Debates of 3 Feb 2015

MR SPEAKER
PRAYERS 10:55 a.m.

Mr Speaker 10:55 a.m.
Hon Minority Leader?
WELCOME ADDRESS 10:55 a.m.

Minority Leader (Mr Osei Kyei- Mensah-Bonsu) 10:55 a.m.
Mr Speaker, thank you very much for this opportunity to welcome Hon Colleagues back to the Chamber to transact the business of Parliament.
Mr Speaker, today marks the first Sitting of the First Meeting of the Third Session of this Sixth Parliament. May I, as tradition demands, welcome Hon Members back to the House after spending Christmas festivities with their families. I would like to believe that the recess has been worthwhile and has enabled us to have some rest while at the same time, reconnect with the people that we represent. I am hopeful we all have sufficiently prepared for the programme lined up for this Meeting.
Mr Speaker 10:55 a.m.
Hon Majority Leader?
Majority Leader (Mr Alban S.K. Bagbin) 11:05 a.m.
Thank you, Mr Speaker for the opportunity to welcome Hon Colleagues from a rather long recess.
Mr Speaker, we know that during the course of the recess, Hon Members had time to interact with their constituents and relay information from Parliament and Government, and to be enriched from the wisdom of our people. So, we are better positioned to do a good job in this Meeting.
Mr Speaker 11:15 a.m.
Hon Members, let me also welcome you back from the Christmas and New Year recess to the First Meeting of the Third Session of the Sixth Parliament of the Fourth Republic.
Since I am seeing most of you for the first time this year, it is only appropriate to take the opportunity to wish you a happy and prosperous new year. I thank the Almighty God for seeing to your wellbeing during the recess, particularly while you were away in your respective constituencies holding surgeries, and also for bringing you all safely back to the House this morning.
It is my prayer the Almighty God will continue to extend His hand of grace towards this House this year and the period thereafter.
Hon Members, you will recall that at the end of the last Meeting, I adjourned the House sine die for the Christmas recess. You will also remember that when the Chairman of the Business Committee, the Hon Majority Leader presented the Business Statement and wanted to indicate the date of 27th January, 2015, I informed the House that since it will be adjourned sine die, he should indicate the business to be done for the first week.
Hon Members, subsequently, in compliance with article 112 (1) of the 1992 Constitution and Standing Order 37 (7), I signed a Constitutional Instrument, 2015 (C.I. 88) on 15th January, 2015 issuing a notice of commencement of the Third Session of the Sixth Parliament of the Fourth Republic, which was gazetted and published in the media.
Since then, I have heard reports in the media alleging that Parliament had to postpone the scheduled date for the commencement of the Third Session because of lack of funds. That report was an inaccurate concoction since only one notice was issued by Parliament. I will request members of the Press to cross- check their facts before rushing to publish untruths in the media.
As you well know, the agenda for this current Meeting is already packed as we have an outstanding business from the previous year as well as new business for 2015. We are also expected in this Meeting to receive and welcome His Excellency, President John Dramani Mahama to deliver his Message on the State of the Nation for the year 2015. I also expect Ministries, Departments and Agencies of
Government to take note of the timetable of the House for this Meeting and submit on schedule their legislative and other proposals which require consideration and approval by Parliament.
On this note, I once again welcome Hon Members to the House. It is my prayer that the Good Lord will guide us in our deliberations.
Hon Members, thank you, very much.
ANNOUNCEMENTS 11:15 a.m.

VOTES AND PROCEEDINGS AND THE OFFICIAL REPORT 11:15 a.m.

Mr Speaker 11:15 a.m.
Hon Members, Correction of the Votes and Proceedings of Monday, 22nd December, 2014.

Hon Members, we have a number of Official Reports for correction -- about eight of them.
  • [No correction was made to the Official Report of Friday 12th December, 2014.]
  • [No correction was made to the Official Report of Monday, 15th December, 2014.]
  • Prof. George Yaw Gyan-Baffour 11:15 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, in column 4051 of the Official Report, the first paragraph, that is line 4, it should really read;
    “. . . the organisation that can actually transform this country, is the Ministry of Trade and Industry and not the Ministry of Finance.”
    Again, in paragraph 5, line 4, I said;
    “The linkage between gratis and the Ministry should be strengthened.”
    Then it goes on to say that
    “. . . the Ministry should help industries, especially manufac- turing, to acquire needed credit, help industr ies to have access to affordable energy.”
    Thank you, Mr Speaker.
    Mr Speaker 11:15 a.m.
    Any other correction?
    Mr Speaker 11:15 a.m.
    Hon Members, the Official Report of Tuesday, 16th December, 2014 as corrected, be adopted as the true record of proceedings.

    Official Report of Thursday 18 th December, 2014.

