Debates of 16 Mar 2006

MR. SPEAKER
PRAYERS 10 a.m.

CORRECTION OF VOTES 10 a.m.

AND PROCEEDINGS AND 10 a.m.

THE OFFICIAL REPORT 10 a.m.

Mr. Speaker 10 a.m.
Correction of Votes and Proceedings - Pages 1 … 8? Hon. Member for North Tongu -
Mr. Charles S. Hodogbey 10 a.m.
Mr.
Speaker, page 3 -- I was present yesterday; I went to the mails room yesterday to sign the register but it had been taken to the Speaker's office.
Mr. Speaker 10 a.m.
Were you marked
absent?
Mr. Hodogbey 10 a.m.
I am talking about
page 3.
Mr. Speaker 10 a.m.
Thank you; the
correction would be done. Pages 9…15? Hon. Member for Adenta -
Mr. Kwadjo Opare-Hammond 10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am sorry to take us back to page 12. I was present at the meeting of the Joint Committee on Employment, Social Welfare and State Enterprises, Poverty Reduction Strategy and Finance but it appears my name has been left out of those who attended the meeting; if the correction can be made.
Mr. Speaker 10 a.m.
Right, thank you for

Hon. Members, we do not have any Official Report. Item 3 - Questions, hon. Minister for Health.
Mr. A. O. Aidooh 10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the hon. Minister is unavoidably absent and has asked his Deputy to answer the Questions on his behalf; if you may permit him to do so.
Mr. Speaker 10 a.m.
Yes, permission granted.
[Interruptions.] Yes, hon. Member for Sefwi Wiawso?
Mr. Evans Paul Aidoo 10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker,
in the Business Committee Report for this week and on the Provisional Order Paper for yesterday, the hon. Minister for Health was to answer Question number 469, which stands in my name. Mr. Speaker, the Question was number three on the list yesterday. But Mr. Speaker, the Question cannot be seen today. I want to know why and how the Question got missing from the Order Paper today.
Mr. Speaker 10 a.m.
Hon. Member, I am
sure you will take it with the Leadership of the House at this stage. Please do that. Question number 285 -- and it is in the name of hon. Samuel Sallas-Mensah, Member of Parliament for Upper West Akim.
ORAL ANSWERS TO QUESTIONS 10 a.m.

MINISTRY OF HEALTH 10 a.m.

Mr. Samuel Sallas-Mensah 10 a.m.
Mr.
Speaker, I beg to withdraw my Question because it was put up about a year ago and the situation now does not call for me to ask this Question again because I have already ordered the health authorities in the area to start using the centre and it is being used too.
Mr. Speaker 10 a.m.
I am very sorry for the
inconvenience caused you. Thank you
very much. Question number 470 -- and it is in the name of hon. Nana Yaw Ofori-Kuragu, Member of Parliament for Bosome-Freho.
Bekwai District Hospital
Q. 470. Mr. E. Nana Yaw Ofori- Kuragu asked the Minister for Health what was the fate of Bekwai District Hospital.
Deputy Minister for Health (Mr. S. Owusu-Agyei): Mr. Speaker, though the Question is not quite clear, I guess it is in connection with the construction of a purpose-built district hospital in Bekwai in the Amansie East District of Ashanti.
The Ministry has already initiated action on this project. Mr. Speaker, in collaboration with the Bekwai Traditional Authorities, a land has been allocated for the project, and all the necessary documents signed. Currently the Ministry is in the process of selecting consultants for the project and an advertisement to that effect was made in the 3rd March, 2006 edition of the Daily Graphic.
Mr. Ofori-Kuraga 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the Bekwai District Hospital is virtually the only hospital in the district and two constituencies depend on it, that is, Bosome-Freho and Bekwai itself. Mr. Speaker, this proposed development has been on the cards for three years and we would want precise dates as to when this project is going to be undertaken.
Mr. Owusu-Agyei 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, my
Answer really indicated that the project is on course. Funding has been secured, and as I said, consultants are being selected for the project and an advertisement has already been made in the Daily Graphic of 3rd March. So the project is on course; we have secured the funding for it.
Mr. Speaker 10:10 a.m.
Question Number 471.
Mr. E. T. Mensah 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I
want to stand down this Question because of the time-lag. It was filed over a year ago and the situation has since changed.
Mr. Speaker 10:10 a.m.
Thank you very much;
and let me apologize for the incon- venience caused you.
Mr. Osei Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 10:10 a.m.
Mr.
Speaker, this House is governed by rules. A Question once asked and admitted by you becomes the property of this House. An individual cannot just rise up and say that “I am withdrawing the Question” and that is a fait accompli. Mr. Speaker, it would have to be with the indulgence of this House. [Interruptions.] He just cannot get up and say that he has withdrawn it. [Interruptions.]
Mr. Speaker 10:10 a.m.
Order! Order!
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, with respect, the first one which was granted sought to ask the hon. Minister the cause of the delay in commissioning the Adeiso Health Centre in the West Akim District. The hon. Member then comes to say that, well, it has been put to use so he is withdrawing it.
Mr. Speaker, the issue raised was the commissioning and the Answer that the hon. Minister has given indicates that the commissioning will be done in due time and yet he says that “Oh, I have gotten it to be put to use so I am stepping it down,” just as the hon. Member for Ningo Prampram is also saying that he is standing it down. Mr. Speaker, it should be with the permission of this House.
Mr. Speaker 10:10 a.m.
I shall go on. Question Number 472.
Binaba Health Centre
Q. 472. Mr. John A. Ndebugre asked the Minister for Health when and how management of the Binaba Health Centre in the Zebilla constituency (Bawku West District) passed from the Ghana Health Service to the Anglican Diocese of Tamale.
Mr. Owusu-Agyei 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the Binaba Health Centre was under the management of the Ghana Health Service until 12th November, 2001 when the Anglican Bishop of the Tamale- Bolgatanga Diocese requested for the centre to be officially handed over to the church.
An MOU was signed with the Ministry and the Anglican Diocese of Tamale- Bolgatanga to hand over the Health Centre to the latter, after extensive discussions with the church, based on the fact that the Anglican and the Presby churches had been very supportive towards the operations of the Health Centre. The Anglican Church often supported with drugs and non-drug consumables, equipment including a generating plant, rehabilitation of physical infrastructure and support for overseas training for staff.
The Presby Church, on the other hand, paid salaries and other allowances of staff even before the Central Government absorbed the salaries of the CHAG staff.
It was based on such benevolent activities that the health centre was handed over to the churches.
However, according to the MOU, the church may decide to relinquish the responsibility of managing and providing health services in the district at any time, but this should be done in consultation with Government to allow for smooth take-over without health hazards to the inhabitants of the area.
Mr. Ndebugre 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would like to know from the hon. Deputy Minister whether the MOU he has talked about in the Answer contains provision for monitoring the performance of the church, and if so, what the latest report indicates in that regard.
Mr. Owusu-Agyei 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the
performance of all the CHAG institutions is monitored by personnel of the Ghana Health Service - the Regional Health Director and the District Health Director. As to the current status with regard to performance, that was not originally part of the Question so unfortunately I can provide that Answer later on. I have to get in touch with the Regional Director in the Upper West Region to be able to obtain the Answer.
Mr. Ndebugre 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would
like to know from the hon. Deputy Minister for Health whether he is aware or his Ministry is aware that the management of the health centre in question has broken down completely.
Mr. Owusu-Agyei 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am
not aware of what my hon. Colleague is saying; I will have to find out.
Mr. Ndebugre 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would like to know from the hon. Deputy Minister whether his Minister, he or a representative of the Ministry will consider visiting the health centre or at worse asking for a comprehensive report from the Upper East Regional Directorate of the Ghana Health Service for his own edification and possible action.
Mr. Owusu-Agyei 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I
want to assure my hon. Colleague that I am scheduled to visit the Upper West Region in a fortnight's time and I hope to visit that health centre. But with regard to whether the hon. Minister has visited the place, I know the hon. Minister was in the
Upper West Region some time ago but I do not know whether he really visited that particular health centre.
Mr. Ndebugre 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would like to know from the hon. Deputy Minister whether he is aware that the health centre in question is located in the Upper East Region and not the Upper West Region.
Mr. Owusu-Agyei 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am sorry for the mix-up. It is located in the Upper East Region. As I told him, I would be visiting the two regions in exactly a fortnight's time and I hope to visit that health centre.
Mr. E. T. Mensah 10:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, in the Deputy Minister's answer as to whether he knows that the health centre is not functioning, he said he is not aware. I want to know whether they have a monitoring unit in the Ministry which monitors and feeds them even before they come to the floor to answer Questions.
Mr. Owusu-Agyei 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the monitoring unit of the implementing agency, Ghana Health Service is working. Really we have monitoring units in all the regions, that is why we always hear - Recently we heard on the television and radio the activities regarding the performance of each of the regions. Monitoring is done and that is why they meet regularly on annual basis or quarterly and give indications as to the performance. I know that some work has been done.

