Debates of 13 Jul 2010

MADAM SPEAKER
PRAYERS 11:55 a.m.

VOTES AND PROCEEDINGS AND THE OFFICIAL REPORT 11:55 a.m.

Madam Speaker 11:55 a.m.
Hon Members, Correction of Votes and Proceedings of Monday, 12th July, 2010.
Page 1 . . . 11 -
Mr George K. Arthur 11:55 a.m.
Madam
Speaker, page 11, item 1, line 3, “…on the complaints from by the Advertising Association..”. I think the word “by” must be deleted.
Madam Speaker 11:55 a.m.
“. . .complaints
from” should be left, we cancel “by”? All right.
Thank you.
Mr Joseph Boahen Aidoo 11:55 a.m.
Madam Speaker, on the same paragraph, “Ghana Advertiser's Board”-- “Advertiser's”, in this context should be plural, so the apostrophe should come after the “s”. “Advertisers'.”
Prof. Christopher Ameyaw-Akumfi 11:55 a.m.
Madam Speaker, on page 10, item (xi) - “Mr Chris Gordon”. The “Mr Chris Gordon” that I know is “Prof. Chris Gordon”. And number (xv), I am not too sure whether “qunty” is the name.
Madam Speaker 11:55 a.m.
Small “q”,
“Mr Alfred qunty, President, GAUA”. Anybody knows?
Prof. Ameyaw-Akumfi 11:55 a.m.
Can we
Madam Speaker 11:55 a.m.
Clerk, check the
name.
Mr Mathias A. Puozaa 11:55 a.m.
It must be
a typographical error. “Chris Gordon” is really a full Professor, so the Hon Member is right.
Madam Speaker 11:55 a.m.
Any other

The Votes and Proceedings of Monday, 12th July, 2010, as corrected is adopted as the true record of proceedings.

Shall we move to the Official Report of

5th July, 2010?

Hon Members in the absence of any correction, the Official Report of Monday, 5th July, 2010, is hereby adopted as the true record of proceedings.

We move to Questions, item 3.

Yes, Hon Majority Leader.
Mr Cletus A. Avoka 11:55 a.m.
Madam
Speaker, the Hon Minister for Energy is unavoidably absent this morning but the Deputy Minister who is our Colleague, Hon Inusah Fuseini is standing in for him. I am craving your indulgence and my Hon Colleagues too to permit the Hon Inusah Fuseini to answer the Questions on his behalf.
Thank you.
Madam Speaker 11:55 a.m.
Hon Member, I do
not see any objections.
Mr Osei Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 11:55 a.m.
Madam Speaker, the Hon Deputy Minister is a Colleague of ours in this House. We
believe that he is capable of standing in.
Madam Speaker, the last time the Hon Minister appeared in this House, he had to be more or less summoned before coming here and when he came, he gave an undertaking -- [Laughter] -- that from then on, he was going to be with us. And just the first time after that pledge, he is reneging. What are we to make of that?
Madam Speaker 11:55 a.m.
That his schedule
is very heavy-- [Laugther] -- anyway.
Hon Majority Leader, I thought the decision has been taken by Leadership that the three Questions -- please, can you comment on that for edification of Hon Members?
Mr Avoka 11:55 a.m.
Madam Speaker,
Leadership has agreed with you that with the time being far spent, and the tall order of business to be done today, we will limit ourselves to those who have asked the Questions. They are basically consistituency -specific, so you will not be taking Hon Members who have not asked Questions so that within 30 minutes, we would finish with Question time.
I will also appeal to the Hon Deputy Minister to be very economical with the facts so that we can save time.
Madam Speaker 11:55 a.m.
Economical with facts?
Mr Avoka 11:55 a.m.
I mean he should not delay, he should be brief. I am appealing to him to be brief so that we can take the sense of the Questions.
Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:05 p.m.
Madam Speaker, in the event, is the Hon Majority Leader withdrawing those words -- his appeal that he should be economical with the facts? Is he withdrawing those words?
Mr Avoka 12:05 p.m.
Yes. I am substituting the words “to be brief” with the earlier rendition. --
Madam Speaker 12:05 p.m.
Yes. He has withdrawn. He said he should not be too long-winded in answering questions.
Shall we have the first Question from Hon Prof. Dominic Kwaku Fobih, Member of Parliament for Assin South?
ORAL ANSWERS TO 12:05 p.m.

QUESTIONS 12:05 p.m.

MINISTRY OF ENERGY 12:05 p.m.

Minister For Energy) 12:05 p.m.
Madam Speaker, Nyamebebu-Dometekrom, Tomfokoro- Aboase, Ongwa and Homaho-Dome communities form part of the on-going SHEP-4 electrification project being undertaken by the Ministry. High Voltage (HV) and Low Voltage (LV) network construction works for Dometekrom, Tomfokoro-Aboase are 100 per cent complete. The only outstanding works
Prof. Fobih 12:05 p.m.
Madam Speaker, in the Hon Deputy Minister's Answer, he said somewhere that:
“… Humaho-Dome are ongoing.”
And yet, later on, he said:
“Nyamebekye re and Dome communities do not form part of any of the ongoing electrification projects ….”
I know that Dome is part of Humaho community, so why the separation?
Mr Fuseini 12:05 p.m.
Madam Speaker, the way the Question has been asked, it appears to us that the Question is about stretches. He asked about Nyamebebu-Dometekrom, Tomfokoro-Aboase, these are stretches, and the Answer is intended to deal with these stretches. And Dome specifically as a community, is not captured under any of the National Electrification Programmes.
Prof. Fobih 12:05 p.m.
Madam Speaker, despite the fact that all these communities started their projects at the same time, we have
some of them lagging behind; they are Humaho-Dome, Ongwa and Nyamebebu. I want to know why they have been left behind.
Mr Fuseini 12:05 p.m.
Madam Speaker, the contracts for the electrification of these communities are given to contractors and the delay might arise as a result of the nature of the contractor working on the project, and that might account for the delay.
Prof. Fobih 12:05 p.m.
Madam Speaker, I want to find out again from the Hon Deputy Minister whether when such contracts are given, there is no prompting or monitoring by the Ministry to ensure that work is completed within the specified time.
Mr Fuseini 12:05 p.m.
Madam Speaker, there are promptings given to the contractors. Indeed, we have consultants on the projects and they give periodic reports of progress of work, and where we have reasons to believe that the work is delaying, we draw the attention of the contractors and the consultants to these matters.
Madam Speaker 12:05 p.m.
Your third question, please.
Prof. Fobih 12:05 p.m.
Madam Speaker, why then are these projects especially delayed?
Mr Fuseini 12:05 p.m.
Madam Speaker, even
though in the view of the Hon Member, the projects are delaying, we still have reasons to believe that they would be completed by the end of this year.
Connection of National Electricity Grid to Fuleso, Anobil, Dwirigum,
Kakra, et cetera --
Q.609. Mr George Kofi Arthur asked the Minister for Energy when the following communities would be connected to the national electricity grid:
(i) Fuleso
(ii) Anobil
(iii) Dwirigum
(iv) Kakra
(v) Kojo Yaw
(vi) Dankwawora Nos. 1 and 2
(vii) Asaasetre
(viii) Agyadum
(ix) Dominase
( x ) M a n s o A m e n f i C a m p (Bethlehem)
(xi) Subrinho
(xii) Gyaekontabuo.
Mr Inusah A. B. Fuseini 12:05 p.m.
Madam Speaker, Fuleso, Anobil, Dwirigum, Kakra, Kojo Yaw, Dankwawora Nos. 1 and 2, Asaasetre, Agyadum, Dominase, Manso Amenfi Camp (Bethlemen), Subrinho and Gyaekontabuo communities do not form part of any of the ongoing electrification projects being undertaken by the Ministry. These communities would be considered under subsequent phases of the National Electrification Programme when funds become available.
Mr Arthur 12:05 p.m.
Madam Speaker, as directed by the Hon Majority Leader, the two Questions are similar, they are
Questions numbered 609 and 610. So, I would like to ask the second Question and then come out with my supplementary questions.
Madam Speaker 12:05 p.m.
All right.
Connection of National Electricity Grid to Nyame Bekyere (via Agona),
Pramso, et cetera --
Q.610. Mr George Kofi Arthur asked the Minister for Energy when the following communities would be connected to the national electricity grid:
(i) Nyame Bekyere (via Agona)
(ii) Pramso
(iii) Asuminam
(iv) Anomatewa
(v) Ankamateng
(vi) Yirenkyikrom
(vii) Gyaukrom
(viii) Konkonkyea
(ix) Victor Krom
(x) Congo
(xi) Bisco
(xii) Alavanyo.
Mr Inusah A. B. Fuseini 12:05 p.m.
Madam Speaker, Nyame Bekyere (via Agona), Pramso, Asuminam, Anomatewa, Ankamateng,Yirenkyikrom, Gyaukrom, Konkonkyea, Victor Krom, Congo, Bisco and Alavanyo communities do not form part of any of the ongoing electrification
Mr Inusah A. B. Fuseini 12:05 p.m.


projects being undertaken by the Ministry. These communities would be considered under subsequent phases of the National Electrification Programme (NEP) when funds become available.
Mr G. K. Arthur 12:05 p.m.
Madam Speaker, may I know whether the Ministry has listed some communities to benefit from the next phase of electrification and whether any of the communities I have mentioned forms part of it?
Mr Fuseini 12:15 p.m.
Madam Speaker, the Ministry will be doing some work in the Western Region but these communities do not form part of any of the phases of being undertaken in that region.
Mr Arthur 12:15 p.m.
Madam Speaker, I
wanted to know whether in the next phase, we would be considered. That is the question. But let me come with my next question.
I want to know whether there is any
formal process that I have to go through or the community has to follow to enable them qualify for consideration in the next phase.
Mr Fuseini 12:15 p.m.
Madam Speaker, there is no formal criterion that the Hon Member would have to satisfy to be able to enable the community benefit from the NEP. Madam Speaker, this is a programme that the Ministry and the Government of Ghana are running. It is intended to end in 2020 and by that time, we would have secured universal access, and all communities that have been listed here would be connected to the national grid by that time.
Madam Speaker 12:15 p.m.
Hon Member, any
more questions?
Mr Inusah A. B. Fuseini 12:15 p.m.
Madam Speaker, it is technically possible to have problems with glass insulators which can lead to frequent and prolonged outages on feeders. However, Electricity Company of Ghana (ECG) does not intend to change glass insulators for porcelain ones. This is because the problems with porcelain insulators are worse than those with glass insulators.
Modern industry trend is to replace glass and porcelain with polymer insulators. ECG has also taken the policy decision to replace all glass and porcelain insulators in its networks with polymeric ones, beginning with the coastal areas where the problems with glass and porcelain are greatest. A number of porcelain insulators installed on feeders along the coast have already been replaced with polymer types and ECG intends to continue with the replacement works as financing becomes available.
On the more substantive issue of frequent and prolonged power outages on the Ahyiem-Agona-Gyedua Ketewa high tension line, it is to be noted that the line under reference is a tee-off (branch circuit) from the 33 kV Asawinso to Sefwi Wiawso main high tension line. A section of this line goes through thick forest, making it vulnerable to rainstorms and severe windy conditions. Tree branches
sometimes fall on the bare conductors and lead to short-circuits and resultant frequent power outages.
Madam Speaker 12:15 p.m.
Thank you; that was your last Question then.
The next Question stands in the name of the same Hon George Kofi Arthur (Amenfi Central) - that is Question 611.
Mr Arthur 12:15 p.m.
Madam Speaker, the Hon Minister did not finish answering the Question. He answered it half way and then stopped and I have some supplementary on them.
Madam Speaker 12:15 p.m.
You mean Question
611?
Mr G. K. Arthur 12:15 p.m.
Yes, Madam
Speaker.
Madam Speaker 12:15 p.m.
Yes, Deputy
Minister?
Mr Fuseini 12:15 p.m.
Madam Speaker, the
line is also vulnerable to lightning strikes, transient over-voltages and other power system phenomenon that result in damage to the glass insulators on line.
To remedy these problems, ECG has ordered insulated (XLPE-covered) aluminum conductors to replace the bare conductors constituting the line. In addition, all defective glass insulators will be replaced with polymeric insulators. Work on the 33 kV line is expected to begin in September, 2010.
Madam Speaker 12:15 p.m.
It is finished now?
Yes -- supplementary questions now.
Mr George Arthur 12:15 p.m.
Madam Speaker, may I know whether the (XLPE covered) aluminium conductors the Hon Deputy Minister mentioned are for the high tensions or they are for the low tension lines?
Mr Fuseini 12:15 p.m.
Madam Speaker, these
covers, that is, the (XLPE covers) that would be covering bare conductors are intended to provide protection to these lines because of the difficulties that are encountered when the lines run through forest, and when foreign matters drop on those lines. So whenever the lines pass through areas which are susceptible to such hazards, the (XLPE) would be used to protect those lines and cables from those hazards.
Madam Speaker 12:15 p.m.
Any other
supplementary questions?
Mr Frederick Opare-Ansah 12:15 p.m.
None

Prof. Christopher Ameyaw-Akumfi

-- rose -
Madam Speaker 12:15 p.m.
I thought the decision was that only the Questioner would ask his three supplementary questions, so we progress further.
Thank you.
Yes, we have the next Question 651,
Hon Simon Atingban Akunye (Pusiga).
Connection of National Electricity Grid to a number Communities in
Pusiga Constituency.
Q. 651. Mr Simon Atingban Akunye asked the Deputy Minister for Energy how many communities in the Pusiga Constituency have been earmarked to be connected to the national electricity grid in the year 2010.
Mr Inusah A. B. Fuseini 12:15 p.m.
Madam
Speaker, there is at the moment, no community in the Pusiga Constituency under the on-going SHEP projects earmarked for connection to the national electricity grid in 2010. However, the Ministry has received a total of 38 communities recently from the Hon
Mr Akunye 12:15 p.m.
Madam Speaker, there are a lot of electric poles that are scattered all over the constituency that were supplied, especially during the past regime. But unfortunately, they could not use them and currently, some of them are getting bad and being eaten by termites. I do not know what the Hon Deputy Minister would do. In case the present programme does not cover those areas, what is going to happen to the poles?
Mr Fuseini 12:15 p.m.
Madam Speaker, the
Ministry of Energy has encountered many such situations that the Hon Member is alluding to. Consequently, the Ministry has directed that an audit be carried out, to determine communities in which poles were supplied or poles were erected and no electrification was carried out and the audit is ongoing.
Madam Speaker 12:15 p.m.
Next question, if
any. [Pause.] No more questions? Yes, Hon Akunye, no more questions?
Mr Akunye 12:15 p.m.
No, Madam Speaker.
Madam Speaker 12:15 p.m.
Thank you.
Hon Deputy Minister, I think I have to express my thanks to you for coming to answer our Questions.
Mr Inusah A. B. Fuseini 12:15 p.m.
Thank you,
Madam Speaker.
Madam Speaker 12:25 p.m.
Yes, Hon Leader, we have finished with Questions.
Mr Avoka 12:25 p.m.
Thank you, Madam
Speaker. We can take item 5.
Madam Speaker 12:25 p.m.
Item 5 - The Hon
Minister may now move Motion number
5.
Mr Avoka 12:25 p.m.
Madam Speaker, the Hon Deputy Attorney-General and Deputy Minister for Justice is here to represent the Hon Attorney- General and Minister for Justice). So, he would take item 5.
Madam Speaker 12:25 p.m.
Hon Deputy Attorney General and Deputy Minister for Justice --
BILLS - THIRD READING 12:25 p.m.

