Debates of 19 Jul 2005

MR. SPEAKER
PRAYERS 10:02 a.m.
Mr. Speaker 10:02 a.m.
Order! Order! Hon. Members, we shall take item 2 -- Correction of Votes and Proceedings. Page 1. . . page 4 --
Mr. Kwadjo opare-Hammond 10:02 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, page 4 has a repetition of the numbers 25 to 47. I do not know whether it was a typographical error or from the printing. It needs to be corrected.
Mr. Speaker 10:02 a.m.
Page 5. . . page 8 --
Mr. Yaw Effah-Baafi 10:02 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, page 8, the top paragraph, I think there is a typographical mistake. The paragraph should read “10” instead of “0”.
Mr. Speaker 10:02 a.m.
All right, the correction will be made. Page 9 --
Mr. Hackman owusu-Agyemang 10:02 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, on page 4 --
Mr. Speaker 10:02 a.m.
Are you going back to page 4?
Mr. owusu-Agyemang 10:02 a.m.
Yes, sir, I was looking for my name and have found it now, but from number 47 it goes to number 148. This is where the problem is -- the numbering. So now, they have put
me at number 44 when I should be number one hundred and something. Then it jumps from number 47 to 148. I do not know; the counting is a bit confusing.
Mr. Speaker 10:02 a.m.
But hon. Member, your name is there; your name is number
44.
Mr. owusu-Agyemang 10:02 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I was saying that I had difficulty locating my name because I am normally number 198 but now I find that I am at number 44. But if you go down the line, you will find that from number 47, it jumps to 148. That is where the problem seems to be arising from.
Mr. Speaker 10:02 a.m.
Thank you, the correction would be made. Page 10 . . . page 13 -- We have two issues of the Official Report -- Wednesday, 13th July 2005 and Thursday, 14th July 2005.
Mr. J. Y. chireh 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, for the Wednesday, 13th July 2005 issue, I want to make a substantive correction. If you look at column 1889, before Mr. J.Y. Chireh, there should be your decision because I rose on a point of order and you granted me permission to do so after which you made another ruling before the other hon. Members. So they should insert your ruling before my name and after my name -- after the statement I made, just before Dr. Osafo-Mensah.

And if you also look at paragraph 1873, instead of “sheds” we have “shelves”. I do not think we can have market shelves; it should be “market sheds”. Then in paragraph 1875 under Mr. Bintin - I think it would be appropriate, and I heard him say so that the word “that” should be inserted between the words “areas requested”. It should be inserted between “areas” and “requested”. The rest are typographical errors which I will submit to the Clerk.
Mr. Speaker 10:10 a.m.
Thank you very much.
Mr. S. A. Kwao 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, on the 12th of July 2005, I made a Statement entitled ‘Building a Healthy Relationship Between District Chief Executives (DCEs) and Members of Parliament (MPs) and there were three contributions including that of the hon. Member for Anlo (Mr. Kofi Humado). Unfortunately, that contribution has been ascribed to the hon. Member for Ho Central (Capt. George K. Nfojoh (retd). I think this should be corrected.
Mr. Speaker 10:10 a.m.
Thank you. Item 3 - Questions.
oRAL ANSwERS To QUESTIoNS
MINISTRY OF EDUCATION 10:10 a.m.
AND SPORTS 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Yaw osafo-Maafo (Minister for Education and Sports) 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, GNAT was the only umbrella professional body for teachers in the country until when some graduate teachers started agitation for recognition and finally broke away and formed the National Association of Graduate Teachers (NAGRAT).
Currently, there are two (2) associations serving the interest of teachers in the GES. Whereas members of NAGRAT consist
Mr. J. K. Gidisu 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, my Question was to extract from the hon. Minister the response to the professional and trade union rights of teachers in the country, because the two are not the same. And in his Answer, he referred to professional rights of both members. Does it mean that the NAGRAT has no trade union rights as his Answer states? Because, the two are not the same. Professional rights are different from trade union rights and in his reaction, he emphasized only the professional rights. Does it mean that NAGRAT has no trade union rights?
Mr. osafo-Maafo 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, not long ago, this House passed the Labour Act, and the Labour Act detailed out the rights of workers. Where there are more than one association within a profession or a group, obviously, both should have a right. The bigger one, accordingly to the law, negotiates on behalf of the
smaller one. That is also in the law and therefore obviously, they have their rights. But like nurses, we have mental nurses, we have theatre nurses and they all come under the Ghana Registered Nurses Association (GRNA), and their Association negotiates for all of them irrespective of the specializations that they represent.
Mr. J. K. Gidisu 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the hon. Minister - [Interruption.]
Mr. Speaker 10:10 a.m.
Hon. Member for Central Tongu, you will wait until you are called upon.
Mr. J. K. Gidisu 10:10 a.m.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The reference the hon. Minister is making to the Ghana Registered Nurses Association does not apply to teachers; it is entirely different. I still want to demand from him whether the NAGRAT has trade union rights as GNAT.
Mr. osafo-Maafo 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would want him to explain what he means by trade union rights.
Mr. J. K. Gidisu 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I thought the Question was with reference to professional and trade union rights. For example, on profession rights, he made reference to the in-service training schemes undertaken by GNAT, which is not done by NAGRAT. Those are some of the professional responsibilities. And when we are talking of trade union rights, they hinge on the terms and conditions and scheme of service of workers. Those are purely the trade union rights and they pertain to the negotiations that he said the larger umbrella group, which is GNAT, does on their behalf. That is why I am coming up with a follow-up question as to whether that precludes the NAGRAT from accessing its trade union rights.
Mr. osafo-Maafo 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the National Labour Commission came out with a statement when NAGRAT had the industrial action, that GNAT has a collective bargaining agreement but NAGRAT has not got a collective bargaining agreement. Under the conditions of service of the GES, GNAT has the collective bargaining agreement.
Mr. Speaker 10:10 a.m.
One last supplementary question.
Mr. J. K. Gidisu 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would want to find out from the Minister whether the GES, as at now, has defined registers for NAGRAT and GNAT members from which they identify teachers in the country. This is because it is noted in the hon. Minister's Answer that teachers relate with the two organizations in respect of their problems. Do they have registers to denote membership of those organizations.
Mr. osafo-Maafo 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I will quote specifically from a section of the GES law; and Mr. Speaker, with your permission I quote:
“Under the Ghana Education Service Act of 1995, Act 506, the Ghana National Association of Teachers (GNAT) and Teachers and Educational Workers Union (TEWU) are the only recognized bodies with collective bargaining agreement with the Ghana Education Service.”
Mr. J. K. Gidisu 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, how then does the hon. Minister reconcile what he has read now with the National Labour Law which gives autonomy to workers to form organizations which he referred to, and which NAGRAT has taken advantage of? If he is now limiting the GES law to only GNAT as a recognized group of teachers, how does he reconcile his earlier reaction to the question?
Mr. Yaw osafo-Maafo 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker,
Mr. osafo-Maafo 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, according to the Conditions and Scheme of Service, teachers in the classroom could be promoted to Directors. However, this has not been undertaken due to supervisory and disciplinary issues. Thus, District Directors are supposed to supervise schools under their jurisdiction, irrespective of the ranks of staff. This we have observed borders on ethical considerations since a Director may not feel happy to supervise his/her colleague Director.
The GES Council has therefore been charged with the responsibility of coming out with more pragmatic modalities to address this issue.
Mr. J. K. Gidisu 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, this question arises out of this year's Budget Statement on education. It stated that they were going to effect the promotion of classroom teachers to directorship effective this academic year. How then does the hon. Minister reconcile his present answer to the Budget Statement?
Mr. osafo-Maafo 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, this is very consistent. I am not saying that; the rule is there. You can teach biology and become a director in the classroom. The headmaster of your school can also be a director. All the basic second-cycle schools are under the District Director of Education and it has been found to be a little inconvenient for directors to be supervising directors. Therefore, they were trying to come out with a special scheme that would enable this to happen.
Mr. Speaker, it is a fact that some teachers are at their best when teaching. A mathematics teacher may want to continue to teach mathematics. Thus, if you promote him to district director, status, naturally he may not even be able to perform the administrative functions the same way as he would teach. Therefore, the need for this to be done is there; it has been recognized and modalities are being worked out.
The Council agreed at their last meeting and they are going to change some names to make this possible. I expect that before the end of the year that arrangement would be in place; so it would be consistent with the Budget, which runs from January to December. It would certainly take place before the end of the financial year.
Mr. J. K. Gidisu 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the financial year is more than midway through and teachers have attended interviews for promotion to the grade of directors. How is the hon. Minister going to look at those that have attended interviews this year? Would he assure this House that, as noted in the Budget, their promotion to directorship would be effected from this year, no matter how long it takes to get that situation redressed as he is talking about?
Mr. osafo-Maafo 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, he as a former teacher knows the system very well. The Director-General of the Ghana Education Service calls for these interviews. They need not be done once a
year and indeed we have scheduled other interviews around September. Therefore, apart from the interview that has been held, yes, there are other interviews on the way.
Mr. G. K. B. Gbediame 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, may I know also from the hon. Minister whether there is any plan to distinguish between the assistant director who is a graduate and assistant director who is a non-graduate in the scheme that he is talking about.
Mr. osafo-Maafo 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker,
certainly not. The assistant director is a position people aspire to. People who are non-graduates may take nineteen years to be there and people who are graduates may take seven years to be there. Once you are an assistant director, you are an assistant director. It is a position and therefore you cannot distinguish between the two.
Mr. J. Z. Amenowode 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker,
the hon. Minister in his response stated that for ethical reasons it would not be appropriate for a director to supervise his or her colleague director. My question to the hon. Minister is -- as at now, we have assistant directors heading secondary schools and we have assistant directors in the classrooms -- is he implying that these headmasters are not able to supervise teachers who are their colleagues?
Mr. osafo-Maafo 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I
believe the two are not the same. If you are made a headmaster of a secondary school, the head of the secondary school, then all teachers who teach in the secondary school come under you because of your designation as the headmaster of the school. If for whatever reason there are other assistant directors, it does not really matter.
But the Ghana Education Service (GES) is of the view that teachers have
found it very difficult to supervise at the lateral level, that is director to director -- the lateral level. It is purely a question of convenience. But once somebody is designated head of an institution -- I mean if you are the Vice Chancellor, you are the primus inter pares. All of you may be professors but once you have been designated as Vice Chancellor, you supervise all the other professors. I think that in the case of a secondary school, that is what applies, unless I did not get his question.
Examination Leakages
Q. 55. Mr. Joe Kwashie Gidisu asked the Minister for Education and Sports what steps are being taken to control and eventually eliminate the spate of examination leakages and other malpractices in the education industry.
Mr. osafo-Maafo 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the Ministry of Education and Sports/Ghana Education Service and WAEC have put in place stringent measures to curb the spate of examination leakages in the country. Security arrangements have been made in the following areas:
the printing of question papers,
the distribution and storage of the papers, and
the movement of question papers to examination centres.
Mr. Speaker, the same arrangement was made and it led to a leakage-free exam during the recent BECE examination. So far, we are on course to ensure a leakage- free SSSCE which ends on the 3rd of August 2005.
Mr. Speaker, I am unable to disclose details of this arrangement for security reasons. We are confident of leakage-free
exams this year. The measures put in place so far are working.
Mr. J. K. Gidisu 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker,
emoluments for people connected with various levels of conducting examinations could be a source of leakage. How is the Ministry trying to address this problem alongside those that he has mentioned?
Mr. osafo-Maafo 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker,
this question is speculative, certainly speculative. We are talking about detailed security measures in an examination and we have put enough in place so that we would not have a problem. To speculate that something could happen if this or that should happen is speculative, Mr. Speaker. That will be my answer.
Mr. J. K. Gidisu 10:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am sure the Minister is aware of various supervisors at various levels of conducting exams and the peanuts that are paid to them as emoluments is a worry to them. That is why I am finding out from him what is being done in addition to those steps he is talking about. And it is not speculative; it is a real situation.
Mr. osafo-Maafo 10:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, in our educational sector, the West African Examinations Council is made up of five countries -- The Gambia, Sierra Leone, Liberia, Ghana and Nigeria. Mr. Speaker, in the other countries they take invigilation as the normal job of a teacher and therefore there is nothing like invigilator's fees. Is he therefore saying that in this country there should be problems of leakages? The answer is no.
This is an international examination; fees are taken by the West African Examinations Council to conduct the examination and the fees taken should
Prof. Al-Hassan w. Seini 10:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would like to know from the hon. Minister whether there are laws that punish people who get involved in examination leakages. If not, I want to know whether he is planning to initiate punitive laws that will tackle this problem at all levels of our education. I am asking this because it looks as if this thing has been occurring all the time yet we do not hear of anybody being punished in the law courts.
Mr. osafo-Maafo 10:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, this is a very important question. When there was examination leakage in the Jomoro area in the last two years, it turned out that even though people were arrested, in the courts they had a problem with the prosecution in terms of what punishment was to be meted to them because the law was quite vague about it. Therefore, the GES is now studying it. The one who was found to have broken into the store and taken questions out was fined a pittance of about a hundred thousand cedis. Therefore, there is a problem with the law on examination leakages.
It appears there are no specific laws in respect of examination leakages. This is one of the areas the GES is addressing. I am therefore happy he has brought it up. There is no specific law that addresses these leakages; it is left to the discretion of the court, and that is not the best.
I think we need to refine the law in respect of leakages to protect examination.
Provision of Science Laboratory at Dadieso Senior Secondary School
Q. 79. Mr. Stephen M. E. K. Ackah asked the Minister for Education and
Sports what plans the Ministry had to provide a science laboratory at the Dadieso Senior Secondary School to enhance the teaching and learning of science.
Mr. osafo-Maafo 10:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the Ghana Education Service (GES) is currently undertaking over 500 projects countrywide at various stages of completion. It is the policy of the Service to complete a considerable number of them before new projects are started.
The provision of a science laboratory for Dadieso Senior Secondary School would be considered when new projects are being listed for inclusion in the Service's budget.
Mr. Ackah 10:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would want to ask the Minister when these five hundred projects are specifically going to be completed.
Mr. osafo-Maafo 10:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the policy of the Ministry of Education and Sports is to ensure that we spend allocations from the GETFund to complete new projects because there are too many projects from the GETFund which have not been completed. Therefore, we expect that the bulk of these projects would be completed by the middle of next year. The policy is to get these ongoing projects completed. There will be very few new ones; and a few will be emergency ones.
Mr. Ackah 10:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, science students in this school write SSSCE like any other school. Mr. Speaker, Dadieso is sixty kilometres and about forty-five kilometres away from Enchi and Juabeso respectively where there are science resource centres. The deplorable nature of the road network makes it just impossible for these students to get to these science resource centres. I want to find out from
the Minister what immediate assistance the Ministry can give to these students to prepare them for their final examinations.
Mr. osafo-Maafo 10:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, he is enumerating certain problems which make the Dadieso case a special case. May I kindly appeal to my Colleague to make a case specific for Dadieso so that it would be taken out of turn. Since we are all putting emphasis on mathematics and science, they are can be taken out of turn.
Improvement of Infrastructure at Daboase Senior Secondary School
Q. 80. Mr. David oppong-Kusi (on behalf of Mr. Anthony Evans Amoah) asked the Minister for Education and Sports what plans the Ministry had to improve infrastructure at Daboase Senior Secondary School.
Mr. osafo-Maafo 10:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the Ghana Education Service (GES) is currently undertaking over 500 projects countrywide at various stages of completion. It is the policy of the Service to complete a considerable number of them before new projects are started.
Improvement in infrastructure at Daboase Secondary School to enhance teaching and learning would be considered when new projects are being considered for inclusion in the Service vote and under the GETFund programme.
Mr. Speaker 10:30 a.m.
Thank you, hon. Minister for Education and Sports for appearing to respond to these Questions. You are released, at least for the time being.
MINISTRY OF COMMUNICATIONS 10:30 a.m.
Mr. Gbediame 10:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, a similar Question was asked some years back and I was told that by the year 2005, Nkwanta was going to be provided with telephone facilities. This time around, we are being told that by July 2006 -- I want to know whether this time around, this promise would be fulfilled.
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 10:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, it is important to emphasize that these promises are given directly by the service providers, and I want to believe that the promise that they have given would be fulfilled.
Mr. J. D. Mahama 10:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, according to the policy of the Ministry, every senior secondary school and training college in this country is to be connected with a broadband line. Mr. Speaker, I would like to know what service the Minister is talking about.
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 10:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the
intention is to make sure that all schools are provided not just with telephones but with broadband access. We are talking about that service.
Mr. J. D. Mahama 10:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would like to know whether this service to be provided to Nkwanta in the second quarter of 2006 is going to be a broadband line.
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 10:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, yes.
Telephone Services to Sefwi wiawso and its Environs
Q. 136. Mr. Evans Paul Aidoo asked the Minister for Communications when telephone services would be extended to Sefwi Wiawso and its environs.
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 10:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the programme currently underway to expand the network services by telephone operators to all parts of the country applies to Sefwi Wiawso and its environs as well. Sefwi Wiawso already enjoys coverage from Scancom Limited. Ghana Telecom and Millicom (Ghana) Limited on the other hand plan to cover the area by June 2006 and July 2006 and July 2006 respectively.
Mr. E. P. Aidoo 10:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, is the hon. Minister aware that Scancom Ltd facilities do not cover even 10 per cent of the Sefwi Wiawso area? Mr. Speaker, I want to ask whether he is aware.
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 10:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, no, I am not aware of that but I would take note and I would follow up to find out what exactly is happening.
Mr. E. P. Aidoo 10:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the hon. Minister's Answers to Questions 117, 136, 147, 148 and 178 that we have today all talk about Ghana Telecom and Millicom