Regarding monitoring, if it had been part of this particular Question I would have been able to provide the appropriate Answer. Unfortunately, it was not part of this Question. So I will have to find out. And normally questions relating to
Mr. E. T. Mensah 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I believe he did not understand my question. If they have a monitoring unit which monitors and updates the Ministry through whichever agency and an effective networking, they will always know the state of affairs in the respective health posts. I asked whether he did not have the information with regard to his saying that he did not know what is happening in the Zebilla Health Post.
Mr. Owusu-Agyei 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the
issue is that we have several health facilities in the country. Even if you read through all the reports on all health facilities it will not be possible to remember offhand what really is the report on each of them. It is not possible. We have a very large number of health facilities spread all over the country - [Interruption.] So he expected that I should have read everything on this particular Question. Unfortunately, that information was not available to me at the time that I was coming here to answer this particular Question.
Mr. Evans Paul Aidoo 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker,
I want to know from the hon. Deputy Minister whether the facility was handed over to the Anglican Church or to the Presbyterian Church or both because in his Answer he said that it was based on such benevolent activities that the health centre was handed over to the churches. So I want to know whether the two churches are running the facility or it is the Anglican Church alone.
Mr. Owusu-Agyei 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker,
reports from the region indicate that the two churches are collaborating in managing that institution. Government provides for payment of salaries of the CHAG institutions. So it is not surprising that two churches can collaborate in managing one institution.
Mr. Speaker 10:20 a.m.
Question number 473,
and it is in the name of hon. Abdul-Rashid Pelpuo, Member of Parliament for Wa Central.
Upper West Regional Hospital (Construction)
Q. 473. Mr. Abdul-Rashid Pelpuo
asked the Minister for Health when the Upper West Regional Hospital would be constructed to relieve the Wa Municipal Hospital of the incessant pressure on it from performing the role of a Regional Hospital.
Mr. Owusu-Agyei 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the
Ministry recognizes the urgency and importance of constructing a new hospital for the Upper West Region. But at the same time, we know that the magnitude of the project cannot be implemented from the regular yearly budget of the Ministry. As such, the Ministry has been sourcing funds for this project since 2002. Unfortunately, the Ministry is yet to identify an interested financier for the project.
Mr. Pelpuo 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would like
to ask the hon. Deputy Minister whether he is aware that apart from the Wa Municipal Hospital there is no hospital anywhere else in the municipality with a population of nearly 100,000 people.
Mr. Owusu-Agyei 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, if I
got the question right, the hon. Member is asking whether Wa is the only hospital
serving the vicinity. Yes, we are aware. The fact is that because the Wa Hospital is at the moment serving both as a tertiary and a private institution every effort is being made by the Ghana Health Service to augment staff facilities at the hospital to cater for the current needs of the hospital.
Mr. Pelpuo 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, now that it is
very clear to us that there are no immediate plans to build a regional hospital, will the hon. Deputy Minister assure us that he is going to upgrade the municipal hospital to a level that will enable it to perform the duties of a regional hospital? The present status of the hospital is an eyesore; the fact that it cannot perform the functions of a regional hospital whilst it is supposed to be performing the functions of a regional hospital is serious.
Mr. Owusu-Agyei 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the
Ministry is aware that Wa has not got a regional hospital so the obvious thing to do is to upgrade and rehabilitate the existing hospital to serve as a regional and municipal hospital. At the same time that we are sourcing for funding for a regional hospital for the Upper West Region, we have plans to upgrade and to rehabilitate the current municipal hospital serving as the regional hospital to provide the required health services.
Mr. Joseph Yieleh Chireh 10:20 a.m.
Mr.
Speaker, the Minister's Answer that he has been trying to get some interested partners -- I want to know from him which organizations or which parties he has been trying to contact so far as to indicate that there is any serious effort being made to that effect.
Mr. Owusu-Agyei 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, we have had discussions with a few organizations which showed interest in supporting this particular hospital. I do not know whether this may not be the appropriate time for me to be mentioning names, but one of them was a Spanish grant. We really wanted to have this hospital constructed from funding from
the Spanish facility around the figure of about 17 million euros.
Unfortunately, that did not go through because the funding that we obtained from the Spanish grant was far lower than that. I think it was just about ten million euros and for that reason that money could not have been used for that project. So we are sourcing other funding for this project and we hope that sooner than later we should be able to obtain it.
Mr. J. K. Gidisu 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, would
it not be the situation of lack of proper repackaging of the hospital to appeal to donors that has caused the suspension, more especially when the Ministry and for that matter the Minister has come to the floor of this House to talk about other hospitals of lesser status than the Wa Hospital which are being supported by donors?
Mr. Owusu-Adjei 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, it
is not a matter of not repackaging the hospital particularly well to be able to attract funding. Every effort has been made by the Ministry. As a matter of fact when financiers come in we show them our priorities, areas where we want health facilities to be put up, then they go on inspection. But as to whether they would go ahead to support the health facility or not it is left to them. As I said, a few financiers have been taken to the site but eventually we have not been able to secure one at the moment. It is not a matter of appropriately packaging the facility in such a way as to attract financiers but a matter of course; definitely we are going to get financiers eventually for this particular project.
Mr. A. S. K. Bagbin 10:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, can the hon. Deputy Minister explain to us why part of the money from the Millennium Challenge Co-operation could not be used for the construction of
the regional hospital in the Upper West Region?
Mr. Owusu-Agyei 10:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the Millennium Challenge Account is specifically meant for certain projects and hospital construction is not part of it. That is the reason why we cannot use it now for the construction of the Wa Regional Hospital.
Mr. E. T. Mensah 10:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I want to know from the hon. Deputy Minister whether they have made any effort to access the HIPC Funds to address this important issue of a hospital for Wa.
Mr. Owusu-Agyei 10:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I said in the beginning that we recognize the importance of constructing a regional hospital for Wa, the Upper West Region. I said also that the normal budgetary resources are not adequate to support such a project. It is a very huge project. Assuming the estimated cost is about 17 million euros, as I said, this cannot be paid out of the HIPC Fund because there is a lot of pressure on the resources already available under the HIPC Fund for this particular project. So Mr. Speaker, it is not possible that we can fund this particular project from the HIPC Fund.
Mr. E. T. Mensah 10:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the last question. Mr. Speaker, since he has been complaining about the size of the budget, has he considered organizing a consortium so that he has a consortium, bits and pieces from HIPC Fund and other places to fill the drum for him to be able to develop the hospital? Has he considered putting up a consortium?
Mr. Owusu-Agyei 10:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, in actual fact we are adopting all strategies for sourcing funding, consortium-wise or whatever. So it is not a matter of sourcing
Mr. Owusu-Agyei 10:30 a.m.


only from one financier but where it is possible to get a consortium to come together to fund such a project, we shall do so. This is not the first time that we have come to that.
Mr. Speaker 10:30 a.m.
Hon. Deputy Minister for Health, thank you very much for appearing to answer these Questions. You are discharged.
STATEMENTS 10:30 a.m.

