non-discussable and impossible to put on hold. Every matter can be resolved as long as we talk.
Mr Speaker, in conclusion, there has not been any conflict that was totally resolved with arms. The participants finally come to the table, so I would encourage dialogue and wish the State of Israel well.
Mr Speaker, with these few words, I thank you for the opportunity.
Mr Speaker 11:50 p.m.
Thank you very much.
That brings us to the end of Statements time. We would move to item listed 3, Questions, if the Hon Minister for Railways Development would kindly take the appropriate seat.
Hon Member for Garu?
ORAL ANSWERS TO QUESTIONS 11:50 p.m.
MINISTRY OF RAILWAYS 11:50 p.m.
DEVELOPMENT 11:50 p.m.
Minister for Railways Development (Mr Joe Ghartey) 11:50 p.m.
Mr Speaker, the Ministry of Railways Development has plans for the construction of a railway line from Kumasi through Tamale to Paga. This is what is known as the “Central Spine” of Ghana's railway network (and is hereinafter referred to as the Central Spine).
The development of the Central Spine has been divided into two sections. These are the Kumasi to Tamale section and the Tamale to Paga section of the Line.
Mr Speaker, the Ministry of Railways Development signed an MOU with China Civil Engineering Construction Company (CCECC) on 20th April, 2018 in furtherance of its plan to develop the Kumasi to Tamale section of the Central Spine.
Steps are being taken to take the process forward and sign an agreement with CCECC for the construction of the Kumasi to Tamale section of the Central Spine.
Mr Speaker, this includes the development of a feasibility study by CCECC and the acquisition of land. Government is also taking steps to attract concessional funding from the Chinese government to fund the Kumasi to Tamale section of the Central Spine.
Mr Speaker, the Tamale to Paga section of the Central Spine is being developed as part of the Accra to Ouagadougou Rail Line. The Accra to Ouagadougou Rail Line will continue from where the Accra to Mpakadan Line ends.
The Ghana section of the Accra to Ouagadougou rail line will go through Ho, Hohoe, Yendi, Tamale and Paga. This is being developed on a Build Operate and Transfer (BOT) basis.
Mr Speaker, fifteen (15) consortia expressed interest in developing the Accra to Ouagadougou Rail Line when an advertisement for Expression of Interest was published in Ghana and Burkina Faso. Eleven (11) consortia have been shortlisted to go to the next stage of procurement.
The Joint Committee of Experts, with representatives from Ghana and Burkina, will meet in Bolgatanga next week to agree on the way forward.
Mr Speaker, this development of the approximately 595 kilometres railway line from Kumasi to Paga, will therefore be undertaken in two sections; the Kumasi to Tamale section and the Tamale to Paga section.
Mr Speaker, the Ministry has no immediate plans to develop a railway line
Mr Alalzuuga 11:50 p.m.
Mr Speaker, in the Minister's Answer, he indicated that steps are being taken to attract some funding.
May I know the specific steps that the Hon Minister is taking to ensure that we get the funding?
Mr Ghartey 11:50 p.m.
Mr Speaker, it is the normal steps that are taken by every Government to attract funding, and those steps are led by the Ministry of Finance to attract concessionary funding, so the steps, I would say, are the steps that are taken when you want to attract concessionary funding.
Mr Alalzuuga 11:50 p.m.
Mr Speaker, Ghana is a middle income country, and I know it is not easy to get concessionary loans for projects of this nature.
Would the Hon Minister convince this House that together with the Ministry of Finance he would be able to attract the loans he is talking of?
Mr Ghartey 11:50 p.m.
Mr Speaker, in my Answer, I said the Ministry is taking steps. Whether those steps would succeed or not is in the hands of God, so what I would tell the Hon Member is that blessed are those who have not seen but yet believe; and I believe that the steps would be successful.
Mr Alalzuuga 11:50 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I notice that the Hon Minister is saying that they do not have immediate steps to continue
with the construction of the railways from Upper East to Wa.
May I know why?
Mr Ghartey noon
Mr Speaker, the railways master plan is in the hands of men, not the hands of God -- [Laughter] -- But in 2013, a railways master plan was done for the whole country, which covers over 4000 kilometres.
That master plan indicated the proposed lines which was based on several considerations; technical, economic, social and environmental considerations.
What was decided was that there would be what they called the Western Line which already existed, and it went from Takoradi to Kumasi.
It was decided that there would be a western line expansion which would traverse the western part of Ghana and end in Tamale, passing through the towns I mentioned, such as Sunyani, Bole, Bamboi, Wa, and all the way up to the north.
Then there was the Central Spine, which is being developed, which passes through the middle of Ghana, through Kumasi, Techiman, Kintampo, Tamale, et cetera. It was also decided that the two lines would be joined by the Fufulso to Sawla road so if you want to go from Upper West to Upper East you would have to pass through that road, and as I said, it was decided based on various considerations.
The master plan is being revised and your suggestion is well noted. I would give it to the experts and based on the various considerations they have, they
would see whether what you are saying is feasible financially and economically.
Mr Speaker noon
Thank you very much.
Question starred 413 standing in the name of the Hon Member for Asuogyaman?
Cost Implications for Changing the Termination of Accra - Akosombo
Railway Line at Mpakadan.
Q. 431. Mr Thomas Nyarko Ampem asked the Minister for Railways Development the cost implication for changing the termination point of the Accra - Akosombo railway line at Mpakadam and what informed the decision.
Mr Ghartey noon
Mr Speaker, on Friday 3rd March 2017, the Minister for Railways Development, together with represen- tatives of the Ministry and from Ghana Railway Development Authority (GRDA) (the Client), TEAM Engineering SPA (the Consultant) and AFCONS Infrastructure Ltd (the Contractor), visited the Tema- Akosombo project in Akosombo for an inspection.
The scope of the inspection included the suitability of the existing Akosombo Port as the termination point for the Railway Line, as foreseen by the preliminary design submitted by AFCONS Infrastructure Ltd. This was based on a previous feasibility study conducted by Dar Al-Handasah Ltd.
Mr Speaker, during the visit, the following issues became apparent noon
The Akosombo Port area is quite compact and the hilly terrain is not favorable for other facilities and future possible and
desirable industrial, commercial and or residential developments to be established using the port as a hub.
The route to the Akosombo Port requires that the proposed railway line lies in close proximity to the dam (in one section specifically less than 100.00 metres) and other sensitive auxiliary structures.
Considerable security implications with its associated costs have to be accordingly taken during the construction phase and also during future traffic operations.
The route to the Akosombo Port is through hilly and rocky terrain and it will involve the drilling of a 1.3 kilometers long tunnel through this hilly and rocky terrain. In one section, the tunnel would be drilled so close to the dam that the possibility of not compromising the structural integrity of the Akosombo Dam could be not be guaranteed.
Any future extension of the Railway Line to the north (Yendi) through the Volta Region, cannot proceed directly from Akosombo Port, but will be possible only by crossing the Volta River somewhere downstream of the Akosombo Port.
Mr Speaker, TEAM Engineering SPA and AFCONS Infrastructure Ltd were tasked to investigate the possibility of an alternative route for the Tema to Akosombo Rail Line and a more suitable termination point for the project.
Mr Speaker, the investigation identified a suitable alternate site in the Mpakadan area as the termination point. This is on the opposite side of the Volta River to the Akosombo Port.
Two crossing point across the Volta Lake have also been identified. These
Mr Speaker, during the visit, the following issues became apparent noon


proposed crossing points are at one of the narrowest sections of the Volta River in that vicinity.

1. Mr Speaker, the terrain at the alternative termination point offers a more open space which can be used not only for the port, but for other associated businesses.

2. The alternative route negates the need for one viaduct measuring 400.00m (km81+000 of the actual route) and two tunnels measuring 297.00m and 631.00 m (km81+500 and km83+000 of the actual route respectively). As far as the construction of infrastructure is concerned, this translates into a saving of about US$25 million from the original contract sum.

3. The alternative route is such that no construction of tunnels is required, but a bridge of length of approximately 1,200.00m to go across the Volta River is needed.

4. It is envisaged that the savings from the construction of the one viaduct and the two tunnels will go a long way in meeting the cost of construction of the bridge over the Volta River.

5. The alternative route makes for homogeneity of the master plan as it puts the Railway Line in the right position for continuation to Yendi.

Mr Speaker, while the termination point at Mpakadan is settled, there are two proposals with regard to the crossing point across the Volta River and also the route after crossing the river to Mpakadan. The longer of the two routes proposed is

approximately 10 kilometres longer than the old route. The Contractors are currently working on the bill of quantities and this will be reviewed by the Clients with assistance from the Consultants when completed.