Ghana Ltd. moving to the various districts by July 2006. Can the Minister be a little bit specific because the companies are moving to the districts by 2006. Can he be specific? Because, it looks as if they are all moving by 2006 to Dunkwa, to Nkwanta, to Sefwi Wiawso and all those areas.I want to know specifically when?
Mr. Speaker 10:40 a.m.
In other words, you want to know in which month.
Mr. E. P. Aidoo 10:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, yes.
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 10:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, such information is provided by the telephone companies. The companies have their own plans and it is out of these plans that they provide us with these answers. I do take note of the coincidence that the hon. Member is referring to, but this is the information that is available from the telephone companies at this point in time.
Mr. Kenneth Dzirasah 10:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would like to know from the hon. Minister what steps or measures his Minister is taking to ensure that there is improvement in the services, generally, of the telephone providers, even as they make the extensions to the various districts. We see that they are expanding and the quality of service is not improving.
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 10:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the quality of service is of concern to the Ministry. I do not want to be holding brief for the telecom companies but I think it is true to remark that all the telephone companies are currently expanding and modernizing their networks, and these problems are only to be expected. But if it is any consolation, all the telephone companies have got certain standards to meet and when they are unable to meet those standards, penalties are imposed. So it is also not in their interest to continue to provide poor services as we
are experiencing now. But I think the major reason is because all of them are currently in the process of expanding and modernizing their networks.
Mr. George Kuntu-Blankson 10:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the Answer given to us indicates that the companies would be moving into various areas they are going to operate in according to their plans. May I know from the Minister whether his Ministry has any control in their activities; because I know they contracted those agencies into this country.
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 10:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, obviously, it is not possible for the Government to force a particular operator to go to a particular place at any point in time. It depends on what the plans, the intentions of the particular company are; and it is not up to the Ministry to dictate to them that they must go to a particular place at a particular point in time.
Extension of Telecommunication Facilities to Jaman District
Q. 147. Mr. Alex Asum-Ahensah asked the Minister for Communications when telecommunication facilities would be extended to Jaman North District.
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 10:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, Millicom (Ghana) Limited hopes to cover Drobo and its environs in the Jaman District by July 2006. Ghana Telecom on its part is mobilizing resources to enable it connect towns within the Jaman District as soon as possible. Scancom Limited has just only last week acquired a site for its installation in the Jaman District and hopes to commence construction in due course.
Mr. Asum-Ahensah 10:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the Question specifically mentions Jaman North District but the Answer given by the Minister is on Jaman, Drobo being the
capital. The question now is, what are his plans for the Jaman North District with Sampa as its capital, now that the district has been divided into two?
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 10:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am aware that the district comprises two constituencies and our plans are to cover both constituencies and not to discriminate between one constituency as against the other.
Mr. Asum-Ahensah 10:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the hon. Minister, in his Answer, stated that Scancom Limited has acquired a site for its installation in Jaman District. I would like to know, where in Jaman North District, this installation is likely to be sited.
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 10:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am unable to be precise as to where they have acquired this site. This information has come to me from Scancom.
Nii Amasah Namoale: Mr. Speaker, the hon. Minister said Ghana Telecom on its part is mobilizing resources to enable it connect towns within the Jaman District as soon as possible. May I know whether it is the cellular or the landlines in terms of Ghana Telecom?
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 10:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, it does not really matter because these days even if it is cellular that they are extending, it is possible to get the fixed cellular terminals, which would provide fixed services as well -- [Interruption.] Mr. Speaker, my hon. Friend says he did not understand what I said. I said that these days, it does
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 10:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, my information is that there are plans to extend Millicom (Ghana) Limited mobile services to Dunkwa-on-Offin in the Hemang Lower Denkyira Distrrict by December 2005. At around the same time, Ghana Telecom hopes to provide its mobile services to Twifo Praso and surrounding towns. The mobile coverage will be extended to Twifo Hemang and the remaining places in the Twifo Hemang Lower Denkyira District by the second quarter of 2006. In the case of Scancom Limited, Twifo Praso will be covered by the first quarter of 2006 according to their plans.
Rev. Donkor: Mr. Speaker, in his Answer, the hon. Minister said “Dunkwa- on-Offin in the Twifo Hemang Lower Denkyira District”. Mr. Speaker, “Dunkwa- on-Offin is in the Upper Denkyira District and I would want to know from the hon. Minister whether he wanted to say Jukwaa which is my constituency capital or he still means Dunkwa-on-Offin in the Upper Denkyira District.
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 10:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I stand to be corrected, but I want to believe that the Answer ought to have been “Dunkwa-on-Offin near the Hemang Lower Denkyira District”. I am sorry for the mistake.
Mr. Speaker 10:50 a.m.
Hon. Minister for Communications, would you want him to repeat the question? Kindly repeat the question, hon. Member.
Rev. Donkor: Mr. Speaker, he only mentioned mobile-phone services and I want to know when Ghana Telecom will extend the line-phone services to the district.
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 10:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I just explained to my hon. Friend a couple of minutes ago that the difference does not really exist again because these days even where there are cellular services, it is possible to provide the fixed cellular terminals which will serve the same purpose as the fixed services. So the difference does not really exist any longer.
Rev. Donkor: Mr. Speaker, I would want to ask the hon. Minister whether he is aware that Kakum National Park, one of the most popular tourist attraction centres in Africa has no telephone services.
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 10:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am not aware of that. But it is an interesting observation which I will try to follow up.
Mr. Albert Abongo 10:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would like to know from the hon. Minister if there is a programme for Ghana Telecom now as it existed in the case of Telecom Malaysia, to provide services within certain periods of time. Does that exist now for Ghana Telecom?
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 10:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I do

not know whether I got the import of the question.
Mr. Abongo 10:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, my Question is that, when it came to the change-over from Telecom Malaysia, arguments were that Telecom Malaysia were not performing to the satisfaction of Ghana and that they could not deliver certain services within some specified periods. Now, this tends to give an impression that one cannot force the service providers to go to a particular place to provide these services. I would like to know from the hon. Minister if he has a programme for these service providers to do their work in this country.
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 10:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the issue of why we were not happy with Telecom Malaysia is a little bit too complex than my hon. Friend put it and I think it will be unfair for me to make any statements as to whether Telecom Malaysia performed badly or not. The reasons, which we have stated in this House, were much wider than what my hon. Friend seems to be implying.
Extension of Telephone Facilities to Tongo
Q. 178. Mr. John Akologu Tia asked the Minister for Communications what plans his Ministry had to extend telephone facilities to Tongo, the capital of the newly created Talensi-Nabdam District.
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 10:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, my information is that Tongo already has coverage from the Ghana Telecom switch at Bolgatanga. I am also told that Ghana Telecom plans to deploy a GSM payphone in the area very soon. The other network operators have indicated that they will be deployed in the district by the middle of next year.
Mr. Tia 10:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, in his Answer he
has stated that GSM payphone will soon be deployed in the area very soon; “very soon” is too open and a political speech. I want to know from the hon. Minister what definite period he has in mind.
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 11 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I happen to be aware of the political importance to -- I happen to know the political importance of the project to my hon. Friend and I want to assure him that the promise is more than a political speech; and I will personally make sure that this is done as quickly as possible.
rose
Mr. Speaker 11 a.m.
Hon. Minister for Works and Housing, are you asking a Question?
Mr. owusu-Agyemang 11 a.m.
Yes, Mr. Speaker, decidedly so. It is a point of order. What does the hon. John Tia mean by “political speech”? That has got a lot of implications and I think that people should desist from equating this to things that they do not understand. What does he precisely mean? We all listened to the Answer. What does he mean by “political speech”? [Interruptions.] Mr. Speaker, he is completely out of order.
rose
Mr. Speaker 11 a.m.
Hon. Minority Chief
Whip, are you asking a supplementary question?
Mr. Tia 11 a.m.
No, Mr. Speaker, I do not think that he knows what he is doing.
Mr. Speaker 11 a.m.
I am asking whether you are asking a supplementary question.
Mr. Tia 11 a.m.
Yes, sir.
Mr. Speaker 11 a.m.
You ask your question.
Mr. Tia 11 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I thought that the hon. Member was very seasoned for this House but I think there is a doubt there.
Mr. Speaker 11 a.m.
Hon. Minority Chief Whip, are you not asking your question?
Mr. Tia 11 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I want to know from the hon. Minister for Communications which particular other network operators have expressed the desire to move into the Talensi/Nabdam District.
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 11 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, all the operators have expressed the desire to go to all parts of the country and this applies to Tongo as well.
Mr. Moses Asaga 11 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I do not understand what he means by “all operators”. Could he just give me the names of the operators?
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 11 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I obviously want to believe that my hon. Friend knows all the operators in this country and that his “political question” was a question that he himself knows the Answer to. But if he wants to be reminded, in this country, apart from the Ghana Telecom, we have Spacefon, we have Millicom, and we have Kasapa. Westel has not been operating satisfactorily and normally but I think they are working on that. So when I say “the other operators apart from the Ghana Telecom” I am specifically referring to Spacefon, Millicom and Kasapa.
Mr. M. A. Asaga 11 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, my question to the hon. Minister is that even though we are talking of Talensi/Nabdam District there are two important towns there, which are Tongo and Nangodi. So I want to know from the hon. Minister when this extension will come to Nangodi