Mr. Mohammed Ibn Abass (NDC - Bimbilla) 10:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I wish to thank you for the opportunity to present a Statement to this august House on the devastating effects a recent rainstorm has had on the people of the Bimbilla constituency.
Mr. Speaker, on Friday, 3rd March, 2006 the Nanumba North District was hit with a rainstorm that caused extensive damage to life and property. Some of the areas specially affected include the Bimbilla township, Chamber and surrounding areas.
Mr. Speaker, preliminary assessment made by National Disaster Management Organisation (NADMO) puts the cost of damage as running into billions of cedis. A total number of about 3,000 people were said to have been displaced by the storm.
Properties destroyed included about 300 houses and 17 schools. Some of the schools affected are the Bimbilla Secondary School where buildings used as hostels for girls have had their roofs ripped off. The Naa Abuduli Day Care Centre, the Central Primary Schools, Our Lady of Peace Primary School, the English/Arabic JSS among others.
Mr. Speaker, this unfortunate disaster
has terribly affected a lot of people, leaving them homeless and compelling them to seek refuge with relatives and friends under very deplorable and congested conditions. Unfortunately non-natives who are mostly government workers have a difficulty in finding people to lodge with till remedy is found.
Mr. Speaker, the effects of this storm on the state of education in the district are quite alarming. As already monitored, 17 schools are affected and this have had serious consequences on the state of education in the district. In some of the affected schools, poor pupils are having lessons in the open under the hazards of the weather whilst in some cases the schools have been temporarily closed down. Educational materials such as textbooks, chalks and other curriculum materials have also been destroyed as a result of the storm.
Mr. Speaker, I wish to indicate that this pathetic situation requires urgent action from all who are in a position to help, especially Government to come to the aid of the people in order to reduce, if not alleviate, the suffering of the victims, especially the affected educational institutions to ensure the return to normal academic work.
Mr. Speaker, I wish to indicate that the NADMO has completed its preliminary assessment of the situation and damage caused. I hope that they would expedite action on sending relief to the victims. I also hope that in sending relief to the people, NADMO would as much as possible resist any political interference that would have the tendency of discriminating between beneficiaries on the basis of their political colouration.
May I also use this opportunity to call on the Ministries of Education and Sports, Water Resources, Works and Housing, the Interior and Women and Children's Affairs
to intervene and co-ordinate their efforts, programmes and activities to alleviate the suffering of the people, especially that of women and children.
Mr. Speaker, once again I thank you sincerely for the opportunity.
Mr. Kofi Karim Wumbei (NPP - Wulensi) 10:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I thank you for giving me the opportunity to lend a hand to the Statement made by my twin brother from the Bimbilla constituency. In fact, when I was in secondary school, there was a saying by the Roman Empire that when the gods are against you then everything is against you.
The hon. Member of Parliament for Bimbilla (Mr. Abass) made a Statement or asked an Urgent Question about his constituency on the hardship of a curfew imposed on Bimbilla. As if by design, that same Friday a “tsunami” struck Bimbilla destroying 17 schools and 300 houses, rendering 3,000 people homeless; in fact, it destroyed government bungalows including the District Chief Executive's residency.
In fact, Mr. Speaker, the enormity of the destruction in the Bimbilla constituency has overshadowed the destruction caused by the storm in other constituencies, especially my consti-tuency, the Wulensi constituency. Mr. Speaker, the 17 schools that were destroyed are actually in my constituency, a village called Kabreya. And Mr. Speaker, I wish to add my voice for the Government and the National Disaster Management Organization (NADMO) to give us assistance to make life meaningful for these people to go back to their normal lifestyles. In fact, economic activities in Bimbilla have almost come to a standstill as at yesterday.
Mr. Speaker, with these few words I lend my support to the Statement made
by the hon. Member.
Mr. Kojo Armah (CPP -- Evalue- Gwira) 10:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I rise to also support the Statement and to extend my condolence to the people of Bimbilla. I watched the disaster there on television yesterday and Mr. Speaker, it was not a sight that anybody should be happy about. I saw beds of students in the open; I saw the DCE's bungalow with the roof ripped off; I saw several schools with their roofs ripped off; and I believe it is such a disaster that all of us should share in their unfortunate situation.
But Mr. Speaker, my concern is about
the level of performance of our artisans. Very soon the rains will descend on us and I suspect that we will continue to have such unfortunate situations in several parts of the country. This is all because artisans who are awarded contracts to put up these buildings do shoddy work for which we continuously complain. If we watched the television footage yesterday, we could see that virtually all the schools had their roofs ripped off.
The question one ought to ask is, what kind of skills are employed in roofing buildings? These are new schools that were built supposedly with our HIPC funds and that should have lasted for some time. But one rainstorm -- my hon. Colleague called it “tsunami” -- One rainstorm comes and the whole roof is lifted up and put somewhere, as if there were no nails, as if there were no wood to even hold the nails.
I think this matter has come to the floor before, several times and we would want to appeal to the building inspectors, those who award the contracts, those who inspect the buildings as they go on to ensure that if we have to use wood, we have to use wood that is mature enough to hold the nails. And if we want to nail the roofs we have to do so in such a manner
Mrs. Alice Teni Boon (NDC -- Lambussie) 10:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would want to add my voice to the Statement made by the hon. Member for Bimbilla.
Mr. Speaker, since the disaster I observed that the hon. Member for the area looks very worried and yesterday when I confronted him, he told me that
he has been getting a lot of calls from his constituency and it bothers him a lot.
Mr. Speaker, you will bear me out that it is not an easy thing seeing what really happened on the television.
Mr. Speaker, the saddest thing about it all was what I saw, so many women with all their property out there and they had nowhere to go. You could see clearly that they had their things at the mercy of the sun and the wind and there was no protection whatsoever. I really felt it when I saw that most schools in the area, the roofs were ripped off and I do not know what will happen to the school children as at now.
If most of the buildings even had collapsed I do not know whether they will have enough trees around the area under which they could sit whilst they wait for the Government or any benevolent society or NADMO and all the District Assemblies to come to their aid. I really felt it in my heart and that is why I would want to make this statement in support of the hon. Member's appeal. I think the Government should come to the aid of the constituency quickly.
We also saw Salaga and I think that both constituencies should be supported. I know that NADMO has difficulties because it had always complained that they have little resources to manage some of these things. I think the cry is a serious one and the Government should look at it seriously, and intervene. The Ministry should intervene with regard to the schools so that they can get them some materials to re-roof the schools and maybe the buildings that have collapsed; the district can also look at it and see what support they can give them.
I would also call on the Ministry of Women and Children's Affairs to do their possible best to assist the poor women and children out there. We saw a man who was reporting on what really happened. He described the situation and said that, when his house was ripped off, his wife and children were trying to run to the other building but it collapsed. So they had to run back and it was really pathetic. So I think that the Ministry of Women and Children's Affairs should look at these issues seriously, go to their aid immediately and then see what they can do for the women and children over there.
The district would now supplement with something but I know with the district alone it is not going to be easy. I overheard the District Chief Executive say that he was going to do his little best to support them. I do not think it will be a difficult thing for them and I think that the Government should come to their aid very quickly. Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker, for the opportunity.
Deputy Minister for the Interior (Capt. Nkrabea Effah-Dartey (retd)): Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker, for giving me the opportunity to contribute to this Statement.
Mr. Speaker, the Ministry of the Interior exercises administrative responsibility for NADMO and I take into account the remarks and comments made by my hon. Colleagues concerning this organization.

Mr. Speaker, it is common knowledge that we cannot give to the National Disaster Management Organisation (NADMO) more than what Parliament has approved. Mr. Speaker, when we were debating the Budget, the Estimates for NADMO were brought to this Chamber and we looked at them; and I agree that we gave to NADMO what we could out of
Mrs. Alice Teni Boon 10:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker,
on a point of order. Mr. Speaker, the Deputy Minister for the Interior is misleading this House. Mr. Speaker, if I heard him rightly, he is saying that they cannot give anything more than what Parliament gave to NADMO. I am sorry to say that that is not true, it is incorrect. Whatever amount was approved in this House came from his Ministry. We could not have added anything to what his Ministry brought to this House.
So if they wanted to give something more than what was given to NADMO, they should have brought that amount here. We only scrutinized and approved. We did not add anything to any amount anywhere, so I think the Deputy Minister is misleading us. So let him bring more for NADMO and let us approve it for them.
Capt. Effah-Dartey (retd): Mr.
Speaker, I would not want to take issue with my hon. Sister; I will just carry on. Mr. Speaker, I think it is also important to make it very, very clear that anytime a disaster occurs, the best that we who are outside the zone of chaos, can do is to assist in an emergency relief. That is all that we can do. In terms of permanent reconstruction, it is almost always a task of the local bodies themselves.

I would therefore call on the Bimbilla

Town Council and the Nanumba North District Assembly to do all that they can, to take into account this disaster when they are preparing their budget for the year. They should take into account the need for reconstruction, they should take into account the disaster that has taken place so that they make a composite, holistic budget that will cover the reconstruction efforts.

Mr. Speaker, in real terms, when we look at what happened, I feel sorry for those who have been displaced, I feel sorry for those who are victims, the 17 schools that have been affected, the school children. Mr. Speaker, I am touched but the reality on the ground is that we must stick to building regulations; we must stick to the existing bye-laws.

Mr. Speaker, the District Assemblies must be up and doing and make sure that not only Bimbilla, not only Nanumba, not only the Northern Region but throughout this country, anybody who is doing any project, obtains permission and that the construction must be under the supervision of a consultant, or an expert. Mr. Speaker, to say that there has been a rainstorm and the roof of your building has been ripped off and therefore you are in a disastrous position -- Yes, I agree that factually you are in a disastrous position. But if the construction of the buildings had been according to the rules and regulations, the chances are that their resistance capacity to rainstorm could have been higher.

Mr. Speaker, on this note, the Ministry of the Interior wants to assure the people of Bimbilla that we are with them in this their hour of need and that we would not talk of politics at all when it comes to trying to alleviate their suffering. We shall do our best for them, in consonance with our principle of development in freedom.
Mr. Speaker 10:50 a.m.
Commencement of
Public Business. Item 5.
PAPERS 10:50 a.m.