  • [Moved by the Hon Member for Obuasi, Mr Edward Ennim and seconded by the Hon Member for Nkoranza South, Mr Kwame Amporfo Twumasi)
  • [ R e s u m p t i o n o f d e b a t e f ro m 12/07/2010]
  • Mr Cletus A. Avoka 12:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, page 24, item number 11, that is the Private Member's Motion.
    Madam Speaker 12:25 p.m.
    Yes, this seems to be a continuation of yesterday's Motion, is that not it?
    Mr Inusah A. B. Fuseini 12:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, yesterday, we had to suspend debate on this matter pending consultation the First Deputy Speaker intended having with you, after he ably assumed the seat in your absence.
    Madam Speaker, an objection was raised founded on Order 93 (1). The objection clearly was to the effect that Order 93 (1) prevents this House from discussing issues that are pending before a court of law in this country.
    Madam Speaker, the argument was that insofar as we are going to express concern in this matter, which concern is worrying -- and insofar as we are going to invite the Public Utilities and Regulatory Commission (PURC) to reconsider their decision, the matter might touch and concern the action that is in court.
    Madam Speaker, it was at this stage that counter-arguments were offered and the Hon Speaker asked that the matter be suspended for a ruling to be given today. I do not know whether Madam Speaker had been adequately briefed and seized of the facts as presented this morning.
    Madam Speaker, we are waiting for your ruling on this matter.
    Madam Speaker 12:25 p.m.
    I thought -- Hon Leader, before even we go there, is the wording of the Motion in order? You are calling upon whom? Before even we take it on board, whom are we calling on?
    Mr Avoka 12:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, we have looked at the content of the Motion and we realised that at the end of the day, if we decide to call on a particular authority to address the issues that we raise here, then there must be somebody specific to be able to do that - action by whom?
    -- For that matter, I would want to crave the indulgence of the Hon Members who moved the Motion, so that we can make an amendment by indicating the particular authority who at the end of the day, will have the legislative authority, the legal authority to be responding to the issues that we raise here.
    That specifically will be the PURC, that is the body mandated to look at these tariffs. So, I thought that once the Hon Members who moved the Motion are available, then they will have the opportunity to rectify the Motion and make it have effect at the end of the day.
    rose
    Madam Speaker 12:25 p.m.
    Are you the Hon Member who moved the Motion?
    Mr Adda 12:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I am one of the Hon Members who moved the motion.
    Madam Speaker 12:25 p.m.
    Did you move the Motion? He is calling on the Hon Member who moved the Motion to look at it and if possible make an amendment.
    Mr Adda 12:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, thank you for the opportunity to contribute to the Motion.
    Madam Speaker, on the issue of amending the Motion, it is only a point of consideration for us who have tabled this Motion. If the Hon Majority Leader and his Colleagues on the other side accept that indeed, the tariffs that have been introduced by PURC are too drastic, contrary to what is in their manifesto and against what it is that they said on campaign platforms, then we would accept --
    Madam Speaker 12:25 p.m.
    Hon Member, it is the wording of the Motion that we are looking at now. The wording of that Motion - that “we should call upon” - and

    I thought if we were going to debate it at all, “call upon whom”? Let us really know what it is all about. It says “calls for its” - call upon whom -- if we should make an order then to whom? That is all that I am saying. It is the wording - at this stage - I thought the Hon Leader --
    rose
    Madam Speaker 12:25 p.m.
    All right, let us hear you. All I am saying is that, those who moved the Motion, the wording of “calls for its” and I ask, “calls on whom”? If we should approve this, who should we order to show concern? That is all that I am saying.
    Hon Minority Leader, that is all that I was calling for.
    rose
    Madam Speaker 12:25 p.m.
    Yes, Hon Boafo, were you going to contribute? Because I thought the Hon Minority Leader - my attention has been brought to that Motion, we are going to go on it. And I am asking, do we need any small amendment? Call on whom? Should we leave it like that, after the Motion is adopted or not, who should we call on?
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, the increases in the electricity and water tariffs were announced by a competent authority. And so, if the Motion provides that it should be immediately reconsidered, certainly, the destination is the appropriate authority.
    Madam Speaker 12:35 p.m.
    So I should say, “when I make the order to the appropriate authority?”
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:35 p.m.
    To the appropriate authority.
    Madam Speaker 12:35 p.m.
    I must mention the
    Madam Speaker 12:35 p.m.


    appropriate authority? Why do you not -- What is it, what is the appropriate authority?
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, in this country, the authority responsible for increasing utility tariffs is the Public Utility Regulatory Commission
    (PURC).
    Madam Speaker 12:35 p.m.
    Yes, that is all I am asking.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, if anybody wants to have it done, it could be done. Except to remind you that, if you bend to amend a Motion that is advertised, then the amended Motion would have to be advertised and then one would say that, all right, notice would have to be given and so on. But it could be amended on the floor by anybody who so intends. So I think that is how it should be done.
    Alhaj i Mohammed-Mubarak Muntaka: Madam Speaker, since we are not getting the movers to do the amendment, I would want to propose that this Motion be amended to read:
    “That this Honourable House expresses concern on the recent announced increased electricity and water tariffs and calls on PURC for its reconsideration.”
    Madam Speaker, I propose this amendment and I hope that Hon Colleagues would support that to enable us continue with the debate.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I really have a problem with the point at which my Hon Colleague is making such an intervention. In what capacity is he making this amendment? Madam Speaker, there is somebody on his feet, he is continuing on the debate.
    When it gets to his turn, he could propose such an amendment and it would be taken on board. Perhaps, one of the movers could also do same. But for him to just interject and say that he is proffering an amendment, I do not see his locus at this time, and indeed, Madam Speaker, for now, at least, he has no locus.
    Mr Joseph B. Aidoo 12:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, the Motion has been moved and seconded and the debate is already set in Motion. So I am at a loss why there should be an amendment in the course of debate or a motion that has already been moved. It Mas never happened on the floor of this House, that a Motion that has been moved, seconded and set in motion, should now be drawn back -
    Madam Speaker 12:35 p.m.
    No, I was not really calling for an amendment, and as the Hon Minority Leader said, it was to be assumed that the order would have to go to the proper authority. It was at that stage I thought -- Well, let us not be specific. But if the movers are happy with it, let us go on with it. I thought it was a correction and not an amendment. Really because if you ask me, an amendment was proposed that we take out the word “immediate”. But we are not asking for an amendment. Let us be specific. But if you say we should leave it, let us leave it.
    Mr Adda 12:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I think it is implied in the Motion that PURC is the only authority that we are talking about. So I do not see the need for an amendment.
    Madam Speaker 12:35 p.m.
    It is not an amendment. Why was it not put in, if that is the only place it should go; why were we not that specific? Never mind, let us carry on.
    Mr Adda 12:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I am grateful to you for the opportunity to contribute to the Motion.
    Madam Speaker 12:35 p.m.
    How are you contributing to it, there is a point that has been raised and I thought it was deferred to today to make a ruling, whether you can continue at all. So when I decide on that, then we will continue with the debate; is that not it? Because it was during the debate that the matter was raised.
    Mr Avoka 12:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I am rather surprised about the turn of events. I think that it is our collective wish that this House does not labour in vain. And what I mean by labouring in vain is that, if at the end of the day, we take a decision, then there must be somebody responsible for implementing that decision of ours.
    So if we are going to call on an institution or a person, et cetera, to review these high tariffs for the benefit of Ghanaians, then we should have a specific fellow so that after this, Madam Speaker would then direct that the proceedings of today would be served on that particular body to take action on the concerns that we raised.
    That is why you graciously requested that if we can make an amendment to indicate the specific body, that is PURC, that is legally mandated to carry out the concerns of this House. Otherwise, if my Hon Colleagues on the other side of the House think that we can maintain it in this form, we can go ahead and debate it, and at the end of the day, if it has no meaning; it would go to nobody, the way it is couched here.
    So I do not know that we would lose if we say that “ ... and calls on the PURC for its immediate reconsideration.” I do not know what we would lose, but at least, we would have targeted somebody who would be responsible at the end of the day to address these issues. If they think that we can leave it in abeyance, then at the end of the day, you do not know who to refer the matter to; we can leave it at that, but we would have laboured in vain.
    Mr Amb rose A. Dery 12:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I can understand the position that Madam Speaker has taken. But yesterday, the Hon Member who moved the Motion did not only mention PURC, but referred to the law; the PURC is the only body that can deal with that. Madam Speaker --
    Madam Speaker 12:35 p.m.
    I was not in the Chair yesterday.
    Mr Dery 12:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, it also depends on the conclusions that we come to; whether the considerations are only going to be for reconsideration or there can be subsidy, all that is appropriate. I think that there is no difficulty because my Hon Friend who moved the Motion, unfortunately, the Chairman was not here yesterday, but the Hon Member mentioned PURC specifically and I think that we can continue.
    Madam Speaker, just like you are referring to the legislative body in this country, it is no derogation that you do not mention Parliament because it is obvious, which the body is. Madam Speaker, I think that we can make progress, save more time and continue. We all know which the authority is and I think we can proceed along those lines.
    Madam Speaker 12:35 p.m.
    Hon Member, why I wanted to be specific, you could have said the relevant body or the PURC. When we come to debating the thing and people get the impression it is government or it is another body, they may talk to that. So I wanted to be specific but if you say it has been moved and seconded and you want to carry on, let us carry on. I thought this is a small -- You say it is assumed, let us carry on.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, in the course of the debate,
    the proposers of the Motion, one of them indicated that it is possible for Government to introduce greater subsidies than we have witnessed. Madam Speaker, if you talk about subsidies, it would not go to PURC per se --
    Second, Madam Speaker, how many occasions have we not had directives from the Chair itself after we have listened to a debate that we are referring this matter to the relevant or appropriate authority?
    Madam Speaker, we have said this several times. Does it mean that when such a directive comes from the Chair, it is hanging? We know the appropriate authority that we are consigning that directive to and so for anybody to assume that because they have not specifically mentioned PURC, it would be left hanging, Madam Speaker, I shudder to think such conclusions could be arrived at by anybody in this House because we all know which body announces the increase.
    Madam Speaker 12:45 p.m.
    Do we all know which body?
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:45 p.m.
    And
    so, if we are saying that it should be reconsidered, certainly, it is that body and we all know as Members of this House. [Interruption.] The Hon Member for Nabdam is saying that we all do not know. Madam Speaker, he was a Member of this House when this House passed that legislation and if he says he does not know, well, I do not know what to say about him. But certainly, he were part of the system and in fact, if people do not know, ignorance of the law is no excuse anyway. [Interruption] Yes, so what is his problem?
    Madam Speaker 12:45 p.m.
    Yes, I think we are
    belabouring this.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:45 p.m.
    Madam
    Speaker, we are belabouring this, otherwise, moot point. Can we go on and make progress?
    Madam Speaker 12:45 p.m.
    Let us go on except when we come to debating, people should know that it is the PURC to whom we are going to -
    Mr Avoka 12:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I do
    not share the position taken by my Hon Colleague the Minority Leader. Madam Speaker, yesterday, it is only unfortunate that you were not available but when the Hon Member who moved the Motion was debating, he did mention National Democratic Congress (NDC). He mentioned His Excellency Prof. Mills, then candidate of the NDC.
    That the NDC made a pledge at Obuasi and Wa, that they will never increase tariffs, that the Government of the day headed by Prof. Mills is insensitive, et cetera. He did not say the PURC was insensitive, he did not say that the PURC made a pledge; he did mention some people.
    So, for the avoidance of doubt, if the Hon Member who moved the Motion can not put his house in order, why do we think that Madam Speaker should be seen to be doing the same work? Why? In fairness to Madam Speaker, why? If he is moving the Motion and he cannot do the right thing [Interruption] he does not want to do the right thing, why does he think somebody has that responsibility to do the right thing for him?
    Madam Speaker, for the benefit of those of us who are not in this House, there are many Ghanaians who do not know the difference between PURC, Government, et cetera. So, the Motion must speak for itself, that is the rule of construction.
    The document must speak for itself.
    Whom are you calling upon? Does it cost us anything to add PURC there? It does not; unless we are not keeping faith with what we are looking for.
    Madam Speaker 12:45 p.m.
    Well, I thought we
    could all agree on this matter and then carry on.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:45 p.m.
    Madam
    Speaker, with respect, I thought this was a very moot point. But given the intensity of the argument and how the Majority Leader was struggling to make the point, Madam Speaker, may I just point something out to the Majority Leader and to this House and I quote from page 94 of the NDC Manifesto.
    Madam Speaker 12:45 p.m.
    Let us curtail this.
    I brought the matter up. I think you have told me that since the relevant authority is there, I will have no difficulty. So, I will let this matter rest there. Let us carry on.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:45 p.m.
    Thank you
    very much, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker, you are a “Daniel” who has come to judgement.
    Madam Speaker 12:45 p.m.
    I thank you. So, I
    think we are now on - Hon Muntaka, I am going to decide what to do with that --
    Alhaji Muntaka 12:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker,
    yesterday, before the debate was truncated, for close to one hour, there was an argument whether to continue or not, and your Deputy did indicate that he was going to confide in you so that you make a ruling.
    Madam Speaker, I want your guidance in this direction. Madam Speaker, I am asking whether you are going to make the ruling whether to continue or not before it is done. So, Madam Speaker, we plead that you give us the ruling before we proceed.
    Thank you very much, Madam Speaker.
    Madam Speaker 12:45 p.m.
    The matter was
    raised during the debate. So, it was suspended for ruling. I will rule, which ever way it goes, we have to follow it and continue or whatever. So, I think if you will bear with me, we will talk about the ruling -- if we want to call it ruling because the wording -- but well, if you want to make a ruling, every case depends on its merit, except it is really legal, it is the decision. But decision or ruling, whatever -- I think we should do that now and know whether we can continue or we cannot. So, I will take the decision.
    Order 93 was the operative Order that was used to raise that objection. With your permission, I will read it. Order 93 (1) and please, listen to the words carefully:
    “ Reference shall not be made to any matter on which judicial decision is pending in such a way as may, in the opinion of Mr Speaker, prejudice the interest of parties to the action”.
    Before a decision can be made, we have to find out, which I have done, whether a case is pending, which I did not know at the time I admitted the Motion and I think it was not known until it was raised here. Otherwise, we would have debated it before and even, we would have noted this before debating.
    My findings are that, yes, a matter is pending. It was filed on the 1st of June. It has adjourned to the 20th of July for an interim application for injunction to be considered. That is the stage it has reached. But what concerned me most was the claims and the reliefs sought. Because it is through that that the Speaker would be able to decide.
    What I read did not put a blanket on reference to court cases but that it should not be done in such a way as to prejudice. And for that you need to know what they
    are asking. The Plaintiff's claim -- which I have a copy from the court is:
    (a) A declaration that the utility services, electricity provided by the third defendant is sub- standard
    (b) An order directed at the second defendant to review the approved rates downwards to reasonable and acceptable levels to reflect the value of the service provided by the third defendant.
    (c) An order of prohibit ive injunction restraining the defendants from implementing any approved increases in rates for the services provided by the third defendant, until the said services meet the required standards in science, law and equity.
    These were the reliefs sought.
    Now, it is at this stage that I need to compare what the Motion says first and what even if we carried on with the Motion, whether any comments on the Motion will be in such a way as to prejudice, having regard to the reliefs sought.
    I have got it all here and if I may draw your attention, the Motion is:
    “That this Honourable House expresses concern on the recently announced increased electricity and water tariffs and calls for its immediate reconsideration.”
    It is my view that that does not automatically stop us from commenting. [Hear! Hear!] But that does not also mean that in the debate, having regard to what is really the issue before the court, we can comment in such a way as to prejudice the interest of the parties in the debate.
    It is for this reason that I will permit the debate. I have taken the trouble to read to you the relevant matters which you may have to shy away from. This is my decision and when we get to places where I think debate is going the wrong way, I will deflect it so that it does not, in my opinion, prejudice the interest of the parties.
    If we resume the debate, can we keep in mind time? I heard you did most of the work yesterday, so -
    rose
    Madam Speaker 12:55 p.m.
    Yes, Hon Member.
    Mr Alban S. K. Bagbin 12:55 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I thank you very much and I totally respect your ruling in this matter. The only thing that I did not hear Madam Speaker draw our attention to, are the parties. I did not hear the parties being mentioned. Who are the parties in the action?
    Madam Speaker 12:55 p.m.
    Well, there is
    nothing wrong with telling you the parties are. They are one Kwame Boateng, Esq. (Plaintiff) v. Attorney-General and, Minister for Justice , Executive Secretary of Public Utilities Regulatory Commission, Electricity Company of Ghana Ltd (Defendants/Respondents)--
    Order! Order!
    rose
    Madam Speaker 12:55 p.m.
    Were you going to contribute to the debate?
    Mr Pelpuo 12:55 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, we want
    Madam Speaker 12:55 p.m.
    Let us hear whether he is out of order or not.
    Mr Pelpuo 12:55 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, we thought that it was our responsibility to bring it up. But we respect your ruling, we want to debate, we are anxious to debate and we want to thank you for that -- and we have all the arsenals to start this debate except that we will propose an amendment to the Motion that will include -- [Interruption.]
    Madam Speaker 12:55 p.m.
    Order! Order, please. Yes, Leader, I thought we could continue with the debate?
    Mr Avoka 12:55 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, yes, we shall continue. I just want to draw your attention to the fact that yesterday, it was Hon Joe Gidisu who was on his feet when I drew the attention of the House to the fact that the matter was before court. I just want to put it in the perspective where the debate was pending when we intervened. So he was on his feet when I intervened.
    Madam Speaker 12:55 p.m.
    Hon Member, then continue. I hope we would not spend too much time. I hear much of the debate has already been done. Five minutes -
    Can you continue from where you left off then?
    M i n i s t e r f o r R o a d s a n d Highways(MP) (Mr Joe K. Gidisu): Madam Speaker, we on this side of the House, though we appreciate the concerns that came with the increase in the tariffs, this is not to say that we do
    Madam Speaker 12:55 p.m.


    not take cognizance of the fact that post - decisions, which ought to have been taken by the PURC over the years, had not been taken. And we do not want to lose sight of the fact that those postponed decisions do not augur well for the health of the economy.