and what plans have been made for that.
Mr. Kan-Dapaah 11 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I obviously will need to be given some notice to provide Answers to this very substantive Question that my hon. Friend is posing.
Mr. Speaker 11 a.m.
Hon. Minister for Communications, thank you very much for appearing to respond to these Questions; you are hereby discharged - [Pause.]
Mr. Tia 11 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the hon. Minister for Works and Housing is threatening me and he is saying that I should not bring certain things. So I want to bring it to your notice and to ask for security -- [Laughter.]
Mr. Speaker 11 a.m.
Hon. Minority Chief Whip, I thought you were so strong to be threatened by anybody but I have taken note accordingly.
Mr. owusu-Agyemang 11 a.m.
Mr. Speaker -- [Interruption.]
Mr. Speaker 11 a.m.
I have not called you
yet. Are you making a comment on what he said?
Mr. owusu-Agyemang 11 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, he said that I was threatening him and that I had been showing my hand. Maybe he needs a new pair of glasses; as far as I know I am not threatening him, not yet - [Laughter.]
Mr. Speaker 11 a.m.
Whatever it is, item 4.
STATEMENTS 11 a.m.
Mr. Joseph K. Nayan (NPP - Nkwanta North) 11:10 a.m.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker, for giving me the opportunity to make a Statement on the Educational
Reforms in Ghana.
Implementation of the most recent educational reforms, which began in 1987, brought to the fore many problems in the objectives, content, administration and the management of education.
Before the assumption of office, the new Patriotic Party had serious reservations concerning some aspects of the reforms, and doubts which were shared by wide sections of the Ghanaian public, especially parents.
The Government of the NPP shares with the people the passionate interest in education and the anxiety to bring about constant improvements in its availability and relevance. There has been a continuing aim to make education more relevant to the world of work after school. However, results have been mixed.
Mr. Speaker, more recently there has been almost unanimous agreement that under the latest 1987 reforms, public education in Ghana has failed to meet expectations in terms of its coverage, quality, equity and economic utility.
The President of the Republic of Ghana, His Excellency John A. Kufuor inaugurated a Committee on the Review of Education Reforms in Ghana on 12th January, 2002. The 22-member Committee comprised knowledgeable Ghanaians drawn from a cross-section of stakeholders in the educational sector headed by Prof. Joseph Anamuah-Mensah.
Mr. Speaker, the Committee at its findings, as indicated in its White Paper, observed that basic education, as currently structured and delivered in Ghana, comprising primary and junior secondary school (JSS) training, is inadequate to equip our young pupils with the basic reading, writing and numeracy skills required for further mass training at the
secondary level to international standards. It does not also equip them, as promised in the 1987 reform, with practical skills and the world of work.
The consensus among Government, educational professionals, parents and employers is that the innovation of a three-year J.S.S. system to cap a six-year primary education course has failed to deliver its promise of comprehensively equipping the youth of that age bracket with directly employable skills. It is also chasing after those unrealistic goals in technical and vocational skills. The J.S.S. system has failed to do more to strengthen the basic skills of Ghanaian youth in numeracy and literacy.
Mr. Speaker, records indicate that on the average, the survival rate from primary 1 to primary grade 6 has been only 79.9 per cent, 81.8 per cent for boys and 78.9 per cent for girls.
We need to raise these figures to 100 per cent to achieve Free Compulsory Universal Basic Education (FCUBE).
The survival rate for the J.S.S. is just a little above that of the primary 1 6. The survival rate becomes more serious even for those who did manage to complete J.S.S.; only 40 per cent are able to gain admission into the S.S.S.
The nation cannot afford this level of attitude at all our levels of education. It is based on this that the Government is in the process of introducing a continuous eleven-year basic education system to create a Compulsory Universal and Basic Education system comprising:
i) 2 years of kindergarten
ii) 6 years of primary, and
iii) First 3 years of high school, that is junior high school of age
14 -- age 15, and also
iv) Assumption of full responsi- bility for the first year of a much structured system of apprentice- ship for junior high school leavers who are unable to enter senior high school programme.

Mr. Speaker, we need to commend the Government, the people of Ghana and the Anamuah-Mensah Committee for the good job they have been able to do to enable the Government come out with the White Paper of the educational reforms.

Mr. Speaker, I believe these Reforms when fully implemented, will stand the test of the times and will be the best-ever educational reforms in this country.

Mr. Speaker, in my opinion, I strongly feel that before the full implementation of the new reforms, measures should be put in place to ensure accessible and quality basic education, especially for rural and deprived areas like Nkwanta North constituency with emphasis on attractive conditions of service for teachers in that area.

Mr. Speaker, I thank you for giving me the opportunity to make my Statement.
Mr. Joe Kwashie Gidisu (NDc -- central Tongu) 11:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would want to associate myself with the Statement on the floor of the House.
Mr. Speaker, some of us have for a long time in this House been challenging the situation that the New Patriotic Party (NPP) Government has been working with since its assumption of office in terms of the ongoing educational reforms.
Mr. Speaker, we noted that for us in Ghana the archives of the Ministry of Education and Sports are loaded with
Mr. Speaker, all along, this two 11:10 a.m.
None

The need for this two-year kindergarten programme becoming part of the universal basic education structure is nothing new. And more especially for the Government to have set up a committee in the first term of its office not gearing itself up towards implementing the White Paper recommendations of that same commission they set up ever since embarking on its second term of office.

Mr. Speaker, I would want to associate myself with the Statement by calling on the Ministry of Education and Sports and for that matter the Government to rather take up the political courage of identifying those areas that need more resources to work effectively and review the ongoing process. This is because it is not a perfect

situation we are working with.

But to continue to say that it is as a result of the White Paper that they are going to change the education system, Mr. Speaker, I would want to differ from that position and to call on the Government to rather come up with the challenges that are there so as to effectively move the educational system forward than revisiting some of those situations that had been purported by the Statement.

Mr. Speaker, thank you for the opportunity.

Unsafe Abortion, the Hard Fact and the way Forward
Alhaji M. M. Mubarak (NDc - Asawase) 11:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, thank you very much for giving me the opportunity to make my maiden Statement to the House.
Mr. Speaker, I feel very honoured, having been sworn in as a Member of Parliament for the Asawase constituency to replace my elder brother, the late Dr. Adamu Gibiril; may his soul rest in peace.
First, I have to thank Almighty God for this day and choosing me to represent my constituency.
Secondly, I thank all Ghanaians, the people of Kumasi and much particularly the people of Asawase constituency for their prayers, support and confidence in my ability to lead them.
Mr. Speaker, my sincere thanks also go to the former President J. J. Rawlings, former Flagbearer of NDC, Prof Evans Atta Mills, the national, regional and constituency executives of NDC for their hard work and support that made my victory possible.
Mr. Speaker, my special thanks go to my hon. Colleagues NDC Members of Parliament (MPs) who made it to
Kumasi to support me in the campaign and participated as polling agents and all those who helped in one way or the other that culminated into my victory. I am most grateful.
Mr. Speaker, I want to use this opportunity to assure my constituents, that Insha Allah that is, by the Grace of God, I will serve them with all the energy in me and promise them nothing but truth and hard work. I shall give them the true leadership devoid of partiality.
Mr. Speaker, I also assure all Ghanaians that I shall work hard to promote good governance and true democracy in Ghana. To this House I shall give of my best to protect the integrity of the House.
Mr. Speaker, having thanked my people I would like to take this opportunity to make a Statement on the unsafe abortion and its effect on women in Ghana.
By definition, unsafe abortion is a procedure for terminating an unwanted pregnancy either by persons lacking the necessary skill or in an environment lacking the minimal medical standards or both.
Mr. Speaker, in the year 2003 there were 1,356 cases of unsafe abortion in Komfo Anokye Teaching Hospital (KATH) and 1,368 in the year 2004, which resulted in 29 per cent and 32 per cent respectively of maternal deaths at KATH. Thirty per cent of maternal deaths have been due to unsafe abortions in (1998) at Korle Bu and only God knows the true situation in other remote parts of Ghana where unsafe abortion rate is higher.
Mr. Speaker, the risk of abortion is 1 death in 3,700 in North America, 1 in 1,600 in Europe, 1 in 130 in Latin
Alhaji M. M. Mubarak (NDc - Asawase) 11:20 a.m.
Maternal mortality levels continue to rise in Africa, from 870 per 100,000 live births in 1987 to 1,000 per 100,000 live births in 2001 and still rising.
Mr. Speaker, it can clearly be seen that unsafe abortion takes its greatest toll in Africa. More than 30,000 African women die each year from unsafe abortion, often illegal abortion, which accounts for an average of 12 per cent of maternal deaths in Africa as a whole and 10 50 per cent in certain African countries. Tens of thousands more women suffer serious injuries, including infertility.

Mr. Speaker, adolescents suffer d i sp ropor t i ona t e ly f rom unsa fe abortion. According to the World Health Organisation (WHO), incidence of unsafe abortion is rising among unmarried adolescents, especially where abortion is legally restricted and fertility-regulation services are inaccessible to young people.

Mr. Speaker, in 1967 World Health Assembly formally recognised abortion as an important health problem in many countries. Unsafe abortions form large percentage of maternal mortality and long-term morbidity. This level of unsafe abortion shows clearly the direct relationship with unmet needs for family planning.

Mr. Speaker, in a developing country, a woman faces a greater risk of 250 if she has to seek services from an untrained, unskilled abortionist. But this risk of death significantly reduces when women have access to safe, legal services as demonstrated in many countries.

Mr. Speaker, whether an abortion is spontaneous or induced, the outcome

as to whether safe or unsafe depends wholly on the quality of care received. The poor, socially disadvantaged, those living in remote areas, adolescents married or unmarried, refugees and internally displaced persons are most at risk. Almost all deaths and complications from unsafe abortion are preventable.

Of all causes of maternal mortality, unsafe abortion is the easiest to prevent. Safe, effective technologies for contraception, pregnancy termination and post-abortion care are underutilized. When performed by trained personnel in appropriate settings, abortion is one of the safest medical procedures.

Mr. Speaker, 50.5 per cent of the Ghanaian population is women and fertility rate is 4.2 children per woman. Maternal mortality ranges from 650/100,000 live births to 870/100,000 live births with national average of 214/100,000.

Mr. Speaker, women usually use cruel methods for the unsafe abortion, ranging from insertion of objects such as sticks, wires, knitting needles, et cetera, into the private part, drinking bleach, herbs, et cetera, physical abuse exerted on patient by another.

Mr. Speaker, Ghana's health systems spend enormous resources to treat women suffering complications from unsafe abortion, for costs that include drugs, medical supplies, hospitalization and personnel. Providing safe abortion reduces unplanned expenditure on emergency care and allows services to be scheduled.

Mr. Speaker, women are dying because of lack of access to family planning, lack of access to quality care, legal restrictions and lack of knowledge of the law.

Mr. Speaker, women are still dying not because of diseases we cannot treat. They are dying because societies have yet to

make the decision that their lives are worth saving. Women deserve the full benefits of the law, they must not be coerced into motherhood contrary to the laws, they must be guaranteed their freedom of choice after all options are presented.

Unsafe abortion kills and maims women but is totally preventable, but in Ghana we have the legal dispensation to eliminate deaths from unsafe abortion. To meet the Millennium Development Goal target of reducing maternal mortality by 75 per cent -- we need to act now; we owe it to the 51 per cent of our population to stop them from dying unnecessarily.

The way Forward

Mr. Speaker, we cannot do new things with our old thinking. Ethical issues in abortion, is a controversial subject. This is because cultural, legal, religious and, of course, ethical contexts make abortion a divisive and sensitive topic. I pray that my audience exercise tolerance as we share ideas on this subject.

My Statement is not intended to engage in a debate about whether or under what circumstances abortion should be legal, rather it is to assist efforts to offer vital health services to the full extent allowed by the existing abortion law. I want us to look at the abortion law and amend it to establish legal abortion services at our health centres where women who qualify under the law to seek legal abortion could visit for safe abortion.
Mr. Speaker, the laws of Ghana allow abortion under the following conditions 11:20 a.m.
i. Rape, defilement of female idiot, incest.
Mr. Speaker, I beg that next time we amend this term, “female idiot”. It does not sound parliamentary.
ii. Risk to life, injury to physical or mental health, and
iii . Substantial risk, serious abnormality or disease.
Those qualified under the law to perform an abortion include a registered gynaecologist and registered medical practitioner. The abortion can be performed at a government hospital, private hospital, clinic registered under the Private Hospital and Maternity Homes Act, 1958 (No. 9) and place approved by the Minister for Health by an Legislative Instrument.
Mr. Speaker, the question one then asks is, when does a raped woman get her pregnancy aborted? Is it at the time she reports to police and medically she is proven to be pregnant or until the court finds the male involved guilty? Which part of the hospital does she go for attention? We know there is a maternity unit, but which portion can she then go for legal abortion? What does the law mean by physical or mental health? Does a school girl preparing to write her exams who gets pregnant qualify for an abortion under mental health?
These and many more are the questions health providers ask themselves which prevent them from attending to potentially qualified women for safe abortion. They are simply afraid of being at loggerheads with the law because the law is not explicit.
Mr. Speaker, another very important issue in our laws is the inconsistencies. Whereas the age of sexual responsibility is 14 years, legal responsibility is at 16 years and marriage and voting responsibility are at 18 years. This means that young girls under 14 years could not be counselled on issues of family planning, but we all witness young girls below the age of 14 years getting pregnant. We need to harmonise these laws for them to meet
Mr. Mahama Ayariga (NDc -- Bawku central) 11:30 a.m.
Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker, for the opportunity to identify myself with the Statement that has just been made.
Mr. Speaker, the debate about whether or not we should legalise abortion has a history; it is the history of the debate between the pro-abortionists and the anti- abortionists.
Mr. Speaker, there is no doubt that we as a country have arrived at the point where we have no choice but to engage in that debate. The statistics, as stated by my hon. Colleague, clearly indicates that many of our women and daughters are dying as a result of unsafe abortion and the experts have clearly pointed out that one of the reasons why many of them have to resort to illegal abortions and thereby abortions under unhygienic and inappropriate circumstances or conditions is the fact that abortion itself, generally, is outlawed except under certain very stringent conditions.

Mr. Speaker, the debate around abortion raises a very critical issue that we need to address our minds to. And it is the question of a woman's right to decide the time and circumstances under which her body can be used as an instrument for procreation. Essentially, that is the debate. Under what circumstances can a woman have the right to determine how her body should be used?

Mr. Speaker, there are those who

indicate that women must have the absolute right to determine when their bodies should be used for that purpose. Many of our groups, especially the religious groups are certainly opposed to this and we know that any attempt to deal with the issue of abortion is confronted with opposition by religious groups. Mr. Speaker, we as a country need to stop behaving like ostriches burying our heads in the sand and pretending that we do not have an issue; in fact, we have a situation and we need to be bold; we need to avoid being timorous souls and we need to deal with the issues squarely.

Mr. Speaker, let me just point out one pathetic situation. If a female student is pregnant in either our elementary school or senior secondary school, the approach has always been to dismiss her. The dismissal of this female student denies her access to education, and if you look at our Constitution, article 27 (3), we have no right to put impediments in the way of a female child simply because we have certain values that we think we must uphold at all cost. Mr. Speaker, we need to look at this situation critically - the tendency to dismiss female students simply because they are pregnant and in the process denying them a lifelong opportunity to access education and to make a difference in our society.