    Hon Member for Subin.
    Mr Isaac Osei 11:25 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, column 4469, paragraph 4, first line, the word “way” which is the second word should be “may”. I am sure. I am sure it is a typographical error. But it should be “may” not “way”.
    I thank you, Mr Speaker.
    Mr Speaker 11:25 a.m.
    Very well. Any other correction? [Pause.]
    Hon Members, the Official Report of Thursday, 18 th December, 2014 as corrected is hereby adopted as the true record of proceedings.
  • [No correction was made to the Official Report of Friday, 19th December, 2014.]
  • Mr Isaac Osei 11:25 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, in the contents, the last item, it says “MOTIONS
    i) Parliamentary Friendship Association Management Committee. . . “ It starts from column 4919; but if you open it, column 4919 is what starts the whole Report. So, it cannot be 4919. Going through, I did
    Mr Speaker 11:25 a.m.
    Hon Member for Subin, you are right but look at column 4929. [Pause.] So, you are partly correct; it should not be 4919.
    Mr Isaac Osei 11:25 a.m.
    With due respect, Mr Speaker, if that is the case, then the sequencing of the contents should also be changed.
    Mr Speaker 11:25 a.m.
    Yes, but there is something in the Official Report but except that the column indicated there is wrong.
    Mr Isaac Osei 11:25 a.m.
    Thank you, Mr Speaker.
    Mr Speaker 11:25 a.m.
    Very well. So, Hon Member for Subin, you are correcting it accordingly?
    Mr Isaac Osei 11:25 a.m.
    Yes, Mr Speaker.
    Mr Speaker 11:25 a.m.
    Hon Members, the Official Report of Monday, 22nd December, 2014 as corrected is hereby adopted as the true record of proceedings.
    At the Commencement of Public Business.
    Hon Majority Leader.
    Mr Bagbin 11:25 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, with the indulgence of my Hon Colleagues and your kind permission, if we can take item four, which is the Youth Employment Agency Bill, 2014. It is at the Consideration Stage; we handled some of the clauses; if we can continue with that process?
    Mr Speaker 11:25 a.m.
    Very well.
    Hon Members, the Youth Employment Agency Bill, 2014 at the Consideration Stage.
    BILLS -- CONSIDERATION 11:25 a.m.

    STAGE 11:25 a.m.