    Madam Speaker, I am saying this with the facts which we raised on the floor yesterday, that looking at the last increase of tariffs in the country, this was in November, 2007 and as such, it was 35 per cent as against the 103 per cent in May 2001.
    rose
    Madam Speaker 12:55 p.m.
    Yes, I thought I was
    going to take a point of order? Yes, let us please, carry on.
    Mr Simon Osei Mensah 1:05 p.m.
    On a point of order. Madam Speaker, I want to find out from my Hon Colleague [Interruptions] -- Please, I am on a point of order.
    Madam Speaker 1:05 p.m.
    But you do not
    find out from --
    Mr Osei-Mensah 1:05 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I
    have information which I want clarification from the Hon Member before he continues. The information suggests that my Hon Colleague is a member or recently was a member of the Board of the PURC. I want to know if that is right, then he should declare his interest before he continues with his submission.
    Thank you, Madam Speaker.
    Madam Speaker 1:05 p.m.
    What is “interest”?
    What is the definition of “interest”? The “interest, I thought, should be a private interest”. The “interest” should be a private interest but if you, a member of this House and you are a member of a committee, then the fact that you are a member of the PURC Board and you think that is an interest?
    Mr Osei Mensah 1:05 p.m.
    Madam Speaker,
    Madam Speaker 1:05 p.m.
    Let us thrash out
    what is meant by “interest” here.
    Hon Majority Leader, “interest” as a member of PURC Board, does that preclude him from contributing because of interest? It is not a contract, it is not a loan, what does he get from it except that as a Member of Parliament and a citizen? Is he also entitled to comment?
    Mr Avoka 1:05 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, Hon Joe
    Gidisu has never been a member of PURC Board. [Interruptions.] He is just playing to the gallary, he has never been a member.
    Madam Speaker 1:05 p.m.
    Well, he wanted
    clarification, if he has got it, I think that is where we should leave it.
    Yes, Honourable, carry on, he has got the clarification. Please, carry on.
    Mr J. K. Gidisu 1:05 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, we should be very realistic about the issues on the floor. One would have to look at the impact of these increases and where there is the need for suggestions
    for reconsidering them, we should be objective in looking at these issues dispassionately. In terms of impact on domestic consumers, those who consume between zero-fifty units, unlike what it was in May, 2001, when the increase was 95 per cent --

    Mr K. T. Hammond - rose —
    Madam Speaker 1:05 p.m.
    Hon Hammond,
    are you raising a point of order? Your light is on.
    Mr Hammond 1:05 p.m.
    Yes, Madam Speaker.
    Thank you very much.
    I am sitting and listening anxiously and I am getting extremely exasperated. Where is the Hon Member getting these figures from because already, he said certain things that I have never heard of in my life, all the years I was the -
    Madam Speaker 1:05 p.m.
    But will you know everything?
    Mr Hammond 1:05 p.m.
    Madam Speaker,
    seven years at the Ministry of Energy, the Deputy Minister responsible for this
    thing -- Madam Speaker, for seven years, I have not heard some of the things he is talking about.
    Madam Speaker 1:05 p.m.
    He is reading from
    something.
    Mr Hammond 1:05 p.m.
    Well, he has not
    mentioned it -
    Madam Speaker 1:05 p.m.
    Find out.
    Mr Hammond 1:05 p.m.
    So, let him tell us
    where he is reading from.
    Madam Speaker 1:05 p.m.
    No! No! Find out
    first before you say you have not seen it before. If it is an official record.
    Mr Hammond 1:05 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, let
    him declare the source. We want to know the source.
    Madam Speaker 1:05 p.m.
    That is what you
    should have said. He says what is the source? Is it official?
    Mr K. Gidisu 1:05 p.m.
    Madam Speaker,
    we should not play politics with this situation because the period which we are considering falls within political regimes. The period we are talking about falls within political regimes and though the PURC is independent, one would have expected just as we are doing today, to let people see the reality in terms of the impact of those increases, whether they measure up to the cost of providing those services. We need to realise -
    Madam Speaker 1:05 p.m.
    Hon Member, all he wanted to know was, was it your own compilation or is it from an official record because they said you were reading from something. And that is why I wanted -
    Mr J. K. Gidisu 1:05 p.m.
    Madam Speaker,
    these are extracts from PURC documents.
    Madam Speaker 1:05 p.m.
    All right. Tell them that they are extracts from these.
    Yes, he says they are extracts, that was why he was reading them.
    Yes, shall we continue.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1:05 p.m.
    Madam
    Speaker, I believe that simply saying that it is an extract from the PURC document is not enough. Maybe, he will tell us the document and the year because they produce annual reports. So, we may need that.
    The second thing is, the Hon Member went further to say that we should not do politics in this House. Madam Speaker, what is the business of this House? We do politics here. If he had said that we should not be unnecessarily partisan, and I believe that was what he meant, he should say so. The business of Parliament is to do politics, if he cares to know.
    Madam Speaker 1:05 p.m.
    I think politics is - a word which covers a lot of situations and would cover all the suggestions you made but let us hear from the Hon Minister.
    The Minority Leader says that you should have said we should not be partisan. It encompasses all but what is your answer? I thought it encompasses all but what is your answer?
    Mr J. K. Gidisu 1:15 p.m.
    Madam Speaker,
    whether partisan or politics, when talking about politics here, definitely, you will be taking a stand. A stand which may differ from the stand of the other Colleague, and for that matter, you may refer to it as partisan in that sense. So, I just want to stand by the fact that -- I want to refer that the figures I am quoting are from the Public Utilities Regulatory Commission, Comparative Analysis of PURC Approved Electricity Tariffs from 2001 to 2010.
    Madam Speaker, no where in the world do people welcome increases in tariffs, no matter the level. And this is a situation we would have to consider, so that when trying to look at the current increases -- I think though PURC is independent, there is the need for Government to supervise its activities in relation to the concerns of people in the country. And this should guide governments, especially to look at those tariffs whether they fit into the regime of providing those services.
    The current Government is people- centered and for that matter, whatever they felt would touch the lives of the citizenry, Government would not hesitate to revisit the situation. It is on this note that the President, in listening to the whole situation that is coming from the various sectors of the society, in his wisdom as the father of this nation, thought it wise to appeal to the PURC to revisit the current levels of tariffs we have in the country.
    Madam Speaker, I will therefore, call on my Hon Colleagues, that in raising concerns about the issue on this floor, there is the need for us to be very dispassionate, looking at the overall interest of this country and in the final analysis, be able to carry the country along with us. It would therefore, be very prudent for us to look at the situation with regard to the PURC, whether the powers that we in this Parliament have at one time or the other given to them, there is the need to revisit those powers in terms of current development.
    It is on this score that perhaps, appropriately, we may have to look at the Motion that is on the floor of this House. It is on this note that I would want to come, Madam Speaker, under Order 78 (d), if you would permit me to quote:
    “. . .a motion to amend a motion of which no notice is required or which is debated twenty-four hours after
    notice has been given;”
    It is on this note that I beg to amend the Motion to read:
    “That this House calls on PURC to reconsider the recent increases in electricity and water tariffs in view of their impact on the general economic situation in the country”.
    So amended Madam Speaker.
    Madam Speaker 1:15 p.m.
    A Motion for amendment has been moved, we need a seconder - we have to second the Motion because he is on the point that it could be made here but it is a Motion and it has to be seconded.
    Minister for Local Government and Rural Development (MP)(Mr Joseph Y. Chireh) 1:15 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I beg to second this amended Motion and to call on this House to accept the amendment which is in line with what the President of the Republic has already directed the PURC to do.
    We know that the impact - [Interruption] - the calculations, people have all sorts of figures that they are bandying about these increases. But as a House, we would want to agree to express the concern because when you take a political decision, it is different. When you take a decision based on an independent commission, it is for us to express our concern and urge them to reconsider all the factors involved in the increases - [Interruptions.]
    Madam Speaker, tell these young people who are shouting at me to listen to me - [Interruptions] - I have a story to tell them. And this story is that, we should not under any circumstance undermine the laws that we pass. I heard comments to
    the effect that “this is NDC Government, insensitive and wanting to punish people”.
    Meanwhile, you know the PURC is an independent organisation created by this Parliament and given the powers to act the way they do. It affects all of us when they take decisions and therefore, when they take decisions and as a House, we are expressing these views, we must be clear we do not undermine that independence they enjoy.
    Madam Speaker, we want everybody to know that for the utility providers to continue to provide even the bad or sometimes good services, we need to periodically and often increase to make them viable. It is because people veered away from taking firm decisions to do so, that today, the increased tariffs have to be massive. Now, he says we were opposing it when we were in opposition; so is he just doing the same thing?This country needs to break away from this ritual - [Interruption] - and I urge my Hon Colleagues to move away from playing to the gallery when there is the need for us to take a firm decision.
    rose
    Mr Chireh 1:15 p.m.
    We need to strengthen the institutions; we need to give them value so that they provide the services that we want. I urge the PURC and particularly the service providers to improve their services to match the increases - [Interruptions.]
    Madam Speaker 1:15 p.m.
    Let him finish seconding the Motion.
    Mr Chireh 1:15 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I beg to second this Motion and say that we the Members of Parliament are concerned and we urge PURC to reconsider the increases.
    Madam Speaker 1:15 p.m.
    Hon Members,
    Madam Speaker 1:15 p.m.


    the Motion is that we include PURC; that is how I saw it. He referred to the appropriate Order 78 (d), that when a Motion is moved here -- And if we do that, then we would consider both of them in our debates and then when the Question is put, we know exactly what we are doing. Unless the process is that we should take the amendment and see whether it is agreed to before we come to this. But let me consult.

    Hon Papa Owusu-Ankomah are they entitled to move an amendment?
    Mr Hammond 1:15 p.m.
    Madam Speaker -
    Madam Speaker 1:25 p.m.
    Hon Member, I will hear from Hon Papa Owusu-Ankomah first.
    Hon Papa Owusu-Ankomah, I have received some but I still will like to -- because I am informed by our Hon Clerk that we will take the two together and when it comes to really putting the Question, the answer we get will be in respect of the amendment. If not, it means the former Motion would be carried. So, if that is the procedure, let us go on.
    Mr Avoka 1:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, in my humble view and from the practice of this House sometime ago, I think that the two motions should be debated side by side and then at the end of the debate,we take a decision in respect of each of them.
    Madam Speaker, even though there are no specific provisions as far as this issue is concerned, at least, we can be guided or persuaded by Standing Order 80 (2) (a) and (b) and with your permission, I will quote Standing Order 80 (2) (a):
    “80 (2) A motion of which notice is
    required proposed by a Member or a motion to amend a motion of which notice is required or an amendment to a Bill may be debated twenty-four hours after notice has been given.
    Provided that -
    (a) when a motion is debated twenty-four hours after notice has been given, amendments may be proposed to it without notice”.
    This is where we have reached, and (b) says,
    (b) in the case of an amendment to a Bill -”
    Madam Speaker, we can substitute, “Bill” here to a “Motion”, just to guide us to see how it goes.
    Madam Speaker 1:25 p.m.
    No, a Bill and a Motion are different.
    Mr Avoka 1:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I just want to be guided. I want us to be persuaded by this.
    “(b) in the case of an amendment to a Bill of which notice has not been given as prescribed under this Order, Mr. Speaker may, at his discretion, allow the amendment to be debated.”
    Madam Speaker, you may allow the amendment to be debated. This is why I am saying that the combined effect of our Standing Orders is that you allow the amendment to be debated and then at the end of the day, we can take a decision in respect of each one of them.
    Madam Speaker 1:25 p.m.
    Have you looked at Order 83(4)?
    “if an amendment is moved to
    an amendment upon which Mr. Speaker has proposed the question, the last mentioned amendment shall be dealt with as if it were the original motion until all amendments to it have been disposed of.”
    What do you make of that one?
    Mr Avoka 1:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, it talks about two amendments.
    Madam Speaker 1:25 p.m.
    But this one is one.
    Mr Avoka 1:25 p.m.
    This one is one, so it may not be applicable. That is why I am saying that there are no specific provisions on the matter, but to save time, we can debate both of them simultaneously and come to a decision.
    Madam Speaker 1:25 p.m.
    When we get there -- when we get to putting the Question, we shall deal with it.
    So we have heard -- a motion has been moved, let us discuss, let us go on with the debate.
    Hon Members, can we, please, hurry up? It seems like we are getting somewhere and then we put the Question.
    Dr Matthew O. Prempeh 1:25 p.m.
    Thank you, Madam Speaker --
    Madam Speaker 1:25 p.m.
    Hon Prempeh, five minutes. We have to finish our work for the day.
    Dr Prempeh 1:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I would want to defer to the Hon Ranking Member on Energy -
    Madam Speaker 1:25 p.m.
    Are you contributing to the debate?
    Dr Prempeh 1:25 p.m.
    Yes, Madam Speaker, I was contributing.
    Madam Speaker 1:25 p.m.
    All right, then, do not be too long.
    Dr Prempeh 1:25 p.m.
    Thank you, Madam Speaker. The Hon Member had not finished? I thought the Hon Member had finished and when he moved the amendment, it was seconded and it was accepted that we would discuss it. But he first debated the matter, so we are moving to the other side.
    Mr Adda 1:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, thank you very much for the opportunity. Indeed, Madam Speaker -
    Madam Speaker 1:25 p.m.
    Had you still not finished?
    Mr Adda 1:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I am a little surprised at what is going on in this Chamber.
    Madam Speaker 1:25 p.m.
    Why are you surprised?
    Mr Adda 1:25 p.m.
    Because, Madam Speaker, the issues that are being raised on both sides of the House seem to be non- contentious in the sense that -
    Madam Speaker 1:25 p.m.
    No, not at all.
    Mr Adda 1:25 p.m.
    They are not because we are talking about increasing utility prices that are not - [Interruption.]
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I want to be very clear. Has the second Motion, the amendment Motion -- has it been admitted?
    Madam Speaker 1:25 p.m.
    Well, it has been moved and seconded.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, my contention is that that a m e n d m e n t M o t i o n c a n n o t b e countenanced in this House --
    Madam Speaker 1:25 p.m.
    Why? What is the Order?
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1:25 p.m.
    Madam

    Speaker, I am invoking the rules. Hon Members should know that there are four kinds of Motions. We have a Motion that requires at least 48 hours' notice, then we have a Motion that requires 24 hours, then we have half hour Motion and then we have motions that can be moved on the floor on the spur of the moment without notice.

    Madam Speaker, this one talks about 24 hours , that is, no notice being required, because if you move a Motion for 24 hours, if an amendment is to be filed, it should be advertised. That is why the emphasis is on 24 hours.