Mr. Speaker 10:50 a.m.
Hon. Members, there is an omission; there should be (c). That is, the Report of the Committee on Poverty Reduction Strategy on the Growth and Poverty Reduction Strategy, GPRS II
2006-2009.
By the Chairman of the Committee --
Report of the Committee on Poverty Reduction Strategy on the Growth and Poverty Reduction Strategy,
GPRS II 20062009.
Mr. Speaker 10:50 a.m.
Item 6 - Motion.
Mr. A. O. Aidooh 10:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I
hear the Minister is on his way to this House, but we have arranged to have the Minister for Public Sector Reform move this motion on his behalf.
Suspension of Standing Order 80 (1)
Minister for Public Sector Reform
(Dr. Paa Kwesi Nduom) (on behalf of the Minister for Presidential Affairs): Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, that notwithstanding the provisions of Standing Order 80 (1) which require that no motion shall be debated until at least forty-eight hours have elapsed between the date on which notice of the motion is given and the date on which the motion is moved, the motion for the Second Reading of the National Identification Authority Bill may be moved today.
Mr. Kwame Osei-Prempeh 10:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to second the motion.
Question put and motion agreed to.
Resolved accordingly.
BILLS - SECOND READING 10:50 a.m.

Mr. Kojo Armah (CPP -- Evalua- Gwira) 11 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I also rise to support the Bill and I will urge hon. Members to fully support the Bill.
Mr. Speaker, as a member of the Committee that examined the Bill, my attention was drawn to a particular issue that the Electoral Commission (EC) raised. Even though the Committee had made some recommendations that they thought the issue had been overstated, I think it is an issue that ought to be properly addressed.
Mr. Speaker, the Electoral Com-mission is saying that by the Constitution, it is a constitutional body that has independence. The Bill seeks to give the Electoral Commission an institutional representation on the board of the Authority.
The Electoral Commission is concerned that if it is represented on the board, its independence might be compromised and that since the Minister also has authority to give directives to the National Identification Authority for the use of the ID cards for whatever transactions, it is afraid that its authority might be compromised thereby. I do not think we actually exhausted this matter and we thought that there should be a two- some meeting between the Electoral Commission and the promoters of this Bill to harmonize the issue.
Mr. Speaker, my concern is that elections are very thorny issues in our part of the world. In Africa, elections can be very problematic. Therefore, if we are moving in a certain direction that one key stakeholder feels concerned about, we should have time to look at that issue.
For me, I do not really think that a
representation on the board, one way or the other, will have very serious effects but as we say in legal language, “justice must not only be done, it must be seen to be done”. If there are any clouds, these clouds must be cleared so that every player in this field would feel comfortable that things had been done and that justice will be assured at the end of the day. Mr. Speaker, that is my main concern about the Report. Otherwise, the Bill is a good Bill; the Authority needs to be established so that in tandem with the Representation of the People (Amendment) Act, which has now been passed, we will clear the field for proper representation in all our national affairs.
It would also allow Ghanaian citizens to have ID cards that can be used for all purposes from the age of six upwards so that everybody can have his own unique identification number that can be used for all purposes and transactions. But I think this particular area, the little concern issued by the Electoral Commission, ought to be looked at before we can actually put these things into effect.
With these little concerns that I have expressed, I think we need to support the Bill and get it passed.
Mr. E. K. D. Adjaho (NDC - Avenor/Ave) 11 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I believe that the general purpose of the Bill is well intentioned, especially considering that Ghana would be using the data that will be generated for economic development. It is especially appropriate in this part of the world where we do not have the necessary statistics on our citizens living in this country.
Mr. Speaker, the point just made by the hon. Member for Evalue-Gwira (Mr. Kojo Armah) should be taken seriously. If you look at the Committee's Report, the statement which they described as over-
Mr. E. K. D. Adjaho (NDC - Avenor/Ave) 11:10 a.m.
statement is rather unfortunate. They did the necessary analysis but they went on to say that it was overstatement.
Mr. Speaker, there is a history behind this Bill. The first step was in the last Parliament when the issue cropped up for the first time and the Electoral Commission said that they had to repeal the law to enable a separate authority to be created for the purposes of national identification. It was their responsibility to do the national identification. Based on that, a law was brought to the last Parliament to repeal that law to create two different groups, one creating the Electoral Commission, to perform its constitutional mandate, one of which is captured in article 45 of the Constitution; and Mr. Speaker, with your permission I quote:
“ The Electoral Commission shall have the following functions -
(a) to compile the register of voters and revise it at such periods as may be determined by law.”
Mr. Speaker, therefore, if you create a situation where data from the National Identification Authority would be used, it is a matter for the Electoral Commission to decide whether to use it or not in building their own data. If you look at the whole tenor of the Bill, a certain impression is created that after the coming into effect of this law, the National Identification Card would replace the other ID cards issued by the Electoral Commission. It is rather unfortunate.
Fortunately, the Committee has recognized that in their Report. Mr. Speaker, I am referring to clause 20 of the Bill, dealing with transitional provisions. The Committee has recognized that and it
has rightly said that it should be deleted. I stand to be corrected that clause 20 should be deleted from the Bill. It is the same spirit; we should not in the Bill create any impression whether remote, directly or indirectly that the National Identification Authority is going to perform some of the functions of the Electoral Commission.

Mr. Speaker, another dangerous area, with regard to this Bill, is registration of citizens abroad. Mr. Speaker, data that would be generated by the National Identification Authority will determine who the citizens are. Therefore, to some extent, my submission is that it becomes a prima facie evidence of citizenship and therefore the possibility of the Electoral Commission using that data cannot be ruled out completely.

If that is so, how do we ensure that that process of registration outside is made transparent, is made in such a way that it does not end up creating unnecessary citizens abroad, or bloating the number of citizens that we have abroad that will form a basis of building data for purposes of voters registration? Mr. Speaker, I believe that if we are able to clear these two doubts, it will be a perfect Bill. It is well intentioned and we should all find a way of fine-tuning this Bill and have it accepted.

But Mr. Speaker, if these two areas are not clearly clarified, then we will have a problem. If you go and register citizens in a country and then you have fifty people and then the Electoral Commission decides for purposes of argument that they are going to register - the person then says that I am a registered voter, and then the person says,

“Look, this is evidence that I am a citizen of Ghana. I have been registered by the National Identification Authority, therefore that information should be used as part of the evidence that I am
Minority Leader (Mr. A. S. K. Bagbin) 11:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I also believe strongly that the concerns that are expressed, with regard to the intrusion into the independence of the Electoral Commission, are real and that this House should take them into consideration rather than waive them off as too far-fetched.
Mr. Speaker, we know that there are a number of organizations that will find the data that will be generated by the National Identification Authority useful and, therefore, those organizations should be allowed to, on their own volition, access them or not access them. But it should not be done through the directive of any authority or Minister, because that will be in direct violation of article 46 which clearly states that the Electoral Commission cannot be directed or controlled in the performance of its functions.
Mr. Speaker, that is real and I think that
rose
Mr. Speaker 11:10 a.m.
Hon. Deputy Attorney- General, do you have any point of order to raise?
Mr. Owusu-Ansah 11:10 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, a point of correction. The Authority is not going to register only Ghanaians. The Authority will register foreigners who are permanently resident in Ghana as well. That is a point of correction.
Mr. Bagbin 11:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I have not said the Authority is going to register only Ghanaians. I am talking about the area dealing with citizenship. I know that it is talking about nationals and, in fact, if he was at the committee meeting, I tried drawing the attention of the Authority to the differences between nationals and citizens. So I am fully aware of the differences.
But I am saying that in registering nationals, including citizens, there is difficulty in identifying citizens because of the nature of our provisions on citizenship. And in fact, the Authority, led by the Chief Executive, Professor Dumor, stated that
they were getting a team of experts and senior citizens to try as much as possible to come to a consensus as to what constitutes citizenship.
Mr. Speaker, that was what we were told and that is a difficult area to accept, because I cannot understand the authority of experts and senior citizens defining what citizenship is. I think that that should be an area for the courts, especially as that is a matter that is very complex, when we refer to the case involving the son of Gilchrist Olympio who was declared to be a Ghanaian because his grandfather was a Ghanaian.
Therefore, there is a real difficulty here and as a country, as a people, we should be hesitant in pushing through some of these things without consensus. And I would call for us to build consensus on this issue so that the data that would be captured by the National Identification Authority will be data that is credible, respected and accepted by all.
Mr. Speaker, when I am talking about all, I am not talking about hundred per cent of all Ghanaians, but that definitely there will be massive endorsement of that data that is captured. Especially when you look at article 7, which deals with Ghanaians marrying outside, both males and females and their offspring, if my hon. good Friend, Dr. Nduom is married outside - [Interruptions] - Oh! I said if -- [Laughter.]