Mr. Speaker, on that note, I would want to urge that as a nation, we must rise up to the occasion and take steps to protect many of our women and daughters who are dying on a daily basis because of illegal abortions. Mr. Speaker, of course, I am not by this approving that female students should get themselves pregnant in school, but I am saying that when it happens -- And we all know that it is usually not their fault; it is the fault of many of the men, they cause it. And so when this happens, it is unfair for us to deny that female child access to education as a result of
Mrs. Agnes A. chigabatia (NPP - Builsa North) 11:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am very grateful to be given this opportunity to contribute to the Statement on the floor of the House. Mr. Speaker, abortion itself is illegal, and as such, the unsafeness of it is a must. Mr. Speaker, abortions are caused by irresponsible men; they tend to run away, leaving the poor woman with the pregnancy; and out of poverty and disappointment, the solution is to terminate it.
I am now entreating this House and the hon. Member for Asawase that abortions -- I think the men should face up to their responsibility that they did it and accept it, but not to run away and disappoint the poor woman. We know that when one causes abortion, one may die, but sometimes out of pain and frustration, there is no alternative than to terminate the foetus.
Mr. Speaker, I dare entreat all men not to use women and dump them and go back for them any time they want. I therefore pray that hon. Members here present, especially the men should do a thorough education in their various constituencies and tell men to accept to be fathers or refrain from being fathers but not to cause poor ladies to go and cause abortions.
Mrs. Juliana Azumah-Mensah (NDc - Ho East) 11:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I wish to associate myself with the very, very important Statement on the floor of the House.
Mr. Speaker, the problem of abortions, especially the unsafe and the illegal ones are on the increase, and as we have heard,
rose
Mr. Speaker 11:30 a.m.
Hon. Member for Nabdam, do you have a point of order?
Mr. Asaga 11:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, on a point of clarification.
Mr. Speaker 11:30 a.m.
Oh! - [Laughter.] -
Mr. Asaga 11:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I wanted to know the technique she was showing. Was it by experience or by theory? [Laughter.]
Mr. Speaker 11:30 a.m.
This is not a point of clarification or a point of order. Hon. Member for Ho East, please, continue.
Mrs. Azumah-Mensah 11:30 a.m.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will ignore that.
Mr. Speaker 11:30 a.m.
Yes, go ahead. [Laughter.]
Mrs. Azumah-Mensah 11:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, as I was saying, the three Ministries - the Ministry of Education and Sports, the Ministry of Manpower, Youth and Employment and the Ministry of Health should collaborate with one another and provide counselling for our young men and women. As somebody has already said, a lot of our women too, may be married but they do not have control over their bodies as to say, “Yes, I want to keep this pregnancy or I do not want it”. So with counselling services, a lot of these illegal abortions can be avoided and then our ladies and the youth also would be alive.
Mr. Speaker, finally, I would like also to have the law deal with the perpetrators of these illegal and unsafe abortions so that when they are caught, they are dealt with drastically and then put in prison with hard labour.
On this note, I would like to associate myself with the Statement.
Minister for women and children's Affairs (Hajia Alima Mahama) 11:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I rise to associate myself with a part of the Statement.
Mr. Speaker, the hon. Member, in his Statement mentioned language that he thought was unpalatable to Parliament, but he ended up also using language that I thought was not only unpalatable to Parliament but also unpalatable to women. The statement was, “the woman's pelvic has become a goldmine for galamsey operators”. This could have been said in a much more respectable way.
Having said that, Mr. Speaker, I agree with his statistics on Africa that we have about 1,000 maternal mortality per 100,000 births. In Ghana, the average is 214 per 100,000 births. So the average in Ghana is well below the African average though in some communities in Ghana, we can have as high as 700 per 100,000 births. This figure, I believe, is attributable to the fact that in Ghana we are supporting with reimbursement for ante-natal care services. In some parts of the country, we started with free ante-natal services. This has been extended to cover the rest of the country.
The President, in his State of the Nation Address, talked about the increase in the number of ambulance services for the country. I would entreat the Ministry of Health and therefore the Ministry of Finance and Economic Planning to consider this and implement it quickly, because having ambulance services in the communities would, to a large extent, reduce maternal mortality in areas where we do not have those services readily available.
Mr. Speaker, maternal mortality too is
Mr. Abdul-Rashid Pelpuo (NDc -- wa central) 11:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would like to associate myself with the Statement but to caution that if we allow abortion to go legal, there is the danger that we are opening the floodgates for people who perform the actions that cause abortion to also see their actions to be legal. We may be finding it difficult to restrain our young people and to ensure that these young people do not do what their matured elders do behind closed doors.

Hajia Mahama: On a point of order. Mr. Speaker, the Statement on the floor has not talked about legalizing abortion. The Statement on the floor is about the situation under which abortion can legally be performed on a woman or a child, for that matter; and we are emphasizing those situations, those legal situations. We have not emphasized that abortion must be legalized. We are saying that the law provides for when abortion must be performed, and if the law provides for that then the services must be there and the health workers must respond to that. That is the Statement on the floor.
Mr. Pelpuo 11:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, my impression is that when such signals are sent out, the next course of action is for people to think that abortion should be legalized, therefrom. And I am just saying that even though it is important that acceptable limits of abortion should be set,

it is still important for people to note that abortion as a whole cannot be legalized in this country if we want to ensure that we protect our young ones and for the young ones to have a future.

In the first place, the whole issue about abortions -- the caution about it -- must be very emphatic; that abortion itself is unacceptable because we should ensure that we keep the child once the woman is pregnant; and that once the woman becomes pregnant, she should have the child.

In the second place, we have a problem of low population in this country. Women should not think about going to abort if it is to - [Interruptions.] Mr. Speaker, what I am saying is that, women, in the first place, must begin thinking twice about going to kill an unborn baby. Whether it is legal or illegal, it is still not necessary for it to be exercised. [Interruptions.]

Hajia Mahama: On a point of order. Mr. Speaker, the hon. Member who just spoke is misleading the whole House. He is talking about legalizing abortion and he is talking about women thinking twice before going to kill a baby. This is not the situation under the laws of Ghana. The laws of Ghana have made abortion lawful under some circumstances and if those circumstances arise, the woman or child, for that matter, seeks abortion. The issue about thinking twice before going to kill any baby does not arise.

Mr. Speaker, he is a man and he cannot stand up and pontificate to women in this House because the laws provide for when a woman can have abortion, and we are talking about those legal situations in Ghana. Mr. Speaker, he is out of order and he should stop pontificating to the women of Ghana.
Mr. Speaker 11:50 a.m.
Hon. Member for Wa
Central, I hope you are winding up.
Mr. Pelpuo 11:50 a.m.
Yes, Mr. Speaker, I do
acknowledge her concern but I am just cautioning that the legal limits within which women are allowed to exercise the right to abort itself must be questioned. I am just saying that it is important that we begin to examine that one as well. It should not be a point or a source from which people begin to think about the larger implications of abortion.
Mr. Speaker 11:50 a.m.
At the Commencement
of Public Business, item 5 -- Laying of Papers. Chairman of the Committee on Mines?
Majority Leader (Mr. Felix owusu-
Adjapong): Mr. Speaker, I am told that the Committee met this morning but they have not been able to finalize it, so maybe if we can defer it and stand it, down, so that if they have finished by the time we are closing, then we lay it.
Mr. Speaker 11:50 a.m.
All right, we stand
it down for the time being. Item 6 -- Motions.
Suspension of Standing order 80 (1)
chairman of the committee (Nana
Akomea): Mr. Speaker, I beg to move,
Mr. A. o. Aidooh 11:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to second the motion.
Question put and motion agreed to.
MoTIoNS
Support Agreement between Government of Ghana and KHI
01 Ghana Limited
Nana Akomea 11:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, That this honourable House adopts the Report of the Joint Committee on Finance and Trade and Industry and Tourism on the Support Agreement between the Government of Ghana and KHI 01 Ghana Limited in relation to the Ambassador Hotel, Accra.
Mr. Speaker, in moving the motion, I would like to present the Report of the Joint Committee on Finance, Trade and Industry and Tourism. Mr. Speaker, the agreement was laid in the House on Wednesday, 6th July, 2005 and referred to the Joint Committee on Finance, Trade and Industry and Tourism for consideration and report in accordance with the 1992 Constitution and Standing Orders of the House.
Mr. Speaker, the Committee met with the hon. Minister for Tourism and Modernization of the Capital City, hon. Jake Obetsebi-Lamptey and a technical team from the Ministry of Tourism and Modernization of the Capital City, officials of the Bank of Ghana, the Attorney- General and the Committee reports as follows:
The Committee referred to the following documents, the Constitution of the Republic of Ghana and the Standing Orders of Parliament.
Mr. Speaker, the Ambassador Hotel
was a gift from the British Government to the newly-born independent Ghanaian State. The hotel commenced business in 1957 and it served as the main hotel for the dignitaries that participated in the Independence Celebration in 1957.
In the last two decades, Mr. Speaker, the iconic hotel has fallen into ruins. And generally, in the last ten years or so, the country has hardly seen a hotel with more than a hundred rooms being built in this country. There has also been the recognition of successive governments that we need to encourage the setting up of top world class hotels in this country for business conventions, for international sporting events and pleasure seekers so that the country can rival other countries such as South Africa, Malaysia and Morocco which abound in such hotel facilities.
To this end, the current Government has identified choice sites around the country for high-class hotel investment, and one such site is the Ambassador Hotel.
Mr. Speaker, the hotel has been through
an unsatisfactory history of divestiture, which finally culminated in the decision by the Lands Commission to terminate the lease of the hotel premises to Ambassador Hotel Ltd. for non-performance of the lease agreement.

The purpose of the current agreement

before the House is to provide support to a new investor, the Kingdom Hotels Investment Ltd, to build the Ambassador Hotel and other related facilities in three main stages. Stage one is to be a five-star international hotel of two hundred rooms with retail facilities. Stages two and three would be an expansion into retail, commercial and accommodation facilities. It is the wish of the Government that more than a hotel would be built on the premises so that it befits the standard of a modernized capital city of Ghana.
Mr. J. D. Mahama 11:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I thought our hon. Colleague would spare us reading the whole thing. We all have copies so if he would just read the main highlights we would make progress.
Mr. Speaker 11:50 a.m.
Chairman, you may have
your own style about whatever it is; let us hear it.
Nana Akomea 11:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would like to assure the hon. Member that it is a very short Report and I would read it very quickly so he can participate in the debate.
Mr. Speaker, the support agreement before this House provides direct Government support for, (1) the investment itself, and (2) the sub-lease agreement between Ghana Tourist Board and Kingdom Hotels Investment Group. The provisions of the support agreement include a five-year tax break for each phase of the project, waivers of duties and other taxes on materials to be used for the project, and that the land would be free of any encumbrances.
The hon. Minister for Tourism and Modernization of the Capital City submitted the head lease between the Lands Commission and the Ghana Tourist Board. He also submitted a project brief specifying the level of investment and other financial details. The sub-lease agreement between the Tourist Board and Kingdom Hotels Ltd also provides for a fifty-year renewable lease. It also provides for rental payments based on the revenue of the enterprise. The percentage to be charged as rent rises over the initial period of the lease from two and a half per cent to five and a half per cent of net revenue.
Mr. Speaker, the hon. Minister for Tourism and Modernization of the Capital City also informed the Committee that the rent is time-specific. He indicated that the two per cent is for the first year, rising to three per cent for the second year, and four and five per cent for the subsequent years. The Committee is, however, of the opinion that other major financial benefits would accrue to Government and the State in the form of job creation, taxes and incomes and Value-Added Tax (VAT), among other taxes.
Mr. Speaker, the Committee made the following observations 11:50 a.m.
(1) That although a lot of companies and individuals showed interest in the development of this hotel, over the years, most of these individuals and companies that showed interest were mere promoters and not investors. (2) That due diligence was undertaken before His Royal Highness Prince Alwaleed Bin Talal Bin Abdul Aziz Alsaud and the Kingdom Hotel Investment Group was identified as a possible ideal partner. The Committee -- [Interruptions] -- Mr. Speaker, I would beg the indulgence of my hon. Colleagues to proceed without any interruption.
Mr. Speaker 11:50 a.m.
Hon. Chairman, your
hon. Colleagues would want you to may be go to the conclusion.
Mr. M. A. Asaga 11:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I did not understand what he said. Which Alsaud is he referring to and a hotel? [Interruptions.]
Mr. Speaker 11:50 a.m.
Hon. Member, I thought you wanted him to go to the conclusion; let him go to the conclusion.
Nana Akomea noon
Mr. Speaker, I am sure the hon. Member would have an opportunity of meeting Prince Alsaud later on in the year.
Mr. Speaker, the third observation is that there is a provision in the Agreement of an offer to SSNIT for their equity participation and to Ghanaian individuals or corporate entities. The Agreement further provides shares to be placed on the Ghana Stock Exchange in the event that the enterprise is taken to public ownership in whole or in part.
That the process of land lease for investment purposes should be streamlined. Members were very concerned with the problems and difficulties that the Ministry of Tourism went through in securing the head lease for this project.
In order to promote the Golden Age of Business and further attract investors, the obstacles and difficulties investors go through in acquiring land has to be considered seriously. In this regard, it was suggested that the Lands Commission should be properly resourced to effectively perform its duties. The procedure in acquiring land lease for investment purposes should also be reviewed in order to encourage investors into this country.
That the Government's facilitation being extended to KHI 01 Ghana Limited should also be extended to local investors with the capacity to invest in the country.
That the extent of the investment that the Government of Ghana anticipated in Phase 1 of the Project has been significantly increased. The project sum has been increased from $27 million to $40 million.
That KHI has already hired the world's leading firm of architects to inspect the site. This actually shows the level of commitment by KHI to efficiently execute a landmark project.
That it is the intention of Government that the hotel be completed in 2007 to celebrate the nation's 50th Independence Anniversary.
conclusion
The Committee is of the view that the Government Support Agreement and Sub-Lease Agreement would contribute to the creation of jobs and encourage prospective investors into the country. The Committee therefore recommends to the House to adopt this report and approve the Support Agreement between the Government of Ghana and KHI and the Sub-Lease Agreement between the Ghana Tourist Board and KHI 01 Ghana Limited in accordance with article 181 (5) of the 1992 Constitution.
Respectfully submitted.
Mr. Speaker noon
Any seconder?
Mr. E. K. D. Adjaho (NDc -- Avenor/ Ave) noon
Mr. Speaker, I think that this project is a laudable one and we want to see the project take off as early as possible. Mr. Speaker, however, we are not too sure of what we are being asked to come and approve in this honourable House. The
Mr. E. K. D. Adjaho (NDc -- Avenor/ Ave) noon


more I look at article 181 as the Committee Report put it, the more I become confused. Why do I say so?