    Mr Speaker 11:25 a.m.
    Chairman of the Committee, which clause are we starting from?
    Mr Joseph Z. Amenowode 11:25 a.m.
    We are starting from clause 18.
    Mr Speaker 11:25 a.m.
    Very well.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker to take the Chair.
    Clause 18 -- Funds of the Agency
    Chairman of the Committee (Mr Joseph Z. Amenowode) 11:25 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 18, delete.
    I would seek your indulgence to move (b) to clause 23 when I come to that.
    Mr Speaker 11:25 a.m.
    Hon Chairman of the Committee, I am not getting your amendment.
    Mr Amenowode 11:25 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I seek your indulgence to delete clause 18, but continue to seek your indulgence to retain subclause (b), subsequently, to clause 23 when I come to that.
    Mr Speaker 11:25 a.m.
    So, what will be the import of the amendment? I will want to indulge you.
    Mr Amenowode 11:25 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I am deleting clause 18, as at this stage.
    Mr Speaker 11:25 a.m.
    You are deleting the entire clause 18?
    Mr Amenowode 11:25 a.m.
    Yes, Mr Speaker. [Pause.]
    Mr Osei B. Amoah 11:25 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, the Chairman of the Committee says he is deleting clause 18 but wants to retain subclause (b); I do not understand it.
    Mr Speaker 11:25 a.m.
    When I asked him again, he said he was deleting the entire clause 18 with liberty to come back.
    Mr Amenowode 11:25 a.m.
    That is so. Mr Speaker, I am deleting it entirely. This is because the provisions in clause 18 are covered elsewhere in clause 23. So, I am deleting it here.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 11:25 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, what the Hon Chairman is seeking to do is really to restructure the arrangement. So, he says that because clause 21 establishes the Fund, he wants to relocate it to after the “establishment of the Fund”. That is what he should have informed us. This is because clause 21 now is talking about the “Youth Employment Fund”, and we should establish the Fund before we know where we will source the funds from. That is the import of what the Chairman is saying.
    Mr Haruna Iddrisu 11:25 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, to support the Chairman of the Committee and as we proceed further, you will know that the Headnote for section 18 is on funds of the Agency. Somewhere along the line, clause 23 will deal with the major issue of sources of money for the Fund, where all these issues will be addressed under that clause.
    Thank you, Mr Speaker.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    MR FIRST DEPUTY SPEAKER
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:35 a.m.
    Yes, Hon Minority Leader, you are up?
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 11:35 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I moved this amendment, not knowing that the Chairman was going to propose for this restructuring. So, I will step it down until we get to the appropriate place and then situate it there. This is because it is really relevant that it goes along with it.
    Mr Amenewode 11:35 a.m.
    It is alright with us here.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:35 a.m.
    Very well.
    I believe we are at clause 19. Is that right, Chairman of the Committee?
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 11:35 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, we were still at clause 18.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:35 a.m.
    Clause 18?
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 11:35 a.m.
    Yes. So, this brings us to the closure, for the Question to be put on the proposal from the Chairman.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:35 a.m.
    Clause 18? I thought that had been dealt with by Mr Speaker. The Question was put and it was carried.
    Mr O. B. Amoah 11:35 a.m.
    The Hon Minority Leader was proposing a new clause to clause 18 and that is why we are still on it. We have not moved to clause 19 yet.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:35 a.m.
    Very well.
    Will you like to step it down?
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 11:35 a.m.
    That is so, Mr Speaker. It has not been abandoned but we must now relocate it to the appropriate place, consequent upon where we place the proposal from the Chairman.
    Clause 18 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:35 a.m.
    So, we move to clause 19.
    Clause 19 -- Account and Audit.
    Mr Amenwode 11:35 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 19, subclause (1), line 2, delete “them” and insert “the accounts”.
    So, it will subsequently read:
    “The Board shall keep books of account and proper records in relation to the accounts in the form approved by the Auditor-General”.
    rose
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:35 a.m.
    Hon Majority Leader, are you up on this issue?
    Mr Bagbin 11:35 a.m.
    That is so Mr Speaker.
    I think clauses 19 and 20 are to be re- engineered and relocated somewhere after we have finished with the issues of the funding.
    It was in the structuring of the Bill and definitely, we can take them now. But the attention of the drafting department will have to be drawn, so that they put them after clauses 21, 22 to 26, so that after that, these will follow.
    They are dealing with the financial provision of auditing, annual report and the rest. They should come after we have finished with establishing the Fund, the sources, the application and management of the Fund and then we can talk about reporting.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:35 a.m.
    Very well.
    Hon Minister, how do you respond to that?
    Mr H. Iddrisu 11:35 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, it is acceptable to us. I am sure, for the purposes of neatness and elegance, it is a normal provision. In many legislations, we have a provision for accounts and audit, which is largely borrowed from the provisions of the Constitution itself on the reporting formula. So, we can take it further away after we have dealt with the issue of the funding of the Agency.
    I thank you Mr Speaker.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:35 a.m.
    Thank you very much.
    I so direct, Hon Members.
    In that case, is it possible for us to continue from clause 27 or we will still have to wait the outcome of what you are going to engineer?
    Mr H. Iddrisu 11:35 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, whatever amendments that Hon Members are seeking to clauses 19 and 20, you will proceed with it but direct the draftspersons and the Table Office to take note to relocate those particular paragraphs in the finalised Bill that will be submitted to the Attorney-General.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:35 a.m.
    I believe that will save us time. Can we deal with the amendments as they come, while in case I forget, the direction is that, the draftspersons should re-engineer and locate those amended clauses to where they properly belong to, so that we come to clause 19.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:35 a.m.
    Hon Chairman, you remember that you dealt with the proposed amendment to subclause 1 and the Question was not put when this intervention by the Majority Leader came up? So, allow me to put the Question and after that, you come to subclause 2.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Mr Amenewode 11:35 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 19 -- subclause (2), delete and insert the following:
    “The Board shall within three months after the end of the financial year submit the accounts of the Agency to the Auditor-General for audit.”
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:35 a.m.
    We are still at clause 19. Chairman of the Committee?
    Mr Amenowode 11:35 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 19, subclause (3), delete and insert the following:
    “The Auditor-General shall after the receipt of the accounts, audit the accounts and not later than six months after the end of the preceding financial year, submit the audit report to Parliament.”
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:35 a.m.
    Chairman of the Committee, we are still at clasue 19.
    Mr Amenowode 11:35 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I stepped it down, that in view of the amendment we carried --
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:35 a.m.
    In that case, I will not put the Question with regard to the clause as variously amended. I will suspend that one until we have dealt with this last one we are talking about.
    Mr Amenowode 11:45 a.m.
    Mr Speaker --
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:45 a.m.
    I will like the Table Office to take note of this portion which we have stepped down.
    Mr Amenowode 11:45 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I would rather want to withdraw it totally, so that you put the Question on clause 19.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:45 a.m.
    Very well. We accept it.
    Hon Members, I will put the Question with regard to clause 19 as variously amended standing part of the Bill.
    Clause 19 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill --
    rose
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:45 a.m.
    Yes, Hon Majority Chief Whip?
    Alhaji Muntaka 11:45 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, with the greatest respect, sorry I could not catch your eye before you put the Question.
    I wanted the Chairman to explain why he wanted to withdraw the amendment for subclause 3. It was to enable the Auditor- General report to Parliament.
    If you look at the original clause, it is talking about reporting to the Hon Minister. So, I wanted to get the clarification why he wants to drop the amendment that he is proposing.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:45 a.m.
    Hon Majority Chief Whip, I believe at the appropriate time, it can be re-introduced depending on how it goes because it is talking about some re-engineering of various clauses with regard to funding and
    so on. I believe when they are able to do all of that, this one will fall in proper place.
    Alhaji Muntaka 11:45 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, with the greatest respect, my worry is that, since you are putting the Question on the various amendments without having given the explanation that it will come again, my fear is that, we could forget about it and that may end --
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:45 a.m.
    That is why I directed the Table Office, that in case the Chair skips it, they should be in a position to draw our attention to it.
    Mr Amenowode 11:45 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, if we take account of subclause 3 -- we have deleted the original subclause 3 and in the new rendition, there is no mention of “Minister”. So, there is no place for that amendment in the subclause 3, as we have moved here earlier.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:45 a.m.
    Yes, Hon Minister?
    Mr H. Iddrisu 11:45 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, ordinarily, I would have a difficulty saying that my Whip is out of Order since you have put the Question on this particular clause.
    Guided that he wants to improve this particular Bill, I would note that he should appreciate that under clause 19, while the Chairman of the Committee moved for the deletion, he also said, “insert a new clause”, which new clause reads, and with your indulgence, I would beg to read,
    “The Auditor-General shall after the receipt of the accounts, audit the accounts and not later than six months after the end of the preceding financial year, submit the audit report to Parliament.”
    So, his concerns are legitimately captured under the new insertion. He did not just delete it, he said that we improve it with the new rendition that I read.
    Thank you, Mr Speaker.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:45 a.m.
    All right. Shall we move on then?
    Clause 20 -- Annual Reports and other Reports.
    Mr Amenowode 11:45 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 20 -- subclause (3), line 3, after necessary, insert the following:
    “and shall cause the report to be published in a manner that the Minister determines”
    rose
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:45 a.m.
    Yes, Hon Minority Leader?
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 11:45 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, with respect, even though we have put the Question, the new amendment, clause 19, subclause (3) -- Mr Speaker, clause 19, subclause (2) provides that,
    “The Board shall within three months after the end of the financial year submit the accounts of the Agency to the Auditor-General for audit.”
    The Auditor-General is supposed to audit the accounts and submit the report to Parliament within six months after the close of the financial year. The proposal from him seeks to predicate the report to Parliament on the receipt of the accounts by the Auditor-General.
    Mr Speaker, I do not think that we need that because the Auditor-General is required to do that. Once you predicate it upon that, then the Auditor-General may have the excuse to say that, “well, they have not submitted it to me”. If they do not, the Auditor-General is required to compel them to do that.
    So, we do not need to say that it should be after the receipt of the accounts
    because that has been taken care of by clause 19, subclause (2). So, clause 19, subclause (3) should just say that; he is required to submit it within six months after the closure of the year to Parliament.
    Mr Amenowode 11:45 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, that seeks to improve upon what we are trying to do. So, I would accept his amendment.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:45 a.m.
    Then we have to go back to clause 19, although I have put the Question, with regard to clause 19 as variously amended.
    So, can we get to you to deal with the amendment he is proposing or he himself will want to deal with that proposed portion of subclause (3)?
    rose
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:45 a.m.
    Yes, Hon Majority Chief Whip?
    Alhaji Muntaka 11:45 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I could propose further amendment to that proposed amendment, to delete in line (1) “after the receipt of the accounts”, so that the new rendition will then be:
    “The Auditor-General shall submit not later than six months after the audit of the accounts -- “
    Mr Speaker, let me try and come again --
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 11:45 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think we will serve the same purpose better if you went the way of the 1992 Constitution. The Constitution provides in article 187 (5) the language to use;
    “The Auditor-General shall, within six months after the end of the immediately preceding financial year to which each of the accounts mentioned in clause (2) of this article relates, submit his report to Parliament . . .”
    It is as simple as that and it is neater.
    Mr Amenowode 11:45 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think that is exactly the new amendment I proposed in subclause (3) and it reads,
    “The Auditor-General shall after the receipt of the accounts --‘'
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:45 a.m.
    “. . . after the receipt” portion should be off.
    Mr Amenowode 11:45 a.m.
    All right. I now understand. We will take that one out, so that it should read:
    “The Auditor-General shall audit the accounts and not later than six months after the end of the preceding financial year submit the audit report to Parliament.”
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:45 a.m.
    Let us go by what he read out from the Constitution. I think that will save us.
    Mr Amenowode 11:45 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, clause 19 (2), the amendment that he proposed, provides that.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 11:45 a.m.
    Clause 19 (2) provides that:
    “The Board shall within three months after the end of the financial year submit the accounts of the Agency to the Auditor-General for audit.”
    That one is taken for a given. So, when you come to clause 19 (3), then you borrow the language contained in the Constitution.
    And Mr Speaker, I think the draft --
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:45 a.m.
    The draftspersons will handle it. We are clear in our minds what we want. So, the draftspersons are directed to capture our thinking in the amendment proposed.
    So, now --
    rose
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:45 a.m.
    Yes, Hon Member?
    Mr Amoah 11:45 a.m.
    Sorry Mr Speaker, since we have gone back to clause 19, I believe that it is a bit irregular for us to be looking at six months for the Auditor-General. If you look at other Acts, there is a precedence and it is very simple and it makes it easier for all of us and the time is also limited. For instance, if I look at the Export Trade, Agriculture and Industrial Development Fund, we have the same provision there -- accounts and audit. Mr Speaker, if you permit me, I would read it, and it is just a short one.
    “35 (1) The Board shall keep books of accounts and proper records in relation to them in the form approved by the Auditor-General.”
    “35 (2) The Board shall submit the accounts of the Fund to the Auditor-General for audit within three months after the end of the financial year.”
    “35 (3) The Auditor-General shall, not later than three months after the receipt of the accounts, audit the accounts and forward a copy of the audit report to the Minister.”
    Yes, that is how it is. But here, we are proposing six months after receipt of the accounts. The proposed amendment says:
    “The Auditor-General shall after the receipt of the accounts, audit the accounts and not later than in six months after the end of the preceding financial year submit the audit report to Parliament.”
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:55 a.m.
    Probably, the question raised before us is, assuming that the Auditor-General does not receive the accounts, and then we are asking the Auditor-General to do so within a certain time frame, there will always be the excuse that “I have not received it and therefore, I cannot work on it.”
    But I believe the Auditor-General, by the constitutional provision, is mandated to audit all these accounts.
    Mr O. B. Amoah 11:55 a.m.
    In that case, we should make it clear because the proposed amendment is also talking about receipt of the accounts and audit of the accounts not later than six months.
    Indeed, my major worry is the six months there. It is three months each and if you give six months for the receipt and auditing of the account --
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:55 a.m.
    Yes Hon Minister, how do you respond to that?
    Mr H. Iddrisu 11:55 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I appreciate the debate and the input but I am guided by the earlier comments of the Minority Leader and your subsequent direction. If the Chairman has no objection and having listened to my Colleague, Hon Amoah, with clause 19, even as it stands in the current Bill -- you have 19 (1), 19 (2) and 19 (3) -- What is missing, and Mr Speaker, with your indulgence and kind permission, I beg to quote:
    “The Auditor-General shall, not later than three months after the receipt
    of the accounts, audit the accounts and forward a copy of the audit report to the Minister.”
    Beyond the Minister, what happens? That is why the Hon Minority Leader referred to article 187 of the Constitution which imposes an obligation on the Auditor-General, to submit that account as a public account to Parliament. So, we can leave clause 19 as it is, by just providing a new provision, that the Hon Minister, upon receipt of the reform from the Auditor-General, shall submit it to Parliament within a specified period and that would have cured many of the concerns that our Colleagues have raised.
    Thank you.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:55 a.m.
    Yes, Hon Majority Chief Whip?
    Alhaji Muntaka 11:55 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, on the dimension brought in by my Colleague, Hon O. B. Amoah, that it is constitutional for the Auditor-General to submit to Parliament all public accounts six months after the end of the immediate preceedings here.
    Must we state them in an Act? There have been so many Bills that came to this House that have now been promulgated into Acts in which we did not state that six months after the preceding year, it should come to Parliament because constitutionally, it has been provided. Must we repeat them in every Act?
    If so, then what about those that we have drafted that we did not put it in because we assumed that once it is constitutional, like the example Hon O. B. Amoah provided -- it is not there -- “to report to Parliament.”
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:55 a.m.
    Hon O. B. Amoah is concerned about the difference because somewhere, it is stated three months and other places, six months. So, his worry is with the duration.
    Alhaji Muntaka 11:55 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, to be on the safer side, why do we not take the rendition of the Constitution like Hon Haruna Iddrisu suggested, so that it becomes an additional clause? If you will permit me, I would propose that it should read;
    “The Auditor-General shall within six months after the end of the immediate preceding financial year, submit his report to Parliament.”