It is envisaged that this process will end by the end of August, 2018. It is only then that the cost implication will be available.
Mr Speaker noon
Thank you very much, Hon Minister, for that exhaustive Answer.
Mr Ampem noon
Mr Speaker, I would want to know from the Hon Minister, looking at the original plan for the Railway Line to terminate at Akosombo so that goods that are transported on the railway could further be transported through the Volta Region to the North, with the relocation of the termination point at Mpakadan, are we going to have a new port at Mpakadan to enable this to continue? And would that port be under the control of the Volta Lake Transport Limited?
Mr Ghartey noon
Mr Speaker, yes, there is going to be a new port. On the second question, whether it would be under the control of the Volta Lake Transport Limited, what I can assure you is that, it would not be under the control of the railway sector. As to who takes control of that, it is for Government to decide; it is for the Ministry of Transport to decide. It would not be under the railway sector.
But all that we have been doing so far, we have been working with the Volta Lake Transport Company Limited. They went with us and even helped us to identify the new site.
So, I have no reason to believe that the position would be different, but that question can firmly be answered by the
Ministry of Transport, under whose jurisdiction these companies operate.
Mr Speaker noon
Thank you very much. Any more question?
Mr Ampem noon
Yes, Mr Speaker. The construction of the railway lines has already started and we do not know of any immediate plan to construct the port at Mpakadan. So, if we finish with the railway lines and the port has not been constructed, how useful would the railway line be?
Mr Ghartey noon
Mr Speaker, the Hon Member should be rest assured that we are very much aware of the fact that it is part of an intermodal transport system. So, the construction would be done. The Hon Member who comes from that Constituency knows that the port that is there is not too complicated a structure.
It is a wharf so he should rest assured. By the time the train reaches there, the port would be there. I wish to assure him. This one is not in the hands of God; it is in the hands of AFCONS.
Mr Ampem noon
Mr Speaker, the Hon Minister confirms in his Answer, that they are making some changes; the railway line would cross the Volta Lake and terminate at Mpakadan and all that. The original approval by Parliament was based on certain designs and scope of work. Are we making variations to what Parliament has previously approved?
Mr Ghartey noon
Mr Speaker, sorry to bring you back to the scriptures. It says, “man was not made for Sabbath but Sabbath was made for man.”
And I believe that the Parliament of Ghana is here to serve the people of Ghana and the Parliament is a listening
Parliament. I would bring my case back to Parliament and make my case.
I am sure that I could count on the Hon Member who comes from that area to support me. This is because this development would expand the economic potential of his area.
Thank you.
Mr Ampem noon
Mr Speaker, I would support but I was—
Mr Speaker noon
Hon Member, I have not called you.
Mr Haruna Iddrisu 12:10 p.m.
Mr Speaker, may I refer the Hon Minister to his Answer on page 2.
Mr Speaker, I would like to quote 12:10 p.m.
“…this development of the approximately 595 kilometres, from Kumasi to Paga, will therefore be undertaken in two sections; the Kumasi to Tamale section and the Tamale to Paga section.”
Mr Speaker, I would reconcile that with the Hon Minister's earlier Answer which said:
“ … the Tamale to Paga section of the Central Spine is being developed as part of the Accra to Ouagadougou Rail Line. The Accra to Ouagadougou Rail Line will continue from where the Accra to Mpakadan Line ends. The Ghana section of the Accra to Ouagadougou rail line will go through Ho, Hohoe, Yendi, Tamale and Paga.”
Mr Speaker, the Hon Minister is in one breath, developing it from the Eastern Corridor which would run through. So, even from Ho -- This is a House of record
Mr Ghartey 12:10 p.m.
Mr Speaker, there is no confusion about this. The railway master- plan envisages that there would be what is called the Central Spine, which is from Kumasi to Paga. It also envisages that there would be the Eastern Line Extension. The Eastern Line is from Accra to Kumasi. The Eastern Line Expansion mirrors typically what is known as the Eastern Corridor Road.
Mr Speaker, when it traverses the Volta Region, it would go to Yendi because of the Sheini iron ore deposits and embark on a journey westward towards Tamale. When it gets to Tamale, it would then go to Paga. So, as far as we are concerned, we are developing the Kumasi to Paga Rail Line in two sections.
One section is part of the Accra to Ouagadougou rail line which I just described. Another section is from Kumasi to Tamale. If we just develop the line through the Volta Region, which comes to Yendi, Tamale and Paga, we would have a gap. That gap is Kumasi to Tamale.
The Kumasi to Tamale section is the section on which an agreement has been signed with CCECC, therefore, that network would be completed. So, I do not see the difficulty the Hon Member has as
I have explained in both Answers. The first one, I said we started the process for BOT. Fifteen companies bid, we shortlisted 11 and next week, we would meet in Bolgatanga.
I could have told him an exactitude if it was only Ghana. This is a joint committee of experts from Ghana and Burkina Faso. We have to satisfy the procurement laws of both countries. So, when we meet in Burkina Faso next week, if the Hon Member asks me a question subsequent to that, I would give him the road map.
As far as the Kumasi to Tamale section is concerned, in my Answer, I have made it clear that we have signed an MoU with CCECC. Government, led by the Ministry of Finance, is taking steps to make sure that the money comes, so that it would be constructed.
Mr Speaker, as to where we would pass between Ho, Hohoe, Yendi and so on, we would go through an extensive stakeholder consultation. I mentioned Ho because it is the regional capital and Yendi because of the Sheini iron ore deposits. Hohoe is next to Ho, but as to exactly which towns it would pass, I do not want to hazard a guess.
It would happen with serious consultations, with inputs from people like the Hon Minority Leader, who has a stake as the Member of Parliament for Tamale, to advise on which side he thinks the line should go.
Even in cities, we have to decide; if Tamale, where in Tamale? Would it be near the airport, in Sagnarigu or the city? All these questions have to be answered and I would invite the Hon Minority Leader to assist in answering these questions.
Mr Speaker 12:10 p.m.
Question numbered 432, Hon Member for Nsawam-Adoagyiri?
Revamp of Accra-Nsawam Railway Line
Q.432. Mr Frank Annoh-Dompreh asked the Minister for Railways Development the extent of progress chalked with the Ministry's bid to revamp the Accra - Nsawam railway line.
Mr Joe Ghartey 12:10 p.m.
Mr Speaker, after the derailment of the Accra bound Diesel Multiple Unit (DMU) on Monday 23rd October, 2017, the Ministry decided to undertake major rehabilitation of sections of the Eastern Line including the Accra - Nsawam railway line.
The contract to undertake the rehabilitation was awarded to the Ghana Railways Company Ltd. The contract sum is GH¢15.034 million. The contract was signed on 20th December, 2017 and it is for a term of seven months.
Mr Speaker, unfortunately, because of unforeseen circumstances, the contract will have to be extended.
The initial difficulty related to the acquisition of treated wooden sleepers. The acceptable quality of treated sleepers could not be obtained in Ghana. An offer from the United States of America also proved unsuitable. Suitably treated wooden sleepers were identified in China and the order has been placed and the sleepers will be delivered by August, 2018.
Mr Speaker, another challenge that has arisen is the deteriorated state of the formation. At some sections of the railway line, such as between the Accra Central Station and the Kwame Nkrumah Over- pass and the Graphic Road section of the line, the formation has completely deteriorated because of human activity.
Soil stabilisation and restoration of the formation has led to the contaminated subgrade soil being removed and being replaced by boulders.
Mr Speaker, in some cases, soil up to two meters deep is being replaced. Old bridges and culverts will also be replaced and extensive drainage will be constructed.
The ballast will be replaced and all rotten sleepers will also be replaced. The formation will be restored where it has been destroyed. The existing stations will also be rehabilitated under this rehabilitation program.
Mr Speaker, in spite of these challenges significant progress has been chalked. The most difficult parts of the rehabilitation is being currently undertaken.
Soil stabilisation and formation restoration is being undertaken. Ballast opening is also ongoing. Negotiations with subcontractors who will undertake specialised work such as construction of bridges and culverts and alignment by permanent way specialist is far advanced.
Mr Speaker, this has also contributed to the revival of the Ghana Railways Company Limited. Three hundred (300) young people have been engaged as permanent railway workers. The total workforce from Accra to Nsawam is 320. This comprises 305 permanent way workers and 15 supervisors who are engineers.
Mr Speaker, the team is led by the Deputy Managing Director in charge of Engineering. The team has been divided into five gangs and these gangs are working on different sections of the Accra - Nsawam Line. Ghana Railway Company Ltd is being revived by its engagement as contractors in this rehabilitation.
Mr Speaker, it is envisaged that the rehabilitation will be completed in December, 2018 and the Accra - Nsawam passenger and light rail service will be restored before Christmas.
Mr Ghartey 12:20 p.m.
Mr Speaker, the railway sector has a community-based employment programme which seeks to answer the question that is being asked by the Hon Member.
We have a policy that directs that companies engage the majority of the people from the particular area that the line is passing through. This is just about two things -- First of all, it creates employment within the specific catchment area and secondly it also gives the people of the area ownership of the railway line.
Mr Speaker, so I would want to assure the Hon Member that he would see it even more when the new construction starts in his area. Just to mention that what is in his area is the rehabilitation. That the majority of the people who would be engaged would come from his area.
It would be done through the traditional authorities and through the political leadership, especially the Municipal Chief Executives (MCEs) and District Chief Executives (DCEs) and through opinion leaders to make sure that the people in every area feel and know that they are part of railway development.
Mr Annoh-Dompreh 12:20 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I have read and seen the Hon Minister engage in extensive consultation; particularly in areas of the Brong Ahafo Region and the Western Region.
Regrettably, the Hon Minister has not done any consultation in Nsawam yet. I would want to know from him if there are plans to visit Nsawam and particularly engage the stakeholders - myself, the MCE, the chiefs and the people of Nsawam?
I thank you, Mr Speaker.
Mr Ghartey 12:20 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I wish to assure the Hon Member that I would visit Nsawam as soon as possible. Next week, I would be in Bolgatanga; when I come back, together with him, we would plan a date for the visit to Nsawam.
Mr Speaker, on the Eastern Railway line, which is the Accra-Nsawam line, we have gotten quite far in our visit and Nsawam is the next section we would visit.
Mr Speaker, I thank you.
Mr Speaker 12:20 p.m.
Question numbered 433?
Work done on the Eastern Railway line and its Challenges
Q. 433. Mr Frank Annoh-Dompreh asked the Minister for Railways Development what works has been done on the Eastern Railway Line and the challenges the Ministry was encountering.
Mr Ghartey 12:20 p.m.
Mr Speaker, the Eastern Rail Line is from Accra-Tema to Kumasi. Currently the narrow gauge line, (1,067mm with a minimum radius of 250m) is not operational due to extensive deterioration of the line.
The narrow gauge between Accra and Nsawam and then Achimota to Tema is being rehabilitated. The contractor is the Ghana Railways Company Ltd and the rehabilitation is ongoing.
Mr Speaker, the challenges that are being encountered include encroachment and continuous human activity that
interferes and undermines the rehabilitation process.
This includes attempts to build and building very close to the rail line and within the right of way, which is hundred (100) feet from the centre of the rail track in both directions. It also includes the difficulty in obtaining treated wooded sleepers.
Mr Speaker, the process to procure an investor to construct a new standard gauge line (1435mm with a minimum radius of 700m) on the Eastern Line is also ongoing.
In 2014, Transaction Advisors led by PricewaterhouseCoopers Ghana Ltd were engaged under a World Bank programme to undertake Pre-feasibility and feasibility studies on the Eastern Line and the Boankra Inland Port as one Project. The final feasibility Report was submitted on April, 2016.
Mr Speaker, in 2017, Cabinet decided to pursue the Eastern Railway Line and the Boankra Inland Project as separate projects. Cabinet directed that the Eastern Line and Boankra Inland Port Project should be developed as separate but complimentary projects.
Mr Speaker, Government then decided to develop the Eastern Line from Accra- Tema to Kumasi with a branch line from Bososo to Kyebi on a Build Operate and Transfer (BOT) basis with Ghanaian participation.
Further to this, a Market Sounding Event was held in Accra in December, 2017, as the commencement of the formal process to procure a private sector investor for the development of the Eastern Rail Line, in line with the international competitive
tendering processes outlined under the Public Procurement Act, 2003 (Act 663) as amended.
Mr Speaker, over a hundred (100) prospective investors attended the Market Sounding Event. Subsequent to this, an invitation for Expression of Interest was advertised and forty-five (45) responses were received. This was received from various consortia; comprising contractors, financiers, rail operators and engineering firms.
The responses were evaluated on the basis of, among other things, the following; understanding of the assignment, experience and track record of firm generally, previous experience on project specific tasks on rail and availability of relevant personnel. After evaluation of the responses, thirty-six (36) firms were shortlisted and invited to the next stage, the Request for Qualification stage.
Mr Speaker, the evaluation of the responses to the Request for Qualification has been completed and fourteen (14) firms have been invited to participate in the final stage of the procurement process which is the Request for Proposals.
The communication for Request for Proposal was issued to the successful bidders on Thursday, 12th July, 2018 and the deadline for response is August 27th,
2018.
Mr Speaker, after this, Government shall commence a process of negotiation with the successful bidder. It is intended that the agreement with the successful bidder will be concluded in or before October, 2018 and presented to Parliament for approval. Soon thereafter the construction of the new standard gauge, Eastern Rail Line will commence.

Mr Speaker, challenges relate to encroachment of the right of way. The Ministry has commenced extensive stakeholder consultation, amongst other actions, to reclaim its right of way.
Mr Annoh-Dompreh 12:20 p.m.
Mr Speaker, clearly, some extensive work is being done on the lines. However, I am also aware there are frantic efforts by Government to source for investors.
I wish to respectfully know from the Hon Minister, in the wake of the ongoing exercise coupled with the efforts to source for investors, how would that play out together with the ongoing works already being done?
Mr Ghartey 12:20 p.m.
Mr Speaker, the plan for the development of the Railway Sector includes the rehabilitation of portions of the old line side by side with the construction of a new line.
Mr Speaker, in the Western Region, for example, the rehabilitation of the line from Kojokrom to Tarkwa is ongoing. At the same time, a contract has been awarded to Amandi who are constructing a new standard gauge line from Kojokrom to Manso. This gives the opportunity for two different trains to run at the same time.
The standard gauge train is faster and more of the express type. It may not stop in every town or village and the narrow gauge rail would be slower and would stop in every town and every village.
That would give opportunity to our people; people of all economic strengths in the society to enjoy the train revival.
Mr Speaker, I was given an example by the engineers that if they have a standard gauge line from Takoradi to Kumasi for example, the train may stop only four
times. It may stop at Tarkwa, Dunkwa, Obuasi and then finally stop in Kumasi. But between those two towns are 31 stations.
Five kilometres away from Sekondi is Kojokrom; five kilometres away from Kojokrom is Ehyiam, from Ehyiam to Ango -- These little settlements may not be necessarily served by the faster train.
Mr Speaker, so we are developing the faster train alongside rehabilitating the slower train.
I always tell people that when one goes to the Kwame Nkrumah Overpass and wants a vehicle to go to any part of Ghana, one has many options. One could take a VIP, VVIP or even a VVVIP or a metro bus or STC and that is the same opportunity that we seek to give people in the railway sector.
Mr Annoh-Dompreh 12:30 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I would want to commend the Hon Minister for Railways Development for works done so far. However, there are issues with the coaches and I am sure the Hon Minister would recall that a number of them have been grounded.
Mr Speaker, I would want to know from the Hon Minister what plans they have to ensure that we have access to standardised coaches that would ply on these lines.
Mr Ghartey 12:30 p.m.
Mr Speaker, the coaches that were used by the GRCL to run the Accra-Nsawam service was nothing to write home about. It was reported that there were holes in them so as the coach was going along you could see the track.
Mr Speaker, two things have been done to address that. First of all, the GRCL itself has been given money by Government to
do extensive rehabilitation on the existing coaches.
The second thing is that, the GRCL has entered into negotiations with Trustnet International. It is a South African company which produces coaches and others and, in principle, they have agreed to give the GRCL 20 coaches.
One train made up of 10 coaches, one locomotive, one power van and one kitchen would be used for the Accra- Nsawam line. When the line is improved, we could also apply a diesel multiply unit. At the same time that we are thinking about the track, we are also thinking aggressively about the rolling stock.
Mr Speaker, I would want to assure the Hon Member that the kind of rolling stock that would be put on the track would meet the new kind of track that is being rehabilitated and constructed and meet his expectation and the expectation of the people of Ghana.
Mr Annoh-Dompreh 12:30 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I would want to know from the Hon Minister if he anticipates the possible payment of some compensation as a result of possible destruction of structures along these lines as a result of encroachment.
Mr Ghartey 12:30 p.m.
Mr Speaker, there are people who are building a metre away from the railway line. There are people who have started building when they heard that the railway lines would be constructed. Either they believe that by building nothing would happen to them or by building they would get compensation. It is difficult to talk about compensation where somebody is breaking the law.
Compensations cannot be paid to trespassers. If we encourage that, there would come a time when -- I tell people they would leave their house in the morning and by the time they get there in the evening, somebody else would be in the house and tell them to compensate them before they leave the house. This is because illegality would have been transformed into legality and created rights.
Mr Speaker, it is a very general question and it has to be looked at on a case by case basis. The standard gage would not pass through the same right of way as a narrow gage. I talked about the minimum radius -- the minimum gage, because it goes faster, cannot have those sharp curves. So, we are acquiring a new right of way as we go along.
Mr Speaker, on the Western line, five kilometres away from the main Accra- Takoradi road in a place called Eshiam; a new land has to be acquired because the curve there is too sharp. To Tarkwa, there would be about three or four places where new land would be acquired.
Where new land is being acquired then compensation has to be paid and that is provided for in article 20 of the Constitution. It would be paid according to what is known in International Law as the Hull Principles - fair and adequate compensation.
Mr Speaker, another thing that is being done is that when these projects are cost, compensation is taken into account. I would want to make it clear that I do not see my way clear in paying compensation to a trespasser.
My position has not changed, unless perhaps some superior legal luminary comes to tell me that my position is wrong.
Mr Speaker 12:30 p.m.
Thank you very much, Hon Minister for Railways Development, for attending to the House to answer our Questions.
You are respectfully discharged.
Hon Members, at the Commencement of Public Business, item numbered 5 -- Presentation of Papers.
Hon Minister for Finance --
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:30 p.m.
Mr Speaker, may I crave the indulgence of the House to enable the Hon Deputy Minister for Finance to stand in the stead of the Hon Minister for Finance to lay these documents.
Mr Speaker, as we know, the Hon Minister for Finance is in the winding up stage.
Mr Speaker 12:30 p.m.
Hon Deputy Minister for Finance?
PAPERS 12:30 p.m.
Mr Speaker 12:30 p.m.
Hon Members, item numbered 5 (b) on the Order Paper.
Chairman of the Committee?
rose
Mr Speaker 12:30 p.m.
Yes, Hon Member?
Mr Ashiamah 12:30 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I am the Hon Deputy Ranking Member on the Committee of Communications.
This Paper was laid last week but we said we have not met and it has come up today, too, so I just want to inform you that your Committee has still not met to discuss the issue on this (Malabo Convention) Memorandum.
Mr Speaker 12:30 p.m.
Hon Majority Leader, any indication as to the situation?
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:30 p.m.
Mr Speaker, yes, I am reliably informed that item numbered 5 (b) on the Order Paper, has not been worked on, so it cannot be taken.
Mr Speaker, we could deal with item numbered 6.
Mr Speaker 12:30 p.m.
Hon Members, item numbered 6 on the Order Paper the Procedural Motion.
Hon Chairman of the committee?
Chairman of the Committee (Dr Kwabena Twum-Nuamah) 12:40 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I beg to move, that notwithstanding the provisions of Standing Order 80(1) which require that no Motion shall be debated until at least forty-eight hours have elapsed between the date on which notice of the Motion is given and the date on which the Motion is moved, the Motion for the adoption of the Report of the Committee on Health on the Commercial Agreement (Engineering, Procurement and Construction Agreement) between the Government of the Republic of Ghana (Ministry of Health) and Engineering, Development & Construction Ltd. (EDC) for an amount of forty million, five hundred thousand Euros (€40,500,000) for works known as “Completion of University of Ghana Medical Centre , Phase 2” under a turnkey project involving Expansion Works at the University of Ghana Medical Centre may be moved today.
Mr Governs K. Agbodza 12:40 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I beg to second the Motion.
Mr Speaker 12:40 p.m.
Thank you very much.
Question put and Motion agreed to.
Resolved accordingly.
Mr Speaker 12:40 p.m.
Item numbered 7 -- Hon Chairman of the Committee.
MOTIONS 12:40 p.m.
Chairman of the Committee (Dr Kwabena Twum-Nuamah) 12:40 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I beg to move, that this Honourable House adopts the Report of the Committee on Health on the Commercial Agreement (Engineering, Procurement and Construction Agreement) between the Government of the Republic of Ghana (Ministry of Health) and Engineering, Development & Construction Ltd. (EDC) for an amount of forty million, five hundred thousand Euros (€40,500,000) for works known as “Completion of University of Ghana Medical Centre -- Phase 2” under a turnkey project involving Expansion Works at the University of Ghana Medical Centre.
Mr Speaker, in so doing, I present your committee's Report.
Introduction
On Friday, 29th June, 2018, the following Paper was presented in Parliament by the Hon Minister responsible for Health, Mr Kwaku Agyeman-Manu:
“The Commercial Agreement (Engineering, Procurement and Construction Agreement) between
SPACE FOR BREAKDOWN - 12:40 p.m.
Mr Speaker 12:40 p.m.
The Hon Second Deputy Speaker will take the Chair at this stage. During the process, the Hon Leaders will be at the Lobby together with me to conduct some other business at one o'clock.
MR SECOND DEPUTY SPEAKER
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:50 p.m.
Any seconder?
Mr Umar Alhassan (NDC -- Zabzugu) 12:50 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I beg to second the Motion but I have a few comments to make. Mr Speaker, even though this is a critical time and we do need additional hospital space, this loan came at a critical time and I also have some observations.
According to the Report, our observation points to the consumables and certain items that we believe must be questioned in this critical time with the much touted “Ghana Beyond Aid”. Mr Speaker, I see it to be very unfortunate that we take loans to finance consumables -- recurrent expenses.
Mr Speaker, it is also unfortunate that we take loans to finance technical training since this is a hospital that we already say is a specialist hospital. Therefore, if we have a specialist hospital, where we would employ specialists, then I believe

that we do not have to train specialists. If we are hiring optometrists or gynae- cologists then we should hire same.