    Madam Speaker, for the 48 hours --May I plead with my Hon Colleague that he should allow me to finish because clearly, he does not even understand the point I am making.
    Madam Speaker 1:25 p.m.
    Let us get the rules right, please.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, there are places for half-hour Motions, Motions that require at least 48 hours notice and motions that require 24 hours notice. That is what I am saying that because this Motion has been advertised for more than 48 hours, this amendment - [Interruption.] Did he listen to Madam Speaker? She did not offer any ruling. [Interruption.] He is saying, “how?”, because he was not listening --
    Madam Speaker 1:25 p.m.
    Carry on.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1:25 p.m.
    Because he was not listening. That is why I applied to the Speakership whether any directive had been made and Madam Speaker said the Motion had been moved and seconded --
    Madam Speaker 1:25 p.m.
    Yes, I did try to seek clarification, that after a Motion of this sort has been moved and seconded, what happens, and I was told by my Clerk, who
    advises me that we could go on and discuss the Motion and the amendment, and then when it comes to putting the Question we - But I called upon you that please, help, and if you are now helping, I am listening.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, with respect to the Chair, you called the Hon Papa Owusu-Ankomah --
    Madam Speaker 1:25 p.m.
    No, I was calling you.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I did not hear you call me, but if you say that, and if a ruling has been made - Madam Speaker, I am happy you are saying that you have been advised by the Clerk. I will challenge, that this ruling is not foundationed in our Standing Orders, it is not. And if, indeed, the advice is coming from the Clerk and if you are now saying that you have ruled, I will not want to challenge it. But Madam Speaker, with respect, I would want that you have a reconsideration of this subsequently because clearly, it is not foundationed in our Standing Orders at all --
    Madam Speaker 1:25 p.m.
    Let us finish this small matter here. We were looking at Order 80 (2). That is what gave us the idea that we could carry on. If we can look at it, Order 80 (2)
    “A motion of which notice is required proposed by a Member or a motion to amend a motion of which notice is required or an amendment to a Bill may be debated twenty-four hours after notice has been given.
    Provided that -
    (a)when a motion is debated twenty- four hours after notice has been given, amendments may be proposed to it without notice”;
    That was what we were referring to.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, let us go to Order 78 and that talks about the 24 hour notice that is required in respect of certain Motions. Order 78 provides, and with your permission, I beg to quote:
    “Unless any Order otherwise
    provides, notice shall be given of any motion which it is proposed to make, except the following --”
    And that is where the Motion requiring 24-hour notice is provided. Otherwise, all other Motions require at least, 48 hours notice except those of them made on the spur of the moment and half-hour Motions. That is what it is --
    Madam Speaker 1:35 p.m.
    Except the following, that is (d).
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1:35 p.m.
    And (d) provides for 24 hour Motions. And that is why it is being particularized and I hope my Hon Colleagues would understand that.
    Madam Speaker 1:35 p.m.
    In other words, we should adjourn or defer this thing. Is that the proposition that we defer this thing for 24 hours before we bring the amended Motion to the House? I thought we could finish with this matter.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, mean that, that one cannot be countenanced. The import of this means that, that second amendment could not be countenanced. That is the import of it.
    Madam Speaker 1:35 p.m.
    Does the import of my initial prodding that if we could correct
    the text and put “PURC” was relevant? That is all they are doing at this stage.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I was careful, I said if that is your ruling, we will withdraw it and allow us to carry on, except I wanted us to advert our minds to this so that we may not repeat it. That is all that I mean. But clearly, it is not foundationed in our Standing Orders --
    Madam Speaker 1:35 p.m.
    My initial ruling, if I had been permitted, would have been that why is it that the Hon Members who moved the Motion would not put the relevant “PURC” there? And I was told that it was implied. But I would have preferred if it were there and if it were implied and if it is there, what is the - Unless you think we need to adjourn it to do the proper thing, we will do so. But I thought we could finish with the matter today. [Pause.]
    Well, I think I will insist that you put the “PURC” there and then we can carry on. Then, there is no need for amendments and this and that. It was a suggestion, I was surprised, was not taken but if it is taken, there is no need to go to this length.
    The Hon Member who moved the Motion -- Well, I suggested that it calls on who and I thought on the PURC. If it is there, it clarifies the position and if it is accepted, we can do this correction, not an amendment or through a Motion or anything. Could that not happen, so that we can carry on with it?
    Mr Adda 1:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I said earlier that it is implied in the Motion that, PURC is the appropriate authority to deal with this.
    Madam Speaker 1:35 p.m.
    So would it be
    wrong to put it there?
    Mr Adda 1:35 p.m.
    It is not wrong but not unless my Hon Colleagues on the other side of the House are being political about it, in my opinion, the Motion is good as it is. We all know PURC is responsible, that was why I said it is not contentious. We know it is PURC, so let it be so.
    Madam Speaker, --
    Madam Speaker 1:35 p.m.
    If there is no harm in it and it is the PURC, why would you say it is good as it is?
    Mr Adda 1:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, there are certain matters that we are all concerned about in this country -
    Madam Speaker 1:35 p.m.
    By consensus, I am gathering the consensus here that everybody is concerned and so if we need just a word to put there and carry on and finish with this work quickly, why do we not by consensus ? Yes. When I come to put the Question, I will not be in a position - They could take an objection at that stage.
    Mr Adda 1:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, so be it added. I have said it.
    Madam Speaker 1:35 p.m.
    He said we put “PURC” m -- Yes, I agree, I think the “PURC” should be put there -
    Mr Adda 1:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, it is agreed so let us add it to it.
    Madam Speaker 1:35 p.m.
    I think sometimes we should agree to -
    Mr Adda 1:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I have accepted that it should be added. May I continue?
    Madam Speaker 1:35 p.m.
    Yes.
    Mr Adda 1:35 p.m.
    Thank you very much.
    Madam Speaker 1:35 p.m.
    Have you finished
    with this side?
    Mr Adda 1:35 p.m.
    Yes, I have.
    Madam Speaker 1:35 p.m.
    All right continue but we are already behind time.
    Mr Adda 1:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I thought this matter was really a non-political matter because we all know that in this country, our tariffs, particularly in the energy sector are below economic rates. We are way below the levels that would enable our utilities make full cost recovery. This is not something that is debatable on this floor because we agree, they agree.
    Madam Speaker, we have been talking about a policy to bring independent power producers to this country to help us add on to our generation capacity in the country. Unless we move to find cost recovery, we cannot do that. We are not debating that, we accept that. The question is how we get to that level.
    Madam Speaker, there is another issue that was raised by some of my Hon Colleagues on the other side of the House, the Hon Minister for Road and Highways, the Hon Minister for Local Government and Rural Development -- they mentioned the lack of quality service delivery by some utility companies.
    I think we also agreed on this side of the House that indeed, service delivery is poor and we need to deal with it appropriately to improve it. If we are going to pay any high tariffs, then we should improve the service delivery in this country. We do not argue over that.
    Madam Speaker, consumer behaviour, particularly in the area of energy used in this country is not the best. We are not energy efficient. We all abuse the energy that is generated for us at a very high cost. This is something we need to deal with and indeed, in the past seven years, we have tried to improve this through various campaigns.
    So as we speak today, there is a responsibility on the part of the consumers on helping for us to improve, not only
    service delivery but also to ensure that we have got adequate power generation capacity for us and that the service delivery would be better.
    Madam Speaker, I think the thing that we are all most concerned about is the rate of increase that we are experiencing. It is true that at the Energy Committee, we agreed that we needed to increase tariffs, we did not argue about that; the issue that we raised was that the rate of increase was something that we should look at seriously and that we should take them alongside other things such as service delivery.
    The operations of the utility companies, the amount of the investment that is going into these companies, are we getting commensurate services from them, at the level that we desire? These are all the things that we talked about at the committee level.
    Madam Speaker, my major concerns came out of the levels of resources that have gone into utility companies in this country over the past seven years. From my estimation, from being in the Ministry of Energy and also being in this House, I can put the figure around one billion dollars, thereabout.
    Monies that have come through the Ghana Energy Development and Access Project, in the neighbourhood of about US$239 million, monies that have come from the U.S EXIM Bank, about US$350 million , monies that have come through the Chinese Government, over US$700 million and monies that have come from the Norwegian Government, from the Eurobond issue, about US$175 million .
    The point here, Madam Speaker, is that we have put significant levels of resources into the utility companies and we are not getting commensurate quality services from them. Therefore, if you are
    going to increase tariffs, let us look at the obligations and all of the players in the arena and ensure that if we agree that we are going to increase tariffs, everybody plays the part properly and effectively for us to get the dividends that we all desire in the country.
    Madam Speaker, let me give you one example at the consumer side. We all agreed in this country that we are misusing power, we were using the onion bulb as they call it, and we decided to convert to the compact fluorescent lamps (CFLs); we were able to implement this successfully and we saved this country about US$32 million.
    Indeed, in New York, this country benefited from a cash donation of one million dollars out of the carbon credit facility. These are all measures that - let me credit the New Patriotic Party (NPP) Administration - have been implemented very successfully towards improving services in the utility areas, particularly energy.
    Madam Speaker, the increases in the utility tariffs today are too steep, too drastic and they come in the wake of other increases. Increase in taxes, increases in fuel prices, some areas are growing up at the commensurate levels.
    Madam Speaker, all these things are not helping Ghana at all. We are rather punishing the average Ghanaian, in the sense that we are imposing taxes, we are increasing fuel prices, we are increasing all kinds of duties and at the same time too, we are coming to increase the costs of electricity and water.
    This is not creating a better Ghana for us, this is creating a bitter Ghana, and that is what my Colleague said when they moved the Motion yesterday. These are matters that we have to address seriously and let the Ghanaian know what is going
    Mr Fuseini 1:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I rise
    on a point of order and my Senior Brother, the former Minister for Energy is seriously misleading the House.
    Madam Speaker, he has said and I heard him clearly that the increases have been “drastic”. In fact, he qualified it with an adjective “very drastic.” Madam Speaker, that is far from the truth. If you do a comparative analysis - [Interruption] - that is a point of order. It is very misleading. It is very, very misleading to say that the increases have been “very drastic” It is very misleading.
    Indeed, it is leading to the point that we are throwing dust into the eyes of Ghanaians -
    Madam Speaker 1:45 p.m.
    Hon Member, what word were you thinking he should have
    Mr Fuseini 1:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, the
    cumulative increase is 86 per cent --
    Madam Speaker 1:45 p.m.
    But I have not come to you yet. He was making a point of order, what is the Order? [Interruption.]

    Hon Members, I think in ten minutes, I will close the debate on this. It has been long enough and I will put the Question. I feel it is about time we could answer this.
    Mr Fuseini 1:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, it is founded on Order 93 - [Laughter.]
    Madam Speaker 1:45 p.m.
    Order 93? --
    [Laughter] -- Let us hear him.
    Mr Fuseini 1:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, and
    particularly, Order 93 (2), which says and with your permission I quote:
    Madam Speaker 1:45 p.m.
    Order 93 what? You
    Mr Fuseini 1:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I am
    trying to get -
    Madam Speaker 1:45 p.m.
    I think you are out

    Hon Member, conc lude you r contribution.
    Mr Adda 1:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, my
    Colleague opposite is trying to object -
    Madam Speaker 1:45 p.m.
    He is entitled to
    draw my attention but he is out of order, so continue.
    Mr Adda 1:45 p.m.
    Thank you, Madam
    Speaker. Madam Speaker, I want my Colleague opposite to take note that the changes that I said are drastic, are facts, if one considers the practicality of them. Indeed, my Colleague, the Hon Minister for Roads and Highways said we must be realistic and look at the reality of the situation.
    Madam Speaker, I have a copy of a Bill that was raised as a result of a letter going from PURC to consumers. The consumer who used to consume 150 units at a cost of GH¢12.5, today, the rate that has been prescribed or directed by PURC, that consumer is now paying GH¢27, the percentage is about 120 per cent. [Uproar.] If you are telling me 100 per cent is not drastic then I do not know what definition of “drastic” is.
    Madam Speaker 1:45 p.m.
    We have finished
    with the drastic part. Can you wind up now?
    Mr Adda 1:45 p.m.
    Yes. I am going on now,
    Madam Speaker.
    The rate of increase is unbearable for Ghanaians, it is making them suffer and it is leading us into a bitter Ghana.
    Madam Speaker, if one compares what pertained during the time of the NPP Administration, to what pertains now, the lifeline threshold that was mentioned by my Colleague opposite, the Hon Minister for Roads and Highway that they are a little more considerate. I want it to be on record that the lifeline used to be between 0 and 50 kilowatt units.
    When the NPP Administration came in, we moved it from 0 -150 units, not 0 - 50, so we added another 100 units as part of the lifeline to make it bearable for Ghanaians. They have brought it back to between 0 and 50 units, so they dropped it by 100 units and that is hurting Ghanaians -
    Madam Speaker 1:45 p.m.
    Hon Member,
    when you say “they” what do you mean? Do you mean PURC?
    Mr Adda 1:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, if this
    drastic increase is not causing bitter Ghana, it is not causing suffering among Ghanaians, I do not know what else is making Ghanaians suffer.
    Madam Speaker, I have another example -
    Madam Speaker 1:45 p.m.
    Hon Member, you have two more minutes to go because other people want to speak. It does not matter that it was part of -
    Mr Adda 1:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, the fact of the matter is that people are about to lose their jobs because their employers are paying up to about 300 per cent increase --
    Madam Speaker 1:45 p.m.
    Order! Order! Let
    him conclude, please.
    Mr Adda 1:45 p.m.
    They are paying up to about
    300 per cent increase in the cost of utilities of their companies. And so, if you drop the lifeline from 150 down to 50 and then you increase the cost of utilities of their companies, those people who are going to be laid off, they are not going to have any incomes to feed their families -- all the attendant social problems are things that we are all very much aware of.
    Madam Speaker, a lot has been said in the public domain from our social partners 1:45 p.m.
    Trade Union Congress (TUC), Association of Ghana Industries (AGI), Chamber of Commerce, Chamber of Mines and so on and so forth. I am happy that President Mills has seen reason and has asked the PURC to look at the matter again. Madam Speaker, we are not criticising for the sake of criticising, I want to recall the minds of this House -
    Madam Speaker 1:45 p.m.
    I will not have any
    more points of order. We are wasting too much time. Please, finish; we have one more here.
    Mr Adda 1:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, the point I am raising now, simply is that there is a way out, there is simply a way out for this nation to be able to move towards full cost recovery. We should have a strategic roadmap that puts obligation on each partner in this whole set-up: consumers, utility companies, governments and what have you. And if we are able to work out this roadmap just as the NPP Administration was doing by bringing in the Corporate Charter - [Interruption.]
    Madam Speaker 1:45 p.m.
    Order! Order!
    Mr Adda 1:45 p.m.
    We started this process. President Mills said that he was going to continue what we were doing. If he continues what we were doing in working out this benchmark arrangements, making the utility companies to sign performance agreements and ensure that they improve services, ensure that the Government makes its contribution - As we speak now, the Government of the NDC has not made a simple contribution into the investment that has gone into the utility companies -
    Madam Speaker 1:45 p.m.
    Hon Member,
    thank you. Your time is up.
    Mr Adda 1:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, my last
    and most important point is that US$800 million is being lost by the people of this country from the inept management of Ghana National Petroleum Corporation (GNPC), of the gas monetisation that should have been ready to be implemented this October, not a single inch of pipeline has been laid, not a single inch of gas infrastructure has been put in place.
    Where is the US$800 million we are hoping to realise by the end of this year? [Interruptions.] The US$800 million could be used to subsidise the utility tariffs and with this subsidy, there is no need for us to pay over 200 per cent increase --
    Madam Speaker 1:45 p.m.
    Hon Member, you
    are out of order. Your time is past. I think you have said more than enough. You have clinched the matter. Let us have one more here. Otherwise, I will leave the Chair for the Second Deputy Speaker because I have to go somewhere. If you want more time on this, then I think I will ask the First Deputy Speaker to take the Chair because I have to go somewhere at 2 o'clock.
    I thought there was a building up of consensus and we are getting to the time where I could safely put the Question and finish with this matter, which has been so long pending. But if you want more time, if that is the sense of the House - it is 1.51 p.m., almost 2.00 p.m. , and I intend to rise at 2.00 p.m. and give the Chair to the - I will take one more from this side and put the Question. I think the House has had its say and if you would allow me, let me take one more -
    Mr Moses Asaga 1:55 p.m.
    None

    Mr Frederick Opare-Ansah -- rose
    - 1:55 p.m.

    Madam Speaker 1:55 p.m.
    Hon Member, we would hear from you, the last but please, do not go at length. Put the salient points - Hon Asaga, I am speaking to you.
    Mr Moses Asaga 1:55 p.m.
    But why? Sit down! - [Interruption.] Thank you, Madam Speaker - [Interruptions.]
    Several Hon Members - rose -
    Madam Speaker 1:55 p.m.
    Hon Members, let
    us pause at this stage. Having regard to the state of Business of the House, I direct that Sitting be held outside the prescribed time. It is almost 2.00 p.m. and I will rise at 2.00 p.m., if we do not finish.
    We will continue, you will have
    your say. One more from this side and I think I will close the debate and put the Question. And please, do not be too long. Everything has been said.
    Mr Moses Asaga (NDC -- Nabdam) 1:55 p.m.
    Yes, thank you, Madam Speaker -
    Madam Speaker 1:55 p.m.
    I will come to the Leaders before I put the Question - I will come to the Leaders.
    Madam Speaker 1:55 p.m.
    What is the point of order? [Interruption.] So we have not heard him. We have not heard what he is saying.
    rose
    Madam Speaker 1:55 p.m.
    The last contributor was also the former Minister - I know. Anyway, Hon Members, let us just hear from Hon Asaga, we go to the Leaders -
    rose
    Madam Speaker 1:55 p.m.
    Hon Member, what
    is the point of order? A point of order here, let me take it, then we come to you.
    Mr Opare-Ansah 1:55 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, having regard to the issue you raised about the matter pending before the court and the fact that the Hon Member being asked to speak is, indeed, a member of the PURC Board, which is a known fact -- [Interruption] - I wonder how, first of all, even if we were to put aside issues of conflict of interest, that he would be able to contribute to this debate in such a manner that would not be prejudicial to the matter that you raised earlier.
    Madam Speaker, I believe Hon Asaga would do all of us good if he advertised his interest in this matter and honourably step
    Madam Speaker 1:55 p.m.
    Are you pre- judging? You never know what he is going to say. For all I know, it is, maybe, contrary to what you say. But he has a right in this House. He may even be in your favour, you do not know.
    Mr Moses Asaga 1:55 p.m.
    Thank you, Madam Speaker -
    Madam Speaker 1:55 p.m.
    Do not be too long because I will cut you.
    rose
    Madam Speaker 1:55 p.m.
    Yes, Hon Member?
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1:55 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, it is quite unfortunate that the interventions that cropped up both yesterday and today have not allowed many more people to participate in this debate as we would have wanted. Madam Speaker --
    Madam Speaker 1:55 p.m.
    We could extend the time. I merely said that I have to leave by 2.00 p.m. and I thought I was going to conclude the matter. But I have increased the time. So the First Deputy Speaker could take the Chair and you would have more time, if that is the wish of the House. From the ruling I gave, I would have preferred if I finished this and really guided our debate from things that we should guard against. But if you want more time for this debate, I have suggested something, I could leave the Chair for -
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1:55 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, it is for that reason that I thought that maybe if you allowed for at least, two, two , [Some Hon Members: No.] Madam Speaker, clearly, the way we are going, if you should extend the time as you have granted, it is not likely that we would take any other matter after this one. So why should people be afraid and be

    shouting? “No”, “No”. If you say you are prepared and you have your arsenals ready, why are you running away from the battle? [Uproar.] [An Hon Member. These are “I care for you people”.

    Madam Speaker, this is a matter relating to the common people and we are talking about the programmes and policies of “I care for you” Government. Why should people be sprinting away?