Mr. Speaker, the article 181 clause (5) is talking of international business or economic transaction of which the Government of Ghana is a party. But Mr. Speaker, company KHI 01 Ghana Limited, according to the document presented to us, is a Ghanaian company and incorporated in Ghana and doing business under the laws of Ghana. Therefore, we are talking about two persons; one a Ghanaian company and then the Government of Ghana. Therefore, I am not getting the international dimension very clearly.

Mr. Speaker, more particularly, if one looks at the Committee's Report, all that we are being asked to do, we will have to come back to this House at the appropriate time. We cannot waive anything. Mr. Speaker, if one is talking about waivers and exemptions, the normal practice is that if it is import duties and other things, one would have to come back through the Ministry of Finance and Economic Planning with the specific exemption for the appropriate resolution of this House to be moved. So they would have to come back to this honourable House.

Mr. Speaker, concerning the five-year tax holiday, my problem there is that this motion or this Report cannot overwrite the benefits that investors are entitled to under the Ghana Investment Promotion Centre. Therefore, if these benefits are not in the Ghana Investment Promotion Centre Act, this motion cannot amend that law; it cannot amend the substantive law.

Mr. Speaker, we are also being told in paragraph 4 of the Committee's Report that the land is devoid of any financial encumbrance. I am also surprised that they are bringing even the land matter in the Report, because the Government,

after divesting itself of its interest for fifty years to the Ghana Tourist Board -- after divesting one's interest in the property one does not go back again to give an assurance that it would be free of encumbrances. It is never done and as a result I do not know exactly what we are being invited to come and approve in this honourable House.

Mr. Speaker, the document laid before this honourable House, if you look at the Order Paper of the day that it was laid, was Agreement for lease and Government Support Agreement in relation to the Ambassador Hotel -- Accra, Ghana. And where is the lease agreement coming from?

Once Government has divested itself for fifty years to Ghana Tourist Board, it cannot enter into another lease agreement with this company again, because it has transferred its interest. Government has granted the lease to Ghana Tourist Board and Ghana Tourist Board has entered into a sub-lease; and that is schedule 2 to this agreement. Therefore, any undertaking that we have to make again, as a liaison, after having divested that interest -- we are no more in a position to make certain undertakings or obligations.

So Mr. Speaker, I believe this honourable House supports the project and we want this project to take off as early as possible because what is there now is an eyesore; but I do not know exactly what they have called us here to do. I can go on and give more examples from the documentation before us.

Nobody should send a signal to anybody that when this motion is approved, it means that if there is a tax exemption the tax exemption will not come to this place. It does not mean that -- that really is the position and I do not know what we want
Mr. E. K. D. Adjaho (NDc -- Avenor/ Ave) 12:10 p.m.
to do. But Mr. Speaker, I believe that part
of the problem we are facing now is the failure of this whole House to do what the Constitution expects us to do under the very article 181(5) by coming out with the necessary modifications. Mr. Speaker, article 181(5) says:
“This article shall, with the necessary modifications by Parliament, apply to an international business or economic transaction to which the Government is a party as it applies to a loan.”

Mr. Speaker, I believe that this House has been in existence for sometime. We should be able to seize the opportunity to come out and define the type of business and economic transaction we are talking about. Therefore, we can make the necessary modifications and everybody would be very clear -- the Executive would be very clear, the House would be very clear -- as to which areas of economic and business transactions we are talking about as a House.

Mr. Speaker, we want the project to take off but I do not know exactly what we are being invited by this honourable House to approve. My personal view is that they can go on with the project without any approval from this House. If they need a specific tax exemption they can come to this House. This House would, through the Ministry of Finance and Economic Planning, approve it for them. If there are tax incentives and they are supported by the existing law, Ghana Investment Promotion Centre Law, they would benefit from it. If they want to repatriate their profits and all those things, if it is in conformity with Bank of Ghana
Mr. Speaker 12:10 p.m.
Deputy Minority
Leader, I want a clarification of your position. When you got up, my impression was that you were seconding the motion.
Mr. Adjaho 12:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, you
proposed the Quest ion af ter the Committee's Report was read so it is the committee's -- [Interruption.] I do not know, but if you think that there is need for secondment -- Mr. Speaker, it is the Committee's Report which was virtually read so, Mr. Speaker, if you think that there is the need for secondment, then you can expunge my contribution, get somebody to second it and then restore my contribution -- [Laughter.]
Mr. Speaker 12:10 p.m.
So you are withdrawing
your support for the motion. You are withdrawing your earlier remark that you were seconding the motion.
Mr. Adjaho 12:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I withdraw
to be restored after the secondment. Mr. Speaker, these are interesting points that I have raised but as I have said, we are not against the project. We want this project to take off but if you look at the Report, if you look at the whole documentation, it raises these points that I have brought to the floor.
Mr. Speaker 12:10 p.m.
Deputy Minority
Leader, I still need clarification. Are you

seconding and raising observations? What is your stand? I do not know. Are you seconding it and raising observations, or what?
Mr. Adjaho 12:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, you have
learnt the rules very fast -- [Laughter.] You have learnt the rules very fast, I must concede. But Mr. Speaker, clearly, initially, I thought it could be preliminary points being taken against the motion. But Mr. Speaker, as you rightly pointed out I think that it ought to be seconded after the motion is moved; then you propose the Question. So I am now withdrawing.
Mr. Speaker, given my conclusion, it would be difficult for me to second it but we are not against the project. I want to emphasise this point; it is very, very important -- [Uproar.] We are not against the project. Mr. Speaker, in fact, they can go ahead and do it and I want to assure them that nobody would appear before the Fast Track Court from this side of the House.
Mr. Speaker 12:10 p.m.
Any seconder of the
motion.
Mr. Hackman owusu-Agyemang 12:10 p.m.
On a point of order. Mr. Speaker, mine is a point of order. I want to raise for us all. Mr. Speaker, when a statement is made on the floor, it becomes the property of the House, and he cannot withdraw it without the permission of the House. He knows that he cannot withdraw it, so if he wants to withdraw his secondment then, Mr. Speaker, you must grant him permission before he can withdraw. So as it is, he cannot withdraw his secondment of the motion. That is a technicality.
Mr. Speaker 12:10 p.m.
Deputy Minority Leader, are you requesting me to grant you permission to withdraw?
Mr. Adjaho 12:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, that is so.
Mr. owusu-Adjapong 12:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to second the motion and in seconding the motion to take advantage of some of the statements that have been withdrawn by the Deputy Minority Leader so that I save him the trouble of having to come back to repeat those same words. [Interruption.]
Mr. Adjaho 12:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I need your guidance. Once I have withdrawn it, I do not see how he can make reference to my contributions because it has to be taken as if it does not exist.
Mr. Speaker 12:10 p.m.
Deputy Minority Leader, are you saying that whatever you said should be expunged?
Mr. Adjaho 12:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, you can use your discretion. In fact, if you look at Standing Orders 5 and 6, you can even make rules when there is no provision made for it. Mr. Speaker, now that it has been seconded I have now restored my contributions -- [Laughter.]
Mr. Speaker 12:10 p.m.
But let the Majority Leader finish his argument.
Mr. owusu-Adjapong 12:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I believe my hon. Colleague wanted to contribute to the debate and now that you have granted him permission to restore all that he said we would try to give him one or two things for him to look at again, and possibly he would change his mind.
Mr. Speaker, my hon. Colleague, the Deputy Minority Leader made reference to article 181 (5) of the Constitution and sought to create the impression that it is not an international agreement and therefore we do not need to have the document here.
Mr. Speaker, first, we need to find out who the parties to this Agreement are. Yes,
we are told it is a company registered in Ghana but Mr. Speaker, we have always been fighting with the rules as to which is a Ghanaian company. I am told this company is owned wholly by foreigners and if one was to remove the veil then one is in fact, left with a company that may perhaps not even be able to borrow from our banking system. Mr. Speaker, I hope my hon. Colleague would wait and let me give him some of the reasons for him to change his mind.
Mr. Speaker 12:10 p.m.
Deputy Minority Leader, are you raising a point of order or you are taking a certain course?
Mr. Adjaho 12:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, on a point of order. Mr. Speaker, the hon. Majority Leader is seriously misleading this House. Mr. Speaker, the “international” qualifies both “business” and “economic”. Mr. Speaker, in article 181(5), the “international” qualifies both “business” and “economic” and therefore he cannot say that the “international” qualifies one and does not qualify the other. He is misleading the House.
Mr. Speaker 12:20 p.m.
Let him go on, please. Hon. Majority Leader?
Mr. owusu-Adjapong 12:20 p.m.
Thank you.
I think this is not a point of order. It is a wrong interpretation of article 181 (5), which he sought to present to us -- [Interruptions.] Mr. Speaker, the “international” qualifies “business” and then we have “economic transactions” -- [Interruptions] -- Mr. Speaker, “. . . apply to an international business or economic transaction”. And my view is this, that this is an economic transaction -- [Interruptions.]
Mr. Speaker 12:20 p.m.
Order! Order!
Mr. owusu-Adjapong 12:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker,
again as I said, we keep on reminding ourselves everyday that we should empower Parliament. Here we are, a potential investor is showing the extra confidence he has in the Parliament of Ghana and we sit here and say, “our hands are tied up; we have nothing to do with such a document”. I believe that we should recognize that we owe a duty to Ghana to look at this transaction and treat it as an economic transaction and not as an international business, especially when we are dealing with a company whose owners are all foreigners.
I believe that this preliminary objection cannot hold water and therefore, we should go ahead and look at the document and the Report as presented by the Committee. And if we are convinced that this would advance the course of Ghana's economic development, more so tourism, then we should approve of it and let business go on in Ghana, so that our people can get more jobs to do.
Question proposed.
Mr. Moses A. Asaga (NDc --
Nabdam): Mr. Speaker, we on this side, support the motion, as we have earlier mentioned. There is a difference between supporting a project and its advantages to the economy of this country and the
Mr. owusu-Adjapong 12:20 p.m.


procedure of approval; the two are not the same.

Secondly, we on this side have never

said that Parliament's hands have been tied and, therefore, we cannot deal with this particular document. All that we are saying is that this document is unnecessary for Parliament. We are giving them the freewill to go ahead. This is all that we are saying -- [Hear! Hear!] So for us, we even want to improve the workings of Parliament and maybe into the future, we even need to look at that article 181 in detail; and I think that the comments raised are valid and would improve parlia- mentary work.

Having said that, this agreement is between Kingdom Hotel Investment Group with its office registered in Cayman Islands, I mean the parent company. It has assets valued over one billon, which makes it very, very strong -- [Interrup- tions] -- one billion dollars, not cedis. It has investments in Africa, in the Middle East and North Africa. We had to call for all these documentations because initially the due diligence that was done was very scanty. The Report has also misled us by saying that due diligence was done. We called for due diligence by the Finance Committee, and I want to put that on record -- [Hear! Hear!]

Mr. Speaker, this new project is actually

to add more hotel occupancy space to Ghana and I think that it is a welcome idea. It is a continuation of what had always existed from 1993 up to 2000 when the National Democratic Congress (NDC) was in government -- [Hear! Hear!] Mr. Speaker, within the period that I am talking about, the Government at that time supported various investors who went into the hotel and tourism business and I can mention a few.

The Continental Hotel or the former

Continental Hotel was refurbished by Libyan investors for it to be now a first- class hotel. The NDC Government, with instructions to SSNIT, got involved in hotel buildings and I believe that the Central Region would be very grateful to the NDC, and also Western Region, for the number of first-class hotels that were built in the Central Region under the Golden Beach Hotel chain.

As we speak today, if you go to Elmina we have the Elmina Beach Hotel, which is one of the best hotels in the country -- [Hear! Hear!] Busua Beach is another very good hotel. If we come to our own capital city, the Royal Palm Hotel is one of the best hotels that we have in this city. So for me, this continuity of the good works of the NDC is highly appreciated -- [Hear! Hear!]

Mr. Speaker, not only did the environ- ment at that time support foreign investors but it also gave incentives for Ghanaian investors to also invest in the hotel business. On this note, I want to acknowledge hon. Dr. Nduom for being able to establish the Coconut Grove Hotel -- [Hear! Hear!] Therefore, when sometimes people say that the NDC was private-sector insensitive, then I wonder what they mean by private-sector because hon. Dr. Nduom can testify that we were private-sector driven -- [Hear! Hear!]