Mr Speaker, also the Hospital's core mandate is supposed to prevent deaths but this loan is going to expand the morgue to store more than 250 dead bodies.

Mr Speaker, whereas this Hospital is supposed to prevent deaths, it looks as if there is an incentive to attract -- [Laughter] -- Mr Speaker, they are budgeting for dead bodies and I believe that we need to find other alternatives; I question it.

Also, the core mandate of hospitals is to provide preventive medicine and cure but not real estates. Mr Speaker, this loan that we are going for to operationalise an existing hospital, which is at Phase 2, could have already been operationalised.

The Hospital which is known as the University of Ghana Medical Hospital has nothing wrong with it and it should have already been operating, but according to the Report this loan is to operationalise it.

Mr Speaker, I believe that it is enough, and because of the critical nature of health needs and hospitals, I support the Motion but these are the observation I want the Hansard to capture for the future.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Question proposed.
Dr Nana Ayew Afriye (NPP -- Effiduase-Asokore) 12:50 p.m.
Mr Speaker, thank you so much for the opportunity to contribute to the Report.
Mr Speaker, this Report is being considered for adoption at the right time because lately there has been a lot of public spirited interest in the operations of the University of Ghana Medical Centre.
Mr Speaker, it is realised from the Report as well as the deliberations of the Committee that the hospital was not operating because of the fact that the Phase 2 project had the acquisition of consumables and the commercialisation of the pharmacy.
Mr Speaker, it also takes into consideration the siting of a plant that would provide back-up power in case of electricity power outage. It is very important for this to be available before a hospital operates fully. But be that as it may, for a complete hospital, whether the life expectancy is 2000 years, 100 years or 99 years, we would all find ourselves in the morgue eventually.
Mr Speaker, it is only important that that provision is made nonetheless and for that matter it found itself in the phase
2.
Mr Speaker, since this is more of a facility which is advanced over that of a tertiary provision, it is clear that some innovations are added to it and that is what the public would want to ask going forward.
There is a provision in the Phase 2 for an IT software and this is obviously very good because clinics have now moved from folders to a folder-less system and there is something which is also called Healthcare Client Relationship Manage- ment.
Mr Speaker, the hospital may always want to get repeated patients and also use means to retain its patients and so the hospital would have to operate in a manner
that would attract people and make it very competitive.
The person would want to get people to send birthday cards and appointment schedules. Therefore, it is very good to see a component as that of the IT software system which would obviously mean that this centre would be more advanced. It would be one of the kind that would not be faced with the issue of “no-bed syndrome.”
Mr Speaker, obviously, if there is an IT system that could tell at the emergency unit how many beds are in the wards, then it would be able to calculate and they would be up to scratch with admission.
Mr Speaker, it is so clear that if this hospital finds itself fully operational, if we have the facility approved, then Ghanaians would have the full benefits of the facility. Mr Speaker, therefore, with these few words, I would be very happy if this House approves this Motion.
Mr Speaker, thank you.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:50 p.m.
Hon Minority Leader.
Mr Haruna Iddrisu (NDC -- Tamale South) 1 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I would crave your indulgence because ordinarily I should have to wait to hear the contributions of other Hon Members and endeavour to conclude.
Mr Speaker, but I would have to join Mr Speaker and the Hon Majority Leader, therefore, permit me to make some comments on the Commercial Agreement (Engineering, Procurement and Construc-
Mr Haruna Iddrisu (NDC -- Tamale South) 1 a.m.
Assuming tomorrow we have a medical emergency on strike actions, we are likely to rely on the 37 Military Hospital. And so the Hon Minister should get some particular attention paid to the 37 Military Hospital and equip it appropriately particularly in respect of the computed tomography scan.
Mr Speaker, may I refer to page 5 of your Committee's Report, paragraph 4.6 and for the Hon Chairman and members of the Committee to note. What are we being asked to consider?
This is not the Loan Agreement as if we were just approving our mandate and authority under article 181 of the Constitution. We are looking at the works contract, and to quote his words, “Engineering procurement and Construc- tion Agreement”.
Mr Speaker, I beg to quote paragraph 4.6 to make my point.
“The issue of value for money was also raised during the deliberations, and the Committee was informed that the value for money audit was not yet ready.”
What are we approving? What is guiding this approval? We do not have value for money audit; and are they coming to Parliament for the approval of this one?
Mr Speaker, oversight is what Parliament exercises and that oversight reflects in ensuring scrutiny for value for money. When we do not have value for money, this House is being called upon to give approval. These are not my words. It says:
“The value for money audit was not yet ready”.
So, the Hon Minister has to assure us that whenever the value for money audit is conducted and the result is ready, he would apprise this House of it because we must know. Other than that, ordinarily, I was going to ask that we stand it down. If we do not have value for money, what are we approving?
Mr Speaker, let me come to the specifics. For instance, in the same paragraph, in the table there, construction cost is €10.7 million working to US$12.585 million. It is for the construction of what?
We just give €10 million for construction. Are they building additional -- Are they adding to the beds. Are they building a pathology centre? What are they building?
Sometimes, it is important that when the Committee is reporting to us they give us the detail breakdown. They cannot just say that we should spend US$12 million on construction. Construction of what? We need to know; and this is works contract. We are not just asking for approval of the loan. So, what is the US$12 million going to be for so that we can follow through?
Mr Speaker, I also see in the same paragraph, which is paragraph 4.5 of the Committee's Report, €9.23 million on outstanding payment. We need evidential information in the first phase of the project which cost was also varied from what we are reading from their Report.
We are paying €9.23 as outstanding payment. They should apprise the Committee and sometimes the Committee must attach that appendix for us to look at.
Mr Speaker, my other difficulty is contractor 's design and project management. It is US$6 million just on contractor's design of what? The hospital has been completed and they are coming to do additional work to operationalise it, and do they need US$6 million for construction design and project management?
Justification -- for project manage- ment, it is yes, but contractor's design -- Is it the design that we must spend US$6 million on?
Mr Speaker, my advice is that the people of Ghana have huge expectations of Parliament in our exercise of oversight, and they expect us to be more diligent in our scrutiny as we sit to exercise this oversight.
We should just not be tolerant and accommodative of numbers. We should interrogate the numbers. We need to know what we are constructing and the cost.
At least, it is commendable that I see the medical and project management equipment have been managed. Instead of the one-year warranty, there is a two- year warranty. That is commendable and that should be the case.
To the Hon Minister, as I said, in many of the hospitals like the 37 Military Hospital, an additional two-year warranty has been provided.
Mr Speaker, we just cannot say “approve €40,500,000.00 for second phase of the hospital.” It is heart-warming that, at least finally, it has been operationalised and functional. We expect that we see an improvement in medical training of doctors by the university.
I think that one of these days, the Hon Minister should be considering a Cabinet policy review for all the teaching hospitals to be made autonomous.
Why can they not pay for their staff with all the moneys they are generating as hospitals, whether it is Korle-Bu Teaching Hospital or Tamale Teaching Hospital or Komfo Anokye Teaching Hospital? We need to take a second look at it. They generate incomes and revenue, yet they continue to depend on the State.
The University is such an important institution, and we should see specialist training emerging out of it. This is huge investment on the social sector.
As for the politics of who is now borrowing and who has not borrowed, I do not intend to go there. A few years ago, I heard the President in the Volta Region that he was commissioning Ghana projects. It is a commendable comment by the President.
He was directed by the directive principle of State policy to continue projects initiated by the previous Administration. What we ask of the President is to acknowledge the initiative and how it started.
This is because, for many of them, in one breath, he barstardises the previous National Democratic Congress (NDC) Administration that they were borrowing, then when he goes to inaugurate the borrowed project, he should let the people of Ghana know that this is one of the borrowed projects.
But when he says Government was borrowing and he goes to inaugurate a clinic with borrowed money or go and inaugurate Legon Hospital with borrowed money -- Certainly, this was not funded from the Consolidated Fund.

What we ask of His Excellency the President and Hon Ministers -- It is not that what the President is doing is wrong; what he is doing is appropriate for the development of our country.

Even though we are not housed, anytime I drive on the Wamali-Sagnarigu road and see the abandoned housing project, we have no reason as a country not to have completed that initiative. I am sure under the former President Kufuor -- but we politicise all these.

So, when the President is happy to be inaugurating, he must happily announce to the people that those projects were initiated by such or in such period and they are being funded by borrowed moneys which is what has accumulated into what we now call a national debt. That is what we asked for. We are not saying what he is doing is inappropriate.

We hope the Hon Minister and the Management of the University would sit and have a rapprochement in terms of the management of this hospital, so that it can serve the better objective to which the hospital was built.

Mr Speaker, with these words, I would want an undertaking from the Hon Minister that, firstly, value-for-money audit would be done; secondly, we would be apprised of the outcome of the value for money audit. We need to tidy up these numbers. We just cannot say construction is US$12 million. It is for the construction of what?

So our Committees must work, so that we know. If they are going to do additional beds, they should let us know.
Dr Kwaku Afriyie (NPP-- Sefwi- Wiawso) 1:10 p.m.
Mr Speaker, thank you very much.
I rise to call on my Hon Colleagues to support the Motion and approve the loan facility. In doing this, I would draw the attention of the House that through this facility, we have a unique opportunity to advance the frontiers of medicine and to make contributions to the knowledge in medicine, especially in our subregion.
I say this because there are several tropical diseases which have been neglected, and since this facility is going to be a quaternary facility, I have a vista of this facility providing leadership in experimental medicine, delving into uncommon diagnostic and surgical procedures which are not common in our part of the world.
Mr Speaker, I also believe that it would provide the opportunity for skills development, and it also has the capacity to provide very specialised care. In fact, when we progress from the tertiary care, we have what we call the acuity level.
That borders on the frontiers of medicine, and I have no doubt in my mind that this facility could provide the linkage between basic research and clinical
practice, and also patient care in Ghana and the wider subregion.
Mr Speaker, to conclude, I believe that it would also provide us with the opportunity to translate scientific advances into new therapies and diagnostic tools. It would also provide the linkages between the existing facilities.
For example, I notice that it is in physical proximity with Noguchi Memorial Centre. They could be the operational linkages.
As a proud alumnus of the University of Ghana Medical School, I welcome this Motion and call on all Hon Members to support and approve the facility.
Mr Speaker, thank you for the opportunity.
Mr Kwame Governs Agbodza (NDC-- Adaklu) 1:10 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I thank you for the opportunity to contribute to the Motion for the approval of the Commercial Agreement for the phase 2 of the University of Ghana Medical Centre project.
Mr Speaker, as a country we must be proud of ourselves for being able to do this for ourselves now and for the future.
Mr Speaker, today, we are told that the Ministry and its agencies have taken steps to start the process of opera- tionalization of this hospital. Indeed, the
country must be aware that it would take some time for that facility to become fully operational where all the range of services that they intend to provide are provided. So I do not think anybody should be running there with stomach ache or headache yet.
In any case, even if it is fully operational, it is not a primary care centre; it is a referral centre. Sometimes we need to put politics aside and educate ourselves so that we could do the right things.
A quaternary hospital is the highest level of referral centre in our country, and may it be so. Government must, however, take steps to provide primary care facilities as well; the Community-based Health Planning and Services (CHPS) compounds and the health centres must be there, so that we could advise people to take their little problems there.
Mr Speaker, your Committee's Report has a few things that we need to interrogate. Indeed, having served at the Ministry yourself, you are aware that regarding the phase 2 loan agreement, it was always going to be required for the Ministry to bring a request for additional funding to Parliament, because as the master plan of the project, we thought these projects should be self-sustaining, so the Ministry and its agencies added some facilities that are actually fee-paying.
There is IVF and other things, even wards that we call VIP wards that are a mid-way between a hotel and your house, where people could go and pay real money for the facility to generate funds to support itself.
The Committee was told that these are all in line. The only thing that was missing was that, the original idea was to have an escrow account, where we could say that
Mr Kwame Governs Agbodza (NDC-- Adaklu) 1:20 a.m.
the moneys collected are put in an escrow account and used to pay for the loan directly.
The Ministry is now saying when the hospital takes the moneys, they would put them in the Consolidated Fund.
The fear is that in the climate in which we are, it is going to be difficult for the Hon Minister for Health to convince the Hon Minister for Finance to hand over that money for them to pass on to the lenders, but I am hopeful that the Hon Minister would be able to do that. Today it is being operationalised.
Mr Speaker, on the issue of warranties, we must commend the Ministry for taking other steps apart from the one year manufacturer's warranty on the critical equipment such as the MRI, CT scans and others, which are very expensive; any of them could be over US$1 million per head.
They are buying two years extra warranties. So for the next three years, we could be rest assured that the equipment would function.
Mr Speaker, however, we have a problem in this country. You would be surprised that majority of our cutting- edge diagnostic equipment that we have invested in the last five years are not functional, simply because over the years, as a country, when we get developers to do these hospitals, we allow them to pick and choose which equipment to bring.
So a developer comes and says “I am building a hospital, I would use general electric scanners”; and then another comes and says he would use Philips. At the end of the day, none of them has got an in-country well fitted set out that could actually do repairs or servicing of same.
Mr Speaker, we expect the Ministry to develop a policy on hospital equipment, where we would say to anybody coming to do development of these projects, that we only subscribe to perhaps two suppliers, general electrics of Philips or Toshiba, and whatever they do must be part of this, so that we ask these developers to come and set up in this country.
Then we do not have a situation where we invest US$ 3 million in an MRI scanner at almost every regional hospital, and when you go there, nobody could do a scan, which is a waste of money.
The last time we spent over US$ 200 million on the Bell Star project. I wonder if even one of those scanners is working today. Some of them just need helium gas replacement, and there is nobody there to even provide the money for the replacement of these gases.
Mr Speaker, the issue of value for money came up, and the Hon Minister assured us that the value-for-money assessment is in progress. He gave us the assurance that he would come to Parliament to apprise us of how it goes, and whatever the outcome or recommendation of value for money is, they are committed to implement it.
We encouraged them that since this is an on-going project, the rates that they have used to produce bills for payment could be used.
Mr Speaker, it would interest you to know that the second phase has only three new things we are building. We are not building any clinical things. We have built the shells for everything, we are only doing fit-ups, whether it is the mortuary or pharmacy.