    But you did not propose the amend- ment. You just said we should take --
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:55 a.m.
    The Hon Minority Leader proposed that amendment, we carried it and I gave directions that the draftspersons should ensure that they capture the Constitutional provision in the Act; and it saves us all the trouble.
    Hon O. B. Amoah, are you alright with what is provided in other Bills for other Acts notwithstanding?
    Mr O. B. Amoah 11:55 a.m.
    Yes. I thought probably, we could just say that it is in accordance with article 187 of the Constitution.
    Why I brought this up is that, within six months, the audit report should be here. But if we are proposing an amendment, saying that he should receive it and work on it six months after the financial year, it could be that within that time he has not even received it. Yet, the Constitution is saying that by six months, it should be in the House.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:55 a.m.
    That is why you are curing the anomaly by repeating the provision in the Constitution.
    Mr O. B. Amoah 11:55 a.m.
    I do not have any problem with it.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:55 a.m.
    All right.
    So Hon Members, I will put the Question with regard to clause 19 as variously amended.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Clause 19 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
    Clause 20 -- Annual reports and other reports
    Mr Amenowode 11:55 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 20 -- subclause (3), line 3, after “necessary”, insert the following:
    “and shall cause the report to be published in a manner that the Minister determines”
    So that it will read;
    “The Minister shall within one month after the receipt of the annual report, submit the report to Parliament with a statement that the Minister considers necessary --”
    And then the new amendment;
    “and shall cause the report to be published in a manner that the Minister determines.”
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:55 a.m.
    Can you give the rationale behind this amendment?
    Mr Amenowode 11:55 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, we were trying to make assurance double sure, to make the Minister publish the report that has been submitted to him or her.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:55 a.m.
    Yes, Hon O. B. Amoah?
    Mr O. B. Amoah 11:55 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, once the report is to be submitted to Parliament, the assumption is that, the report has been brought to Parliament and I do not see why the Minister should also publish