Mr. Speaker, the Government's support for the lease agreement does not end there. The other issue --
rose
Mr. Speaker 12:20 p.m.
Hon. Deputy Minister
for Energy, I did not see you. You are so close that I did not see you.
Mr. Hammond 12:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, on a point of order. Mr. Speaker, is it allowed
for a Member to embarrass another Member by reference to him -- [Uproar] -- by putting words in his mouth, by suggesting that Dr. Nduom can attest to that? Mr. Speaker, he has not said any such thing -- [Interruptions.]
Mr. Speaker 12:20 p.m.
Order! Order!
Mr. Hammond 12:20 p.m.
Dr. Nduom can speak for himself -- [Interruptions.]
Mr. Speaker 12:20 p.m.
Order! Hon. Member, I did not, in fact, hear what you were saying. Please, go ahead. Were you embarrassing anybody?
Mr. Hammond 12:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I have not completed. I was also asking and if he could also tell us, because some of us are not very clear as to the ownership of La Palm. He said something about La Palm, so if he could also tell us about that -- [Interruptions.]
Mr. Speaker 12:20 p.m.
Hon. Member for Nabdam, please, continue.
Mr. Asaga 12:20 p.m.
So Mr. Speaker, I think that when our own citizens have done very well for this country, we must find a forum to congratulate them -- Ghanaian investors in Ghana -- and this is the forum I have chosen and Dr. Nduom is very happy with that -- [Hear! Hear!]
Secondly, I take my cue from the fact that when we were dealing with this document -- and with your permission, I beg to quote Dr. Nduom at the committee meeting; he said:

So Mr. Speaker, this is quite an encouragement and I would want us to support this project to be able to build the Ambassador Hotel into a first-class five-star hotel.
Mr. Speaker 12:20 p.m.
Hon. Deputy Minority
Leader, may I get further clarification from you? You referred me to article 181(5) and it talked about international business or economic transaction to which the Government is a party. Attached to these papers there is an agreement between Ghana Government and KHI 01 Ghana Limited; is this covered by that?
Mr. Adjaho 12:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, the company
you have just referred to, is registered under the laws of Ghana. It is not treated as a foreign company, which has been registered in Ghana. It is incorporated under the laws of Ghana.
Mr. A. o. Aidooh 12:30 p.m.
I just want to make a quick intervention on the question that was put, the issue as to whether this document should be here at all. Mr. Speaker, it is my view that the document that we are considering properly belongs to this House and it needs our approval. It is unfortunate that my hon. Colleague (Mr. Asaga) has said that the privileges being extended to foreign investors must be given to local investors as well. So we appreciate the fact that we are dealing with foreign investors. Mr. Speaker, article 181 (5), if I may read, is as follows:
“This article shall, with the necessary modifications by Parliament, apply to an international business or economic transaction to which the Government is a party as it applies to a loan.”
Mr. Speaker, what it means is that the
Mr. A. o. Aidooh 12:30 p.m.


important thing is to find out whether (1), the Ghana Government is a party; and (2) the venture is an international business or economic transaction. Mr. Speaker, essentially the nature of the other party is not the determining factor. The nature of the other party is never the determinant factor. Mr. Speaker, if it were so it would read as follows: “An international economic or business transaction between the Ghana Government and a foreign investor”. Mr. Speaker, what I am trying to say is that what we have to do is at the substance of the Agreement, the nature of the Agreement and not the parties.

Mr. Speaker, if you look at the Agreement itself, the General Agreement, clauses 3.1.1 and 3.1.11 -- Mr. Speaker, I beg to read 3.1.1:

“On the first occasion following the grant of the New Hotel Lease but prior to a Listing on which the Company proposes to undertake an issuance of new Shares to Persons other than solely Kingdom or its Affiliates . . .”

Mr. Speaker, I emphasise the words “Kingdom or its Affiliates”. In clause 3.1.11 too we have the same words “Kingdom or its Affiliates”.

Mr. Speaker, “kingdom” is defined --

First of all, on page 3 of the Agreement, the word “Affiliate” is defined as follows:

“Affiliate means any entity which directly or indirectly, through one or four intermediaries, Controls, is Controlled by, or is under common Control with such entity; provided, however, that for the purposes of this Agreement Affiliates of the Company shall include His Royal Highness the Prince Alwaleed Bin Talal Bin Abdulaziz Al Saud, members of his immediate family (parents, siblings, spouse, children or grandchildren and
Mr. Adjaho 12:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, the hon.
Member is misleading this honourable House because the issue is whether it is a Ghanaian company or a foreign company registered in Ghana. Mr. Speaker, if somebody wanted to take action against the company today, he is not going to take action against the descendants who will be coming in a hundred years from now and all those things. Mr. Speaker, the law is very clear, it is a limited liability company, registered in Ghana; they could have chosen to make it a foreign company registered in Ghana but they decided to incorporate it in Ghana here. Mr. Speaker, that is the point I am making and he should respond to that.
Mr. Speaker 12:30 p.m.
Yes, this is the point you have been making all the time. You also talked about the necessary modifications that have not been made by Parliament. [Pause.] Alright, let him go on.
rose
Mr. Speaker 12:30 p.m.
Are you taking a further
point of order?
Mr. Mahama Ayariga 12:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker,
Mr. A. o. Aidooh 12:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I
think that my hon. Colleague is a little bit confused. The issue being canvassed by his side is that the Ghana Government is a party but the other is a Ghanaian; that is what they are saying. So he should understand that. So Mr. Speaker, the point I am making is this -- [Interruptions] -- And I am surprised that my hon. Friend, Mr. Adjaho is still showing apprehension about the parties.
Mr. Mahama Ayariga 12:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, the hon. Deputy Majority Leader continues to mislead this House. Mr. Speaker, it is obvious that the party that he is referring to is Ghanaian because it is registered under our laws; as a company limited by guarantee -- [Uproar.]
Mr. A. o. Aidooh 12:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I want to raise a point. Mr. Speaker, I have not said that KH1 01 Ghana Limited is not registered in Ghana; it is registered in Ghana. But I am saying that the venture is an international business transaction because no matter what the facts are, the Ghana Government is making obligations and commitments to parties who are not Ghanaians. Therefore, Mr. Speaker, I will conclude by saying that this Agreement is clearly caught by article 181 (5) and even if we are erring, I will advise that we should err on the side of caution because the Supreme Court has decided -- [Interruption.]
Mr. Speaker 12:30 p.m.
Hon. Deputy Majority
Leader, I will call you to contribute but your hon. Colleague has raised a point of order so let him continue. I will call you later, let him; continue.
Mr. Mahama Ayariga 12:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, what the hon. Deputy Majority Leader is saying is that anytime the Government of Ghana provides guarantee for any company, whether or not the company is registered as a legal entity in Ghana, then there is an international transaction. Mr. Speaker, this is an absurd interpretation of this constitutional provision. This is because in international law the fact that there is a Prince involved, does not make it an international transaction. Indeed, if they wanted it to be an international transaction, it should have been the Government of Saudi Arabia and not a Prince, not through a company registered as a legal entity in Ghana.
Mr. Speaker, if we refer to the Agreement itself, paragraph 2, describes the personality that we are dealing with
Mr. Speaker 12:40 p.m.
Order! Order, please!
Mr. A. o. Aidooh 12:40 p.m.
On a point of order. Mr. Speaker, I am surprised that my hon. Friend does not understand me. Mr. Speaker, I was saying that even if we were to err, we should err on the side of caution because the Supreme Court has decided that any agreement -- [Interruption] --If it is not brought here the rights under it are unenforceable. And so I would submit that this Agreement is squarely caught by article 105 and needs the approval of this House to be effective and binding on the parties.
Mr. Speaker, I thank you.
Mr. Dan Abodakpi (NDc -- Keta) Mr. Speaker, I rise to add my word of support for the project. I think, as stated earlier on, this is a very good project. It is an important project that as a country we should crave for. But for what my understanding was, that the main shareholder is KHI 01 Ghana Limited wanted parliamentary approval as a kind of comfort for his investment in Ghana, I was against this investment coming here to Parliament. This is because in passing the Ghana Investment Promotion Centre Act, we did it with facilitation in mind that that should act as a one-stop centre for approving all investments into this country. But for the vagaries of African politics, the uncertainties in the minds of this important investor whose name alone, in fact, constitutes a flagship which we can access more investments --
For that request my understanding was that he wanted parliamentary approval as a
comfort, and I was of the view that given that the liaison in this transaction is Ghana Tourist Board (GTB) and GTB has clear incentives also under this package, just as the Ghana Investment Promotion Centre, we needed not introduce bureaucratic processes and procedures in approving this project and that it should be done at a level of GTB and Ghana Investment Promotion Centre.
But as I said earlier, but for the comfort that the Prince needed that if he invested into this edifice that has been standing there for so long and has become an eyesore, and that a change of government will not result in unnecessary acrimonies, et cetera, its coming here would not have been necessary.
So if there are some legal problems that need to be sorted out, my plea to the honourable House is that we should take note of the legal concerns that have been raised so that the Attorney General's Department and this House should facilitate the resolution of the legal difficulty so that we can let this project go ahead and give the right message to this investor and especially the investors that we are trying to woo from that side of the world. I think, for me, that is the issue that we should be dealing with.
Mr. Speaker, thank you very much.
Minister for works and Housing (Mr. Hackman owusu-Agyemang) 12:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I tend to go on the same tangent as my hon. Friend from Keta. But what I am trying to point out is that if the Constitution does not bar this issue, then we do not really have to flog it. At the end of the day, we have brought to this House a lot of Agreements between the Government of Ghana and entities in Ghana. If we remember the car loan for the Members of Parliament, it was between Barclays Bank and this House.
rose
Mr. Speaker 12:40 p.m.
Hon. Member for Bole, do you have a point of order to raise?
Mr. Mahama 12:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, yes. Mr. Speaker, the hon. Minister for Works and Housing is not only succeeding in confusing himself but he is trying to confuse the whole House. The example he gave about Barclays Bank and Parliament raising a loan from Barclays Bank, I do not see what relevance it has to the argument he is making -- [Interruption.]
Mr. owusu-Agyemang 12:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, if he does not see that, I think the ordinary Ghanaian wants to understand that inasmuch as there is an obligation on the part of the Government vis-à-vis any lender or investor, it could come to this House. So if it is not barred from coming to this House and this is the way forward, we must move forward. The point that I am making is that both sides of the House support this project and there is no problem as to whether it calls for abundance of caution -- [Interruption.]
Mr. John Mahama 12:40 p.m.
On a point of order. Mr. Speaker, the hon. Member has not got the point I am making. In the case of the Barclays Bank loan, there was the issue of a Government of Ghana guarantee. In the event that that loan was not paid, the Government of Ghana would be obliged to pay the loan. Mr. Speaker, that is why it came to Parliament and it has absolutely no similarity to the current
issue that we are discussing.
Mr. owusu-Agyemang 12:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, if anybody is confused -- There is an insect called Triboliom confusion and it is the hon. Member who is behaving like a Triboliom confusion -- [Laughter.]
Mr. Speaker, this paper we have here says -- “Agreement between the Government of the Republic of Ghana and the KHI 01 Ghana Limited”. Now, if we are saying that that particular title is wrong, that is another story. But if the Government of Ghana decides to hold brief for GTB, then by extension of reasoning it means that it is the Government of Ghana which is the responsibility holder. But that is not the important point I would want to canvass here.
Dr. Benjamin Kunbuor 12:50 p.m.
On a point of order. Mr. Speaker, I think my hon. Colleague is grossly misleading this House. The issue that is being discussed here is whether this is the appropriate forum to get the approval. What the hon. Deputy Minority Leader indicated was basically that, looking at almost all the essentials of this particular arrangement, he did not think this was the proper forum. But to say that because we do not have a constitutional bar that prevents this matter from coming, then it should come -- Perhaps, he should be asking, what is compelling it to come? This is because the most significant thing is that it is when the law compels you to come to the House that you come. If one is not compelled by a law and one chooses to come, one should not complain that legal issues are being raised.

It has been ruled on in this House
Dr. Benjamin Kunbuor 12:50 p.m.


in relation to the Highly Indebted Poor Countries (HIPC) fund; when the specific question was asked as to why HIPC funds had not come to this House for guidelines to be prepared, what did the hon. Minister say?
Mr. owusu-Agyemang 12:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I do not think, with the utmost of respect, that that was a point of order, neither was it a point that I was trying to canvass.
Mr. John Mahama 12:50 p.m.
On a point of order. Mr. Speaker, the hon. Minister for Works and Housing is definitely lost. The approval of this Agreement, as the hon. Deputy Minority Leader said, would not lead to a tax waiver. If there is an intent to give tax waivers, those would have to come to this House and be handled by separate Resolutions granting that waiver. And so, the argument the hon. Minister is canvassing that we do not need to come back for tax waivers and that we should just go ahead and approve this does not meet what we are trying to do.
Mr. owusu-Agyemang 12:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I think yet again, my hon. Friend from Bole Bamboi is very confused also. That is not the point that I am making. He should listen to me carefully and then he
would hear my arguments.

Several hon. Members -- rose --

An hon. Member: Lawyers.
Mr. owusu-Agyemang 12:50 p.m.
Lawyers, not “so-called” Lawyers.
Mr. Speaker 12:50 p.m.
He has corrected himself.
Mr. owusu-Agyemang 12:50 p.m.
Lawyers. [Interruptions.]
Several hon. Members -- rose --
Mr. Speaker 12:50 p.m.
You may resume your seats; he has corrected himself. [Interruption.]
Mr. owusu-Agyemang 12:50 p.m.
Withdrawn. Mr. Speaker, lawyers -- withdrawn “so- called”.
Mr. Speaker, inasmuch as the lawyers cannot agree among themselves -- [Hear! Hear!] -- That is the more reason why, as the hon. Deputy Majority Leader says, we must err on the side of caution. Right now we want to move forward; we want to get the investment; we are losing time. [Interruption.]
Mr. Ayariga 12:50 p.m.
On a point of order. Mr. Speaker, I think the very senior hon. Member of this House is missing the point. We have established the fact that a company here is a legal person under Ghana laws. Article 17 of our Constitution is very clear on this issue that we shall not discriminate. This is a clear case where we are seeking to grant preferential or differential treatment to another company based on the status of the investor in that
Mr. Speaker 12:50 p.m.
Hon. Member for Bawku, please, we should be circumspect about this matter. I thought this was the point the hon. Member for Keta was making, so please, let us take a cue from him.
Mr. Ayariga 12:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I certainly take a cue from that statement, but we are simply saying that we need to be given very good reasons why we need to go against article 17 of the Constitution which is in very, very compelling language. That is the point that I want to make.
Mr. Speaker 12:50 p.m.
All right. Hon. Minister, you were in the middle of your argument.
rose
Mr. Speaker 12:50 p.m.
You are yielding to him?
Mr. owusu-Agyemang 12:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am yielding to him for now so he can argue his point.
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, with respect, we seem to be going forwards and backwards. An hon. Member is on the floor and he is interrupted on a point of order. The rules of this House are very clear according to Standing Order 92 (1) which says -- and Mr. Speaker, with your permission I beg to quote:
“No Member shall interrupt any other Member except:
(a) by rising to a point of order, that is, where any of these Orders is alleged to have been infringed, w h e r e u p o n t h e M e m b e r
speaking shall resume his seat and a Member interrupting shall simply direct attention to the point which he decides to bring to the notice and submit it to Mr. Speaker for his decision.”
Mr. Speaker, what my hon. Colleagues are doing -- They rise up on a point of order and they are arguing; and most unfortunately it is about the same point that they keep repeating. Mr. Speaker, I think that is unacceptable. With respect, they should be ruled out of order and allow the debate to proceed.
Mr. Speaker 12:50 p.m.
Order!
Mr. owusu-Agyemang 12:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I believe that we as a House must be realistic and not handicap ourselves and for that matter the whole nation by indulging in the fine legal provisions in the Constitution. Right now, the little difficulty we have in this House is whether the Agreement should have been here or not. The Executive, having discussed it, thought it should be here. The lawyers who looked at it thought it should be here; the Joint Committee met on it. At that point in time, if the Joint Committee thought that Mr. Speaker had erred in referring the matter to the Joint Committee, then they should have come to tell us that but in this instance the Joint Committee has come back with the report, which means that in their opinion the matter is well placed before this House. So I do not see why now hon. Members of the other side say that it should not have been here at all. It is at the committee level that whether it is admissible or not should have been argued, but one does not wait for the report to be brought to be debated, only to be told that it should not be here -- [Interruption.]
Dr. Kunbuor 12:50 p.m.
On a point of order. Mr. Speaker, I think my hon. Colleague is really misleading this House because
Dr. Kunbuor 12:50 p.m.