The only three new things we are building is workers' bungalow, security fencing and electricity substation.

I am sure we have passed that previous political stage about the UGMC not being operational because we do not have power supply. Indeed, the generators are there. However, we believe that a facility of that size needs its own substation. So, it is appropriate for the Ministry to take steps to provide that substation so that it would be more reliable.

And the other things about the outstanding debt; indeed, there is evidence of an outstanding debt on phase I which the Ministry needed to pay from this facility. I am happy we are going to do this and get over it.

But Mr Speaker, hence forth, never again should we, the politicians allow ourselves down the route of pretending that one party or the other deliberately decides to inflate prices.

Mr Speaker, I would have to say this; not too long ago, somebody said that the Ministry was in the habit of building a hospital that cost US$20 million and the Vice President said that they could build it for US$3 million. Mr Speaker, that is a palpable untruth. It is not possible.

What the Vice President saw was a minute clinic done by the Ministry of Roads and Highways as part of a composite project and it was not even supposed to be equipped. You are comparing 3000 square metres to over 10,000 square metres.

Mr Speaker, I would say that if anybody, including the Vice President

could prove to me that they could build one-hundred-and-fifty-bed district hospital for US$3 million, Mr Speaker, I would pay for it.

So, we should not allow these things to go down the record. You cannot build a fully-equipped district hospital for US$3million.

It is not possible, so people should tell the Vice President; do not lead us into temptation where the public thinks that, as politicians, we come here and then create situations and flee this country.

It is not possible and that advice must go to both sides of the House where we have the temptation of always knowing the price of everything but knowing the value of nothing.

Three-unit classroom block in Adaklu must be the same price at East Legon. But it does not work like that in industry. There are locational differences that make prices differ.

So, Mr Speaker, as a country, we must be proud today; we have built for ourselves a world class health facility that you would hardly see in West Africa. Now, it is time for us to operationalise it and make sure that we could maintain it, that this hospital could last.

Who knows a few of us, if we are lucky, may be patients there before we pass on to whereever we would go after this life. But as long as it works well, I am sure that posterity would judge.

I urge the Hon Minister to take some of these pieces of advice critically; firstly, we want to know what happens as regards value for money; secondly, we want the communication beyond this to be straight. The Hon Minister and his Public Relations Officers should not confuse us again.

This hospital has been operationalised today. In the past, they told us they needed this loan to operationalise it; we are talking about this loan today and we have operationalised it. What does it mean? It means that the inability to operationalise it initially was not entirely the issue of this loan.

That is the fact. This is because if we have not approved the loan but we have operationalised it, it means we could have done that in 2017 the same way. But guess what, politics aside, I believe this is a good loan agreement; let us do this for ourselves.

When the President commissions anything that the previous Government started, all we require is acknowledge- ment. Acknowledgement that, “Yes, you have done something.”

Mr Speaker, finally, when they said we have borrowed money but they do not know what we used it for, and then they go commissioning the same things, as the Hon Leader said, I believe it is appropriate for the country to know that when the NDC borrowed, they saw what we did with it because they commissioned it.

However, their GH¢35 billion borrowing, we are yet to see a hencoop for it.

Mr Speaker, with these few words, I urge my Hon Colleagues to approve this Agreement to allow the Hon Minister for Health and their agencies to complete this project for Ghana and for all of us.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:20 a.m.
Hon Members, this is a House of reason, it is not a House of emotions. When I am presiding, I am not going to tolerate any of those catcalls that are mischievous. And I see those who make those noises. [Laughter.]
rose rose
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:20 a.m.
Is that the Hon Minister for Health? I thought you would allow the Hon Members to express their views and then you could take that on board when you are winding up.
Mr Agyeman-Manu 1:20 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I thought Leadership had agreed that there would be two from each side of the House who would speak and I would wind up as Hon Minister for Health.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:20 a.m.
Yes, I saw on the other Side, your senior on his feet, who might have also worked on the same project.
Mr Agyeman-Manu 1:20 a.m.
Mr Speaker, the Hon Minority Leader yielded his opportunity to speak to him.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:20 a.m.
I am not bound by what the Hon Leaders agree on; I have to express and exercise my discretion. So, I am saying that the Hon Member for Wa West who was on the same Seat is on his feet, so after him you would be given all the opportunity to give an appropriate response.
Hon Member for Wa West?
Mr Joseph Yieleh Chireh (NDC-- Wa West) 1:20 a.m.
Mr Speaker, thank you very much. I was engaged in something else very important for the work of Parliament and that is why I was not here from the beginning.
But first of all, we are all happy that at long last, the phase 2 of the project is going to be done. And the effort of the previous Government has been continued by this Government, even though, as we always say, eighteen months late. Better late than never!
Mr Speaker, again, we are all happy that this facility which one of its kind, at least in the subregion, would serve not only Ghanaians. We, as politicians have been lambasted and crucified because they say, when we are sick, they fly us outside.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:20 a.m.
Hon Member, is it that “they say,” or it is the truth?
Mr Chireh 1:20 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I do not know. I see that other people other than politicians are also flown outside.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:20 a.m.
Yes, but they are using their own resources and if they are using State's resources, it is approved by the politicians. So, we are leading and we have to take the responsibility. So, kindly accept it; it is not that. “they say” and let us see how we could improve on that.
Mr Chireh 1:20 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I take guidance from you. They say and I believe that, that is what happens.
Now, one of the real reasons for this facility is to make Ghanaians know that the politicians are also thinking of how to reduce the cost of sending critically ill people to India, South Africa, America or
anywhere else. At least, if we operationalise it and it is effective, at least, the airfare would not be part of the problem.
Mr Speaker, again, the critical mass of specialists that we would produce would then be available to the rural areas and regions far away from the urban centres.
So, my advice to the new management of this facility is, as much as possible, ensure that people who are trained there, people who get service there, realise that we, as politicians, also think about the ordinary people in terms of closeness to where they could be treated.
That is one of the reasons at the beginning, many of us were calling for this operationalisation. Since it is a policy choice, it has been decided and we could only continue that way.
However, as my Hon Friend who spoke before me advised, any time this is done, it should be done because we do not want national resources to be wasted. We do not want investments to be ignored and we would think about creating new ones.
Our Constitution frowns on that and we know that whatever any past government does, all the succeeding governments must ensure that they are continued. The politics of this, I believe, would be over. As the Health Committee, we would continue to monitor and ensure that what it is meant to do is done.
We would monitor and still urge the Ministry of Health to change its position on how this hospital is to be run. If it is run strictly as a public facility instead of a special purpose vehicle that would be seen to operate a little outside the health system, we would have difficulties.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:30 p.m.
Hon Minister, in view of the issues that have been raised, I would give you ample time to respond to them. So you may have your bite.
Mr Agyeman-Manu 1:30 p.m.
Mr Speaker, let me thank my Hon Colleagues, especially those who sat on the Committee to produce the Report.
I would start by urging all my Hon Colleagues to approve of this Motion for us to be able to continue the work that was started and we are supposed to continue. Some of us talked about politics and continuity and I would want to echo the late President Prof. Mills in one of his State of the Nation Addresses. He said he would continue projects that are justifiable to continue to complete.
I also want to believe that you have all accepted the new thinking of our President H. E. Nana Addo Dankwa Akufo-Addo and his commitment to continue projects that have been started prior to his getting into office.
Mr Speaker, we are talking about projects that were also left before President Mills assumed office but are still undone. Eight years plus 18 months --
Kumasi, the Komfo Anokye Maternity Block, in Fomena -- several of them are littered across the country.
However, as my Hon Colleague said, as politicians we should not do things that would waste State resources which would not give us the intended benefits for which these projects were started. Going forward, we are all learning from our previous mistakes and I believe we would put politics aside and pick on certain things.
Mr Speaker, the Hon Minority Leader talked about unnecessary conflicts that have delayed the operationalisation of this facility for 18 good months. Then, in another breath, he talked about the type of management we would use to run the facility.
He advised that teaching hospitals be made autonomous to the extent that they would pay their own bills for at least current expenditures. This would enable the State get some value for money from the services rendered.
It is because of some of these reasons that I would want to disagree with the Hon Minority Leader that whatever conflict was started was unnecessary. No, they were very legitimate and necessary.
One would sit in the Ministry of Health, go through the Ministry of Finance to borrow money, set up a project implementation unit, award the contract to a turn-key operator and these are all done by the Ministry of Health.
Then another Minister for Health, without the Minister for Finance, would sign off a State asset in health to a university as a gift. Then the university's council would decide to look at how the facility could be managed for us to have value for money.
So, a special purpose company vehicle should be set up. Then Directors are nominated and they use their individual names as directors to set up a state-owned company.
So, a past Vice-Chancellor, who had finished his term, would continue to sit as a Director in his own name. A former Deputy Minister would continue to sit as a Director on the Board in his personal capacity. Same with other people who had finished their terms. Why would we want to do so?
There was no evidence of any agreement or MOU between that special purpose vehicle either with the university or the Ministry of Health, as to what we would do with revenues that might be generated from that place. These are some of the things that we interrogated and which might have led us to this position.
Mr Speaker, I must tell you, on my course of fighting that battle, a lot of things came out. Why would the former Minister for Finance, Mr Seth Terkper, refuse to sign a financial agreement for them to borrow 50 million to do the phase 2, even prior to Nana Addo Dankwa Akufo-Addo's assuming the seat of presidency?
He was not happy. These things were hidden and the State would never know these. These are some of the reasons that strengthened me to continue my fight.
Mr Speaker, I might disclose certain information. At one stage, the current university authorities were bold to tell me that I had fought their battle for them. Why would they say so?
I would want to move on. Uncompleted projects like those in Fomena among others, which I talked about, we are currently --
rose
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:30 p.m.
Hon Minister, I can see your Colleagues on their feet on the other side of the House. Let me just hear what it is about.
Mr Chireh 1:30 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I rise reluctantly because, at this point, the issues that the Hon Minister as a person who is an Accountant and knows about our Companies Code -- Again, he raised issues which people cannot answer. The people have answered in various ways but I do not think that is the conclusion he should come to.
The issues he has raised, maligning and giving bad motives to people in service to their country, I believe that is bad. The Hon Minister should stop going backwards. If he goes backwards, we would all go backwards and whatever it is, we would do.
However, it is not fair and I am very pained about it because we have all served this country and we do not want people after we have served this country, to just malign us using political platforms. It is not right.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:30 p.m.
Hon Minister, it is right to respond to the issues that were raised by your Hon Colleagues. What I can only advise is for you to take his concerns on board as you respond to them. However, it is appropriate that the Hon Minister states his case clearly as to why they took those steps.
So, it is the name calling that is going beyond the rules. This is because those people are not here to defend themselves. So, Hon Minister, take that on board as we go along.
Mr Agyeman-Manu 1:40 p.m.
Thank you.
Mr Speaker, I believe I have taken a lot of bashing for the non-operationalisation of the facility as early as January, 2017 and I believe that this is my little chance to explain to the entire Plenary of the House for people to have sympathy and passion towards me and stop the bashing across the media at the Hon Minister for Health.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:40 p.m.
Hon Minister, I have given you the opportunity to respond. I only said the name calling should stop, since, those you are mentioning are not here to defend themselves. But definitely, you have to state your point and state it clearly; that I agree with you.
Mr Agyeman-Manu 1:40 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I would continue.
The loans were structured to come in two phases. The phase 1 is what we spent according to the Report and the documentation I sent here. It is close to about US217 million dollars.
The phase 2 of the facility, apparently, was structured such that without that loan, we just cannot operationalise the Phase 1. My Hon Colleague on the opposite side tried to talk about why we should not borrow to procure consu- mables to run the hospital.
But that was how the entire project was structured. Even the consumables that we ought to procure should be procured by the turnkey operator, not the Ministry.
So, it was like build, stock it with everything and then even train for us so that we just come and take over a facility that is already in motion. That was how the facility was structured.
Therefore, for the Phase 2 that includes consumables, if you do not borrow the money, you cannot operationalise it.