    it in a manner that he determines. Reports are submitted to Parliament and they become public documents. So, I do not see why the Minister should also publish it in a manner that he determines. It is quite unusual, if a report is submitted to Parliament, that is the matter. In publishing it the way he determines, I do not know how it is going to --
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:55 a.m.
    Yes, Hon Minister?
    Mr H. Iddrisu 11:55 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I would crave the indulgence of the Chairman to abandon his proposed amendment and allow clause 20 as captured in the Bill to be carried.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:55 a.m.
    We will like to hear from the Chairman himself.
    Mr Amenowode 11:55 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I accept the proposed suggestion to the amendment of my Minister. So, I am abandoning my amendment.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:55 a.m.
    Yes, Hon Minority Leader? I see you appear to be in some quagmire.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 11:55 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, it is not because he is abandoning it but I recollect that the recent Bills that we have been passing, we have this proviso and I do not really understand why he is abandoning this. There has been the emerging trend these days, and we have always included that portion, and I thought it was because of that that he wanted that distinction.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:55 a.m.
    Actually, I believe he is acting on the concerns raised
    by Hon O. B. Amoah, that if the matter has been dealt with in the earlier clause, making it mandatory for the Auditor- General to present the audited report to Parliament, why will we want to go through this ministerial procedure?
    Yes, Hon Chairman.
    Mr Amenowode 11:55 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, as I said earlier, we wanted to make assurance double sure. Since it is already provided for, that is the reason I am agreeing with the Minister's suggestion to withdraw.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:55 a.m.
    Very well.
    I have granted you leave to withdraw it. Therefore, there will be no need for clause 20 to be amended.
    Yes, Hon Minority Leader?
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I was a bit distracted by my Colleague who wanted me to attend to another matter -- Hon J. B. Danquah. I look at clause 20 (4) and I think that chronologically, if the Minister should require any information, that information should be availed by the Board before the Minister sends the report to Parliament. It should not be the case that the report has been submitted to Parliament, thereafter, the Minister requires further information.
    I think that it should rather precede clause 3. It should be between (2) and (3). I am looking at clause 20 (iv). It should not be at where it is. It should rather come between the original (2) and (3). I am talking about the arrangement. Otherwise, it should not be that after the report has been submitted to Parliament, then the Hon Minister says that further information is provided. What to do with that information is not known.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:05 p.m.
    But before then, Hon Majority Chief Whip?
    Mr H. Iddrisu 12:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I have no objection to the suggestion by the Hon Minority Leader, but my concern is that, it is referring to any another report that the Hon Minister may require.
    Mr Speaker, if it is in the wisdom of the House that we bring it before, I do not think it will spoil anything.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:05 p.m.
    Hon Members, I believe we are ad idem concerning the proposal made by the Hon Minority Leader. So, I will direct that the draftspersons deal with the matter as appropriate.
    Clause 20 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
    Clause 21-- Establishment of the Youth Employment Fund.
    Mr Amenowode 12:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 21, delete.
    We are making provision for that in a subsequent clause. As it stands now, we are deleting, we are not establishing a new Fund. It will be explained as we get to clause 23.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:05 p.m.
    So, if I understood you, you are deleting the whole of clause 21?
    Mr Amenowode 12:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, we are deleting clause 21 in its entirety.
    Mr Haruna Iddrisu 12:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I am not very clear with the suggestion provided by the Chairman of the Committee. Clause 23 is talking about the source. But we need to establish it first,
    talk about what we want to use it for, before we talk about the sources. If we do not establish it, how are we talking about the sources? If not, then he should provide a better explanation why he wants to do this. This is because, it has to be established first before the sources of the Fund.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:05 p.m.
    I believe that if we look at clause 21, it establishes a Fund.
    Baba Jamal M. Ahmed: Mr Speaker, when one looks at the original Bill, there was supposed to be a Fund -- separate Fund established with all moneys going into it -- before, if the Agency wants to source funds, it would source from it. Now, that Fund is what we are deleting completely. The money of the Agency, whatever source it comes from, would go straight into the account of the Agency, and they will use it for their purposes.
    So, there will be no Fund as established, where you will have Ghana Education Trust Fund (GETFund), like other Funds -- No! We are completely taking this one out. Where we are saying, that the sources of funds, whereever they are coming from, will go straight to the Agency and they will use them for their work.
    So, when one goes to subsequent clauses, one would see that wherever it is “Fund”, it has been changed to suit the Bill as it is.
    Mr H. Iddrisu 12:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, may I, with your indulgence, refer my able Whip to the Long Title of the Bill? And it reads:
    “An act to establish the Youth Employment Agency for the purpose of the development, co- ordination, supervision and the facilitation of the education of the youth and to provide for related market”.