the status of something before the House has nothing to do with whether Cabinet thinks it is right, whether lawyers outside think it is right and whether a committee of this House thinks it is right. The matter can be raised here as long as it is before this House.
Mr. owusu-Agyemang 12:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I have not denied that fact. The fact that, (1) the Executive of this country thought it should be here, (2) Mr. Speaker thought it should be here, (3) the Joint Committee thought it should be here, means that the majority thinks it should be here. But that is not the important issue. The important issue here is that whatever it is, because of all these little difficulties, as the hon. Deputy Majority Leader said, we must err on the side of caution.
We all support it so what is the big deal as to whether it should be here or not? Let us be practical, hands on, hon. Members of Parliament, and approve this Agreement since nobody has any objection and let us move on with it so that we can have this investment for the anniversary. Otherwise, we would be indulging in trivialities which at the end of the day is not that germane to the issue on the floor. Let us now move forward and approve the contract, Mr. Speaker.
Alhaji M. A. Yakubu (NPP -- Yendi) 1 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, my view is that you can solve the problem easily for us. The Agreement was laid in this House some 13 days ago. The Joint Committee of Finance and Trade and Industry and Tourism met and I believe membership of these Committees from both sides attended the joint meeting of the Committee.

Mr. Speaker, I do not think when the Agreement was laid, any objection

was raised; I do not think that when the Committee met there was a disagreement about it. Fortunately for us, both sides are saying that they support the project. If that is the case and this process has gone on all this while, then Mr. Speaker can rule that this is properly before the House; and since we have no quarrel about the essence of the project then we would just go on and approve it. So I think, Mr. Speaker, in view of the argument you rule that this Agreement is properly before the House and let us take a decision on it.
Mr. J. D. Mahama (NDc -- Bole- Bamboi) 1 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, contrary to the Second Deputy Speaker's point, the problem here is that we are setting a precedent. Mr. Speaker, we are opening a pandora box. What we are being told is that in the case of a particular company that is registered here in Ghana, if you lift the veil from that company, the owners are foreigners and so because of that, in order that their business is facilitated, Parliament must approve it as an international business transaction.
Mr. Dan Abodakpi 1 p.m.
On a point of order. Mr. Speaker, I think Government, at a certain point in time, in its search for a strategic investment, can vary existing rules and procedures. In some other
jurisdictions -- I want to cite the case of competition between France and the United Kingdom for the location of a Japanese auto industry. At the end of the day the French won by giving all kinds of incentives that were not in their books because they thought it was strategic; that was why I was making the point that to that extent therefore -- [Interruption.] No, it is based on the point that because we are varying something -- That is the point I am making; it is a point of order.
So I want to make this point. It could register in our minds but I am saying that some legal nuances have been raised here which at the end of the day, to me, even do not link to the benefit of the investment because all the automatic things that one wants are there in the Investment Code. That is the point we made earlier on, that this thing could have gone through the Investment Promotion Centre but for the so-called comfort that the investment was looking for. That is the context within which I want to place it.
Mr. Mahama 1 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, i t emphasises exactly the point I am making. Mr. Speaker, what is the investor asking for? He is asking for a five-year tax break. Mr. Speaker, it is already available in the laws that this very House has passed -- [Interruption.] He is asking for an additional five -- Mr. Speaker, if he wants an additional five, he should come to this House and we would pass the appropriate resolution and give him the additional five. He has been guaranteed five already and he wants an additional five; we would pass a resolution and give it to him. Mr. Speaker, he is asking for a waiver of duties and other taxes on materials to be used for the project. Mr. Speaker, the Ghana Investment Promotion Centre laws allow him that leverage. If he brings it to this House we would pass a resolution and grant all the exemptions.
Mr. Speaker, the only obligation on
Minister for Justice (Mr. Joe Ghartey 1 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, indeed, thank you for giving me the opportunity to contribute to this motion.
Mr. Speaker, the point has been made that because the company is incorporated in Ghana and therefore it takes away the financial aspect of the transaction, it does not therefore come under article 181 (5) of the Constitution. Unfortunately under international investment law this is not
Dr. Kunbuor 1 p.m.
On a point of order. Mr. Speaker, for the guidance of both young and old international business lawyers, I would want to indicate that my hon. Friend is misleading the House. [Hear! Hear!] You do not just get up and lift a veil of incorporation to find the real identify behind the company for no reason. The grounds are very clear -- fraud -- that is one of the essential grounds. Is this company involved in any fraudulent act for us to lift the veil? The second has to do with revenue matters where the issue is -- [Interruptions] -- it is the real identity of the taxpayer which is at stake. So my submission basically is that -- [Some hon. Members: Teach them, go ahead.]
Mr. Speaker 1 p.m.
Let us have decorum, the hon. Member is raising a point of order, let us listen to him -- [Interrup-tion.]
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, if it is a point of order we want to know what Order has been infringed.
Mr. Speaker 1 p.m.
Please, resume your seat, hon. Majority Chief Whip.
Dr. Kunbuor 1 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, what I am simply saying is that my hon. Colleague is misleading the House. Even the court decision in Solomon and Solomon in which the lifting of the veil of incorporation has become significant has been overruled in his own country and there are specific statutory reasons -- [Uproar.] So he is misleading the House.
Mr. Speaker 1 p.m.
Hon. Member, I understand you are a lecturer but this is not the time to lecture. [Laughter.]
Mr. Ghartey 1:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would just want to point out to my hon. Friend on the opposite side of the House that Solomon versus Solomon is in Company Law but I am talking about International Investment Law. [Hear! Hear!] And the principles in Company Law are different from the principles in International Investment Law.
Mr. Moses Asaga 1:10 p.m.
On a point of order. Mr. Speaker, the hon. Member is misleading us on the definition of international business and economic transaction. This Agreement is not an international and economic transaction. [Hear! Hear!]
Mr. Speaker 1:10 p.m.
Let him continue.
Mr. Ghartey 1:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, the reason
why I said if you look at the entirety of the Agreement, it is an international business or economic transaction is that I recall that not too long ago we were told that -- Everybody had a copy of this Agreement and therefore we should not be discussing it. But if he wants me to read it out, I would start reading from page 1 to 29. I am saying that when you look at the entirety of this Agreement, it is in form as well as intent an international business and economic transaction.
Mr. Speaker, that being the case, I do
Mr. Speaker 1:10 p.m.
Order! Order!
Mr. Ghartey 1:10 p.m.
And we hope that this having been brought to Parliament, Parliament would not hesitate to pass it overwhelmingly because it falls squarely under article 181 (5) of the Constitution.
Mr. Speaker 1:10 p.m.
Hon. Members, after one more contribution, I will ask the hon. Chairman to wind up and I will put the Question.
Minority Leader (Mr. A. S. K. Bagbin) 1:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, we are being called upon to approve motion number 7. And Mr. Speaker, the motion is talking of the House adopting the report of our own Committees on Finance, Trade, Industry and Tourism on the Support Agreement between the Government of Ghana and KHI 01 Ghana Limited in relation to the Ambassador Hotel, Accra.
Mr. Speaker, the motion is on adopting the Committee's Report. Now, if one goes through the Committee's Report, the Committee did recommend at paragraph 7.0 which is the conclusion part of the Report that “we adopt the Support Agreement between the Government
Minority Leader (Mr. A. S. K. Bagbin) 1:10 p.m.


Agreement under article 181 (5).
Papa owusu-Ankomah 1:10 p.m.
On a point of order. Mr. Speaker, I think that the expression used by my hon. Friend, the Minority Leader (Mr. A. S. K. Bagbin) leaves much to be desired. Well, as to whether something is legally right or wrong, his opinion cannot substitute for the opinions of others. If he is expressing his opinion, he should say so. When he talks about this as being legally wrong, I believe that that is his opinion. He cannot pronounce on the legality of anything that is happening here.
As far as Parliament is concerned, it is the opinion of Mr. Speaker, and as far as the law is concerned, it is the opinion of the Supreme Court. Well, Mr. Speaker, you have already ruled -- [Interruptions.] Mr. Speaker, there is a tendency to make this House a court of law and that is very dangerous for us.
Mr. Speaker 1:10 p.m.
Minority Leader, you may continue.
Mr. Bagbin 1:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am very happy that my hon. Colleague got choked half-way -- [Laughter.] He realized that he was also doing what I was doing -- expressing an opinion on a point of law; that is all. So he is also expressing his opinion [Interruptions.] So he should not say that I should not express my opinion. [Laughter.]
Papa owusu-Ankomah 1:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I was expressing an opinion. The point I am making was that when we are contributing to debates in this House we must not make definitive statements on matters of law as though the law is in our
bosom. It is very dangerous -- and it is an expression of an opinion -- and we should always bear that in mind. Thank you, Mr. Speaker; that was the point I was making and I believe that this time it is appropriate that we make this point.
Mr. Speaker 1:20 p.m.
Let him continue.
rose
Mr. Speaker 1:20 p.m.
Hon. Member, you
cannot make any point of order at this stage unless he is prepared to yield to you.
Dr. Kunbuor 1:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I just want
Papa owusu-Ankomah 1:20 p.m.
I apologise,
Mr. Speaker -- [Interruptions] -- and I hope my hon. Colleagues would always bear that in mind.
Mr. Speaker 1:20 p.m.
I am sure he has
answered it himself. Continue, hon. Minority Leader.
Mr. K. T. Hammond 1:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, there is an issue in this House which has been pending for some time now, which has not been resolved by your goodself; and it has arisen again. Mr. Speaker, I have an issue to raise in respect of what my learned friend and the hon. Minister for the Interior said but because he rose on a point of order, now I do not know how we would clarify the point that he raised.
Mr. Speaker 1:20 p.m.
Then resume your seat
and let him continue.
Mr. Bagbin 1:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, once again,
I want my hon. Colleagues to know that I am expressing an opinion, my understanding of the law; and I must do that with confidence. I believe that the
position I am taking is the position that the law has taken and is unassailable. Mr. Speaker, that is exactly what I am doing.
Mr. Speaker, some are saying that we
should err on the side of caution; others are saying that we should not err at all. Which one do you prefer? Some say err on the side of caution, others say do not err at all. It is better not to err. Mr. Speaker, we are saying that do not let us err; and the other side of the House is saying let us err on the side of caution. Mr. Speaker, what is this?
Prof. Mike oquaye 1:20 p.m.
On a point of
order, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my hon. Friend on the other side forgot one aspect of the trio, and that is that we should also move out of the abundance of caution, so that the erring matter does not arise at all. Mr. Speaker, we should move out of the abundance of caution; that should not be forgotten in the argument that has come from this side of the House. This is in line with the fundamental principle of law that that which is not forbidden is permissible; and they have not shown by any one point that what they are saying is against any particular law. Mr. Speaker, he is very much out of order.
Mr. Speaker 1:20 p.m.
Hon. Minister for Energy, you would realize that that was not a point of order; you only contributed.
Mr. Bagbin 1:20 p.m.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, I totally agree with you that it is not a point of order. He was propounding a very dangerous principle. Mr. Speaker, he was speaking like Shakespeare -- [Interruptions] -- that for the abundance of caution we should kill Banquo. Do not kill him at all -- [Laughter] -- because in the same language it is said to make assurance doubly sure let us kill Banquo.
They should not go there; they should not kill him. To make assurance doubly sure, that is the principle he is propounding but Mr. Speaker, we are saying that it is not advisable at all to err. It is not in the interest of the nation, it is not in the interest of this House to err, whether it is to err for
the abundance of caution or ex abundanti cautela as the Latin would say; and we are saying, do not let us err at all.
Dr. A. A. osei 1:20 p.m.
On a point of order,
Mr. Speaker 1:20 p.m.
Order! Let us have some
decorum.
Mr. Bagbin 1:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I totally

Mr. Speaker, I agree with my hon. Colleague, the hon. Majority Leader, that this is not an international agreement, and once it is not an international agreement, I believe that the provision that has been quoted is definitely out of place. We should not approve this Report; we should not adopt this Report under article 181(5). Mr. Speaker, yes, the Report is before us and our Committees have had the benefit of learning more about what is taking place in Government concerning the lease of the Ambassador Hotel to investors; we have been apprised of all that information.

Mr. Speaker, we totally support the project, it is a very good investment; we encourage the Government to go ahead, but we think it is very wrong to come before Parliament and expect us to be approving local agreements between companies in Ghana.