Mr. Speaker, if I should not use hon. Dr. Nduom, I am told I could use a woman called Stella. If Stella decides to marry any person outside Ghana who is a non-Ghanaian -- [Interruptions.] My good- self? Yes, all right -- the offspring thereby are Ghanaians. There is a difficulty in trying to get who is a Ghanaian because definitely it is even not possible to get the

number that are married outside.
Mr. Speaker 11:20 a.m.
Chairman of the Committee, do you have a point of order to raise?
Mr. K. Osei-Prempeh 11:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, unfortunately the hon. Minority Leader seems to be throwing dust around. Mr. Speaker, the Constitution is the supreme law of the land. Everybody knows that citizenship is acquired either by birth or through registration. If article 7 of the Constitution gives somebody the right to become a Ghanaian through marriage, I do not see the problem that it will create for his offspring.
If I am married to a foreigner and he is registered by virtue of that marriage and becomes a Ghanaian, his children or my children and her children are Ghanaians just by the Constitution. Where is the conflict? There is no conflict. The Minority Leader is trying to create, I would not use mischief. I mean, it seems that he is creating a confusion, which does not exist. It is only in his mind and I believe that he should have regard to the Constitution.
Mr. Bagbin 11:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the problem we have sometimes is one of fixation. The issue I am raising is one of identification. I am not throwing dust into the eyes of any person but it is just that there is a fixation and therefore when you are talking, people are unprepared to listen to the choice of words. I am raising an issue of identification -- how to identify them and register them. That is what I am
Minister for Education and Sports (Mr. Yaw Osafo-Maafo) 11:20 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the National Identification Authority or identification, for that matter, of citizens of this country and those residing here is something we should have done long ago. And I am happy to note that it was really started during Busia's time but interrupted up and down.
Mr. Speaker, we have very serious identification problems which impede a lot of transactions in this country. Frauds are multiplied just because people getting involved in agreement can vary from place to place, and if you happen to travel and you leave something behind for somebody else to continue you will find that identifying those you are dealing with becomes a problem for the one who took over from you, because in this country we do not have common identification.
I do agree that we should make sure that in implementing this identification proogramme, the Electoral Commission office is properly insulated. There is no doubt about it. But it is also true to say that when identification is done and done properly, the first authority to jump at it will be the Electoral Commission itself.
Taking the budget of the Electoral Commission, during the last elections we spent about ¢240 billion. Which component of this budget comes through the identification exercise? If you do this preliminary work and it is done properly, in fact, the cost of elections in this country will drop drastically because you would have done certain fundamental work that will be available for the Electoral Commission at its own volition to use. Therefore, I agree that all of us should think through its implementation to make sure that it is usable by all who may need
it.
Mr. Speaker, I am very much worried about even the financial sector. We have tried several times, in loan administration, to deal with identification and it has not been easy. If you know the number of bad loans that have arisen because of lack of identification, you would have seen that this Bill is really important.
Mr. Speaker, I pose the question. All our neighbours in the French-speaking countries have identification (ID) cards. What is there that makes the Ivorians, the Togolese, to be able to administer ID cards and effectively use them for their national transactions but Ghana is not able? Mr. Speaker, I believe very strongly that we should not throw the baby out with the bath water. We should look at it, it is important, we need it; it is part of development.
All over the world we travel; you all travel. Do you ever go to a place where you need your passport to be identified? The answer is no. If you are involved in an accident or there is a problem, you just pull your ID card and off you go. They just take your number from your ID card and the transaction is completed.
Mr. Speaker, there is no doubt that the National Identification Authority Bill is very important. To me, it should have taken place long ago but it is better to be late than never. Let us think through it, on a bipartisan manner; let us look at it as a Parliament. Let us look at it as Ghanaians and let us come out with an Identification Authority Bill that will answer most of our questions when it comes to identification, including even the Office of the Electoral Commission, because it is going to make things cheaper as we move along.
Mr. Speaker, with these comments, I want to throw my weight behind the Bill.
Mr. E. T. Mensah (NDC -- Ningo/
Prampram): Mr. Speaker, I also rise to support this Bill but the little concerns that I have, almost all the things that I wanted to say have been said; it is about the use of the data which will be available.
We are talking about the various agencies but my worry is knowing what elections bring about at the end of elections in our part of the subregion. For the moment, I believe that we should not allow the Electoral Commission to access that information. If they want to gather information for electoral purposes, they have to do it because they have been remotely compelled to use the information.
I think that we should be very certain about that for now because we are developing and there would be a stage where we would have a totally and truly independent Electoral Commission which can access all kinds of data or information from whatever source. But for now, given our history, where we are coming from, as a subregion, now even as a country per se, we should be very grateful about just allowing the Electoral Commission to use the data like all other organizations.
Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. With this contribution I support the motion.
Mr. Speaker 11:30 a.m.
The Minister may wind up.
rose
Mr. Speaker 11:30 a.m.
Are you winding up? The Minister to wind up.
Minister for Presidential Affairs (Mr. Kwadwo Mpiani) 11:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am happy to notice that both sides of the House accept that it is very important
for this country to put in place a National Identification Authority to issue identify cards to all Ghanaians as well as non- Ghanaians resident in the country. After listening to hon. Members, I realize that we are very much aware of the importance of this Bill. However, Mr. Speaker, some issues have been raised and I would want to touch on two of them.
First, citizenship. I believe the law describes who a citizen of Ghana is. I was a little disturbed when I heard that my officer came here to state that senior citizens of the country would determine who a citizen is. If he said that, I am sorry it must be withdrawn. Citizenship of this country is prescribed by the Constitution and I believe this is not the first time we are describing who a citizen is. We have used it on many occasions and I believe on this occasion too we should be able to use the law as it is, to determine who a citizen is.
I agree that there may be grey areas but I believe registration will be taking place in cities and villages and wherever there are problems, I believe citizens of those areas will be able to come together to determine whether a particular person is a citizen of this nation or not.
Mr. Speaker, the most important one is about the use of the data by the Electoral Commission. The most important thing is what the Minority Leader said, that we must have data that will be credible and accepted by all. Mr. Speaker, if you have data that which is credible and accepted by all, why should we allow an Electoral Commissioner to come to this House to demand money to go and prepare another data which even may not be acceptable to all citizens of this country?
Mr. Speaker, we have had experience in this country where all of us here, both sides, challenged people who might have
Mr. Bagbin 11:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, we are simply drawing the attention of the Minister because his choice of words, “why should we allow an Electoral Commission to come . . ., why should we allow” - you see, article 46 says that in the performance of his duty, the EC is not subject to the direction or control of any person or authority. That is the one we are drawing attention to. It should be allowed on its own to access it or not to access it. We have to try to convince them that it will be more prudent for us to use credible data, but we cannot compel them; that is all what we are saying.
Mr. Mpiani 11:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I just asked why they should be allowed, because I heard the hon. Member for Ningo Prampram (Mr. E. T. Mensah) stating that they should not use that data. I think that will be a wrong proposition.
Mr. E. T. Mensah 11:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I was cautioning that there is a default, if you like, a transitional period, where - Once you talk about the credibility of the register through transparent methods, I do not have a problem. But for a period, there is a need for us to be very careful because they can be remotely compelled. We are saying that they can access the data themselves but they can be remotely compelled. That was what I said.
Mr. Speaker 11:30 a.m.
Yes, all right, Minister please.
Mr. Mpiani 11:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am just appealing to this House that we should look at the issues dispassionately. I intentionally quoted the Minority Leader because I think he said the right thing; that data which is credible and accepted by all -- When we have data which is credible and accepted by all, as a nation we
should ask ourselves, do we have to spend more money for somebody to collect this data again. Do we have the luxury of spending thaty money? This is all that I want to bring out. The independence of the Electoral Commission, Mr. Speaker, I want to assure hon. Members, has been given and they have it and I do not think anybody can challenge that.
The basis of democracy is this independence and I want to assure hon. Members that this Government sincerely believes in that. All that we are trying to say is that it will be even in the interest of that Electoral Commission to access such credible information; it will make their work easier. It will be less expensive to the State and whatever comes out of elections, I believe, will be accepted by all because the information or the data is credible and accepted.
Mr. Speaker, with these, I would want to thank hon. Members for the support and I want to assure the House that anything to be done under this Bill, when it becomes an Act, will be done on bi-partisan basis.
Question put and motion agreed to.
The National Identification Authority Bill was accordingly read a Second time.
Mr. Speaker 11:30 a.m.
Item 8 - Motions - Minister for Presidential Affairs.
Suspension of Standing Order 128 (1)
Mr. Mpiani 11:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, that notwithstanding the provisions of Standing Order 128 (1) which require that when a Bill has been read a Second time it shall pass through a Consideration Stage which shall not be taken until at least forty-eight hours have elapsed, the Consideration Stage of the National Identification Authority Bill may be taken today.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 11:30 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I
beg to second the motion.
Question put and motion agreed to.
Resolved accordingly.
Mr. Speaker 11:30 a.m.
Hon. Members, we now move to item 9 on the Order Paper - National Identification Authority Bill - at the Consideration Stage.
BILLS - CONSIDERATION STAGE 11:30 a.m.