    Madam Speaker, only two will not offend anything. I said two -two; you have said one - one and I am submitting an application to allow for just one more in addition to what you have said. Madam Speaker, it is a very harmless application and I hope that it will be granted.
    Madam Speaker 1:55 p.m.
    Well, I will grant it somewhat in the sense that I have already said after this I was calling on the Leaders. It makes the two- two you require, does it not? So if you have something, Hon Minority Leader, I will call on you first, conclude it, then we will - I am of the view that we have got to a stage where - but conclude it. I am giving the Leaders the opportunity that will make the two that you have requested.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1:55 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I would want to plead that you allow for two- two, excluding the Leadership so that we have three - three -- [Interruption.] Madam Speaker, I know my Colleague is not ready. With all these pleas, I know he is not ready. My Colleague the Majority Leader is not ready for the battle and that is why he is pleading.
    Madam Speaker 1:55 p.m.
    I doubt whether he is not ready. But we have not heard from Hon Asaga yet. Hon Asaga, time is of the
    essence, you have five minutes.
    Mr Moses A. Asaga 2:05 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, thank you very much for this opportunity. I think that there was some misleading information that was given to us by Hon Joseph Adda and I thought that I needed to correct it.
    Madam Speaker, when the Committee met with the PURC, the proposal from the utilities was a 154 per cent increase in tariffs but out of the technical competence of PURC and the fact that they are supposed to cater for consumer interests, they reduced it to 89 per cent as the increase.
    So it is not true that they did not have sympathy for consumers. The proposal from the utilities was 154 per cent increase and PURC, having a human face, decided to bring it down to 89 per cent on a weighted average basis.
    Madam Speaker, I think that everyone is complaining and there is a kind of confusion who really sets tariffs.
    I think that we need to let Ghanaians understand that an entity called PURC was enacted in 1997 and they have their rules. And the role of PURC is to fix rates; no government does it. Section 16 (1), (2) and (3) and section 17 are very clear about the setting of tariffs.
    Madam Speaker, I want to read section 16 (3). It states that in preparing the guidelines, the Commission shall take into account --
    (a) consumer interest;
    (b) investor interest; and
    (c) the cost of production of the service and the assurance of financial integrity of the public utility.
    Madam Speaker, in doing this, the PURC would have taken into consideration all these factors that we are talking about. The Hon Ranking Member already did allude to the fact that we should be talking of cost recovery if we are to
    get the Independent Power Producers (IPPs) because no investor will come here to generate electricity and sell it for no price. There is standard practice and therefore Madam Speaker, I think that when we, putting the context, we should be dialoguing with the PURC.
    In the wisdom of PURC, the Commission of PURC has in it, the TUC representative who is the Secretary- General of TUC and he is supposed to represent labour. Labour issues were considered. We have the Association of Ghana Industries. Its representative is on the PURC. And therefore, before the tariffs were announced, all these stakeholders were consulted.
    Madam Speaker, it is on record that the TUC agreed with the PURC that because 154 per cent was drastic and 89 per cent weighted average was also drastic, they would want a 42 per cent and that is what labour negotiated for. So, for it to be made as if both the Government and the PURC were not sensitive, I think it is unfortunate.
    Madam Speaker, the utility companies can only survive if they can generate revenue of US$806 million to be able to service and to improve equipment, to be able to supply uninterrupted electricity to Ghana. Madam Speaker, when we were getting the lights out, everybody was complaining “it is lights out, it is lights out.”
    Madam Speaker, there is now an improvement because of the role that PURC is playing , nobody, nobody should think that the Government is insensitive. Already, the Government is subsidising up to US$48 million for lifeline.
    Madam Speaker, I think that what we need to do is to ask ourselves, as Parliament, when we enacted the PURC
    Madam Speaker 2:05 p.m.
    Order! I want to hear him.
    Mr Asaga 2:05 p.m.
    You said their responsibility should take into consideration the consumer interest, investor interest, cost of production -- So, you do not just set tariffs without taking into consideration certain parameters.
    Madam Speaker, section 4, and with your permission, I want to quote - and it is up to Parliament to now decide. Section 4 says:

    This is what it says. So, if we, Parliament, think that we want to remove this section 4 -
    Madam Speaker 2:05 p.m.
    We do not -- That is not the motion. [Laughter.]
    Mr Asaga 2:05 p.m.
    That is the motion.
    Madam Speaker 2:05 p.m.
    The motion is, we are expressing concern. It is good to tell us the law. But if I may draw your mind back, the motion is that we are expressing concern. That is not the same as trying to dictate to them.
    Speak to the motion.
    Mr Asaga 2:05 p.m.
    Yes, so, Madam Speaker, I believe that knowledge to Hon Members is also important. Therefore, in speaking to the motion, we must allow all Hon Members to also understand the role of
    Madam Speaker 2:05 p.m.
    Hon Asaga, let me take a point of order from the Hon Minority Leader.
    Mr Asaga 2:05 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, on this note, I thank you. [Laughter.]
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 2:05 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, my Hon Colleague has sat down and he spoke about knowledge in this House. Madam Speaker, it is significant to know that he himself grossly misled this House and Ghana when he spoke about a subsidy of US$48 million. Madam Speaker, it does not exist anywhere, except in his imagination. The subsidy is GH¢48 million, not US$48 million.
    Madam Speaker 2:05 p.m.
    That is a point of correction.
    Yes, corrected then.
    Hon Members, so what are we doing now -- you want one more from this side?
    All right, Hon Kan-Dapaah, do but five minutes.
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 2:05 p.m.
    Madam Speaker -
    Madam Speaker 2:05 p.m.
    Yes. Let me hear
    from the Hon Majority Leader.
    Mr Avoka 2:05 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, can we be clear on the guidelines so that we would know what we are doing next. Are you saying that he is the last speaker on the Minority side and I would be the last speaker here?
    Madam Speaker 2:05 p.m.
    I am saying that - I was going to, after this, ask the two of you,
    as the second persons to comment. And he said, he was not going to comment. He said even he thought you were also not going to comment. So, if we take one from the Minority side and you are prepared to comment, you would make up the two. One here, one there and because the Hon Leaders are commenting, we put the Question, otherwise, we would never finish the debate.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 2:05 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, when you got to the turn of Hon Moses Asaga, you said one here, one there and then the Hon Leaders. And then I pleaded for two-two.
    Madam Speaker 2:05 p.m.
    And then, I ruled that the two-two, I would take into account one-one and the Hon Leaders making two-two.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 2:05 p.m.
    Precisely. So, if Hon Moses Asaga had spoken, then the other one comes here. Then, another - if we have to talk, it will be me and Hon Majority Leader. Madam Speaker, let us not forget that the Motion was moved by Hon Members from this side of the House and it is for us to wind up anyway. People should get that clear.
    Madam Speaker 2:05 p.m.
    So, the winding up would then make three? Is that what you are saying?
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 2:05 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, after him, then it will be me and the Hon Majority Leader. Madam Speaker, when we get there, we would know what to do.
    Madam Speaker 2:05 p.m.
    Then you wind up?
    Yes, Hon Kan-Dapaah?
    Mr Albert Kan-Dapaah (NPP - Afigya-Sekyere West) 2:05 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I thank you for the opportunity. I rise to speak against the motion as amended which now reads:
    “That this Honourable House calls on the Public Utilities Regulatory Commission to reconsider the recent increases in electricity and water tariffs in view of their impact on the general economic situation in the country.” --
    Madam Speaker 2:05 p.m.
    Was that the amendment?
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 2:05 p.m.
    That is what they brought?
    Madam Speaker 2:05 p.m.
    This is what they brought, is it? But I have just looked at it. That was not the amendment. I think the amendment was to put PURC there which we have already decided. So, I do not think there is - yes, Hon Member, I have just seen this.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 2:15 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, should we know who published this addendum, because clearly, this is not the amendment proposed by my Hon Colleague.

    When you made the suggestion, Madam Speaker directed and then when it came to the turn of the Hon Member for Navrongo Central (Mr Kofi Adda), he said, yes, he was taking that on board, directing it at PURC. That is what was said. What kind of construction is this? --
    Mr J. K. Gidisu 2:15 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I did not make a suggestion. I moved a motion; I moved a motion, not a suggestion and it was seconded and it
    reflects what has been captured there.
    Madam Speaker 2:15 p.m.
    Hon Minority Leader, I believe and it is confirmed by the Hon Member that that is what is suggested and that is why the Clerks went to prepare the addendum.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 2:15 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, the ultimate direction came from your Chair -
    Madam Speaker 2:15 p.m.
    Yes, after the -
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 2:15 p.m.
    And the Chair's position was that we should insert “by PURC”. That was the agreement, and when it came to the turn of the Hon Member for Navrongo Central (Mr Kofi Adda), you asked when he was going on; you then directed that he takes that on board. So he inserted that, and that is not it; this is not it. Madam Speaker, this clearly , is not what we agreed on. It cannot be accepted in this House. What kind of fraud is this?
    Mr Avoka 2:15 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, clearly, we cannot be suggesting that Madam Speaker was the one who moved the Motion or requested -- It cannot be said so.
    Madam Speaker, I am a witness to one of the Clerks coming to consult the Hon Member for Central Tongu and they tabulated the amendment and I took it from them; it is the same. So I am surprised about the position being taken by the Minority Leader and his type of language. It may not follow. I understand he even used the word “fraudulent”. “What kind of fraud is that”? That is unparliamentary. Fraud on whom? Is it the Clerks, Madam Speaker or the Hon Member here? He should withdraw that. What is fraudulent about what has happened here?
    Madam Speaker 2:15 p.m.
    Let us resolve this; it is pushing us even further back than I
    Mr J. K. Gidisu 2:15 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, the words are in my handwriting and the Clerk can testify; this is my handwriting. And Madam Speaker, I want to quote the amendment that I moved on the floor:

    It was seconded.
    Madam Speaker 2:15 p.m.
    Order! Order! Hon Members, let us not belabour the point. If even that is what he said, we would put the Question at the end of what he said and if the Motion is not carried, it means the first Motion is substituted. That is why we are debating both together.
    But my interjection was in respect of the correction of the first Motion, and I think the practice is that, I would put this Motion that he says and Ayes, or Noes, we get the answer. If it is rejected, it means the amendment is rejected and then the other one is carried.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 2:15 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, with respect to you, we agree to the procedure that if in such a situation, if you put the Question, it would first be put on the amendment. If it stands, it means automatically that the second one falls. Madam Speaker, that is the process, nobody is questioning it.
    But Madam Speaker, you would recollect that after the toing and froing and we settled on the first one as amended, that is by adding the words: “by the PURC,” - [Interruption.] I am quoting the words that you used here. Madam Speaker, you said so after all this -
    Madam Speaker 2:15 p.m.
    We must correct the first question you asked -- was that what
    he said? We have gone to him and he said that was what he wrote for the Clerks and they ran to print this. According to the seconder, that was what he seconded. It does not matter; when it comes to putting the Question, the decision will be a wholesale; if the House rejects it, which could happen, then we move to the first one which we have corrected. So that was how come this thing was printed, when he said that was what he said and it was rushed to our office.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 2:15 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, it does matter, the substance of the amendment proposed. Because when you are putting the Question, we should be clear in our minds which motion -- the language and structure of the amended motion.
    Madam Speaker, the interest at the very outset, and you are right when you said that initially, when we had the pre-Sitting briefing, the suggestion was that it should be addressed to a relevant body, the PURC. And so, we said it should include “by the PURC” at the end.
    Madam Speaker, you would recollect that after he moved the amendment, after some toing and froing, then you directed and you gave the indication that “so, after all this, we go back to my initial prodding”. Madam Speaker, those were your express words and I do not know what the Majority Leader is standing up for. Madam Speaker, so clearly --
    Madam Speaker 2:15 p.m.
    Let us finish with this, then we hear him.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 2:15 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, so clearly, the directive was that we should add at the end of it, “by PURC” so that the amended motion would read:
    “That this Honourable House expresses concern on the recently announced increase in electricity
    and water tariffs and calls for its immediate reconsideration by the
    PURC.”
    Madam Speaker, that was the import of your own directive. And so how come we have this? That is why I was worried, and said that, by your own directive, it did appear fraudulent. That is what I said and I insist. Madam Speaker, because if we go back for the Hansard, Madam Speaker, you would be well informed that this is what you said.
    Madam Speaker 2:25 p.m.
    Hon Member, let us not use the word “fraudulent”; use another word. Use another word, “mistaken” or something else, but --“fraudulent” imports too much of criminality.
    Mr Dery 2:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, another issue of substance is that, in the first rendition, which you considered in the context of Order 93 (1), you said because it was expressed “concern”, it did not offend - it did not fall within the ambit of anything that would adversely affect it.
    Now, you would see that the new Motion does not have “concern”. So the issue is this, that there is no ruling from you as to the context within which this one is acceptable or not, as regards Order 93 (1). That is the point; you said because it was just expressing concern and in view, of the reliefs, you did not think that it was going to have anything to affect the general rule.
    In that regard, if there is a new rendition, then that ruling is not on the new rendition. Let us take note of that. Therefore, it is moving it further because the new rendition does not talk of concern; it is rather an order to reconsider; have a look at it and I think we better view the new rendition in the context of Order 93 (1). That is my point.
    Madam Speaker 2:25 p.m.
    Hon Member, there is a proper point made. My initial ruling dwelt on the former Motion which says, “it is a concern that we are expressing”.
    And it is in the light of that that I read the reliefs that were pending before the court and dealt with the matter to say that I would allow a debate but steer it from anything that would affect the interest of the parties. At that time, the intended amendment had not been moved at all.
    The wording is now different. It is to “reconsider recent increases in electricity and water tariffs, in view of the impact on general economic situation in the country.” It is now giving a reason, whereas the other one was just a concern which will go to them. At the end of the day, if this is passed, we have to refer it to them and it is the concern. And the words were adversely chosen, I think because of the regulations read by Hon Asaga.
    Nobody can force them - I am not going to pronounce on the reliefs they are seeking from the court, whether it even falls within it but he has a point when he says the decision I made was based on the first Motion. What do you say to that? Let me hear from -
    Mr Avoka 2:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, with due respect to you, this is not the procedure or this is not the order of events that happened this morning. Madam Speaker, I recall that you made the prompting that we should identify a body like the PURC so that at the end of the day, we would know who would be held responsible or who would take on board our concerns. At that stage, I intervened and said that subject to his acceptance, then we could insert “and calls on PURC”.
    Then they got up -- Minority Leader replied and said that, that was not acceptable and I said all right, it was your Motion; if they wanted it to go that way, let it go and that ended. It was after that you invited Hon Joe Gidisu to contribute. It was at the end of his contribution that he made this amendment and I heard him and we can call for the Hansard. I heard him --
    Madam Speaker 2:25 p.m.
    No, no, I thought I had made the ruling on whether to go on at all. But they are talking of that initial ruling.
    Mr Avoka 2:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, you could not have made an informed ruling by taking some information from one side of the House. You could not have made the ruling.
    Madam Speaker 2:25 p.m.
    I do not think that is what I am trying to do.
    Mr Avoka 2:25 p.m.
    You could not have made a fair ruling by listening to them and not listening to us; that cannot be a fair ruling.
    Madam Speaker 2:25 p.m.
    I do not think; you will be impugning my -
    Mr Avoka 2:25 p.m.
    I insist that that was the
    Motion moved by the Hon Joe Gidisu.
    Madam Speaker 2:25 p.m.
    No, I do not. I do not agree with you. When I first came here, I was told the process that had happened in my absence and then I was asked to rule whether we could go on at all. It was at that stage that I ruled. It was thereafter that I suggested that the Motion needed a little correction. I am getting the order straight; if I am wrong, tell me. So it was not as if I did not want to hear from one side. Let us exercise patience so that we have the things properly done and the Motion properly moved for the benefit of the people of this country. If we make mistakes, let us correct them.
    Mr Alban S. K. Bagbin 2:25 p.m.
    Thank you very much, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker, I think the first issue had been settled. The first issue dealing with what really happened on the floor. I think that had been settled. I was here myself and I think what the Clerks simply did was to capture the business that took place on the floor, because the Motion was moved and seconded and that was now for the
    consideration of the House.
    The first Motion which had earlier commenced debate in your absence, which actually led your Deputy to adjourn proceedings, was what you ruled on in the morning. And clearly, the ruling gave an indication to the fact that you were going to steer the debate in such a way that it would not prejudice the outcome of the case pending in court.
    Now, the second issue is what Hon Ambrose Dery has raised, whether this proposed amendment would not lead to that effect. Madam Speaker, I want to address that concern raised by my Colleague, the Hon Member for Lawra/ Nandom (Mr Ambrose P. Dery). Madam Speaker, the first motion says:
    “That this Honourable House expresses concern on the recently announced increased electricity and water tariffs and calls for its immediate reconsideration.”
    Madam Speaker 2:25 p.m.
    Yes.
    Mr Bagbin 2:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, so it is
    not just expressing concern; there is an addition. We are calling on the PURC to reconsider its position immediately. That is the second leg. Now, this new --
    Madam Speaker 2:25 p.m.
    Where is the “immediately”?
    Mr Bagbin 2:25 p.m.
    “And calls for its immediate reconsideration”. That is the motion -- “immediate reconsideration”. I am just referring to -
    Madam Speaker 2:25 p.m.
    Yes, let us hear you out.
    Mr Bagbin 2:25 p.m.
    That is the essence. So we are expressing concern, and at the end of the day, we would call on the PURC for immediate reconsideration of the increases. Now, this Motion that is seeking to amend the first Motion says --
    “. . .calls on the PURC to reconsider
    the recent increases in electricity and water tariffs in view of their impact on the general economic situation in the country”.
    You must give reasons why you are calling on them to review. And the reason here is that, it has some impact on the economic situation in the country. That is the reason you are calling on the PURC to review --
    Madam Speaker 2:25 p.m.
    But from this House, you heard people's concerns about the substandard service; it was not the only reason?
    Mr Bagbin 2:25 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, if the issue had only been expressing concern, I would not stand up to raise this. But the second leg calling on it to reconsider, that is the one that has prompted me to say, that in essence, the two Motions are similar --
    Madam Speaker 2:25 p.m.
    Are they the same? They may be similar but not the same.
    Mr Bagbin 2:35 p.m.
    They are not the same, they are similar. The second motion is affirmatively calling on the PURC, not just expressing concern. Because the PURC is an institution established by this House. If we think that the PURC is doing something that is very different from the rationale, the reason, the objective for which we established it, it is for us as a House, to call on it, to redirect it even though the Act says that in the performance of its functions it is not subject to the control. We are not controlling it.
    We are just appealing to the PURC that ‘in view of what is happening, can you go back as an independent body and then take into consideration what the impact of the increases would be on the economy?” -- The economy is going to affect all of us and I know personally that Government expressed these same views and His Excellency the President called on the PURC to take a second look at it. So these are the issues that I think -
    Madam Speaker 2:35 p.m.
    But if you say in essence, it is the same, why do you want to change the wording for them? They know why they brought it.
    Mr Bagbin 2:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, that is why your intervention, which was not an amendment, because Madam Speaker cannot amend a Motion --
    Madam Speaker 2:35 p.m.
    It was not an amendment. It was a correction.
    Mr Bagbin 2:35 p.m.
    But I recall Madam Speaker saying that we could solve this problem by just inserting “by the PURC”.
    Madam Speaker 2:35 p.m.
    That is a correction. We did not change -
    Mr Bagbin 2:35 p.m.
    Exactly. That was from
    Madam Speaker.
    Madam Speaker 2:35 p.m.
    Let us thrash this
    issue before I put the Question.
    Hon Member, you were on your feet and I have asked you that you had said it was the same, and I am saying if it is the same, the corrected one, if it is the same as this, why are we proposing an amendment?
    Mr Bagbin 2:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, the Clerks are duty-bound to capture the Business of the House --
    Madam Speaker 2:35 p.m.
    Correct.
    Mr Bagbin 2:35 p.m.
    They have not participated in the debate at all. They have simply captured it. If this House decides that we would insert “by the PURC”, to remove that doubt as to who we are expressing to, then in essence, it will serve the same purpose --
    Madam Speaker 2:35 p.m.
    But then do we prefer the wording to them?
    Mr Bagbin 2:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, it is important that the earlier one be captured
    Mr Bagbin 2:35 p.m.