Mr Agbodza — rose --
Mr Agyeman-Manu 1:40 p.m.
If Mr Speaker is not aware, I would tell him.
I can tell Mr Speaker so the Hon Member on his feet should please sit down. I would tell Mr Speaker myself.
Mr Speaker, we came to meet a situation where --
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:40 p.m.
Hon Minister, you address Mr Speaker; you do not “tell” Mr Speaker. You are speaking to the whole world through the House. So, when you say “If Mr Speaker does not know, I would tell him”, that kind of language is unparliamentary and unacceptable and you would have to withdraw it.
Mr Agyeman-Manu 1:40 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I thank you for your counsel. I withdraw that language with all respect.
Mr Speaker, I would now say I would address Mr Speaker myself and I am still on Finance.
Mr Speaker, still on Finance, we came to meet empty coffers as everybody knows in our country. We had challenges --
Mr Ahmed Ibrahim — rose --
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:40 p.m.
Hon First Deputy Minority Whip, why are you on your feet? I have seen you on your feet for some time now.
Mr Ahmed Ibrahim 1:40 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I am just empathising with you and the Hon Minister on his feet is not sensing the collective wisdom of the House to follow you.
Mr Speaker, you said we should not speak to emotions. We should look around the normal and go accordingly. People are telling him, “repeat it! repeat it!” even when you are guiding him.
Mr Speaker, the Hon Minister is a senior Member of this House. Sensible issues have been raised by Hon Members on the Report. He should try to bring the House together and toe the line of his Leadership, including Mr Speaker. If all of us are to listen to Members saying “repeat it”, even when the Chair is guiding us, we would run into difficulties.
The Hon Minister should look around and go accordingly. As I sit here as Deputy Minority Whip, Hon Members are coming to me and saying they would want to do this and that and I say no; let us tone down and listen to the responses coming. But he is rather worsening issues in the House.
Mr Speaker, we are less than 50 Hon Members in the House. We need 138 Hon Members in the House before the Question can even be put and before a decision can be made. So, while the Chair is saying he should not raise controversial issues, the Hon Member is talking about value for money and all those things.
We are managing the House together with the Chair. He should therefore tone down accordingly.
Mr Agyeman-Manu 1:40 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I would take counsel from Leadership since the Hon Member is now representing the Minority side.
Mr Speaker, I would want to commit myself to the sentiments expressed by contributors on the Motion. And I would want to assure the House that I would come back to apprise the House anytime the value-for-money audit is completed. That I would try to do.
Mr Speaker, we are already in the process of developing a policy for hospital equipment. I believe that would shift a little bit from what we have been doing in the past where suppliers train their own people to come and install equipment and they leave everything and go.
Then we do not have efficiency in terms of building capacity for biomedical engineering in the facilities and across the country. So, we have already taken that on board.
Mr Speaker, we are also taking steps to address the problem of the substation on which I was seriously quoted out of context by talking about generators. So, that is on board and we are going to complete it in another 18 months.
We have started with the Electricity Company of Ghana (ECG) and Millennium Development Authority (MiDA) is assisting us to also address that.
Mr Speaker, we are still looking at what type of management we should use to work in the facility. The Interim Manage- ment is helping us to operationalise it. We have gone on to request for advertising for permanent, actual calibre management people to see how we could work to gain some value from the facility.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:40 p.m.
Hon Minister for Health, I thank you very much.
Question put and Motion agreed to.
Hon Majority Chief Whip?
Mr Ameyaw-Cheremeh 1:50 a.m.
Mr Speaker, we may take item numbered 8 which is the Resolution.
RESOLUTIONS 1:50 a.m.
Minister for Health (Mr Kwaku Agyeman-Manu) 1:50 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I beg to move,
THIS HONOURABLE HOUSE 1:50 a.m.
HEREBY RESOLVES AS 1:50 a.m.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:50 a.m.
Any seconder?
Chairman of the Committee (Dr Kwabena Twum-Nuamah) 1:50 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I beg to second the Motion.
Question put and Motion agreed to.
Resolved accordingly.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:50 a.m.
Hon Majority Chief Whip, any indication as to the next item to take?
Mr Ameyaw-Cheremeh 1:50 a.m.
Mr Speaker, the Report on item numbered 9 is not ready. It could be taken on Friday because tomorrow would be a very busy day for the Mid-Year Review of the Budget Statement.
Mr Speaker, we may consider the Right to Information Bill, 2018 but looking at the time and Business, you may suspend Sitting for some time so that we could come back to it; but we are at your convenience.
Mr Ahmed Ibrahim 1:50 a.m.
Mr Speaker, tomorrow, 19th July, 2018, is a special day and you know Hon Members are supposed to be seated in the Chamber early in the morning for the Mid-Year Review of the Budget Statement to be presented to this House.
Mr Speaker, even as I speak, the Hon Attorney-General and Minister for Justice is not in the House and it is almost 2.00 p.m.
Ordinarily, the House is supposed to Sit from 10.00 a.m. and adjourn at 2.00 p.m. So we are officially done with the normal Sitting hours, but because tomorrow is a special day, the media would engage Hon Members on their prospects or expectations on the Mid-Year Review of the Budget Statement to be presented tomorrow.
Mr Speaker, Hon Members would be engaged in almost all the media houses from this time till tomorrow morning, so I believe it is an appropriate time for this House to adjourn to enable Hon Members to go and do their engagements with media houses and then we could come early tomorrow.
Mr Speaker, if the Hon Majority Chief Whip would side with me, I believe that would be better.
Mr Ameyaw-Cheremeh 1:50 a.m.
Mr Speaker, we may have to do some work on the Right to Information Bill, 2018, and take it forward. Looking at the Business for
tomorrow, we would not be able to consider it. If we even do two hours when we return from suspension, it would be all right.
The Hon Chairman of the Committee, the Hon Ranking Member and the other Hon Members are ready to work, but that was why I said that we are at your convenience.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:50 a.m.
Hon Majority Chief Whip, the issue that the Hon Deputy Minority Whip raised concerning the absence of the Hon Attorney-General and Minister for Justice is important.
The Right to Information Bill, 2018 is so critical to the health of our democracy and the enjoyment of our rights and freedoms as a people. So far, we have been carrying on without the Hon Attorney- General and Minister for Justice and it is a cause for worry.
If only she would be available today, we could accede to your call to, at least, sit for two more hours to consider the Bill. This is because the whole country is up in arms against Parliament for the delay in the passage of this very critical Bill, but the allowed absence any time we are considering the Bill is something that cannot be glossed over.
Hon Majority Chief Whip, if you can assure us that the Hon Attorney-General and Minister for Justice would be available this afternoon, I would urge Hon Members to let us accede to your request to at least sit for two more hours today.
Please, what do you say to that?
Mr Ameyaw-Cheremeh 1:50 a.m.
Mr Speaker, the Hon Deputy Attorney-General and Minister for Justice who is also our Hon Colleague was in the Chamber this morning and he has been with us almost
throughout. I cannot vouch for the substantive Hon Minister because I have not got in touch with her today, but the Hon Deputy Attorney-General and Minister for Justice would be available.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:50 a.m.
Where is the Hon Deputy Attorney-General and Minister for Justice?
Mr Ameyaw-Cheremeh 1:50 a.m.
Mr Speaker, he is not in the Chamber presently, but he is within the precincts of Parliament to support in the Consideration Stage.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:50 a.m.
So, you are assuring us that, at least, he would be available?
Mr Ameyaw-Cheremeh 1:50 a.m.
Mr Speaker, exactly so.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:50 a.m.
Hon Deputy Minority Whip?
Mr Ahmed Ibrahim 1:50 a.m.
Mr Speaker, we must not be seen to be inhibiting the passage of the Right to Information Bill, 2018. We are eager to do that and since the Hon Majority Chief Whip said that the Hon Deputy Attorney-General and Minister for Justice would be in the Chamber, we take him at his word.
Mr Speaker, if Sitting would be suspended, the reporting time must be exactly the time we agree to report back so that the two hours can be “strictly two hours.”
Mr Speaker, with that, we agree.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:50 a.m.
For how long do you want the House to be suspended? Is it two hours? Should we return at 4.00 p.m.?
Hon Members, please, when we say 3.00 p.m. or 4.00 p.m., we should mean it. If you are not here by that time, I would take the Chair. So please, be sure of the time.
Mr Ahmed Ibrahim 1:50 a.m.
Mr Speaker, Hon Members are saying that 3.00 p.m. is too close, so we must be in the Chamber by
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 3:30 p.m.
Leadership, kindly guide the Chair.
Mr Ameyaw-Cheremeh 3:30 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I support the proposal put forward by the Hon Deputy Minority Whip, that we should be back at 3.30 p.m.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 3:30 p.m.
Hon Members, the House stands suspended till 3.30 p.m.
2.00 p.m. -- Sitting suspended.
5.08 p.m -- Sitting resumed.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 3:30 p.m.
Hon Majority Leader, any indication?
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:30 p.m.
Mr Speaker, we would want to continue the Right to Information Bill, 2018, from where we left off yesterday, but before then, there is a Paper that I may want to lay on behalf of the Hon Minister for Finance on the Order Paper Addendum --
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 3:30 p.m.
All right. Order Paper Addendum 2.
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:30 p.m.
Mr Speaker, Order Paper Addendum 3.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 3:30 p.m.
I do not have that with me. I have Order Paper Addendum 2.

Hon Members, Order Paper Addendum 3 -- Presentation and First Reading of Bills.

Hon Minister for Finance?
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:30 p.m.
Mr Speaker, respectfully, there are two of the Order Paper Addendum. I have just noticed that the Order Paper Addendum 2 was not attended to in the morning. So, we may have to deal with that first. All of them are supposed to be laid by the Hon Minister for Finance.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 3:30 p.m.
That is why I started with Order Paper Addendum 2, but you drew my attention to Order Paper Addendum 3.
So, Hon Members, let us go back to Order Paper Addendum 2 -- Presentation of Papers by the Hon Minister for Finance.
Hon Minority Leader, is there any disorder?
Mr Iddrisu 3:30 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I heard you say Hon Minister for Finance and I looked to see the Hon Minister for Finance or any of the Hon Deputies --
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 3:30 p.m.
We would have to hear from the Hon Majority Leader first.
Mr Iddrisu 3:30 p.m.
All right. Let us hear him. [Laughter]
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 3:30 p.m.
The Hon Minority Leader is trying to be more in a hurry than the President. [Laughter]
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:30 p.m.
Mr Speaker, it is the same attitude that landed him yesterday where he crash-landed. Mr
Speaker, you must teach him to pace himself very well. Yesterday, he crush landed and so he must be told to keep pace.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 3:30 p.m.
Please, let us go on with Business.
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:30 p.m.
Mr Speaker, as I indicated, there are Papers on the Order Paper Addendum 2 and 3. The two of them are supposed to be laid by the Hon Minister for Finance.
We all know the assignment that the Hon Minister for Finance has to do. So, I would want to crave your indulgence and that of my Hon Colleagues to lay these documents on behalf of the Hon Minister for Finance.
Mr Iddrisu 3:30 p.m.
Mr Speaker, I understand that yesterday there was a crash, but I have not seen any debris in this House [Laughter.]
Mr Speaker, the Leader of Government Business and Hon Minister for Parliamentary Affairs wants to do that on behalf of the Hon Minister for Finance.
Ideally, our advice remains same, that the Hon Minister or his Deputies, at least, one of the Deputies, must dedicate himself and his work to this House so that even in the absence of the Hon Minister, particularly -- Knowing what may happen tomorrow because of mid-year review of the Budget Statement, we can forgive them if they are not here.
So, he can proceed to lay the Papers except that when he says -- I held him to some democratic coup yesterday and he appreciated us. Next time, he would not be served notice.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 3:30 p.m.
The Hon Minister for Parliamentary Affairs would lay the Paper for and on behalf of the Hon Minister for Finance.
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:30 p.m.
Mr Speaker, let me just indicate that for the Order Paper Addendum 2, the first three items, (i), (ii) and (iii) are supposed to be laid by the Hon Minister for Education. It is rather item 1 (iv) and (v) Order Paper Addendum 2 that should be laid by the Hon Minister for Finance.
Mr Speaker, let me lay the one for the Hon Minister for Finance and because there is an Hon Deputy Minister for Education, she will do so on behalf of the Hon Minister for Education.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 3:30 p.m.
Hon Majority Leader, let me draw the attention of the House to the fact that the Order Paper Addendum 2 is accordingly amended.
PAPERS 3:30 p.m.
Minister for Education) 3:30 p.m.
(i) Contract Agreement between the Government of the Republic of Ghana (Ministry of Education) and the AVIC International Holding Corporation of the People's Republic of China for the Ghana-China Project on the Rehabilitation and Upgrading of Equipment in Polytechnics and Technical Institutes (including Technical Universities/Poly- technics).
Referred to the Committee on Education.
Mr Iddrisu 3:30 p.m.
Mr Speaker, you could even include the Leadership of the Committee on Finance. As you come through a supplementary contract, it will be important that the leadership of the Finance Committee can join them.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 3:30 p.m.
Hon Minority Leader, we would have loved to do that but in view of the pressure of work on the Committee on Finance and particularly, what will happen tomorrow, they may not have that pleasure of time to participate in the deliberations of the Committee on Education.
So, let us just allow the Committee on Education to handle these matters.
Hon Majority Leader?
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 5:18 p.m.
Mr Speaker, in these matters, it is always better to allow the leadership of the Committee on Finance to just make space and join the Committee because it is a Commercial Contract Agreement.
So, if the leadership of the Committee on Finance could join them -- But of course, the main Committee is the Committee on Education.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:18 p.m.
I agree with you totally but I am just looking at the practicability because the leadership cannot go and be with the Committee on Education when there is a matter for them to deal with.
In fact, my attention has been drawn to a lot of referrals to the Committee, so, I agree that it would have been better for them to be part of the Committee, but if it is the guidance of the Leadership, then I could proceed to direct that the leadership of the Committee on Finance should join the Committee on Education to consider these referrals.
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 5:18 p.m.
Mr Speaker, in this instance, as I said, the referral is principally to the Committee on Education, but then we would serve copies to the leadership of the Finance Committee and when they peruse the document and they have any useful suggestions, they could then ferry same to the Committee on Education so that they may not have to meet together necessarily.
Mr Speaker, so at the presentation of the Report, one part would not come and say that they were not part of the consideration.
It would go to the Committee on Education, copies would be served to the leadership of the Finance Committee and if they have any useful contributions or suggestions, then they would ferry same to the Committee on Education.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:18 p.m.
Hon Members, in view of the pressure of work on the Hon Members of the Finance Committee, I direct that copies of these Agreements be sent to the leadership of the Committee on Finance, but the referrals are to the Committee on Education.
Does it mean that the Hon Deputy Minister laid the three Agreements for and on behalf of the Hon Minister for Education? Or she just laid one?
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 5:18 p.m.
Mr Speaker, she would lay the three Papers.
By the Deputy Minister for Education (Ms Barbara Ayisi on behalf of the Minister for Education): --
(ii) Supplementary Contrast Agreement No. 1 to Contract No. AVIC/GHZ/11M5003 for the Ghana-China Project on the Rehabilitation and Upgrading of
Equipment in Polytechnics and Technical Institutes (including Technical Universities/Polytechnics) between the Government of the Republic of Ghana (Ministry of Education) and the AVIC International Holding Corpo- ration of the People's Republic of China.
(iii)Supplementary Contract Agree- ment No. 2 to Contract No. AVIC/ GHZ/11M5003 for the Ghana- China Project on the Reha- bilitation and Upgrading of Equipment in Polytechnics and Technical Institutes (including Technical Universities/Polytechnics
between the Government of the Republic of Ghana (Ministry of Education) and the AVIC International Holding Corpora- tion of the People's Republic of China.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:18 p.m.
For the avoidance of doubt, the three Papers have been presented and all of them are referred to the Committee on Education with copies to the leadership of the Committee on Finance for consideration and report to the House.
Referred to the Committee on Education.
We would now move to item numbered 1 (iv) and (v) at page 2 of the Order Paper Addendum 2. Hon Minister for Finance?
By the Minister for Parliamentary Affairs (Mr Osei Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu) (on behalf of the Minister for Finance)
-- 5:18 p.m.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:18 p.m.
Hon Members, we would now take Order Paper Addendum 3 -- Presentation and First Reading of Bills.
The Bill would be presented for and on behalf of the Hon Minister for Finance by the Hon Minister for Parliamentary Affairs.
BILLS -- FIRST READING 5:18 p.m.
Mr Iddrisu 5:18 p.m.
Mr Speaker, if you would indulge me, since it is the Minerals Income Investment Fund Bill 2018, maybe, the leadership of the Committee on Mines and Energy could also join to enrich the process.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:18 p.m.
Usually, without a formal direction, Hon Members are permitted to attend the sittings of all Committees, but to ensure that this is done, I would proceed to direct that the leadership of the Committee on Mines and Energy should join the consideration of this Bill by the Committee on Finance.
Hon Members, we would now return to page 6 of the original Order Paper to consider the Right to Information Bill,
2018.
Hon Members, the Right to Information Bill, 2018 at the Consideration Stage.
BILLS -- CONSIDERATION STAGE 5:18 p.m.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:18 p.m.
Hon Chairman of the Committee, we are back to clause 1.
Chairman of the Committee (Mr Ben Abdallah Banda) 5:18 p.m.
Mr Speaker, we have one more proposed amendment to clause 3 after which we would bring the curtains down on the whole of clause 3.
Mr Speaker, I beg to move clause 3, subclause (2), paragraph (d), delete and insert the following:
“the name, address and the contact details of the information officer or a designated officer of the public institution where a request to access information may be made;”
Mr Speaker, I would like to seek your leave to further amend the proposed amendment specifically, in line 1, delete the word “there” that comes immediately after “and” and insert “any other”.
So the new rendition would read:
“(d) The name, address and any other contact details of the information officer or a designated officer of the public institution where a request to access information may be made;”
Mr Speaker, we are therefore deleting paragraph (d) of subclause (2) and inserting this new amendment.
Mr Rockson-Nelson E. K. Dafeamekpor 5:28 a.m.
— rose —
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:28 a.m.
Hon Dafeamekpor, the Hon Member for South Dayi, I will allow you since you have migrated to join the Leadership.
Mr Dafeamekpor 5:28 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I am in support of the proposed amendment except that the fourth line should read, “where a request to access information is made”.
Instead of “may be made”, I propose that it should be “is made”.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:28 a.m.
Hon Member, we are dealing with a manual.
“2. The manual shall contain
(d) The name, address and any other contact details of the information officer or a designated officer of the public institution where a request to access information may be made;”
That is how it should flow and not “is made”.
Yes, Hon Majority Leader?
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 5:28 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I thought he himself has abandoned the intended amendment because if it is “is made”, then the availability of those pieces of information is depended on when it is made. But if we say “may be made”, then whether or not there is a request, there is an obligation to provide the information.
Mr Dafeamekpor 5:28 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I am guided and so, I would accordingly withdraw my proposed amendment.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:28 a.m.
We are grateful.
Hon Members, I would proceed to put the Question.
Now, for the about third or fourth time, I would put the Question, and I pray that this would be the final on the whole of clause 3.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Clause 3 as variously amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:28 a.m.
I pray that we do not go back to it again.
Clause 7 -- Information relating to law enforcement and public safety
Mr Banda 5:28 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I beg to move --
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:28 a.m.
Hon Chairman, I can see your Hon Ranking Member on his feet.
Hon Ranking Member, the Hon Chairman has not moved the amendment yet or are we out of order?
Alhaji Inusah A. B. Fuseini 5:28 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I am just looking for guidance. Before we come to the advertised amendment, I think clause 7 (1) itself needs an amendment before we go to paragraph (b).
Mr Speaker, it says 5:28 a.m.
“1. Information is exempt from disclosure if it contains matters which if disclosed can reasonably be expected to . . . ”
I think the rendition should be:
“1. Information is exempt from disclosure if it contains matters the disclosure of which can reasonably be expected”.