    Mr Speaker, in essence, the idea of the Fund was to contemplate how to generate funds to support youth employment. But as well captured in the Long Title, I think that I support the Chairman of the Committee, that when we get to clause 23, we would have debated how we will fund the Youth Employment Agency as an institution. But its object was not to have the Youth Fund established for that purpose.

    Thank you.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:05 p.m.
    Very well.
    Yes, Hon Minority Leader?
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think we are talking about two different things. The Hon Minister responsible for Employment and Labour Relations has spoken about the title to the Bill. But the intention of any Bill, the policy drive finds expression in the Memorandum.
    Mr Speaker, the Memorandum accompanying this Bill, on the third page (3), and that Memorandum which establishes the policy drive is authen- ticated and indeed, signed by the Hon Minister himself.
    Mr Speaker, and so, this shifting of ground, I do not understand. The first paragraph provides and I read from clauses 21 and 22:
    “21. There is established by this Act, a Youth Employment Fund.
    The object of the Fund
    22. (i) the objects of the Fund are:
    (a) to support youth development through skills training and internship; and
    (b) to prepare school drop-out to continue their education”
    Mr Speaker, this is the gravamen of it. Is the pivotal issue. So, for the Hon Minister to abandon the clause and now tell us to look into some other direction, I beg to disagree.
    Mr Speaker, I would want to believe that this will have received serious Cabinet consideration and approval before being sent here. So, he cannot really treat us to a different meal.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:05 p.m.
    Hon Chairman of the Committee, can I hear from you? At the Committee level, what prompted your decision to delete this particular clause?
    Mr Amenowode 12:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, the decision was taken on the basis that -- We realised that youth employment as it is, has some Funds that are funding it. So, there was no need to create another Fund but rather legitimate those sources of funding for the Agency, so that we do not create a new Youth Employment Fund like we have GETFund or Funds for Health Insurance.
    This one has been operating with funds already that they use. Just that they were not legitimised, and our purpose was just to legitimise those, and that was why we said sources of funds for the Agency rather than creating a Youth Employment Fund.
    Mr Speaker, those were the considera- tions.
    Thank you.
    Mr Joseph B. Danquah 12:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I would like to ask the Hon Chairman of the Committee, from the basis of his argument, whether it meant that the revenue accrued to the Agency is going to sit in the Consolidated Fund. So, he does not want the revenue accruing to come into a dedicated Fund that will be subjected to parliamentary formula or approval? Is that
    what he is trying to say? That he wants it to go into their Agency and sit in their Consolidated Fund? Is that what he is trying to indicate to us?
    Mr Amenowode 12:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, the intention is that, those Funds had already come to Parliament. Like the 15 per cent of the District Assemblies allocation that we are requesting, had already come. The formular had already come from Parliament, which we have approved. So, it is rather being taken from what has been approved in Parliament already. National Health Insurance Levy (NHIL) has come to Parliament and has been approved and so, those are just sources of funding for the Agency. Those Funds have already been approved, Mr Speaker.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:05 p.m.
    Yes, Hon Majority Chief Whip? [Interruption] -- [Laughter.]
    Alhaji Muntaka 12:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, thank you very much.
    Mr Speaker, from the explanation given by the Chairman and the Hon Deputy Minister, they are no longer interested in setting up a Fund, but the Agency must have funding, just as we did with the University of Ghana and other institutions. We should not create a Fund, but there should be funding sources for the Agency and that is what they want to do.
    What it means, to my understanding -- and I have seen in the proposed amendment, that they will equally be deleting clause 22, and that they will amend clause 23 to read: “Funds of the Agency”. So, it is no longer, “establishing the fund”. I think that we have done that
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:15 p.m.
    So, your proposal is that we defer this to a later time and deal with the others and possibly come back at the end of it, so that we make some progress? Is that it?
    Mr Muntaka 12:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think that this is also a very good suggestion -- to go to clause 23, deal with it and then we come back to deal with this one. By the time we deal with the clause 23, it may be much clearer to the majority of us. That may be the way to go. I think your suggestion would also be helpful.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, a Bill has come to this House and it is informed by a principle. Midstream, you want to change the rules of engagement. That is what exactly you want to do now. So, let us hear from the Hon Minister, what the policy drive is, and the policy drive is informed by the memorandum, by which you are telling us that you intend to establish a dedicated Fund.
    Mr Speaker, that is fundamental to this Bill, and I believe that you carried this to Cabinet and it was approved, and you are only piloting it — you are only shepherding it here.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:15 p.m.