Mr. Osei-Prempeh 11:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, clause 2, subclause (3), delete and insert “national identity cards issued under this Act shall be used in all relevant transactions which require identification”.
Mr. Speaker, the reason for this amendment is based on concerns raised by the Electoral Commission which feared that if this is put in, the hon. Minister may direct that they compulsorily use it, but we thought that we should make it neutral so that anybody who finds it useful to use it will use it. Therefore we decided to propose this amendment to the House. Mr. Speaker, I beg to move.
Mr. Osafo-Maafo 11:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, may I crave the indulgence of the hon. Chairman that the word “relevant” there may not be necessary. If we said “national identification cards issued under this Act shall be used in all transactions which require identification”, the word “relevant” is needless.
Mr. Kenneth Dzirasah 11:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, the word “shall” in line 2 of the proposed amendment creates a sense of compulsion. It means therefore that if the Electoral Commission is one of those institutions that may use the national identification for purposes of compiling an electoral roll, then they are bound to do it by this provision. That is what we have been trying to do all along.
Mr. Speaker, it is important to acknowledge that registration for the purposes of election is optional. I do not have to register, but under this law it is compulsory to register as a citizen. What it means is that when the National Identification Authority has its register and the Electoral Commission is bound by the provision to take it, we will have a situation where those who are not even interested in registering as voters will have their names on the electoral roll. This will defeat the essence of our concern that the electoral roll continues to be bloated.
So in the circumstances, I will propose that in place of the “shall” we should allow the “may” in which sense should the Electoral Commission decide on its own to pick the register, it can pick it and it will not be bound or compelled by any law to use the register, that will be compiled by the National Identification Authority.
Let us not forget that after issuing the ID Card, the National Identification Authority has a register which the Electoral Commission may access and that is the possibility that will exist in case they decide to adopt a very easy way of registering voters. And in that event Mr. Speaker, as I said, I would like to repeat that people who may not even be interested in voting will find their names on the electoral roll and that is not safe.
Mr. A. O. Aidooh 11:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I have

listened to the views expressed by my hon. Friend on the other side. On the face of it, it will not make much difference if we use the word “may” instead of “shall”.

Another point is that any Ghanaian or any person who will be holding the ID Card after it has been effected is a Ghanaian; any person who will have an ID Card issued by the Authority for Ghanaian citizens is a Ghanaian and that is how it should be treated.

If the Electoral Commission intends to compile a voters' register, what the law is saying is that if I proceed I must be able to identify myself as a Ghanaian, as he said, and then that card would be the evidence. But if I do not intend to register I will not go there and my name will not be in the register. But if I intend to register and I go there, my evidence of citizenship is the ID Card issued by the Authority.

So what he is saying is not right, that the word “shall” will by all means mean that everybody will have his name on the register. That will still be optional; if I do not go to the centre to register, my name will not be there even though my name will be in the register of the Authority. And therefore there is no reason why we should tamper with the word “shall”. That will be the best evidence of identity after the law is in effect.

Mr. Speaker, I will therefore support the amendment. Let us leave it as it is because after the ID Card have been issued that will be the most authentic form of identity for citizenship. Therefore, it is not true that once it is issued and the word is “shall”, then automatically your name will be on the Electoral Commission roll; it is not true.