    by the Clerks and the Clerks simply captured it.
    Madam Speaker 2:35 p.m.
    Yes. Oh! Yes, that is what happened.
    Mr Bagbin 2:35 p.m.
    That is all. So it is for this House to decide -
    Madam Speaker 2:35 p.m.
    Whether the wording of the first or the second should carry --
    Mr Bagbin 2:35 p.m.
    Exactly.
    Madam Speaker 2:35 p.m.
    I think so and that is why I said when it comes to procedure, after we have put the Question on the second one and if it is rejected by reason of the wording, the first one would then be carried. Is that not it?
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 2:35 p.m.
    Madam
    Speaker, I am lost because -
    Madam Speaker 2:35 p.m.
    Let us hear the Minority Leader so that we carry on the work for the people.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 2:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, when the Hon Minister for Water Resources, Works and Housing was talking, this place was quiet. We were all listening. I cannot just for the life of me understand why people would not want to hear -
    Madam Speaker 2:35 p.m.
    Because it is past two o'clock and they need to go and eat.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 2:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, when the Hon Minister was speaking, it was also past two o'clock.
    Madam Speaker 2:35 p.m.
    Anyway, that is on the lighter note.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 2:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, you had ruled on this first one and the directive that you gave, I clearly remember when you asked Hon Adda to commence, it was the Majority Leader himself who stood up and said, “Is he taking it on board?” And then he said, “yes, so added”, and he said, “no, it was not enough, he should say that he was adding it”. Why was he saying that he should add it? Does it lie in his mouth to insist that he amends his own Motion? No, it is because of the directive that you gave, that it be so amended. That is why he did what he did.
    So for anybody to say that then there should be this other one, I fail to understand. Be that as it may, the person on the floor before all these interjections, was the Hon Kan-Dapaah and I believe he would have the opportunity to go on instead of these interventions. Madam Speaker, they are really derogating from the course of the debate.
    Madam Speaker 2:35 p.m.
    What is the point of order?
    Mr Bagbin 2:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker cannot
    so direct when the proposed amendment is not seconded. If the proposed amendment is to add “by the PURC” and had been seconded, then Madam Speaker could direct -
    Madam Speaker 2:35 p.m.
    It was not an amendment. I went on at length to say that this was not changing anything. It was not an amendment. It was an omission or whatever but if they agreed to go on, I would agree and he said it was implied. That was when I said if it was implied, why do we not put it there and they all agreed. And I think we all agreed that it should be there. But that does not preclude somebody from moving an amendment.
    Once the amendment has been moved,
    I think the point that is being raised now is that the amendment has changed the concept or the intent of this and put in “because of economic situation” and then I am being urged to say that it is the same. I am also saying that if it is the same, why was it brought - But I am prepared to go on and put the Question, it is for the House to decide.
    Yes, Hon Member, you were on your feet, were you? Can you, please, finish with it?
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 2:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, the determination of utility prices in this country has been ceded to the PURC and Hon Asaga was right in emphasising that.
    Madam Speaker, when the Act was passed in this House, it was the clear intention of this House that the PURC should not be subject to the direction or control of any other person. Madam Speaker, this, we all know, the fact that the determination of electricity prices and water prices have been given to the PURC, that is known by everybody in this country, and yet it did not stop any of the political parties from commenting on it in their various manifestos and Madam Speaker -
    Madam Speaker 2:35 p.m.
    Hon Member, you know that apart from Parliament, anybody could comment on PURC's work? Apart from Parliament, in circumstances where there is a pending case -- If we had come here before the case was brought or after the case was brought, we were also entitled --
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 2:35 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, it is but I was not talking about it in that sense. The point that I was making is that, we all know in this country that the law -
    Madam Speaker 2:35 p.m.
    Let us cool tempers. Let us finish this matter, otherwise, I would have to leave the Chair because
    the time is -
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 2:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, because the law in this country is that the determination of utility prices, utility, meaning water and electricity has been ceded to the PURC and there is not doubt about that.
    Madam Speaker, in spite of the knowledge that it is not the Government of the day that determines electricity prices, all political parties find it necessary to make comments about electricity prices in their manifesto. I just want to draw Hon Members' attention to what is contained, for instance, and I will be coming to other parties, in the Manifesto of the NDC.
    It reads, there is this statement that --
    “The long period of darkness under the NPP will become history under the NDC Government because NDC will reduce the cost of electricity production and thus enable lower electricity tariffs to be charged”--
    Madam Speaker 2:45 p.m.
    But you have just said that we all know it is not the Government, so why do we belabour the point? It is the PURC which fixed it.
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 2:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, similarly on water, this was what was said:
    “Access to safe and adequate water to meet basic human needs with emphasis on access by the poor will be the main area of policy focus in urban areas.”
    Madam Speaker, the point I am making is that, there is nothing wrong with the political parties making statements on water and electricity prices even though the determination of the prices has been ceded to PURC. And indeed, as I have
    Madam Speaker 2:45 p.m.
    But does not the Government itself express its concern and urge what we are urging here? So, there is no need to belabour that point. The Government itself, as we have heard from the House, has said that they should do it. They should relook at it. They cannot order them nor can anybody order them but that -- So, if the Government has done that, is it not right?
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 2:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, the point has been made and possibly so by the Hon Moses Asaga that there is the need for the PURC in determining electricity prices to take into account consumer interest and investor interest. This means that there will be occasions where because of the need to protect consumer interest, we will have tariffs that are probably on the high side because there has been this attempt to meet the interest of the investor. There is nothing wrong with that but when that happens, the Government of the day has a duty to intervene in a manner that will restore to the people of the country, the ability to pay. And that is just what we are arguing about --
    Madam Speaker 2:45 p.m.
    And that is what the Government has done.
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 2:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, when the point is made that while the NPP was in government, bigger and higher electricity increase percentages were made. The question you should ask yourself is, how come we came up with

    all those huge increases and yet there was no public outcry like what we are experiencing today? And I will tell you the reason --
    Madam Speaker 2:45 p.m.
    Yes -
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 2:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, the reason is that, when the increases were announced, Government also came up with certain measures to mitigate the effects of those increases on the consumer and that is what we are asking them to do. We have done nothing wrong - we do not see anything wrong with the electricity prices going to the levels where they have, but we are saying to them that Government has a duty to intervene with important measures to make sure that we can afford it. This is the point that they are missing --
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 2:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, it was -
    Madam Speaker 2:45 p.m.
    I now get your point. [Hear! Hear!]
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 2:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, it was the intention of this House, as Hon Adjaho who was very, very prominent in it when we were passing the PURC Act -- Hon Adjaho knows that we were concerned that the PURC should not be subject to the direction of any outside body. We did not want Government to interfere with their work.
    When you say that the PURC should reconsider, an outside body is trying to interfere with the work of the PURC. That should not happen, it is very dangerous. It is, therefore, wrong for the Government to call the PURC and ask them to reconsider. It is illegal, it should never happen.
    Madam Speaker, it is similar to the Government calling the Chief Justice and asking the Chief Justice to go and
    reconsider the decision in a particular case. It is wrong. Hon Asaga knows that there are many, many policies and programmes that can be introduced by Government to mitigate the effect. That is what we are asking for and it is not to be encouraged by this House, that we ask somebody to interfere with the work of the PURC.
    On the basis of this, I want to propose an amendment to the effect that “this Honourable House expresses concern on the recently announced increased electricity and water tariffs and call for its immediate reconsideration by Government”.
    Madam Speaker, I beg to move.
    Madam Speaker 2:45 p.m.
    Well, I do not know whether you need a determination to accept or not, because I had ruled that I am allowing this because of the persons sued and the reliefs they were seeking. But this one, you are saying Government should go in and you yourself have said that the law says nobody should go. Let me clarify it.
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 2:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, I have argued that Government should not interfere in the pricing process by the PURC but beyond that there are other measures, other interventions that Government can introduce just as we did when we were in power; like subsidies, like cross subsidization --
    Madam Speaker 2:45 p.m.
    Yes, I got that. I thought that was it?
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 2:45 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, you got that point. I am not asking Government to interfere in the process, that will be illegal. The motion as it stands now, is illegal. You cannot interfere in the work of the PURC but Government has other measures that they can undertake outside of the process, and
    we call upon Government to do that. It is on that basis that we are asking for an amendment motion which I have already proposed. An amendment motion which calls for the immediate reconsideration by Government --
    Madam Speaker 2:45 p.m.
    Reconsideration, is it Government which reconsiders it? The power to make this, was it not with the PURC? And is it not the PURC that should reconsider it? I think if you say that, I would think you are giving Government powers which it does not possess. But you did make some suggestions that, that is how you managed it -- subsidies, and this is all in line of reconsideration, is it not? But I do not know, you could write it and bring it, we put the first one, and we put the second amendment.
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 2:55 p.m.
    Madam Speaker -
    Madam Speaker 2:55 p.m.
    But then I would have to rise; it is 3 o'clock. The First Deputy Speaker would take over.
    Mr Joe Ghartey 2:55 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, can I second the motion?
    Madam Speaker 2:55 p.m.
    Let the First Deputy Speaker come in, then you can second the motion. I have to - [Interruption.] I thought this is so long-standing since June, but we have to follow the rules. Yes?
    Mr Ghartey 2:55 p.m.
    Madam Speaker, while you get up I want to -
    Madam Speaker 2:55 p.m.
    Thank you for your forbearance.
    Mr Ghartey 2:55 p.m.
    Thank you, Madam Speaker. I will remain on my feet - [Interruptions.]

    2.55 p.m. -- [MR FIRST DEPUTY SPEAKER
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 2:55 p.m.
    Hon Members, I thought Hon Kan-Dapaah was on the floor. Have you finished with your submission? -- Oh, very well.
    Mr Ghartey 2:55 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, Hon Kan- Dapaah moved the Motion, I got up to second it; Madam Speaker recognized me on the floor to second it and then she got up. So if you have come -
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 2:55 p.m.
    What is the -
    Mr Ghartey 2:55 p.m.
    The Motion he moved; the amendment -
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 2:55 p.m.
    Yes, I want a copy of the Motion -
    Mr Ghartey 2:55 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, let me get the -
    “That th is House expresses concern on the recently announced increases in electricity and water tariffs and calls for the immediate reconsideration by Government”.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 2:55 p.m.
    Hon Member, if you look at the PURC Law, putting “Government” there is totally inadmissible. It is the responsibility of the Chair to admit Motions and adding “Government” to that Motion based on the law establishing it, is completely inadmissible. Because it, is not the Government that fixed the tariffs, so adding Government is inadmissible. From what I have listened to, a reconsideration by Government is contrary to the law which we ourselves have passed in this House. So that amendment is inadmissible.
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 2:55 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think if I re-state my case, you would probably have a better understanding of where we are coming from --
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 2:55 p.m.
    Hon

    Member, at the end of the day, I would be putting the Question on the Motion; I would not be putting it on your case, but on your Motion.
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 2:55 p.m.
    No, no.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 2:55 p.m.
    The Vote would be taken on the Motion as amended. But so long as you add “reconsideration by the Government”, that is inadmissible.
    Mr K. T. Hammond 2:55 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, can we kindly get this clarification, so you know what my Hon Colleague, Kan-Dapaah is saying?. Mr Speaker, there is a very clear distinction between intervention as - [Uproar] - Wait! Wait! “Intervention” as the Order Paper has suggested and then the illegality that Mr Speaker is talking about.
    Everybody knows what the law is and that the Government cannot intervene in the setting up of tariffs by PURC but that is not what - From all that Hon Kan- Dapaah has said; that is not the point. The Government has a role in making sure that the tariffs that are set are placed in a certain category that individuals feel comfortable in paying. That is what the Hon Member is seeking to amend this Motion to reflect. It is not in any attempt to dabble in what PURC is supposed to do.
    Mr Speaker, you will recall that there have been instances in this country where other Governments had publicly come out to say that even though the PURC had said this, they were going to do this by way of putting some money - [Interruption] - We did it in 2006. So Mr Speaker, I think the amended motion as suggested by Hon Kan-Dapaah is the right thing to do and Mr Speaker should accord him that. [Hear! Hear!]
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 2:55 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, you will recall that when I was making my
    intervention, I got your honourable name inside. The point I was making was that when the Bill was being considered in this House, it was our intention that nobody should interfere with the process of tariff setting by the PURC. No outside body should be able to do that. And the increases, having been determined by the PURC, we have to accept. But they must be accompanied by certain interventions by Government to mitigate the effect. Mr Speaker, to ask PURC to reconsider, is illegal; it is wrong. So the amendment motion that I am seeking, is --
    “That this Honourable House expresses concern on the recently announced increased electricity and water tariffs and calls for immediate intervention by Government.”
    That is all. [Interruptions] - Yes -- For “immediate intervention by Government” -- [Interruption] - intervention.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 2:55 p.m.
    Hon Kan-Dapaah, intervention can also mean reducing or reconsidering it. Hon Member, “intervention” - the amendment to the Motion is not clear. The “intervention” - [Interruption] - very good. “Intervention” means so many things -- in the law that we passed; “intervention” means so many things -- so that “intervention” is still inadmissible.
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 2:55 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, , in that case -
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 2:55 p.m.
    Hon Kan- Dapaah, I know you to be a very good Parliamentarian. Why are you struggling with moving an amendment to a Motion? Why are you struggling today?
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 2:55 p.m.
    I want to thank you, Mr Speaker, for that intervention and I think you have a very good point. I thank you for that. In view of that, Mr Speaker, can I now amend it to read:
    “That this Honourable House expresses concern on the recently announced increased electricity and water tariffs and calls for immediate mitigating intervention by Government”?
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 2:55 p.m.
    Yes, Hon Fuseini?
    Mr Inusah A. B. Fuseini 2:55 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I am opposing the amendment motion; I am opposing it --
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 2:55 p.m.
    Hon Member, you cannot oppose the motion, it has not even been seconded. So Hon Member -
    Mr Fuseini 2:55 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I have some information; point of information.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 2:55 p.m.
    Let them -
    Mr Fuseini 2:55 p.m.
    In view of what Hon Kan-Dapaah has said, it is important for this House to know what prevails at PURC and what Government is doing about it. It is very important.
    Mr Speaker, it is a point of information. It is very, very important. He has said that Government should do something about the PURC. That is the point I am raising.
    Dr A.A. Osei 3:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, just a point
    of information.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:05 p.m.
    Hon
    Member, I have not given you the floor. I want to get the terms of the amendment motion on paper, even if it is handwritten, if you can write it down for me. I want to get it so I know exactly what to put there.