    Mr Speaker, so, what is informing this policy change? Has Cabinet now reneged on that? This is what will have come before us —
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:15 p.m.
    Hon Minority Leader, your point is well made but that notwithstanding, the proposal now on the floor is, they are seeking to delete certain clauses. We are saying, let us defer those amendments seeking to delete those clauses, and then let us go further down and deal with what is there.
    At the end of it, we will come back — No! It is not as if we are dealing with it in toto. We will come back, and if the need arises, we will go by the way you are proposing.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, except that — clause 23 is consequential to what we agree to do in clauses 21 and 22, and so, we cannot just go and deal with the branches when we have not dealt with the root and stem.
    Mr Speaker, let us invite the Minister — he is sitting here -- conversing and doing some asides. Let him respond to the issues that we have raised and then we can move on.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:15 p.m.
    Very well.
    Hon Minister, can we hear you, especially with regard to the policy issue that the Minority Leader has raised?
    Mr H. Iddrisu 12:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, the Minority Leader is apt with his submission on the policy issue, but it does introduce what I may describe as a personal quagmire, whether this House, Parliament, has the power working through its committee, to review a policy decision captured in a Bill.
    Mr Speaker, indeed, the Bill, as was approved by Cabinet and subsequently submitted to Parliament, and accordingly referred to your Committee, has all the fine details of policy, which is seeking as I read in the Long Title, to establish a youth employment agency.
    Mr Speaker, the Youth Employment Agency is contemplated to be funded with dedicated funding sources. That is why when the Majority Chief Whip rose, he gave an indication that, probably, we can indulge the Chairman to step down clauses 21 and 22, and probably, after we have dealt with clauses 23 and 24, we would appreciate the argument of the Hon Minority Leader and convince the Chairman, that the establishment of the Fund is still necessary.
    Mr Speaker, in coming with this Bill, I have learnt from many experiences, including that of the late Hon Baah- Wiredu, who was then Minister for Finance and piloted this initiative, to deal with youth crisis as an emergency.
    Mr Speaker, at the time, if you would recall — I would probably urge the Hon Chairman of the Committee to stand down for a moment. We shall move to clause 23, and come back. But I do agree — I can change my mind to agree with the Hon Minority Leader. That is the essence of the debate, that policy wise, he is apt, but also must note, that the Long Title —
    Mr Speaker, you are a brilliant lawyer; a guide to interpretation, we always say that you look at the Long Title to get the object of the Bill, which the Hon Member must learn. But I have no problem accepting that the committee of Parliament can or cannot change a policy decision. It is a matter that all of us can take — I am asking, is Parliament clothed with authority to do that? I am minded to support what I submitted and which
    Cabinet approved, which provided for that.
    I would indulge the Hon Chairman to, for a moment, abandon clauses 21 and 22. When we lead the debate on clause 23, we will appreciate whether we need the Fund.
    Mr Speaker, at winnowing — if the Minority Leader would appreciate — he presided over it. That was when there was an argument that we should dedicate 2.5 per cent to VAT, which would have made it sit in tandem with the argument of the Chairman. If we have a dedicated funding source, we could call it the “Youth Employment Fund”, but knowing that there is some apprehension by the Hon Minister for Finance regarding earmarking, we were guided that clause 23 could comprehensively deal with it. But I would still urge my Chairman to abandon it for a while, while we make progress.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:15 p.m.
    Very well.
    Hon Members, I will direct that we defer, not abandon clauses 21 and 22, and then go to clause 23, after which, if we come back, we will be in a better position to appreciate the point being made.
    Let us then go to clause 23.
    Clause 23 — Sources of money for the Fund.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:15 p.m.
    Yes, Chairman of the Committee?
    Mr Amenowode 12:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I would want to yield to the Hon Minister to bring clause 23 to the House.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:15 p.m.
    Very well.
    Mr H. Iddrisu 12:25 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I would seek your leave and indulge you, that
    clause 23 as captured on page 5, I would do a review of it and submit a new proposal.
    Mr Speaker, I do so because I recognised that Hon Matthew Opoku Prempeh and Hon Osei Bonsu Amoah had earlier moved some amendment, which was seeking to have a charge on the Consolidated Fund. Our Standing Orders are very clear on it. I do so on behalf of the President.
    The sources of funds for the Agency are, or shall include --
    (a) Funds for the Agency
    Mr Speaker, so clause 23 will read 12:25 p.m.
    “The sources of funds for the Agency are:
    (a) moneys approved by Parliament;”
    This will be the normal yearly budgetary allocations that the Hon Minister for Finance may so submit.
    Then, Mr Speaker,
    (b) “Sixty per cent of Communications Service tax”
    That is presently the situation. The Communications Service Tax over the years is dedicated to supporting youth employment.
    Mr Speaker, (c) will now read 12:25 p.m.
    “Fifteen per cent of the allocation from the District Assemblies Common Fund formula shall be allocated to the Youth Employment Fund.”
    That was why I said when we go along, we will appreciate what the Hon Minority Leader said. Then (d) will be --
    Mr Speaker, (c) will now read 12:25 p.m.


    “Five per cent of the Ghana Education Trust Fund formula will also be allocated to support youth employment.”