No. That is better drafting because we are saying that it is exempt from disclosure if it contains matters the disclosure of which and not if disclosed.

I am therefore proposing that we delete “which if disclosed” and insert in its place “the disclosure of which”.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:28 a.m.
Hon Minority Leader?
Mr Haruna Iddrisu 5:28 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I can see that the Hon Inusah Fuseini is concerned about the use of “disclosure” and “disclosed” in the first line. Therefore, he does not want a repeat of the word “disclosed” in the second line to make clause 7 (1) more elegant.
Therefore, it should read “Information is exempt from disclosure if it contains matters reasonably expected to” then the rest of the words are deleted.
Mr Joseph Yieleh Chireh 5:28 a.m.
Mr Speaker, the drafting here and the new drafting style with the use of “of which” and the way it is now, I do not see any problem with it. Rather, if we have these two amendments, one proposed by the Hon Ranking Member and the further amendment by the Hon Minority Leader, it would make it non-relative.
The current rendition makes the information disclosure -- And the fact that this information, if disclosed, would create a problem. That is why it is exempted.
Now, if we delete “if disclosed” and just say “can reasonably be expected'' the relationship between the disclosure and the effect it would have is not there.
In my view, the way it is drafted is still better because it warns us completely of what is likely to happen. But if he further amends and delete these phrases, it is not too elegant, and even if it is shorter, it does not bring out the cause for its exemption.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:38 a.m.
Hon Member, I have not yet gone back to the Committee to see whether the proposal is
Mr Agbodza 5:38 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I am not sure whether we are not being inconsistent. If you read clause 5, it tells you information is exempt from disclosure, then it continues with why the disclosure is exempt.
If you go to clause 6, it says the same thing. Why are we trying to have a different rendition when it comes to clause 7? Why could we not just repeat the preamble for clauses 5 and 6, to make it much simpler?
Mr Speaker 5:38 a.m.
Yes, we did some amendment to clauses 5 and 6, and we actually moved away from the use of the terms “if it” to “where the information”. Instead of saying “if it”, we said that “information is exempt from disclosure where the information contains matters which if disclosed can reasonably be expected to”, then the rest follows.
Hon Chairman, is the Committee amenable to this proposal? The proposed amendment that has been made by the Hon Member for Tamale Central and improved upon by the contributions on the Floor -- If you want, I can read the rendition to you.
Mr Banda 5:38 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I got the sense of the proposed amendment by the Hon Member for Tamale Central. He is making same because of the sake of elegance, but I realise that whether we adopt his proposed amendment or we leave it as it is, the meaning of the provision would not change.
All that the provision is seeking to say is that if the matters contained in the
information are disclosed can reasonably be expected to -- So, Mr Speaker, if we adopt his or we leave it as it is, I am of the humble opinion that the meaning would not be distorted.
So, Mr Speaker, I would go by his proposed amendment to the extent that the sense does not change, for the sake of elegance.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:38 a.m.
My only guidance is to delete the “if it” and replace it with “where the information”.
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 5:38 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I was just going to make the same amendment.
If you look at what we did in clauses 5 and 6, we substituted the “if it” in clause 5 in the opening phrase and then brought “where”. We did the same thing for clause 6, “information is exempt from disclosure where the information is prepared . . . ”
So we would do the same thing for clause 7, “information is exempt from disclosure where the information contains matters, which if disclosed, can rea- sonably be expected to…” and the others would follow.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:38 a.m.
For elegance and consistency.
Mr Defeamekpor 5:38 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I have a different rendition to that of the Leader, and it is to the effect that;
“Information is exempt from disclosure where the disclosure is reasonably expected to
(a) interfere with the prevention, protection or curtailment of contravention or possible contravention of a law”
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:38 a.m.
Hon Member, what are you reading?
Mr Defeamekpor 5:38 a.m.
“Information is exempt from disclosure where the disclosure is reasonably expected to --
Mr Speaker, I believe that the focus of this clause is on the disclosure.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:38 a.m.
It is an exempt clause.
Mr Defeamekpor 5:38 a.m.
Yes, so we are saying that if the disclosure of that information is reasonably to paragraph (a), then there is a long list of instances. That is why I am of the humble opinion that if it is phrased like this, then once any of them can be sprung into life, then that information has to be exempt.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:38 a.m.
Hon Member, the focus is on what is in the information, what it contains, so those words must come.
Ms Safo 5:38 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I totally agree with you. The emphasis of the use of the word “it” in this clause, the way it stands, which we have changed to “where”; the emphasis is not on the disclosure.
The emphasis is on the content of the information where if you disclose such content, then paragraphs (a), (b) and (c) would follow.
So I disagree with the Hon Member when he says the emphasis is on the disclosure. It is rather on the details and the content of the information.
Mr Chireh 5:38 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I am afraid, if we do not consult with the drafters - in drafting, you can use the word “if”. It has a special meaning, and “where” -- It should not be our duty here to change completely “if” to “where”, because in
these provisions each of them has a certain way of carrying the information.
In some cases, you can say “where” and it would be appropriate, but if “if” is used, it also conveys a different meaning.
I am saying that the “if” gives it a relationship, so for a long time now the new drafting styles -- and I believe the Hon Deputy Majority Leader went for the last course in drafting and may be -- So there are so many things that are permissible.
Of course, we could not even say “which”. We were forced at that time to repeat whatever we wanted to say, which was part of what the Hon Ranking Member said, but I do not want us to run into the difficulty of changing every “if” in this legislation as if it is consequential.
I do not believe it would be appropriate. We need to consult with the draftspersons, because there must always be a flow in the drafting.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:38 a.m.
Well, the draftspersons are not around, but “if” is a conditional term, and I think it is not appropriate here. Let us listen to the Hon Majority Leader.
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 5:38 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I was going to dwell on the same thing. The first “if” in the first line is situational, it is not conditional, that is why we are changing it to “where”.
The second “if” is conditional, so we maintain that. So, “information is exempt from disclosure where information contains matters which if disclosed can reasonably be expected to…” then the others would follow. That is how it is supposed to be.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:38 a.m.
So there is no proposal for us to change the second “if”, because that one is appropriate. So I would just read the rendition, and then we can proceed to put the Question, unless somebody disagrees with us. The rendition is that;
“Information is exempt from disclosure where the information contains matters which if disclosed can reasonably be expected to … ”
Mr Quashigah 5:48 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I am wondering if we could not shorten that sentence. This is because I believe strongly that if we say ‘‘information'', it is implied; it contains matters which if disclosed — So, if it should rather read:
“Information is exempt for disclosure if it can —
(a) interfere with …
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:48 a.m.
It is not to exempt information from disclosure, no. It is the content of that information. So, your proposal is run short of it.
But let me listen to the Hon Member for Gomoa West.
Mr Alexander Kodwo Kom Abban 5:48 a.m.
Mr Speaker, mine is a combination of the renditions of the Hon Ranking Member and the Hon Majority Leader. I believe that we could consider this rendition that “information is exempt from disclosure where the information contains matters the disclosure of which can reasonably be expected to…”

So that we maintain the elegance that it brought and then we also would be consistent with the use of “where”.
Mr Iddrisu 5:48 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I may persuade the Hon Fuseini to abandon his objection to clause 7(1), stand it down for you to put the Question and further direct that the draftsperson shall improve it to convey the policy intent, so that we still put the Question on “if” and not “where”.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:48 a.m.
I have a problem with a decision of the House being subject to the discretion of a public officer. So, at the end of the day, we do not see the final rendition again. And who would be held responsible? The House or the draftsperson?
Hon Majority Leader?
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 5:48 a.m.
Mr Speaker, first of all, let me remind us that we could not go beyond 7.00 p. m. We have to leave early to allow the technicians to come and put this House in good shape for tomorrow.
Mr Speaker, the Hon Minority Leader is urging us to close at 6.30 p.m. and when we make progress, he brings us back and wants us to close at 6.30 p. m.
Mr Speaker, respectfully, I believe where we have got to, there is not much contention. That is:
“Information is exempt from disclosure where the information contains matters which if disclosed, can reasonably be expected to . . .”
If we could put the Question on that, I believe we could make good progress.
Alhaji I. A. B. Fuseini 5:48 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I am yielding to the advice of the Hon Minority Leader to abandon my proposal and I am further going by the proposal by the Hon Majority Leader to delete “if it” to be consistent with what we did earlier to read:
“Information is exempt from disclosure where the information contains matters if it is disclosed can reasonably be expected to —”
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:48 a.m.
Hon Members, to expedite matters, the Chair would not permit the movement of any Motion that is not on the Order Paper so that we could move. If there are concerns, you could file them and it would be brought to the attention of the House tomorrow but we would take this one.
Now, the proposal is to delete “if it” in line 1, of clause 7(1) and insert “where the information”.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Mr Banda 5:48 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 7, subclause (1), paragraph (b), line 2, delete “a law” and insert “an enactment”.
Mr Speaker, the new rendition would read 5:48 a.m.
“Information is exempt from disclosure where the information contains matters which if disclosed, can reasonably be expected to
(a)interfere with prevention, detection or curtailment of a contravention or possible contravention of an enact- ment;”
Mr Speaker, the reason for the proposed amendment is that under article 182 of the 1992 Constitution which deals
with interpretation, the interpretation of an enactment is broader and more expansive than law. It includes law, Acts of Parliament, Decrees and so on and so forth.
Mr Speaker, this is the basis for the proposed amendment.
Mr Iddrisu 5:48 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I support the Hon Chairman's proposed amendment. It makes for better reading and carries the intent of the clause. I, therefore, do support it as a co-sponsor.
Mr Ahiafor 5:48 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I am opposed to the amendment proposed by the Hon Chairman of the Committee. Mr Speaker, the reason for opposing the amendment is that, in our Constitution, we have been using laws.
Mr Speaker, I may refer to article 106 of the 1992 Constitution; it reads:
“The power of Parliament to make laws shall be exercised by bills . . .”
Mr Speaker, if we go to article 107 of the 1992 Constitution, it reads 5:48 a.m.
“Parliament shall have no power to pass any law —
Mr Speaker, “law” is used. Mr Speaker, if we go to articles 296 and 297, “law” is also used. So, using law in this particular rendition does not make any problem.
Mr Chireh 5:58 a.m.
Mr Speaker, we are not saying that “law” is not used in the Constitution. But this definition as we say, broadens all the laws that could be made.
What we are talking about is that an enactment includes even subsidiary legislation or other competent body. So, if we say “enactment”, it just shows that
Mr Chireh 5:58 a.m.


it went through a process of enactment. The basic thing we do here is to make laws, so it is not the use of the word.