The Electoral Commission will have

your name in its register if you proceed there to register as a voter; your evidence of citizenship is ID Card. If you do not go there, your name will not be on the Electoral Commission's register. I therefore support the amendment and urge my hon. Colleagues to support it in that light as well.
Mr. A. S. K. Bagbin 11:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I think the hon. Deputy Majority Leader has missed the point because when you possess the National Identity Card, you are known as a national and not necessarily a citizen - [Interruption] - We are talking about national identi-fication and not citizenship identification; it is national.
Now when you have that ID Card, you are a national of Ghana, you could be a citizen or a non-citizen. Now when you talk about register, register for voting, that is for citizens. Mr. Speaker, if the bodies are compelled by the word “shall” to use that data, even if the data is restricted to only citizens, they are collecting the data from that Authority concerning citizens.
Mr. Speaker 11:40 a.m.
Order!
Mr. Bagbin 11:40 a.m.
The words are saying that “national identity cards issued under this Act shall be used in all transactions which require identification”. In registration we require identification; in voting we require identification, that is why we send our polling agents there to be able to identify. So I am saying that if that body is compelled to use the data from the Authority, it will include names of people who will otherwise not agree to register to vote. [Interruption.]
Mr. Speaker 11:40 a.m.
All right, you have raised a point, let him answer.
Mr. A. O. Aidooh 11:40 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I think my hon. Colleague is rather getting the point wrongly. What we are trying to do here is not to give the data to the Electoral Commission, no; it is the card which should be taken there for the purpose of identification. The data of the Authority will not be given to the Electoral Commission if they do not want it. The Electoral Commission will have to compile the voters' register in view of the proposed division of clause 20.
The data being compiled by the Authority may not automatically be released by the Electoral Commission. And it is not true that if I do not want to register as a voter, the data will be with the Electoral Commission and therefore my name will be there as a voter. There is a difference between registration for voting and the process of voting; I think he knows that. That is why, I still stand by my position. I think my hon. Colleagues have got it wrong. The card being issued is evidence of citizenship but it is not necessarily the ultimate card for registration; it cannot be so.
Mr. Kwadwo Adjei-Darko 11:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, it looks as if we are confusing the data with the possession of the card. Mr. Speaker, there have been allegations during registration of voters with regard to under- aged people registering. Sometimes some are challenged to bring birth certificates, but if you look at the births and deaths registration, it was only in 2004 that we even had 51 per cent birth registration.
So if we have a card which gives every information about us and we go in to register with the Electoral Commission -- Because this Bill is not saying that we are substituting the Electoral Com-mission's registration card with the National Identity Card but we will go there to register.
Once you produce your card, it gives every information about you, even your age and therefore there will even be no room for people challenging whether you are a Ghanaian, or whether you are under-aged and setting up commissions and committees to review petitions and so on. So this is just a card to facilitate any transaction including registration of voters by the Electoral Commission and the issuance of ID cards for election purposes by the Electoral Commission. Therefore, there is no conflict or compulsion about the Electoral Commission being compelled to use this and so on.
You are going to register and you have to show that you are a Ghanaian and you are 18 years and above; you do not have a birth certificate -- this is your card as a citizen and your date of birth and everything on it. So there is no challenge and the Electoral Commission goes on to register you and that is what this is seeking to do.
Mr. Bagbin 11:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I just want to conclude because what they raised are points of order. Mr. Speaker, I was making a submission and they raised points of order. “National identity cards issued under this Act shall be used in all relevant transactions which require identification”. There is a proposal to remove “relevant”. Now, Mr. Speaker, the data definitely will segregate a number of areas. One of the areas will be citizens from 18 years and above and that will form a data that could be captured by the Electoral Commission.
The Electoral Commission will now be using this data as a basis for registration of
Mr. Speaker 11:50 a.m.
Hon. Minority Leader, we are dealing with this amendment. What do you suggest?
Mr. Bagbin 11:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I suggested “may” and not “shall”.
Mr. Speaker 11:50 a.m.
Chairman of the Committee, what do you suggest? Is it acceptable to you?
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 11:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, I believe that it should be “shall”. The reason is simple. One, we are not doing this for election purposes alone. Mr. Speaker, if a police officer accosts somebody and says “who are you?” if you have the ID card -- What this means is that the only issue of identification is the National Identification Card (NID) because with that they can only punch a button to the
NID Centre and it will show your details that you are Mr. Kwasi Mensah.
Mr. Speaker, if that is not there and they ask the person, “Who are you?” and he says “I am Kwasi Mensah and this is my passport”, the passport can be accepted if we make it “may”. But we are putting a compulsion in there so that for every transaction which is relevant what we will demand is this one.
Mr. Speaker, what we are saying is for election purposes. If I am going to my constituency at Kwaman to register, nobody may ask me even to provide my ID card. But if somebody challenges me that I am not a Ghanaian, what will be required is the National ID card. I cannot pull my passport and say that I am a Ghanaian, I have a passport. What will be required is the National ID card because that can easily be ascertained; that is why it should be “shall”. If we make it optional it means that if I go to the registration centre, if I go to the bank, if I am arrested by the police for anything and I am asked to produce something and I say, “Well, this is my passport, this is my Parliament workers' card or this is my . . .” - Mr. Speaker, that will be con-fusing.
If you are accosted in la Cote d'Ivoire or Togo or any francophone country, what they ask you is your Carte d'Identite that is the most essential one -- a card to identify you; and it is universal so we are not going to create various forms of identification. If you have a National ID it becomes supreme so that if we want to know your identity it is the one which will operate. We should not leave room for people to say that “I have my bank ID Card, “I have this ID Card and that ID Card”. We should not only focus our attention on the elections because what hon. Bagbin and hon. Dzirasah are saying may not arise at all and they are not relevant. I believe that it should be “shall”.
Mr. E. K. Salia 11:50 a.m.
Mr. Speaker, from
what the Chairman of the Committee is saying it means that if this Bill is passed and I am travelling anywhere and I do not have my citizenship identity, card and I have any other form of identity, it shall not be acceptable to those who are demanding it. I do not think that is fair because in other countries when you are asked to produce an identity, you can even use your driver's licence, you can use any other form of identity apart from the citizenship identity card. It is on the basis of this that I think that it should not be compulsory for it to be the only document to use to identify oneself.
You can use your passport, you can use your driver's licence, you can use your school identity card or any other form of identity that you have. It should not be restricted only to the citizenship identity card. I do not think it is fair and I do not think it will work in this country. This is a new thing. The French that he is using as a example, this has been from their birth. It has been a system that has been in place for all these years so everybody is given an identity card and it would take some time for all Ghanaians to have this citizenship identity card and to get used to carrying it everywhere, otherwise most people would lose their ID Cards anywhere.
Mr. Kwadwo Mpiani noon
Mr. Speaker, I am just a little bit disturbed that we seem to be driven by the Electoral Commission (EC) instead of looking at the merits of the thing. Mr. Speaker, this is National Identification Authority Bill and issuing of national identification cards. All we are saying is that even if we use the EC as an example, if the EC decides that they are going to register every citizen and it is a condition that you must prove your nationality, all what we are saying is that
produce your national identity card to prove that you are a citizen of this country.
I think that is all what we are saying. Even if they decide to register everybody, if they say we do not have use of this data and that we are going to register everybody - It says the condition of the EC is that before you are registered you must prove that you are a citizen of Ghana. All what we are saying is that it is compulsory on you to produce your identity card to prove that you are a national of this country.
Mr. Speaker, we are not guinea pigs in this. The hon. Minister for Education and Sports will bear me out. I was with him in Germany sometime ago and we were stopped by the police and the first question the Police asked was that everybody in there should show his or her identity card. It was compulsory. I had to tell them I am not a citizen of Germany and I was asked to produce an identity which was my passport. Unfortunately, I did not have my passpont on me and if he had not intervened I would have been detained. Please, do not let us be driven only by the EC.
If we make it “may” it defeats the whole purpose of the Bill, because if you cannot compel somebody to produce his identity, then what is the purpose of the Bill? So Mr. Speaker, let us look at it, nobody is saying that the EC should do this. But in anything which involves showing one's nationality, it is compulsory that one should show one's national identity card, this is all what we are saying.
Mr. Dzirasah noon
Mr. Speaker, I raised
the issue and my concern was prompted by a statement that the Minister for Presidential Affairs made to the effect that why should this House approve colossal sums for the registration of voters when there is a list of Ghanaians properly identified under the National Identification
rose
Mr. Speaker noon
Hon. Minister, do you have a point of order?
Mr. Mpiani noon
Yes, Mr. Speaker. I was just asking the House to think about an issue of that nature. I was not saying that it is a policy of Government; I was asking the House to reflect that if we have a credible - We should think about it. Would it be appropriate for the House? If we all believe that we have a credible database which is accepted by all, the House should reflect and think whether it is appropriate for the House to vote money for EC to go and do it; I was just asking the House to reflect on this.
Mr. Speaker noon
Yes, please wind up.
Mr. Dzirasah noon
Yes, I will do so.
Mr. Speaker, you see, when very senior officials of Government come to the floor of the House and make statements we should be putting them to strict proof.
Mr. Speaker, the point I would want to make is this, if we admit that registration as a voter is not compulsory and the EC must use -- the word is “must” -- the data that is compiled by the National Identification Authority, it means that there are so many names in the register which will not be relevant for the purposes of the voting which also means that the EC must necessarily compile a voters register.
So what will be the use of the Authority's register to the EC if it is going to compile its own register anyway? So reference
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu noon
Mr.
Speaker, my hon. Colleague on the other side is clearly misunderstanding the import of this provision. There is nothing here that compels the EC to use the data; there is nothing here. Mr. Speaker, in any event the reaction of the Minister for Presidential Affairs was to the statement by my hon. Colleague from Ningo Prampram who said that the EC must not be allowed to use the data, which I thought was outrightly outrageous. Why should the EC be prevented if they deem it fit for using the - Mr. Speaker, that will even amount to controlling EC if they deem it fit to use the information but then we should make a law to prevent them from using the information. That rather would infringe on the Constitution.
So Mr. Speaker, I believe that this is an innocuous matter. Indeed, there is nothing here in this provision which says that the EC must be compelled. Initially, I thought I understood the issue raised by my hon. Colleague, Mr. Kenneth Dzirasah, in the use of the word “shall”. But Mr. Speaker, let us leave out the EC which has become contentious. Are we saying that the banks, all other institutions should not be compelled to use it as a matter of identifying who a Ghanaian is?
If we use “may” that will be the import of it and that will render useless this Bill that we are making. So I think that, Mr. Speaker, with respect, you have heard enough and the Question must now be put.
Mr. Speaker noon
Yes, but let the hon.
Member for South Tongu finish his arguments. This was a point of order unless you have finished.
Mr. Dzirasah noon
Mr. Speaker, I have
finished.
Mr. Speaker noon
All right, then I will put
the Question. I think we have debated this for too much.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
That:
“subclause (3), delete and insert ‘national identity cards issued under this Act shall be used in all relevant transactions which require identification'.”
Mr. A. S. K. Bagbin noon
Mr. Speaker, earlier on the hon. Minister for Education and Sports moved an amendment to this one, deleting “relevant” which was accepted by the Chairman of the Committee but the Question you put did not take notice of that.
Mr. Speaker noon
Yes, that is so; it was not
my impression that he accepted it.
Mr. E. T. Mensah noon
Did you accept
the removal of the “relevant”? I have an objection to that; we must retain the “relevant” because it settles all the issues that we are talking about.
Mr. Speaker noon
Hon. Members, let us
continue, there is a further amendment.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh noon
Mr. Speaker,
I beg to move, clause 2, subclause (4), delete and insert the following:
“The Authori ty shall public periodically in the national Gazatte as provided for in regulations issued under this Act, a list of all State institutions which utilize data generated by the Authority.”
Mr. Speaker, the original rendition in the Bill is that the subvented agencies and other bodies designated by the Minister
shall publish the Gazette. Mr. Speaker, the Committee was of the view that we should remove that from the role of the Minister and put there a situation where it will come before Parliament into our regulations so that Parliament will at every particular time know institutions which are using the data.
Mr. Speaker, that is the rationale and I beg move.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Clause 2 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I did rise up and I could not catch your eye, but it is a small matter that I wanted us to consider.
Mr. Speaker 12:10 p.m.
Which clause?
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, it is in respect of clause 2 (4) that we just went through.
Mr. Speaker 12:10 p.m.
Unfortunately, we have finished with that.
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, it is just a minor thing. Instead of letting us go through it at the Second Consideration Stage - It is a minor matter.
Mr. Speaker 12:10 p.m.
But this has been carried; what do we do?
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:10 p.m.
With respect, Mr. Speaker, if we have to go through it during the Second Consi- deration - [Interruption.]
Mr. Speaker 12:10 p.m.
Let us do it later.
Clause 3 - Governing body of the Authority.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 12:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, clause 3, subclause (1), paragraph (b), delete “not below a rank equivalent to the rank of a Director in the Civil Service”.
Mr. Speaker, the reason is that we were told that in some of the institutions mentioned there, like the Births and Deaths Registry, the only Director there is the head and he has two terms. At the end of his two terms nobody from the Registry can represent the Births and Deaths Registry and therefore it is better to free their hands so that if the Director or the boss is not there anybody or any other suitable employee can represent the Registry on the Board. I beg to move.
Mr. Osafo-Maafo 12:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to support this amendment. You go to some Ministries and there is only one Director, and we have laws which restrict people below this rank and therefore this same person is put on so many boards, and I do not think it is fair for the system. We even have that problem in the Ministry of Education and Sports. It is not all the time that you have certain ranking officials available. So we do not want to load the few there with all the directives, leave it to the discretion of the management of the place.
So I support this position of “not below” and whatnot. I think we should give discretion to whoever is managing the institution to get a suitable person to represent the institution.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 12:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, clause 3, subclause (1), paragraph (b), subparagraph (iv), delete all the words after “Deaths” and insert “Registry”.
Mr. Speaker, this is because the
Department of Births and Deaths is no more a Department; it is a Registry; that is the official title. It is the Births and Deaths Registry, not Births and Deaths Department. I beg to move.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 12:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, clause 3, subclause (1), paragraph (b) add a new subparagraph as follows:
“Nat ional Heal th Insurance Commission”.
Mr. Speaker, from the National Identification Authority we were told that the institutional representations there are made of frontline users, those who would primarily use the data captured by the national identification system and the Committee believes that the National Health Insurance Commission would be one of such prime users and therefore they be added to the governing board. Mr. Speaker, I therefore move that the National Health Insurance Commission be added to subclause (1).
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Mr. J. Y. Chireh 12:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I raised the issue of clause 3 (1) (e) which says “three other persons nominated by the President . . .” I proposed an amendment to it and the Committee agreed, but only that they reduced the number from two women to one woman and I think that it should be “three other persons nominated by the President, one of whom must be a woman”.
Mr. Speaker 12:10 p.m.
Chairman of the Committee, what do you say to this?
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 12:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I have no objection to that. In fact, it was an oversight and we agreed at the Committee.
Mr. Mpiani 12:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I think the hon. Chairman should look at the figures again. If we have the three there, then we are going to have a Board of twelve members, but I think we should have an odd number so that if it comes to voting we would not have any problem, unless we want to give a casting vote to the Chairman, which is also not very right in these instances.
Mr. Speaker 12:20 p.m.
Hon. Minister for
Presidential Affairs, I think the point that he was making was to retain the three, but include one woman out of the three. Is it not the point you were making? Yes, that is not going to change the composition.
Mr. Mpiani 12:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, what I am
saying is that if we maintain the three, then we are going to have a Board of twelve; that would be an even number and that is not right. So we can either decide to have two or four so as to have an odd number for the Board members.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 12:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker,
I get what the hon. Minister is saying. What it means is that with the inclusion of the National Health Insurance Council the membership becomes twelve so we may decide to make the “(e)” “two other persons nominated by the President or four other persons nominated by the President one of whom shall be a woman” so that the membership becomes thirteen. So we should reduce it to “two other persons nominated by the President one of whom shall be a woman . . .”, I believe we agree to that.
Mr. Speaker 12:20 p.m.
Let me get it, that is the
last one you are thinking of, four other persons, one of whom shall be a woman. Is that what you are saying?
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 12:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, no,
“ . . . two other persons nominated by the President one of whom shall be a woman.
Mr. Speaker 12:20 p.m.
Not three, two?
Mr. E. K. Salia 12:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, before
Mr. Speaker 12:20 p.m.
Hon. Member for Jirapa,
let us deal with this and maybe come to that later.
Mr. Salia 12:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, my point is
Mr. Speaker 12:20 p.m.
I have noted your point
but I said let us deal with these three or two persons first.
Mr. S. N. A. Attoh 12:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker,