    Hon Members, I will let you second the

    motion but I thought Madam Speaker had
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 3:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I have
    not withdrawn the amendment motion.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:05 p.m.
    Hon Joe
    Ghartey, please, second the motion.
    Mr Ghartey 3:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, the Hon
    Member who moved the motion is on the floor of Parliament, then other Hon Members on the floor are saying he has withdrawn it, how can he withdraw it?
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:05 p.m.
    Hon Joe
    Ghartey, please, address the Chair.
    Mr Joe Ghartey (NPP Esikadu/ Ketan) 3:05 p.m.
    : Mr Speaker, I beg to second the motion moved by the Hon Albert Kan- Dapaah and in seconding the motion, I want to put on record that the --
    All other Motions have been seconded and if Hon Fuseini was paying attention rather than laughing, he would have known that there was only one Motion
    on the floor.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:05 p.m.
    The amendment proposed is that we should delete the words, “its immediate reconsideration” and insert “mitigating intervention by Government”.
    Mr Ghartey 3:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, that is the
    motion I am seconding and in seconding the motion, I want to state emphatically that indeed, both sides of the House are in total agreement that the PURC is an independent body that sets the price of tariffs. If the PURC has set the price of tariffs, then the only body, the only person, the only legally constituted body which can intervene, is the manager of the economy and we are calling on Government to bring into effect, mitigating circumstances to provide subsidies so that the ordinary people of Ghana, the barber in Esikadu, the hairdresser in Kibi, will be able to continue to do their business -- the cocoa farmer in Suhum, the nika nika boy in Wa Central --
    Mr Speaker, on that note, I beg to second the Motion.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:05 p.m.
    Hon Members, one from here, one last -
    Mr Ghartey 3:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, with respect,
    I forgot to mention Wassa Akropong.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:05 p.m.
    Hon
    Members, I have to be very, very fair to both sides of the House. I have allowed
    -- 3:05 p.m.

    Dr A. A. Osei 3:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, with

    respect, when Madam Speaker left -
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:05 p.m.
    Hon
    Members, one Hon Member -- two minutes, then I will put the Question.
    Dr A. A. Osei 3:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I want to remind us of what Madam Speaker said when she was leaving, that after Hon Kan-Dapaah, the Leadership were going to be the last ones. There would be no other Hon Member.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:05 p.m.
    Hon
    Member, if you use that same argument, then why did Hon Joe Ghartey second the motion?
    Dr A. A. Osei 3:05 p.m.
    That is what she said.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:05 p.m.
    Hon
    Members, very well. Are the Leaders ready to speak? [Pause.] Hon Minority Leader, I thought you said you were not going to speak? You will speak?
    Hon Members, let me have an idea -- Very well.
    Hon Minister for Communications, then we come to the Hon Minority Leader.
    rose
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:05 p.m.
    Hon
    Majority Leader, if you speak, in view of the new amendment -
    Mr Avoka 3:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I am conceding my place to Hon Haruna Iddrisu. If that is the case, the Hon Minority Leader can speak now, then I will wind up through Hon Haruna Iddrisu.
    There are two Motions.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:05 p.m.
    Hon
    Members, we now have three motions, the original Motion and the two amendment motions. So, Hon Minority Leader, are you ready?
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker,
    since you have indicated that there are three Motions and since you recognise that we should have winding up on the Motions and since you have recognised further that two of the Motions are from this side of the House, it would amount to great injustice if you say that I should speak and the Hon Majority Leader winds up.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:05 p.m.
    Hon Minority Leader, you know the standard practice is that the Hon Minority Leader speaks and then the Hon Majority Leader speaks and that brings us to our end. When I call, I will call the Hon Majority Leader and if the Hon Majority Leader says he will yield to that person, it is between the Hon Majority Leader and that Hon Member. But as of now, he says the Hon Minority Leader will speak and then I will call the Hon Majority Leader.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:05 p.m.
    Mr
    Speaker, initially, I was going to wind up for and on behalf of the Hon Members who moved the Motion.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:05 p.m.
    The two?
    Would you wind up for the two Motions, the original and the -
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:15 p.m.
    The Original. Mr Speaker, I think when it comes to such things, the House is not divided into Majority and Minority. We have Motions that have been filed. It lies within the competence of the Hon Members who moved the Motion to wind up. It is not reduced to Majority and Minority. That is why I think this directive is not all that proper.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:15 p.m.
    Hon
    Minority Leader, you know that Madam Speaker has virtually closed the debate, so I am calling on the Leaders to speak and then we put the Question.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:15 p.m.
    Mr

    Speaker, may I with respect yield my slot to Hon K. T. Hammond.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:15 p.m.
    You have
    yielded to him? Very well. Hon K. T. Hammond, the Hon Minority Leader has yielded to you.
    Mr Kobina Tahir Hammond (NPP - Adansi Asokwa) 3:15 p.m.
    Thank you very much Mr Speaker and I thank my Leader very much for yielding his situation to me to be able to contribute to the various Motions as re-amended on the floor of the House -- [Interruption]
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:15 p.m.
    I heard
    you well and you did not use the word “situations”. Hon K. T. Hammond, two minutes and then I put the Question.
    Mr K. T. Hammond 3:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker,
    I cannot speak to this topic for just two minutes, please --
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:15 p.m.
    Hon Member, two minutes for both, then I put the Question.
    Mr K. T. Hammond 3:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, let
    us get certain things in perspective before those listening to us would make sense of what is going on today. Mr Speaker, the Motion was brought to this floor primarily because -
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:15 p.m.
    Hon K.
    T. Hammond, you have the floor.
    Mr K. T. Hammond 3:15 p.m.
    I have been
    speaking. Mr Speaker, those on the other side of the House, in seeking to win the mandate of the people of Ghana to rule this country, made a series of promises
    Mr Bagbin 3:15 p.m.
    On a point of order. Mr Speaker, I heard my Hon Colleague, Mr K. T. Hammond say “those on the other side”. I think we are Hon Colleagues and if he is referring to us, he should do that in a parliamentary language; he cannot say “those on the other side”.
    Mr Hammond 3:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, if I
    omitted the “Hon Members on the other side” I beg for the forgiveness of the House. Because you will appreciate that I am a stickler for the rules of this House and the other day I deprecated the Hon Member out there -- [Interruptions.] Mr Speaker, so if I did say that, I beg your pardon.
    Mr Speaker, the Hon Members on the other side, as I indicated, in seeking the mandate, made those promises. Some of the promises were to reduce the prices of petroleum drastically; to make sure that utility prices came down drastically.
    Mr Speaker, what are we seeing? One thousand or so per cent increase in road tolls.
    Mr Speaker, about 43 or so percentage increase in the petroleum prices. And to the credit of the Judiciary, Mr Speaker, I make this announcement to those who do not know; the courts have ruled about the illegality of the petroleum prices that were hiked on the people of this country. The court has now ruled that it is illegal and they could not have done that and so they should rescind the decision immediately.
    Mr Speaker, there was also a promise in the Manifesto that utility prices were going to come down. This is what I have found so disappointing about Hon Members on that side, the Government of that side.
    Alhaji Muntaka 3:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I
    believe that my Hon Colleague is a senior Member of this House and he knows the rules of this House very well. What we are debating is completely different from what he is talking about.
    We have all agreed that there are laws governing the issue of tariffs; meanwhile, he is talking about petroleum, he is talking about road tolls. Mr Speaker, if we all have to go into these things, we will derail the sense of the debate.
    Mr Speaker, I would want to remind him that he was a Minister of State during the last Administration and when PURC was fulfilling its mandate of increasing tariffs, their Government absorbed the tariff and it left an outstanding amount of GH¢30 million --
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:15 p.m.
    Hon Member, continue; but we are not talking about petroleum and road tolls. That is on irrelevance.
    Mr Hammond 3:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I was

    Accordingly, the Government of the NPP decided to absorb it; that is the point we have been making. That is the point Hon Kan-Dapaah has been striving to make today. He is seeking the intervention by this Government; not interference with the functions of the PURC but intervention by this Government, as we did, to make sure that prices come down.

    Mr Speaker, again, let us get something

    into proper perspective. It seems to me - and I make this submission without the slightest reservation. It seems to me that the various utility companies were actualite with the state on the ground when they met with the PURC to tell them the state of affairs before which PURC arrived at their whopping 89 per cent increase.

    The reason is this -- Mr Speaker, at the time when we were leaving Government and the status quo was the pricing before this current Government increase came in. This was the situation. In arriving at the consumer pricing, certain matters are taken into account. One is the generation mix, and two is the price of petroleum.
    Mr Asaga 3:15 p.m.
    No, he is lying -
    [Interruptions.] Yes, he is lying.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:15 p.m.
    Yes, Hon
    Deputy Minister for Energy?
    Mr Emmanuel Armah Kofi Buah 3:15 p.m.
    On a point of order. Mr Speaker, I think my senior Colleague here is misleading the House. Mr Speaker, I listened to the debate and when my senior Colleague, Hon Kan-Dapaah stood up to speak, he made it very clear that the issues we are discussing are very, very serious. I remember this House invited the Ministry of Energy about the utility situation. Mr Speaker, I was here and the reason we are discussing this issue is because we all agree that the utility -
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:15 p.m.
    Hon
    Deputy Minister, you stood up to a point of order, so let us look at the -
    Mr Buah 3:25 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, the point of
    order is very clear, that we are discussing the PURC and the impact of the tariffs increase on the people of Ghana, and I expect my Hon Colleague to focus on that point. I think he is veering very far away from this point and he is misleading the House.
    The important point here, Mr Speaker, is that, we all agree that this country needs to address the issue of tariffs, that the tariffs that the utilities currently get are not adequate enough to really meet the full cost recovery. But we also agree that the impact of the current increase must be mitigated and that is why the Ministry of Energy and the Government -
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:25 p.m.
    Hon
    Deputy Minister, you have made the point that he should address relevancy. That is finished. So, Hon K. T. Hammond, all the three Motions are very clear; they are all talking about tariffs in terms of electricity and water. So address yourself only to those matters. We are not talking about petroleum prices and all those things; we have to make progress. We cannot spend the whole day on this matter; we cannot spend the whole day on this matter alone. It is not fair.
    Mr Hammond 3:25 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, when
    the Hon Deputy Minister said that he thought we were serious, I found that pretty offensive because I thought the matters we are discussing here are pretty serious for him to suggest that some of us were not being serious.
    In any event, Mr Speaker, he may not have been listening to what I was saying. I was talking about the energy mix, the mix which comes out with the electricity, out of
    which the pricing is done and that is done by basis of generation from hydro from Akosombo, and then thermal at Tema and Aboadze. That is what I am talking about.

    Mr Speaker, the point I am making is this, that at the time the first utility arrangement was put in place, the energy mix was 30 per cent hydro, 70 per cent thermal and there is a reason for that. The price of thermal generation was very expensive at that time. Mr Speaker, because of that mix, at the time that the last product announcement was made, the production cost was 22 cents.

    Mr Speaker, I can tell you now that the production cost in total is about 13 cents. Mr Speaker, at our time and at the production cost of 22 cents, we were selling at the price that prevailed until the recent announcement. What is the urgent justification, now that all these prices have gone down?

    Mr Speaker, let me tell you something that the House may also not have known. Former President John A. Kufuor's Administration, when we came into power -
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:25 p.m.
    Hon
    K. T. Hammond, you are veering away. I listened to Hon Kan-Dapaah when he was moving the Motion; you are veering away. You are a very Senior Member of the House, so let us limit ourselves to electricity and water tariffs -- on the recent increase. The Motion is about the recent increase, which has been announced by the PURC.
    Mr Hammond 3:25 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, so I
    was making the point --The prices, even those which have just been announced by

    the current PURC, I am saying they are predicated on some basis -
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:25 p.m.
    Hon
    Member, we have passed that stage. You are just the last person to speak for your side. The Hon Minority Leader was speaking; he yielded to you. Now, you are laying a new foundation; you are now moving the motion anew and the rule of repetition or all those things are there. Kindly wind up. Now, you are going back to lay a new foundation? Kindly wind up, limit yourself, be focused and then we put th Question and conclude this debate.
    Mr Hammond 3:25 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I am obliged to listen to your ruling but I thought I should let the whole world know that the foundation for arriving at the tariffs as we now have them, may have come about because somebody did not tell the truth. Because the figures are there -
    Mr Asaga 3:25 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, on a point
    of order. Mr Speaker, I think that when we get up to speak, we should speak with facts and we should also know that we were in government but we are no longer in government. He has been out of government for almost one and a half years, so he has not got the facts. He is misleading --
    First of all, on the generation mix, it is not 30/70 as he said The report that is being generated and given by the VRA is about 45 per cent thermal and 55 per
    cent hydro.
    Secondly, the cost of generation today by the utilities is G31 per kilowatt hour. So that generation is as a result of the new mix which he does not know about.
    Thirdly, Mr Speaker, the Government
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:25 p.m.
    Hon
    Moses Asaga, please, the last sentence that you made is out of order.
    Hon K. T. Hammond, you have the floor.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:25 p.m.
    Mr
    Speaker, Parliament is a serious House which has no room for wild allegations. May I call on the Hon Member for Nabdam to provide concrete evidence of what he has said; otherwise, he must withdraw it.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:25 p.m.
    Hon
    Member, I thought I had ruled him out of order? I have ruled him out of order; I have completely ruled him out of order.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:25 p.m.
    Mr
    Speaker, if that is taken, then he must withdraw the statement Because sitting down, I heard him shout “it is true!” “it is true!” Mr Speaker, so call on him accordingly to withdraw tje statement.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:25 p.m.
    Hon
    Asaga, if you cannot substantiate that statement, you have to withdraw it for now.
    Mr Asaga 3:25 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, the first question is, did he resign as Chairman or not? [Interruptions.] Yes. So let us start with that. I made two statements.
    [Interruptions.] Mr Speaker, the sentence was that the Chairman resigned because government was interfering --The first question is, did he resign or not? [Interruptions.]
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:25 p.m.
    Hon Moses Asaga, please, withdraw the statement. Let us make progress.
    Mr Asaga 3:25 p.m.
    I will not withdraw the
    statement, Mr Speaker.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:25 p.m.
    Hon
    Moses Asaga, Member of Parliament for Nabdam, if you have said that the man resigned, we all know that he has resigned; it is a statement of fact. But you also went on to say it was because of the disrespect for the PURC. We all heard it; we should not waste time on some of these things, please. If you can withdraw that statement -
    Mr Asaga 3:25 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, for the sake
    that you are in the Chair, I withdraw the statement.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:25 p.m.
    Hon K.
    T. Hammond, yes, he has withdrawn the statement. Hon Minority Leader, he has withdrawn it.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:35 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, with respect to your Chair, we will not take this conditional withdrawal. The Hon Member is a senior Member of this House and I believe that he knows the rules of this House. One cannot just get up and make any convoluted - Please, he should not do that; he should do what is right. I insist that he does what is right.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:35 p.m.
    Hon
    Minority Leader, you are right. But we also use those words as an escape route at times on the floor. But you are absolutely right. He has withdrawn it.
    Hon K . T. Hammond - he has withdrawn it.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:35 p.m.
    Mr
    Speaker, a Member uses words that are not acceptable in this House, he is called to withdraw them. Mr Speaker, you yourself, even before he did it, you ruled him out of order. Now, you call on him to withdraw and he tells you that it is because you are in the Chair. Mr Speaker, what kind of language is that? And you think it should be entertained in this House? You think that language should be entertained in this House?
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:35 p.m.
    Hon Minority Leader, you are perfectly right and I did say that earlier . But I know that some of us, at times, we say that as an escape route. You know he has actually withdrawn the statement but he is only using it as an excuse or as a cover. The man has withdrawn it, the man has completely withdrawn what he has said, and I have ruled him out because that is of no moment. I have ruled him out.
    Hon K. T. Hammond, let me hear the
    last statement from you because I want to put the Question. Whatever has to be said has been said. There is nothing new to be said on this floor. I want to put the Question, so your last sentence.
    Mr Hammond 3:35 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, my
    brother Moses Asaga, I do not normally ignore him when he makes points of order but on this occasion, I will ignore him, because he does not know why Mr Kwame Mpiani resigned and I am not going to get involved in that.
    Mr Speaker, my last statement is that I want the good people of Ghana to know that they have been conned - [Interruptions.] Because this is a Government which claimed that it was interested in the social well-being of the
    Mr Avoka 3:35 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, with the
    greatest respect, we want the debate to flow. But for him to say that he wants Ghanaians to know that they have been conned, I think, is unparliamentary. It is very, very unparliamentary. He should withdraw that word. Who has conned them?
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:35 p.m.
    Hon K. T. Hammond, the word “conned”, you are saying that fraud -- It is tantamount to the use of the word “fraud”, so it is unparliamentary. Withdraw - it is unparliamentary; withdraw it.
    Mr Hammond 3:35 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I
    substitute it with “have been actualitized.” Is that better? The good people of Ghana have been actualitized with uneconomic truths. Mr Speaker, that is the point I make. The good people of Ghana, come 2012, will register their singular disapproval at what this Government has done to them - [Interruptions.] When they promised them that they will reduce everything only to see that they have rather drastically increased everything -- [Interruption.]
    Mr Avoka 3:35 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, with the
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:35 p.m.
    He has
    withdrawn it.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:35 p.m.
    Hon Minister for Communications, very, very brief -- [Pause.] Did he speak? Hon Minister, have you contributed to the debate?
    Mr Haruna Iddrisu 3:35 p.m.
    No, Mr Speaker,
    I have not - [Interruptions.] No. No. I have not.
    Some Hon Members 3:35 p.m.
    Yesterday.
    Mr Haruna Iddrisu 3:35 p.m.
    No, I have not.
    Mr Speaker, yesterday -- [Interruptions] - Mr Speaker, yesterday, there was a very brilliant legal position espoused by the Hon Papa Owusu-Ankomah and I only came on a point of order to draw his attention to the second leg of the motion which was so moved by their side. I have not had the opportunity to participate in this debate.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:35 p.m.
    Hon
    Members, he has not spoken. He had made some interventions but he has not spoken.
    rose
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:35 p.m.
    Hon
    Majority Leader?
    Mr Avoka 3:35 p.m.
    I have yielded my position
    to him, Mr Speaker.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:35 p.m.
    Hon
    Member, he has yielded his position to you.
    An Hon Member 3:35 p.m.
    Ei!
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:35 p.m.
    Is it your
    Mr Haruna Iddrisu 3:35 p.m.
    Mr Speaker,
    thank you very much -
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:35 p.m.
    Very, very
    brief; I want to put the Question.
    Minister for Communications (Mr
    Haruna Iddrisu)(MP): Mr Speaker, thank you very much for the opportunity to contribute to the Motion that this Honourable House calls on the PURC to reconsider the recent increases in electricity and water tariffs in view of their impact on the general economic situation in the country, ably moved by the Minister for Roads and Highways (Mr Joe K. Gidisu) and seconded by the Minister for Local Government and Rural Development (Mr Joseph Y. Chireh).
    In doing so, Mr Speaker, I disassociate myself strongly from the otiose Motion, which was recently moved by the Hon Albert Kan-Dapaah and seconded by the Hon Joe Ghartey.
    Mr Joe Ghartey 3:35 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I regret
    that -- [Interruptions] -- Mr Speaker, my Hon Friend opposite described the Motion that was moved by Hon Kan- Dapaah and seconded by my goodself as “otiose”, which means superfluous -
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:35 p.m.
    To what?
    Mr Ghartey 3:35 p.m.
    Serving no practical purpose. Mr Speaker, there is no greater insult that a Member of Parliament can render unto another Member of Parliament that he is in this House for no purpose -- [Laughter.] Mr Speaker, especially when as Members of Parliament we have people from outside Parliament who are constantly attacking us. What has happened today is interesting because there has been heckling on both sides of the House. But Mr Speaker, we must be careful -- [Interruptions] - It is on a point of order. What he said, I am asking him to withdraw it. And I am not simply asking him to withdraw it, it is abusive. I am giving him the reasons he should withdraw it. I am urging him to withdraw it.
    Mr Speaker, it is totally abusive; it is totally -- That a Member of Parliament should refer to a senior Member of Parliament - [Interruptions] - a person such as Hon Kan-Dapaah who moved the motion - a Member of Parliament should refer to his senior at the Bar, my goodself, that what we did was superfluous, unnecessary, self-serving, while all we are doing here, Mr Speaker, is representing the good people of Ghana.
    All we are doing here by this Motion is saying that Government should intervene. He may disagree with us and Mr Speaker, I will respect his right to disagree with us. I will defend your right to disagree with us, but I will attack anything you do to insult us, or to insult the integrity of Parliament and insult and undermine the entire democratic dispensation that we live in.
    Mr Speaker, my Friend opposite, Hon
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:45 p.m.
    Hon Joe Ghartey, why? Is your point of order against Hon Moses Asaga or against the
    Hon Minister?
    Mr Ghartey 3:45 p.m.
    As I was flowing in one
    point of order, I heard Hon Moses Asaga coming under Order 100. We have rules in this House and we have suggested out there that 100 is left hand.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:45 p.m.
    Hon
    Minister for Communications, what do you say?
    Mr H. Iddrisu 3:45 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, thank you
    very much. Hon Joe Ghartey knows that it is not in my character to be insulting and that I would not do and I will never do. And Mr Speaker, Hon Joe Ghartey knows that I do hold, not just the person of Hon Kan-Dapaah but his opinion, with extreme respect and high esteem.
    But I disagree with him because if he
    had listened to me, I had just taken off, it was to point out that this important amendment Motion moved and seconded by him only seeks to ouster, to throw away his original Motion that had good intentions for this House, expressing legitimate concerns.
    Therefore, my reference to its practical purposes is not to undermine the movers of the Motion but to say that they were better off under the original Motion than this amended Motion. That is precisely my argument.
    rose
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:45 p.m.
    Hon
    Minister, his objection is being taken to the use of a particular word.
    Mr H. Iddrisu 3:45 p.m.
    If he found that word
    offensive, I withdraw it, Mr Speaker.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:45 p.m.
    Very well,
    continue.
    Mr H. Iddrisu 3:45 p.m.
    But Mr Speaker, I was also demonstrating that Government remains very sensitive. Indeed, we made a pledge, like all other governments to improve the quality of life of the Ghanaian and to improve upon the performance of State institutions including the Electricity Company of Ghana (ECG), Volta River Authority (VRA) and Ghana Water Company Limited (GWCL).
    Mr Speaker, my first major point is for this House, in undertaking this important deliberative function, -- utility tariffs have been increased, the Ghanaian public is concerned, and industry is concerned because of its related consequence on cost of living and on cost of doing business, appropriately so.
    But Mr Speaker, we should go beyond mere partisanship to appreciate the challenges of the utility companies to which the able Hon Ranking Member on Energy ceded when he said that ultimately we should be driving towards full cost recovery.
    Mr Speaker, indeed, the utility companies were requesting for an increase of 184 per cent. Mr Speaker, Government did not grant that. Government granted 89 per cent on the average and for non- residential users 42 per cent, that should be appreciated.
    Mr Speaker, I have made reference
    to partisan politics because we should be guided by the sustainability of our utilities. I have in my hand here, Press Release - Public Utilities and Regulatory Commission, May 2001 - and Mr Speaker, I want to -
    Mr Dery 3:45 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I just want a point of elucidation. I thought I heard my Brother on the other side of the House say that “government granted” - he said
    Mr Dery 3:45 p.m.