So I think that “enactment” is better and we should support the amendment by the Hon Chairman.
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 5:58 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I believe we could save time by agreeing with the Hon Chairman of the Committee on the amendment that they want to effect.
I agree with the Hon Member for Avenor-Ave -- [Interruption.] -- For half of Avenor-Ave -- [Laughter.] I agree with the Hon Member for Akatsi South, that it appears the two words are sometimes used interchangeably in the Constitution. If we look at article 11, there “enactment” is subsumed under laws but then if you come to article 295, under interpretation, I guess the matter is put beyond doubt.
So, I believe we could make do with enactment, because properly speaking, as the Hon Member for Wa West said, decrees are not enactments. They have not been passed by Parliament, but that is how the Constitution has also defined it for us. So, it must go along with what the Constitution has told us, even though I disagree with this --
The PNDC Laws were never enacted. They dreamt of them, gave them to us the
following day and said that they were laws. How did they become laws? They were decrees.
Mr Speaker, I believe we could go with the definition offered by article 295 to save time. All what we are saying here is going to form part of the interpretation of the Act, should any conflict arise after the passage of the Bill. So, let us go with the proposal by the Hon Chairman and save ourselves good time.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:58 a.m.
The difficulty I have is that the Constitution of Ghana is part of the laws of Ghana but the definition of an enactment in the Constitution does not include the Constitution.
That is the difficulty I have and we are bound by the definition of “enactment” in the Constitution. We are looking at a provision that would encompass all the laws of Ghana and article 11 is clear on the laws of Ghana. So, are we excluding the Constitution?
Mr Chireh 5:58 a.m.
Mr Speaker, as you rightly said, the Constitution defines “enactment”. Now, we know that the Constitution is above all the enactments we make. What we are doing -- It is other enactments we are talking about and not the Constitution. It is not part of the enactmens.
Why I say so is that it is of a certain category. So, any other enactment -- As for the Constitution, it already exists. We cannot now reduce it to an enactment or subsume it under a law. That is why its inclusion in enactments would be inappropriate.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:58 a.m.
Let me listen to the Hon Chairman before I come to Hon Members.
Mr Banda 5:58 a.m.
Mr Speaker, first of all, “the laws of Ghana” is a term of art and under it is listed the components of the laws of Ghana. However, the Constitution is a law and under article 295 of the Constitution, an enactment is defined to include a law.
So, if we agree that the Constitution is a law, it means that the Constitution is part of the definition of an enactment. This is because if an enactment includes a law and the Constitution is a law, it therefore means enactment captures the Constitution.
Article 11 is only talking about the laws of Ghana and “the laws of Ghana”, we all know, is a term of art. This is because we cannot say “the enactment of Ghana”. That is how the Constitution terms it; the laws of Ghana. So, I do not think we would be far from right if we say enactment includes the Constitution of the Republic of Ghana.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:58 a.m.
Well, the same article 11 you quoted includes enactments in the definition of laws.
Let me listen to the non-lawyers. The lawyers will continue to try to confuse us.
Yes, Hon Minister for the Western Region?
Dr Kwaku Afriyie 5:58 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I believe we are better off using “enactment” because it is very expansive and I have searched for its synonyms. A Bill, Act, law, order, decree -- So, Hon Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu, I disagree with you. A decree is part of an enactment.
Resolution, ruling, rule, regulation, statute, edict, measure, Motion, command, commandment, pronouncement, pro- clamation, dictate, dictum, dicta, fiat and legislation are all enactments.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:58 a.m.
That definition is dangerous. [Laughter.] We are being guided by the definitions in the Constitution. With the Hon Member's proposal, we would be trespassing into some areas.
Two more contributions, then I would put the Question.
Hon Minority Leader?
Mr Iddrisu 5:58 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I still think that “enactment” is better and makes for more elegant reading than “laws”. I have looked at page 182 of the Constitution where “enactment” is defined. I heard the reference to article 11 and its import is the hierarchy of the laws.
Article 11 under the Constitution is to convey to us the significance such as grandfather, father and son in that order. Article 11 by the Constitution deals with the hierarchy of the laws in order of importance.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 5:58 a.m.
Hon Minority Leader, that reference came when an attempt was being made to say that “enactment” is more encompassing than laws.
Mr Iddrisu 5:58 a.m.
I believe and support so.
Alhaji Fuseini 6:08 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I would want to draw your attention to something very fundamental. Initially, I was tempted to go with the amendment, until my attention was drawn to the Constitution. I saw that the law in the Constitution was not the law used in the Act; they are two different things.
To get the sense from the Constitution, you must take the sense from article 11 where it talks about hierarchy --
Alhaji Fuseini 6:08 a.m.
The Constitution says, “an Act of Parliament, Decree, Law” -- that must be telling you that the enactment defined here is looking at Act of Parliament, simplicita.
It is looking at the Military Decrees that we have passed and it is looking at the PNDC Law; it is not the law that is used in the enactment. That is the reason initial capital letters are used.

Mr Speaker, I am saying that if you say “enactment”, enactment used in the enactment with capital ‘L' is not the same thing as the law used in the Act with a small ‘l'. And I was further saying that the law used in the Act in defining an enactment with capital ‘L' speaks to the PNDC Laws.

So, you cannot say that the “Law” used there is the law used in the Act. The law that is used in the Act is more expansive than the law that is used in the enactment as defined in the Constitution. That is the reason after law if you go to Constitutional Instruments and then to Statutory Instruments -- It is also showing you the hierarchy.

So, let us maintain the rendition as it is in the law.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:08 a.m.
Yes, Hon Anyimadu-Antwi, I believe your contribution would be the last we would take on this amendment.
Mr Anyimadu-Antwi 6:08 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I support the Hon Chairman that we would have to maintain the law here.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:08 a.m.
The Hon Chairman wants it to be deleted.
Mr Anyimadu-Antwi 6:08 a.m.
Mr Speaker, then I am going contrary to that of the Chairman.
I would want us to maintain “the law”. The same argument that my Hon Friend at the other side of the aisle picked; if you look at article 11 titled “The Laws of Ghana”, all the other sources that are listed; “the common law”, “the existing law”, “enactments” and what not are all anticipated under what we are talking about of a possible breach.
So, if we just limit ourselves to “enactments”, then we are talking about only Parliamentary Acts and I think that it goes beyond that. Therefore, I support the position that it must be laws and not “enactments”.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:08 a.m.
It is because you have also not addressed yourself with the definition of “enactment” in the same Constitution -- That is where the confusion is. Whether it is a law or an enactment, I believe it means the same. So, if we could move on.
I would put the Question.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Mr Banda 6:08 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 7 subclause (1), paragraph (a), line 1, delete “a law” and insert “an enactment”.
Mr Speaker, it is a consequential amendment. The new rendition would read 6:08 a.m.
“(1) Information is exempt from disclosure where the information contains matters which if disclosed can reasonably be
expected to (b) prejudice the investigation of a contravention or possible contravention of an enactment”
I thank you, Mr Speaker.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:08 a.m.
We are still on clause 7 (iv) of page 6 -- Hon Chairman of the Committee?
Mr Banda 6:08 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 7 subclause (1), paragraph (c), delete “reveal” and insert “prejudice”.
Mr Speaker, the new rendition would read 6:08 a.m.
(1) Information is exempt from disclosure where the information contains matters which if disclosed can reasonably be expected to
(c) prejudice investigation techniques and procedures in use or likely to be used in law enforcement”.
Mr Speaker, the rationale behind it is that every exemption clause must be harm- test based in order to justify the information which is to be exempted. There is therefore a word that normally qualifies the exempt information.
Mr Speaker, if you take clause 7 (1) (a) for instance, it says “interfere with the prevention…” If you take clause 7 (1) (b), it says “prejudice”. But clause 7 (1) (c) as it stands does not give any indication whether the disclosure is likely to occasion a prejudice or a harm.
Mr Speaker, without the harm-test based clause, the mere provision of the clause would not render it exempt. That explains why we are seeking to delete “review” and substitute “prejudice” in order to give it the legal basis for the exemption of that information.
Mr Speaker, I thank you.
Ms Safo 6:18 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I disagree with the proposed amendment. If we use the word “prejudice” in clause 7 (1) (c) as it pertains in clause 7 (1) (b), we would be creating confusion and a lot of ambiguity.
Mr Speaker, clause 7 (1) (c) talks about the technique of investigation. So you cannot prejudice information technique, but you can reveal it, which would interfere with the gathering of the relevant information that is required for prosecution or for other purposes.
Mr Speaker, so the way it stands is what is intended by the framers being ourselves, which is that where investigation is going on whether by the Bureau of National Security (BNI) --
We are not talking about anything prejudicing the process; it is the technique that would be used to extract the relevant information that they require to carry on with the action that is supposed to be taken.
So, the word “prejudice” here is used as “compromise”. We could only compromise the process of the investigation but when it comes to the actual technique, it is the revelation that would be prejudicial to the outcome of the action.
Mr Ahiafor 6:18 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I support the Hon Deputy Majority Leader in opposing the Hon Chairman of the Committee's proposed amendment. The word “reveal” is in place in the sense that we “reveal” investigation techniques but how do we “prejudice” investigation techniques?
We are talking about “exempt information”. It is only when the information would reveal the investigation techniques that we would want that particular information to be exempt. We would plead with the Hon Chairman of the Committee to drop the amendment he has proposed so that we maintain the word “reveal”.
Mr Banda 6:18 a.m.
Mr Speaker, if we leave the rendition as it is, the presupposition is that, all investigation techniques and procedures are exempt. That is not the intendment of the provision.
Mr Speaker, every exemption clause must be subjected to a harm test. That is the standard. If the disclosure of the information does not occasion any harm or prejudice, there is no justifiable basis for the exemption of that information. That is the essence of this proposed amendment.
If we say “reveal investigation techniques and procedures”, it is open- ended, very vague and at large. What kinds of investigation techniques and procedures are we talking about? Investigation techniques and procedures which if revealed could occasion --
Mr Speaker, if we say, “prejudice”, it is a term of art which means “cause damage
to” and we could cause damage to information techniques or procedures or we could harm or damage. There is nothing wrong with the use of the word prejudice.
Mr Speaker, I am still of the humble opinion that if we leave the rendition as it is, we would not have captured the intendment of the framers of this provision.
So, I respectfully insist that we should maintain, “prejudice” because when we read the rest of the paragraphs of the provision, they follow. For instance, paragraph (i), says, “interfere”; (j) says “endanger”; (k) says “prejudice”; and (1) says “facilitate the escape of a person”.
Of course, if this disclosure of information would facilitate the escape of a person from lawful custody, that information ought not to be disclosed.
Mr Speaker, we should try and read all the paragraphs together and get the sense of what the proposed amendment seeks to achieve. I still maintain that we delete “reveal” and insert “prejudice”. That would capture the intendment of the provision.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:18 a.m.
Hon Chairman of the Committee, before I give the floor to any other person, could you revert your mind to paragraph (h) where the same word, “reveal” is used?
Mr Banda 6:18 a.m.
Mr Speaker, yes, and under paragraph (h) we would amend it.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:18 a.m.
That is where you would have a serious problem.
Mr Banda 6:18 a.m.
Very well. So, when we get there --
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:18 a.m.
Let me listen to the Hon Member for Wa West.
Afterwards, I would come to the Hon Minority Leader.
Mr Chireh 6:18 a.m.
Mr Speaker, the Hon Chairman of the Committee is belabouring a point that could not be sustained. The purpose of any investigation --
Here, if we want to be realistic, in America, they torture people to get information during their investigation. If one prejudices something, what does that mean? The “prejudice” being referred to as “fair trial” is in the Constitution.
Nobody should be disadvantaged in any trial. But this one is to reveal; which security or intelligence institution would like somebody to reveal their techniques of investigation?
Mr Speaker, we have Anas Aremeyaw Anas, he has his method of investigation. People disagree with it but it is a technique one would have to reveal. That is why a person applies for information and it is under (c), if anyone challenges it, they could go and say so but to say that we should use the word “prejudice”, what would we be prejudicing?
I believe that we should still maintain, “reveal” so that it is only when we reveal it and it is seen to be a torture, inappropriate -- whatever people have said about Anas' investigation -- that is where one would go to the Commission and explain. But if we do not reveal --
If I want to investigate somebody who has committed an offence and they want to know the method I would use, it would not work anywhere. No Government or institution could function with this kind of prejudice you talk about. How would we even determine whether it would prejudice the investigation?
I believe that the framers have reasons for using the words. Let us see what it means. The methods or techniques of investigation could not be revealed.
Mr Iddrisu 6:28 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I am opposed to the amendment of the Hon Chairman of the Committee. I would plead with him to read paragraph (g); “prejudice” is used there. It is used in paragraph (c) and even in (b) to serve that purpose.
If the word “techniques” was not part of the word “investigation”, then we could think of changing the word, “reveal”. So, it is not to “prejudice investigation”.
The word, “investigation” does not stand alone but with “techniques and procedures”. How do we “prejudice investigation techniques and procedures”? So, the word “reveal” is more appropriate”.
If it were just “investigation”, we could be engaged in an effort to delete the word, “reveal”. We have the word “prejudice” in paragraph (b) and (g) so I believe the Hon Chairman of the Committee should abandon this so we maintain what is in the Bill.
It does not defeat the policy intentions. We are talking about “investigation techniques and procedures in use or likely to be used in law enforcement”.
Mr Speaker, if I had my way, I would delete the word “in” and insert ‘for'; to read “investigation techniques and procedures in use or likely to be used for law enforcement” and not “in law enforcement”.
I would further amend the “in” to read “for” if that appears acceptable to him. We should rather say, “for law
Mr Speaker, the word 6:28 a.m.
“prejudice” has been used in the same clause 7(1) not once -- to serve the purpose where you may have or harbour some fears, so we should make some progress.
Alhaji I. Fuseini 6:28 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I will implore the Hon Chairman to drop -- I remember that when we came to that point, we argued but did not make -- until we -- This is because what do we seek to protect?
Is it the technique or the procedure? We do not want to expose it so that it will compromise the investigation and that is what we seek to protect; the technique and the procedure. So, I have said that a revelation of the technique and procedure would compromise the investigation and that is why we seek to protect.
Mr Speaker, so I believe that “reveal” is the word.
Mr Quashigah 6:28 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I have looked for the meaning of prejudice and it talks about:
1) preconceived: opinion that is not based on reason or actual experience; and
2) law: harm or injury the results or may result from some action or judgement.
Mr Speaker, if it is about its harming the investigation techniques, then I do not see much difference between using the words “reveal” and “prejudice”.
So, if prejudice in this context would mean “harming the investigation techniques and procedures in use or likely to be used in law enforcement”. Then it is also appropriate.
Dr Kwaku Afriyie 6:28 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I believe that this House would have to determine what we want. For me, it is not semantical whether we want to use the word “prejudice” or “reveal”.
“Reveal” is very narrow and I go with Hon Quashigah to some extent that when you look at the synonyms of “prejudice”, it is “harm”, “disadvantage”, “damage”, “injury”, “hurt”, “impairment”, “loss” and “disbenefit”.
So, if what we do not want is to endanger the techniques, then I will go for the word, “prejudice” because it is more expansive so that it will cover the techniques. This is because when you say that “reveal”, then it means that it is a very narrow definition, if that is the intent, then we can go with it.
But if we do not want, in any way, to disenable the techniques, then we would have to go for “prejudice”.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:28 a.m.
Hon Members, this is a very simple matter. I do not know why we are belabouring the point. It is just to prevent the disclosure of techniques and procedures to be used to investigate a matter. So the use of the word “reveal” is appropriate.
I did not want to come in initially but I think that the Hon Chairman would have to advice himself on this matter.
Mr Banda 6:28 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I realise I am the lone ranger in this bus -- [Laughter.]
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:28 a.m.
There are some sympathisers with you. It is only that they do not have -- You do not seem to be on solid ground so --
Mr Banda 6:28 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I am. This is because if we maintain the word “reveal”, what it means is that all investigation
techniques and procedures are exempt. That is the implication but that ought not to be the case. We cannot exempt all investigation techniques and procedures.
Mr Speaker, if the disclosure is likely to occasion a harm, its exempting clauses must be as narrow as possible. If the disclosure is likely to occasion a harm --
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:28 a.m.
Hon Chairman, whose disclosure of investigation technique procedure would not cause a harm? There is a technique that is to be used to investigate a matter, and then it is disclosed. Are you saying, that will not cause a harm? It will.
This is because the person to be investigated is given notice and therefore, the person can take steps to, at least, elude or subvert the investigation. That is it.
So, maybe, the draftspersons are saying that the better term is “prejudice”, yet from the context that we see it, the better word is “reveal”. This is because what we have talked about is covered by paragraph (b) which talks about the prejudice of investigation.
So, that is where it comes in but now, we are talking about revealing the techniques of investigation and I believe that we should adopt that word, “reveal” and not “prejudice”.
Well, you take the decision and I will put the Question. I believe that we have spent too much time on this simple word.
An Hon Member 6:28 a.m.
[Inaudible]
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:28 a.m.
Hon Member, your whisper is to the hearing of the Hon Speaker.
Ms Safo 6:28 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I am in total agreement with the analysis you made which is what I early on proposed and the Hon Member for Wa West and others supported.
Mr Speaker, if you look at the Bill of the same clause, where “prejudice” has been used, it is in respect of or reference to a procedure or process. It is only when you reveal the investigation technique, as you said in paragraph (g), then you compromise the whole investigative process.
That is when we can use prejudice when there is a fear of danger being caused to the whole process of investigation.
Where reference is being made to how you extract the needed information that will form the core of your investigation, it is the revelation of the technique that they used.
If somebody is undercover to extract some information and you say that this person is undercover, then it is the revelation that will cause the “prejudice” that we are talking about to the investigative process.
So, first, you have to reveal that technique for there to be a compromising situation which will end up causing some form of prejudice to the entire investigative process but we cannot seek to use prejudice because we have seen prejudice used in the earlier clauses.
Mr Speaker, I have noticed that where “prejudice” is used, for instance, in paragraph (g), “prejudice the fair trial of a person…”
So, it is a process and when you come to paragraph (m), prejudice is used in reference to a system.