I think, Mr. Speaker, that we would be setting a very dangerous precedent and very soon, almost all the private sector companies would want to come to the

House for this comfort; and this comfort is actually brutum fulmen; it is just an empty boast by the House that it is giving comfort whilst it is giving nothing. There is no comfort that you can get through an illegality; you cannot get any comfort through that. So this House cannot pretend to be giving something that it does not have.
Prof. oquaye 1:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, if you invoke “not having”, which you are trying to give, I would like us to remember the inherent powers of Parliament; and that is very important. The inherent powers of Parliament enables it to do any act that would protect the interest of the people of Ghana; and there is no boundary when we come to the inherent powers of Parliament. We should not forget that. Parliament has got -- [Interruptions.]
Mr. Bagbin 1:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I thank the hon. Colleague very much for propounding the theory that is found in parliamentary democracy in Britain. But in Ghana, the Constitution is supreme -- [Hear! Hear!] -- Parliament operates under the Constitution. In Britain, it is not the same -- [Interruption.]
Mr. Speaker 1:20 p.m.
Hon. Minority Leader, you go ahead.
Mr. Bagbin 1:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, let me just wind up -- [Interruption.]
Prof. oquaye 1:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, in such circumstances, you must quote something which infringes upon the Constitution, and in this particular case there is nothing
Mr. Speaker 1:20 p.m.
I hope you are winding up?
Mr. Bagbin 1:20 p.m.
Yes, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Bagbin 1:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, it is important to clarify that this Report is being brought under a constitutional provision and we are saying no, that constitutional provision is being misapplied. There is no need to bring this Report under this constitutional provision. As you rightly said, you can do it without infringing on any constitutional provision, without bringing it to Parliament. Once you bring it to Parliament, then you put it under a constitutional provision, Parliament has to scrutinize to see whether that constitutional provision can clothe that authority you are seeking from Parliament - [Interruptions.]
So Mr. Speaker, we are saying no, the Government can go ahead, allow the companies to enter into the agreement, go ahead to support them and make sure that they invest to the benefit of this country. We, as a House, are not clothed with that authority. Mr. Speaker, as I said, we are bound by the provisions of the Constitution and we should not just err, even if the erring is on caution. Mr. Speaker, we should not also say that to make assurance doubly sure, we should kill Banquo; we should not kill him at all.
Mr. Speaker, I will end by saying that there is no “comfort” bed here in Parliament and therefore, we are giving no “comfort” bed to anybody.
I totally oppose the motion and I urge
all Members to do so and reject the motion on the floor.
Mr. Speaker 1:30 p.m.
Chairman of the Committee, you may wind up.
Nana Akomea 1:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I have to thank my hon. Colleagues on both sides of the House for supporting the Ambassador Hotel Project, especially hon. Doe Adjaho, the Deputy Minority Leader.
Mr. Speaker, some interest ing observations have come out of the expressions of Members' support that I would like to comment on. Mr. Speaker, when I moved the motion and you called for the voice vote, hon. Doe Adjaho, my good Friend's voice was the loudest “Aye”, but then he went on to say that the motion should not be moved on the floor. He was the same person who supported it when you called for a voice vote.
Mr. Speaker, further to that, when this Agreement came before the House, you referred the Agreement to the Committees on Finance, Trade and Industry and Tourism. Mr. Speaker, those two committees are composed of Members from all sides of the House and we spent several days at Committee considering this particular motion - [Interruptions.] Mr. Speaker -- [Interruption.]
rose
Mr. Speaker 1:30 p.m.
Deputy Minority Leader, let us hear you.
Mr. Adjaho 1:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, my hon. Friend is misleading this House. The motion I supported was for the suspension of the Standing Order so that I could be in a position to quickly kill the new motion. Mr. Speaker, that was the reason why I supported it. To say that I supported that motion, and also supported the Report of the Committee, which is the subject-matter of the current debate, is to miss the point. Mr. Speaker, he should be called to order.
Nana Akomea 1:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, the
motion was for the suspension of Standing Orders for the consideration of the Report. The motion was not merely for the suspension of Standing Orders. The Standing Orders could be waived so that the adoption of this Report would go ahead.
Mr. Speaker 1:30 p.m.
Order! Order!
Nana Akomea 1:40 p.m.
So Mr. Speaker, all the views that have been expressed were canvassed at the committee level and at the end of the day, all of us, all the Members of the Joint Committee approved of the Agreement. There is no minority report. So to come back to the House and then for members of the Joint Committee to oppose the motion is a little bit difficult.
Mr. Speaker, the major observations that have arisen from my Friends on the opposite side have to do with article 181 (5). Mr. Speaker, there is some ambiguity as far as applying that article to this motion is concerned, and from the contributions from Members, that ambiguity has become clear.
But Mr. Speaker, I would urge Members to look at this in relation to what my good Friend, hon. Abodakpi said; that this project is a special project. It is dear to the hearts of all of us. Let us give as much comfort as we can. If we think that article 181 (5) needs to be straightened up,

the article itself makes provision for that; that Parliament shall apply the necessary modifications to this clause.

So I agree totally with what hon. Dan Abodakpi said that later on we can straighten that clause if we wanted to. But we should bear in our minds that any activity that seeks to expand the oversight responsibility of this House should be encouraged. We have all been privy to so many agreements, so many treaties; you can name them - Star Hotel, La Palm Hotel -- where questions had arisen because the oversight responsibility of Parliament was not invoked.

Question put and the House was counted:
AYES -- 1:40 p.m.
NOES -- 1:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker 1:40 p.m.
Order! Order! Please,
let us have decorum.
Mr. J. A. Tia 1:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I want to come under Standing Order 114. Order 114 (1) states:
“In the case of a division, Mr. Speaker shall direct that the lobbies
be cleared, and upon such direction being given the division bells shall be rung for one minute. After a lapse of two minutes from this direction he shall put the Question, and Mr. Speaker shall declare whether in his opinion the Ayes or Noes have it. If his opinion is again opposed -- [this is where I am coming] -- he shall announce the names of two Tellers for the Ayes and two for the Noes and shall direct that a division be held.”
Mr. Speaker, you did not allow this side to call for a headcount; you used your powers or discretion to let us have a headcount and you have declared that result. I am challenging that result that it is incorrect and I am coming under Standing Order 114, the second leg, to ask for a division.
Mr. Speaker 1:40 p.m.
Chief Whip, I proceeded
under Standing Order 113, not 114.
Mr. Tia 1:40 p.m.
Yes, you proceeded under
Mr. Speaker 1:40 p.m.
There is no need for
argument. I have ruled and if you want to challenge me, you may come properly.
Mr. Tia 1:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, that is what I
Mr. Speaker 1:40 p.m.
Chief Whip, you said
Mr. Tia 1:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I was just
drawing your attention to the Order, that I am coming under Standing Order 114 to
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, Order 113 and 113 (2), which you applied says, and with your permission I quote:
“A member may call for a headcount or division if the opinion of Mr. Speaker on the voice vote is challenged.”
Mr. Speaker, you used your discretion and called for a headcount which is an alternative. Mr. Speaker, what my hon. Colleague is trying to come by does not have any provision in the Standing Orders to support him. He is invoking something extraordinarily which is unknown to this House and Mr. Speaker, it cannot be entertained. [Uproar.] Mr. Speaker, he talked about 114, and the 114 that he is talking about is hanging in the air; it is premised on 113. Let him tell us, if after a headcount, it can be invoked; it cannot. Mr. Speaker, that is the clear provision of the Standing Orders; he should not invoke something that does not exist in the Standing Orders. [Interruptions.]
Mr. Speaker 1:50 p.m.
Hon. Minority Chief
Whip, let us go through your authority for this; let us go through that Order 114, please.
Mr. Tia 1:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, if you read 114, I
Mr. Speaker 1:50 p.m.
No, you read the whole thing.
Mr. Tia 1:50 p.m.
I should read the whole of
114?
“In the case of a division, Mr. Speaker shall direct that the lobbies be cleared, and upon such direction
Mr. Speaker 1:50 p.m.
No, no. Please, go ahead.
Mr. Tia 1:50 p.m.
I should read the rest? The
second leg of it says:
“If his opinion is again opposed [emphasis mine] he shall announce the names of two Tellers for the Ayes and two for the Noes and shall direct that a division be held.”
Now, I premised my objection on the basis that Mr. Speaker used his discretion to ask for a headcount; under normal circumstances the dissatisfied side would have called for a division or a headcount. That would have formed the first leg for a division, which Mr. Speaker took away.
We are saying that having declared the results, we are coming on the second leg of Order 114 to ask for a division. That is why I am saying that the emphasis there is “again opposed”, -- if your ruling is “again opposed”. So unless you are saying that there can never be a division in this House, which means Mr. Speaker will always jump the gun and ask for a headcount and prevent the Noes from asking for a division. That is what it would mean.
Mr. Speaker 1:50 p.m.
Hon. Minority Chief
Whip, I want to be educated on this. As I said, I was using my powers under Order 113. I asked for a headcount and nobody took any objection to that. Then counting was done on two occasions and nobody took any objection to that. I said, Ayes have it, then there is this objection.

The objection you are raising is against the ruling that the Ayes have it. This is the objection you are taking, that the Ayes have it. Do you think when I have given the ruling on that you can raise this objection you have just raised?
Mr. Tia 1:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, that is exactly
Mr. Speaker 1:50 p.m.
Order 114; I had not
declared any result then.
Mr. Tia 1:50 p.m.
Please, I said that when you
used your discretion to immediately ask for a headcount you took our mandate, our opportunity to challenge -- and your discretion cannot be objected to in that. So you took the opportunity away from us. So I am saying that having had the head count and declared the results, I am coming under Order 114, the second leg to challenge the results and ask for a division. It is as simple as that.
Papa owusu-Ankomah 1:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker,
in terms of voting in this House, we are governed by Standing Orders 113 and 114. When you read 113 closely, headcount and division, are alternate. You cannot have a headcount and at the same time have a division, and I would proceed to justify my understanding by reading in extenso Standing Orders 113 and 114. Mr. Speaker, Order 113 says and with your permission I quote:
“(1) When the Question has been put by Mr. Speaker at the conclusion of the debate, the votes shall be taken by voices “Aye” and “No”, provided that Mr. Speaker may in his discretion instead of declaring the result on the voice votes call for a headcount.”
Which is what you did. And (2) says:
“A Member may call for headcount or division if the opinion of Mr. Speaker on the voice vote is challenged.”
So one can only call for a division when Mr. Speaker's announcement of the voice vote is challenged and not on any other occasion. In this case, Mr. Speaker, you never declared a voice vote. You called for a headcount in the exercise of your discretion under Standing Order 113 (1). So I am saying, and I am submitting with all due deference and respect to the House that the hon. Minority Chief Whip is seeking to ask for something that the rules do not allow him to ask for. [Hear! Hear!] I would therefore submit, Mr. Speaker, that his request should be dismissed and that the vote that you declared by virtue of the headcount be considered to be the final vote. [Hear! Hear!]
rose
Mr. Tia 1:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I think that I have the right to respond. [Interruption.] Let me respond to his submissions before he can ask any other question. I think that I have made the submission and he is challenging it.
Mr. Speaker 1:50 p.m.
Whether I will call you later or not, at this stage let me listen to him.
Mr. Lee ocran 1:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, the issue on the floor of the House is not a very contentious one. In fact, both sides of the House have long ago agreed that this hotel business should go on. Yes, the hotel should be built. What we have been arguing about is the legalities and procedure. I think we have exhausted enough time; let us take a decision. All of us agree that the hotel should be built. [Interruption.]
Mr. Speaker 1:50 p.m.
Hon. Member for Jomoro, are you over?
Mr. Lee ocran 1:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would
be leaving it to my Leader.
Mr. Bagbin 2 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I think that a lot has been said about Standing Orders 113 and 114. Mr. Speaker, we are all aware that one can challenge the decision of the Speaker only by a substantive motion. In the Standing Orders the exception is only during voting where that decision could be challenged; and we go through a procedure. So Mr. Speaker, the intention of Standing Orders 113 and 114 is again not to confirm the position that one cannot challenge the decision of the Speaker. But Mr. Speaker, there are two procedures; one could go by headcount or by division, and that is what is now being argued. Mr. Speaker, you opted for a headcount and at the end of the day you gave an indication that the Ayes had it -- [Interruption] -- By the Standing Orders -- [Interruption] -- So it is a decision -- [Interruptions.]
rose
Mr. Speaker 2 p.m.
Hon. Majority Chief
Whip, are you taking a point of order?
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 2 p.m.
That is
so, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the hon. Minority Leader is saying that there are two alternatives, that is, in place of a voice vote, a headcount or a division. And then he said that you opted for a headcount. Mr. Speaker, Standing Order 113 (1) does not give you a choice, with respect. Mr. Speaker, it is said that the Speaker cannot call for a division. Standing Order 113, Mr. Speaker, obliges you to call for a headcount; that is clear. So the hon. Minority Leader is still wrong when he
says that you have two options and you opted for one; that is the point.
Mr. Speaker 2 p.m.
Let him continue with
his argument.
Mr. Bagbin 2 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I know that
you appreciate the meaning of the word “discretion”. It is the word “discretion” that is used in Standing Order 113 and I am saying that you exercised your discretion in that option. That is simple and short -- [Interruptions.] That is what I said; I said he “opted for” -- In exercising his discretion, he opted for a headcount. [Interruptions.]
Mr. Speaker 2 p.m.
Let us have decorum.
Mr. Bagbin 2 p.m.
In exercising his
Mr. Speaker 2 p.m.
Please, continue.
Mr. Bagbin 2 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I understand
rose
Mr. Speaker 2 p.m.
Hon. Majority Leader,
I will call you. But hon. Minority Leader, there was only one point on which I wanted a clarification. You talked about the integrity of the process; that is what I am particularly interested in.
Mr. Babgin 2 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am saying that it is the question that is being raised. They are doubting what was given you, which you took. [Interruptions.] That is what he is doing by raising the division. That is what I am saying. That is why he is raising the division and I am saying that you have taken a decision on it and that is the decision that we agree with; and we should let matters go on.
Mr. owusu-Adjapong 2 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I think we need to thank the hon. Minority Leader for agreeing for us to make progress. But Mr. Speaker, we have scheduled a lot of meetings for today and therefore we do not intend taking the Resolution today.
Mr. Speaker, it is already past 2 o'clock and therefore you can exercise your discretion.
Mr. Speaker 2 p.m.
Hon. Members, thank you all very much for the day.
ADJoURNMENT
  • The House was adjourned at 2.07 p.m. till 20th July, 2005 at 10.00 a.m.