    I would urge that the draftspersons look at it since we seek to take fifteen per cent from this Fund to support youth employment.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:25 p.m.
    Yes, Hon O. B. Amoah?
    Mr Osei B. Amoah 12:25 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, the Hon Minister started by saying that he has the authority of the President to make the amendments. Indeed, he appears to be confusing us with some of these amendments.
    I believe in this particular matter, probably, we will have to defer it for him to come officially and formally. This is because we keep shifting from one point to another. If the President or Cabinet has now decided that this is how it should go, I do not think he should just stand here and say that this is what the President said, so, he is moving this way.
    If the Government is shifting its position, then we should know and there should be a formal arrangement to this. But just saying that, the President has given him the authority to make these amendments -- [Interruption.] That was what he said.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:25 p.m.
    Hon Minister?
    Mr H. Iddrisu 12:25 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I rise on a point of order, probably, to give clarity, so that my Colleague, the Hon Osei Bonsu Amoah will appreciate --
    I said that I knew that clause 23 as advertised on page 5 stood in his name and that of Hon Matthew Opoku Prempeh. Then I added that per our
    Standing Orders, it is only a Minister acting on the authority of the President who can make a charge on the Consolidated Fund or any other Fund. On that note, I proceeded to make the amendment for clarity.
    Mr Speaker, I simply suggest that, he could not have moved a Motion asking for a charge of 5 per cent and 10 per cent per the Standing Orders of Parliament even though we share the notion and the position that he took.
    Thank you.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:25 p.m.
    Very well.
    The Hon Minister has moved for this proposed amendment. Shall I put the Question?
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:25 p.m.
    Yes, Hon Minority Leader?
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:25 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I noticed that the amendment that the Minister for Employment and Labour Relations proferred to us was not even advertised. Much as I see some sense in what they want to do, Mr Speaker, I was cautious when he attempted to move that leg and I said we should be careful because it goes to the bottom of the matter before us. The policy direction provided by the Cabinet to us is that we should establish a dedicated Fund.
    The Hon Minister has not even responded to that and now, he says on the matter of applying a portion of GETFund and so on, which are dedicated funds -- On behalf of the President, he can give us assurances but on behalf of the President, he is not telling us that Government has changed its position on the establishment of a dedicated Fund.

    Can he give us the assurance that the President and indeed, Cabinet have changed their mind on the setting up of a dedicated Fund?
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:25 p.m.
    Hon Minority Leader, may we look at Standing Order 122.
    “The House shall not, unless the Bill is introduced by a Minister or a Member on behalf of the President, proceed upon any Bill including any amendment to a Bill that in the opinion of the person presiding makes provision for any of the following:
    (b) the imposition of a charge on the Consolidated Fund or other public funds of Ghana or the alteration of any such charge otherwise than by reduction;”
    So, reading from here, it looks like we are on track by what he is doing because it is only when a Minister is acting on behalf of the President --
    Bonsu — rose
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:25 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, going down that lane, I do not disagree. This Bill is coming from the Executive. So, we do not even need the intervention of the Hon Minister at this time to say that it is funds or whatever.

    Mr Speaker, once we get over that hurdle, I believe we can proceed because as I said, if the signal is from Cabinet that they have changed their minds --
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:25 p.m.
    Hon Member, remember that he posed a question, that is it possible for Parliament in its oversight responsibility at committee level to take a look at whatever is contained even in the Memorandum and effect amendments thereto?
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:25 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, it is the policy that is driving this Bill before us. If Government decides to alter that policy, clearly, it destabilises the whole Bill. It destabilises the cause of the whole Bill and that is turbulence engineered by the person who is supposed to shepherd the Bill.
    So, Mr Speaker, I believe that today is the first day and we must begin on a good note. I would want to plead with the Minister for Employment and Labour Relations, that given the circumstances, if we can give ourselves a little breathing space, we certainly will have to --
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:25 p.m.
    Allright.
    I think I buy the suggestion you are making. Today is the first day of Sitting, so let us give ourselves time and let the Committee, together with the -- Unless the Hon Majority Leader has something to say -- take a second look at it and come back, so that we can move forward.
    Yes, Hon Majority Leader?
    Mr Bagbin 12:35 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I was just discussing with the Hon Minister, that this is quite an important issue and since there is no firmness in the communication, I think it is better we take a date. We should adjourn and then go and do further consultation and come back to clarify the situation. I do not support the establishment of a dedicated Fund. So, we will have to go and do further consultation and come back.
    Mr Speaker --
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:35 p.m.
    Since you have the floor, can you move the Motion then?
    Mr Bagbin 12:35 p.m.
    That was what I was trying to do.
    Mr Speaker, looking at the time and in the absence of any other business, I beg to move, that this House do --
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:35 p.m.
    Before then --
    Mr Bagbin 12:35 p.m.
    Is there some other business?
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:35 p.m.
    No. We have not brought the Consideration Stage to an end. So, we are jumping the gun.

    Yes, Hon Majority Leader, you have the floor.
    Mr Alban S. K. Bagbin 12:35 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, in the absence of any other business and since some committees are going to meet, may I beg to move, that the House do adjourn till tomorrow at 10.00 o'clock in the forenoon, where we shall reconvene to continue with business.
    Mr Osei Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:35 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to second the Motion.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:35 p.m.
    Hon Members, I will put the Question. The Motion has been moved and seconded that this House stands adjourned till tomorrow at 10.00 o'clock in the forenoon.
    Question put and Motion agreed to.
    ADJOURNMENT 12:35 p.m.

  • The House was accordingly adjourned at 12.37 p.m. till Wednesday, 4th February, 2015 at 10.00 a.m.