So, all of it is a process or procedure that would be compromised which we are talking about, but what the reference is being made in respect of paragraph (c), the exemption is going for where, if you reveal some technique which is being used by investigators, it will at the end of the day, prejudice the whole process.

It is the revelation that the emphasis is on when it comes to 7(c).

Mr Speaker, so I would urge the Hon Chairman of the Committee to abandon the proposed amendment.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:38 a.m.
Hon Members, there must be an end to litigation. Enough time has been given for Hon Members to make up their minds and so I would put the Question.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:38 a.m.
Item numbered (v).
Mr Banda 6:38 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 7 subclause (1), paragraph (h), delete “reveal” and insert “endanger”.
Mr Speaker, so the new rendition reads 6:38 a.m.
“Information --
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:38 a.m.
Hon Chairman, you seem to be averse with the word “reveal”. You do not like to see the word “reveal” anywhere. How do you endanger a record of information? I do not know -- But I do not want us to open another long debate on this matter.
Hon Chairman, you are just conveying the decision of your Committee so you may go on.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:38 a.m.
“Information is exempt from disclosure where the information contains matters which if disclosed can reasonably be expected to endanger a record of information that has been confiscated from a person by a police officer or a person authorised to effect the confiscation in accordance with an enactment.”
Mr Speaker, the intent of this proposed amendment is to say that if the disclosure of the information would destroy or endanger a record of information that has been confiscated then what it means is that that information would be exempt.
Mr Speaker, but if we leave it as it is, then what it means is that any information confiscated from a person by a police officer would not be disclosed.
Mr Speaker, this makes the provision open ended and the argument I advanced for the justification of the proposed amendment which we have just effected goes for this same amendment.
Mr Speaker, because as much as practicable, when we are formulating an exemption clause, we should subject the exemption clause to a harm test.
Mr Speaker, the question that we need to ask ourselves is whether the disclosure would occasion any harm. If the answer is yes, then that information would not be disclosed; but if the disclosure would not occasion a harm, then the information must be disclosed.
We cannot formulate an exempt provision and leave it so vague and open ended. Mr Speaker, that would be a recipe for disaster and that is the reason I am

Mr Speaker, I am conveying a sense. So, endanger a record of information that has been confiscated. Mr Speaker, so this is my reason for the proposed amendment.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:38 a.m.
Either you tamper with a record of information, destroy it or delete it. Hon Chairman, but to endanger it --
Well, Hon Minority Leader.
Mr Iddrisu 6:38 a.m.
Mr Speaker, the Hon Chairman with his latest amendment is endangering clause 7 of this Bill. [Laughter.]
Mr Speaker, we cannot endanger a record of information. Mr Speaker, he is saying that information that has been confiscated from a person by a police officer or a person authorised to effect the confiscation in accordance with an enactment.
So, how could one endanger a record of information? It is not elegant. If you reveal that record -- Mr Speaker, maybe, there has been a confiscation by the police and we want that information to be kept intact. As Mr Speaker said, they could tamper with information.
Mr Speaker, maybe for want of a better word, he could use that, but it does not jell to say “endanger” a record of information. Therefore, I do not find it elegant enough to support the Hon Chairman on this.
Mr Speaker, I have seen him labouring to convince us but in trying to convince
us, he travelled beyond “endanger” to “prejudice”. Mr Speaker, so ‘‘endanger'' does not belong to (h) and we cannot start it.
Mr Speaker, the Hon Chairman should always be guided that in reading the sequence of (a), (b), (c) up to (h), we are guided by the regulatory words in clause 7 (1). Mr Speaker, thank you.
Dr Afriyie 6:38 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I totally agree with the Hon Chairman because the synonyms for “reveal” is “divulge”, “disclose” and “tell”.
These are the three synonyms but for “endanger” the synonyms are “imperil”, “risk”, “threaten”, “jeopardise”, “damage”, “injure” and “harm”, so I believe that we should support the “endanger”.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:38 a.m.
Hon Member for Wa West.
Mr Chireh 6:38 a.m.
Mr Speaker, thank you very much.
The Hon Chairman in moving these amendments has been using the harm test and if he is using the harm-test then he must carry the House along with him. Mr Speaker, what harm?
The issue he is raising is that, if a record is endangered -- How do we endanger it and who is to determine that the information one is seeking, if given, would endanger the record of information?
Mr Speaker, the harm test-must be in context and why does he want the information to be revealed or not? Mr Speaker, that should be the question. But if he harm-strings the investigating bodies in the name of human rights, then that is fine.
-- 6:38 a.m.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:48 a.m.
Well, the Bill has been endangered now. [Laughter.]
Yes, Hon Majority Leader?
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 6:48 a.m.
Mr Speaker, if a record of information that has been confiscated from a person by a police officer or person is revealed, it is that person who may be endangered. It is not the record.
Here, we are not talking about a destruction of the records or maybe
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:48 a.m.
Yes, Hon Member, I gave a clear guidance in paragraph (c) but the House decided against the guidance, just as you have stated, and so we just had to move on.
Truly, in paragraph (h), “endanger”, “to put to danger”, “to imperil” -- Hon Chairman, “imperil” here would be the person and not the record.
But if it is tampering with the record or destroying the record or deleting some information from the record, we could take that; but to endanger a record of information, that would be very difficult.
Hon Members, do not rush to look at definitions in www.google.com. There are rules of interpretation. These are legal rules, and what we do here would be interpreted and applied.
Words, even though in English language, they carry legal meaning. We,
therefore, have to be careful in rushing to definitions in www.google.com. They can only act as a guide to interpretation.
So, Hon Members, I would put the Question. It is for you to take the decision.
Yes, Hon Member?
Mr Anyimadu-Antwi 6:48 a.m.
Mr Speaker, before you put the Question, I was about to suggest a further amendment to introduce the word “destroy” instead of the word “endanger” that has been proposed.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:48 a.m.
Hon Chairman, what do you say to the proposal now; instead of “endanger” we are using “destroy”?
Mr Banda 6:48 a.m.
Mr Speaker, we learn in the course of debate. I have listened to the Hon Majority Leader and Hon Minority Leader, and I have taken a cue from them. I therefore seek your leave to withdraw the proposed amendment and maintain what is in the Bill.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:48 a.m.
Hon Members, the Hon Chairman has listened to your counsel and he is withdrawing the proposed amendment.

Can we now move to item 10 (vi) in page 7 of the Order Paper?

Clause 7, Chairman of the Committee and the Hon Minority Leader?
Mr Banda 6:48 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 7 -- subclause (2), paragraph (a), line 1, delete “success” and insert
“outcome” and in line 3, delete “a law” and insert “an enactment”.
The new rendition reads:
“(2) Despite subsection (1), information is not exempt from disclosure where that information.
(a) Consists merely of a report on the outcome of a programme adopted by a public institution to deal with a contravention or possible contravention of an enactment.
Mr Speaker, the reason is that a report could be a success or a failure. So, a more generic word is acceptable in place of “success”, and this is the word “outcome”. The word “outcome” could be negative or positive.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:48 a.m.
Hon Members, it is quite a straightforward amendment. Hon Minority Leader, you are one of the proposers.
Mr Iddrisu 6:48 a.m.
Mr Speaker, instead of using the word “success”, the word “outcome” is broader because it encompasses success or failure. We are talking about considering a report of programmes adopted by public institutions.
If we pass it as it is, it means it can only lead to one irresistible conclusion that it must be successful. That is why the use of the word “outcome” is better as the Hon Chairman has proposed.
The second is consequential as we did; substituting “law” for “enactment”.
I support the Hon Chairman.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:48 a.m.
I would now put the Question on the whole of clause 7.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 6:58 a.m.
Mr Speaker, there is a consequential amendment in 2(b). I think it did not feature here, but it is only consequential for 2(b).
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:58 a.m.
I direct that the draftspersons make the consequential amendment. Where we are referring to contravention of a law, it should be of an enactment.
Mr Ablakwa 6:58 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I am sorry to do this, but before you put the Question on the entire clause, I thought that the Hon Majority Leader gave a sense of the House that we want to retrace our steps when it comes to paragraph (c). So if we could take a second look at that.
I get the sense that the House now wants to follow the cue you gave us earlier, which we did not quite appreciate at the time, so that we do not need to come back to clause 7, if you would grant us leave.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:58 a.m.
Hon Members, is the House now disposed to reconsidering clause 7(1) (c)? If so, we would look at it, but the Hon Chairman is to lead us in this.
Is it the case that the Committee would want to reconsider (c) with regard to the use of the word “reveal” instead of “prejudice”?
Hon Chairman, you are not being bullied into submission -- [Laughter.] If you are convinced that your position is the right one, please urge us on, and then we move forward.
Mr Banda 6:58 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I would be guided by the sense of the House.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:58 a.m.
In this case I am not getting the sense of the House. I am only getting disagreements, but we have already put the Question on that one.
It is the House that took the decision, but the Hon Majority Leader has drawn our attention that the better rendition should have been “reveal” instead of “prejudice”, so I am asking whether the Committee would reconsider their earlier position. But I am saying you should not be pressurised or bullied into submission.
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 6:58 a.m.
Mr Speaker, the proposal came from the Committee, and upon further consideration, the House has come to a conclusion that we must retrace our steps.
And so now it is no longer in the hands of the Committee. It is in the hands of the entire House, and that is why the Hon Chairman is saying that he is guided by the sense of the House.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:58 a.m.
The sense of the House is that we go by the word “reveal”?
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 6:58 a.m.
Mr Speaker, that is so.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:58 a.m.
Is the Hon Majority Leader echoing the sense of the House rightly? I can hear from my
left hand side, but there is complete silence from my right hand side.
Is that the sense of the House? All right, I go back to clause 7, subclause (1), paragraph (c). I am going to put the Question, that the sense of the House that I get, which is actually not a motion that has been moved, was to delete “reveal” and insert “prejudice”. That was moved by the Chairman.
The Hon Chairman has not withdrawn that motion, and he says he wants to be guided by the sense of the House, and so I am going by the sense of the House to put the Question, so that I can get the clear decision of the House.
Hon Majority Leader?
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 6:58 a.m.
Mr Speaker, for the avoidance of doubt, the Question has been put on that particular subclause, and at that time the House agreed to go with the amendment proposed by the Hon Chairman. We are asking that we relax the rules and go back.
Appropriately, we may have to move a motion of rescission, to rescind that decision. If we are not relaxing the rules, then a formal Motion would have to be moved to rescind that decision to go back. The door is then open for us to do the new amendment.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:58 a.m.
That is why I have been focused on the Hon Chairman, and the Hon Chairman seems not to be giving us the leadership.
It means that somebody would then have to move a Motion of rescission, because it is a decision of the House, and by our rules you can only do that by a motion of rescission.
This is because we are at the Consideration Stage, we are relaxing the rules, and so that Motion need not be such a substantive Motion that you need notice to table or move.
So you can do it now.
Mr Banda 6:58 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I beg to move, for the rescission of the decision deleting “reveal” and inserting “prejudice”, and to maintain the original rendition in the Bill, specifically clause 7(1) (c).
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Clause 7 as variously amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 6:58 a.m.
The Hon Majority Leader gave an earlier indication. I think it is a few minutes past 7 p.m.
Hon Majority Leader, do you still stand by your earlier indication?
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 6:58 a.m.
Mr Speaker, yes, so that we are able to have good rest for tomorrow's business, I would still cling to the position that I took earlier. I was just going to say that adjourning the House rests with you.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 7:08 a.m.
Hon Members, in view of the impending business for tomorrow, I would proceed to adjourn the House.
Hon Members, we have come to the end of the Consideration Stage of the Right to Information Bill, 2018, for today. We would continue tomorrow.
Yes, Hon Majority Leader?
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 7:08 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I want to inform the Hon Members of the Business Committee that we would meet tomorrow at 8.30 a. m. at the usual place, seventh floor.
Mr Second Deputy Speaker 7:08 a.m.
The announcement is that, the Business Committee would be meeting tomorrow at 8.30 a. m. And the House would be Sitting
at what time? Will it be the usual 10.00 a. m.?
Hon Members, I proceed to adjourn the House to tomorrow Thursday, at 10.00 in the forenoon.
ADJOURNMENT 7:08 a.m.