    ‘government granted'. I want to know if that is what I heard.
    Mr H. Iddrisu 3:45 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, if I said “government”, that obviously would have been a slip. I am referring to a document from the PURC - the institution clothed with the mandate to determine these tariffs. And Mr Speaker, I am referring to May 2001, the very factors which may have informed this day's decision to which decision this House is expressing legitimate concern. Mr Speaker, it reads:
    “The Public Utilities and Regulatory Commission has approved an average tariff increase of 103 per cent for electricity effective 2001 as against average increase of 310 per cent requested by the utilities. For lifeline domestic consumers, the increase is 95 per cent.”
    But Mr Speaker, the significance is in the preceding paragraph. Mr Speaker, it states, and with your permission, I read:
    “PURC considers this limited increase justifiable in the light of several adverse factors affecting the utilities, in particular the inability of the utilities to meet their reasonable production cost and the adverse effect of the micro- economic environment on the utilities operations experienced last year”
    -- 3:45 p.m.

    Mr Adda 3:45 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, indeed, my Hon Colleague is misleading this House. He is giving you a figure of 184 per cent as the request that was made by the PURC, whereas the Hon Chairman of the Committee gave a figure of 154 per cent. The conflict of these two figures is
    evidence that they do not have the right figures and also goes to support the notion that we raised earlier that the Energy Committee did not approve what it was that the PURC asked for,that Hon Moses Asaga referred to earlier. The two are misleading this House and I want that to be on record, Mr Speaker.
    Mr H. Iddrisu 3:45 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, appropriately, the figure is 154 per cent - that was the request. [Interruptions.] And the PURC could not grant that request because it also anticipated that it will have, as appropriately pointed out in the amended Motion, an impact on users.
    But Mr Speaker, it is important that
    we categorise the users of electricity. We have industrial users, we have small scale miners, we have consumers, we have lifeline users.
    Mr Speaker, I am happy that at least,
    they agreed that for the period from June to December, the requirement of the utilities in terms of what they require to function effectively is in the region of GH¢800 million. This is what they will require just between June and December.
    Mr Speaker, even with this tariff adjustment -
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:45 p.m.
    Hon
    Minister, try and wind up and let us put the Question.
    rose
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:45 p.m.
    Why, is
    there any point of order?
    Some Hon Members 3:45 p.m.
    Yes.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:45 p.m.
    Hon Kan-
    Dapaah?
    Mr Kan-Dapaah 3:45 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, on a
    point of relevance.
    Mr Speaker, Hon Ennin, in moving the Motion -- and if he had listened to my intervention, we have said that we have no problem with the figures as presented by the PURC. Our worry is the lack of appropriate intervention from Government to mitigate it. I think the Hon Minister should be addressing that instead of talking about why it became necessary to increase it.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:45 p.m.
    Hon
    Minister, continue.
    Mr H. Iddrisu 3:45 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I just
    referenced that, for the period June to December, their requirement is GH¢802 million. Income to be derived from this tariff increase, to which we legitimately are concerned about its impact on consumers whether industrial or lifeline users, will yield GH¢753 million providing for a shortfall of GH¢48 million. Mr Speaker, for all intents and purposes, that is a subsidy to be borne by the Government of Ghana.
    Additionally, there is GH¢22 million,
    based on the old tariffs, subsidy to the ECG for consumers using zero to 150 units, which is the large users, apart from those whose use are for industrial purposes and some GH¢22 million - So, overall, government subsidy is in the region of GH¢74 million. That is a mitigating measure by the Government of Ghana.
    But accordingly, respecting the PURC
    and its institutional mandate, the President has directed that the PURC, in exercising its own remit, will take all the concerns being raised including that of this august House in ensuring that they arrive at a figure which is much more acceptable and which will assure the institution of some sustainability while getting some relief for the consumers.
    I thank you, Mr Speaker, for the opportunity.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:55 p.m.
    Hon Members, that brings us to the end of the debate.
    Hon Members, I refer you to Standing Order 113 (1). I would call for a head count instead of Voice Vote so that you do not go through other processes, et cetera.
    Hon Members, I have discretion there.
    Under the practice, I would put the Hon Kan-Dapaah's amendment Motion first. If it is carried, that ends the matter. If it is not carried, I would move to Hon Joe Gidisu's Motion. If it is carried, that ends the matter; if it is not carried, we move to the original Motion standing in the name of Hon Ennin and others.
    So Hon Members, what Hon Kan- Dapaah's Motion tends to do, is to delete the word “is” in the second line and the word “consideration” in the third line and substitute them with “mitigating intervention by Government.” So that the Question now would be:
    “That this Honourable House expresses concern on the recently announced increased electricity and water tariffs and calls for immediate mitigating intervention by Government.”
    Question put and the House was counted:
    AYES -- 87
    NOES -- 94
    Motion negatived.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:55 p.m.
    Mr
    Speaker, we insist that we close the doors immediately and count again. [Interruptions.] We disagree with this number. Mr Speaker, let us close the doors immediately and count. Mr Speaker, we will close the doors immediately and do a division in this House and nobody enters
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 3:55 p.m.
    Order! Order! Hon Members, you know that the figures brought to me by those who did the counting -- you can read, that is what I have pronounced on. So Hon Members, accordingly, Hon Kan- Dapaah's amendment Motion is lost.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 4:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I have called as per Order 114 for a division immediately. These numbers that you have announced, we challenge them. Mr Speaker, we call for a division immediately and the door should be closed and we clear the galleries up there under Order 114. Mr Speaker, immediately.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 4:05 p.m.
    Hon

    Hon Members, I have pronounced on

    the results given to me by the Table Office. I will now move to the second amendment Motion.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 4:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I insist that what you have done is wrong; this amounts to rigging in this House
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 4:05 p.m.
    Hon
    Minority Leader, I called for a head count right from the beginning. I did not call for a Voice Vote. If at that time you had called for a division, that would have been different.
    Hon Member, I did not pronounce on
    a Voice Vote and therefore, you have nothing to challenge.
    Hon Members --
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 4:05 p.m.
    Mr
    Speaker, as you are aware, before you call for a count, one may call for -
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 4:05 p.m.
    Hon
    Members, your Leader is on the floor; you do not want to listen to your Leader? Your Leader is on the floor.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 4:05 p.m.
    Mr
    Speaker, before you call for a count, you are aware that you create the enabling space for a division or a head count. I do not want to believe that you wanted to foreclose this chapter and that is why you did what you did by calling immediately for a head count.
    Mr Speaker, I want to put it on record that the number of the Majority at the time you were counting was 86. Mr Speaker, it was 86 and this amounts to rigging in this House. If you insist as I said, we will leave it to you and your conscience.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 4:05 p.m.
    Hon
    Majority Leader, I want to go to the second Motion.
    Mr Fuseini 4:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, advise the
    Minority Leader. He cannot be impugning the integrity of this Parliament by his pronouncements. If the Hon Minority Leader has reasons to believe that at the time of the counting, the Majority side here was 86, he needs to demonstrate it
    by evidence. But to say it at this time, is impugning the integrity of this House; he cannot do that. He cannot impugn the integrity of this House -- of the House, it is unacceptable to do that. Why does he does do that?
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 4:05 p.m.
    Hon
    Members, we now move to Hon Joe Gidisu's Motion.
    Question put and House was counted:
    AYES -- 95
    NOES -- 89
    Resolved:
    That this Honourable House calls on the PURC to reconsider the recent increases in electricity and water tariffs in view of their impact on the general economic situation in the country.
    The Clerks” Office should communicate
    this position to the PURC accordingly.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 4:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker,
    just to observe that the first count that we took, the claim was that the number was 94. There were at least, three people who entered from the other side. My Hon Colleague who is sitting there -- and he knows. The other one in white smock, he knows that he moved in. Then we had the Deputy Minister. Then we have my Hon Colleague from the North. The three of them moved in. So 94 plus 3 is 95? That is the arithmetic of Parliament.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 4:15 p.m.
    Hon
    Minority Leader, that brings us to the end of the debate on this Motion.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 4:15 p.m.


    Members, I thank you very much for your co-operation.

    Hon Majority Leader, we are at your

    service. The adjournment of the House is at my discretion because it is past two o'clock --
    Mr Avoka 4:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, item 7 on the Order Paper -- The Education (Amendment) Bill -- just the principles; just five minutes.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 4:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I believe, given the mood of the House and knowing how far we have travelled, I think the item that my Hon Colleague refers to is in respect of the STX. Is it?
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 4:15 p.m.
    No, the Education Bill.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 4:15 p.m.
    I would want to plead with my Hon Colleague that we stand it down and commence business on it tomorrow.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 4:15 p.m.
    Hon Majority Leader, he says he is pleading with you to stand it down till tomorrow morning. What do you say?
    Mr Avoka 4:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I thought we could just take some five minutes to indicate the principles of the Education Bill to us. But if that is not in the mood of the House, then the Chairman of the Committee on Finance can read the Committee`s Report on the STX Loan Agreement -- [Some Hon Members: No.] -- so that we can then do the debate tomorrow. The Chairman can just read the Report and then we can start the debate tomorrow. [Interruptions.]
    Hon Colleagues, let me plead with you. We have to progress. We have done just a Private Members' Motion the whole day. We have not done much and we have decided that we have extended Sitting. So if I would crave your indulgence.
    Let us allow the Chairman to read the Report. We would not need to debate it.
    We can defer the debate until tomorrow. Just for the Chairman to read the Report and then we can defer the debate to tomorrow.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 4:15 p.m.
    Hon Minority Chief Whip, do you want to say something?
    Mr Frederick Opare-Ansah 4:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, this House has just decided that it will not ask Government to take any mitigative measures with regard to PURC's increase in tariffs. Mr Speaker, the least we can do is to join the people in their suffering at this time. Some of us have not eaten the whole day and now, in this kind of mood we want to Sit here and pretend all is well. Mr Speaker, let us go home this evening and mourn with the people, at least, tomorrow we will come back a little refreshed, then we can take on a new business.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 4:15 p.m.
    Hon
    Members, I have taken the mood of the House into account and I think the best and the proper thing to do now is to have this House adjourned till tomorrow at ten o'clock in the forenoon, so that when we come, I will call on the Leadership to take Public Business above any other business. In fact, yesterday and today, we did not do any Public Business and therefore, tomorrow, we have to start Public Business first thing in the morning.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 4:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, if I may plead. As you rightly observed, today, before we Sat , the time was almost 12 o'clock midday. If we had saved the first two hours, I believe we could have done far more than we have done now. So I would plead that we Sit at ten o'clock tomorrow and if we do, we would be able to do much work.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 4:15 p.m.
    Hon Minority Leader, I entirely agree with you and in fact, that is what would be happening tomorrow. At ten o'clock exactly on the dot, the Speaker will enter the Chamber and if there are only one or two people, we will start until somebody raises quorum and then we will suspend Sitting until we get the required number.
    But Hon Members, I want to plead with the House especially the Leadership. Tomorrow, when we come, let us start with Public Business before we move to any other business. The whole of yesterday and today was only for Private Members' Motion. So tomorrow, we will start with Public Business.
    Mr Avoka 4:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, well said and I will agree with the information by the Hon Minority Leader and your goodself that given the mood of the House, we should adjourn.
    I just want to take the opportunity to thank all Hon Colleagues for the lively debate that we have had today and the very well-informed decision we have arrived at. I appeal that tomorrow, we will come early and actually do the Business.
    I thank everybody.
    ADJOURNMENT 4:15 p.m.