Question put and amendment agreed

to.
Mr. Speaker 12:20 p.m.
Yes, hon. Member for
Jirapa, we have now come to your turn.
Mr. Salia 12:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I was drawing your attention to the fact that in the main
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 12:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, the Committee disagreed with the Electoral Commission's contention that if the hon. Minister gives direction of a general nature to the Board, it would be affecting them, it would be giving directions to them. Mr. Speaker, any directions given by the hon. Minister would be going to the Board or going to the National Identification Authority and not the Electoral Commission. Therefore we find that law untenable and disagree, that is why we do not effect any amendment to that effect. We believe that the EC is very important and they should play a role -- they should have a representative on the Authority. That is the view of the Commission and we leave it to the House.
Mr. Speaker 12:20 p.m.
Is it your case that it should be retained or not? Hon. Chairman of the Committee, I just want - [Interruption.]
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 12:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, the Electoral Commission should be maintained on it; we believe that it is in the national interest.
Mr. F. A. Agbotse 12:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, the explanation they gave is that as a constitutional Commission they do not want to be on the Board to take directives from the hon. Minister. It would be in violation of the Constitution. I think that would be compelling them to be on the Board, that is what they do not want - [Interruption.]
Mr. Yaw Osafo-Maafo 12:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, if you look at the institutions which are represented, these are institutions with know-how in data collection, in managing data, et cetera. I do not see why that know-how within the Electoral Commission should not be put at the disposal of the nation, if the need arises, and they cannot decide that they would not provide the know-how to this nation. If you look at those who are there, Ghana Statistical Service, Social Security and National Insurance Trust (SSNIT), Births and Deaths Registry, all these institutions are there because they have something to do with data collection and processing. Electoral Commission has a store of know- how, a knowledge in data collection and in processing and they should put this at the disposal of the nation. Therefore, they should not opt out; they should not be allowed to opt out.
Alhaji Sumani Abukari 12:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I think that at the committee level, we agreed that we should delete the Electoral Commission; the reason being that as they said, they do not want their independence to be compromised.
Mr. Speaker, if you look at the Bill carefully, the hon. Minister has the right to give directives to the Authority, as and when to do what they should do, how to operate and all that. And Mr. Speaker, that does not stop the Electoral Commission from compiling their own electoral row. Even if this identification row is compiled, they can compile an independent electoral row devoid of whatever list that this row have.
So Mr. Speaker, what they are saying is that the hon. Minister has been given certain powers to authorize the Board to do certain things in certain ways. Mr. Speaker, they are saying that they do not want to be on a Board where the hon. Minister would authorize them to do certain things contrary to their
operations -- as a constitutional body, that would compromise their constitutional independence.
Mr. Speaker, the Electoral Com- mission's independence has been guaranteed by the Constitution and we should all see to it that it is in our interest, all of us, that that independence is maintained. It should not be subject to any Minister or the Executive. Mr. Speaker, I think most of us at the meeting agreed that we delete the EC; if they do not want to be there, they should not be there.
Fortunately for the Authority, the Executive Secretary or the Chief Executive Officer (CEO) of the Authority is a former high ranking member of the Electoral Commission with responsibility for compiling these things. Therefore, he has all the wealth of experience and he can put it at the disposal of the Authority.
Secondly, nothing stops the Authority at any time they want, from consulting the Electoral Commission; they can consult them without necessarily they being on the Board. So Mr. Speaker, we think that for the independence of the Board, let us delete the “Electoral Commission” and allow their Chairman to put his experience at the disposal of the Authority. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Nana Akomeah 12:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I find it difficult to understand how the independence of the Electoral Commission can be compromised because a member of the Electoral Commission is a member of this Board. It is not the Electoral Commission boss or whoever; it is a representative of the Electoral Commission. Therefore, if the Electoral Commission is represented on this Board, how does that compromise the independence of the Electoral Commission? Members of Parliament here are members of Boards and we are
independent -- [Interruption.] How does - [Interruption.]
Mr. Speaker 12:20 p.m.
Order! Order!
rose
Mr. Speaker 12:20 p.m.
Hon. Member for Tamale South, do you have a point of order to raise?
Mr. Haruna Iddrisu 12:30 p.m.
I am on a point of order and Mr. Speaker has recognized me. Mr. Speaker, I very much appreciate the concern the hon. Member is raising but if we refer to clause 10 - Ministerial Directives under the Bill that is being considered -- one can understand the apprehension of the Electoral Commission; and with your permission, I will quote clause 10 as it is in the Bill:
“The Minister may give directives to the Board of a general character relating to the performance of the functions of the Authority . . .”
This clearly means that the Authority would be subject to ministerial directions. The Electoral Commission's basis for being apprehensive is founded in article 46 of the Constitution, that they shall not be subject to any directive. So I think that my very good Friend should advert his mind to clause 10 as will subsequently be considered and then we delete “Electoral Commission”, to put this matter to rest, Mr. Speaker.
Nana Akomea 12:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, my
understanding is that the Electoral Commission will not be compromised in its duties if it is represented on this Board. And like the hon. Minister for Education and Sports said, we need the expertise of the Electoral Commission. I do not believe that their independence would be compromised.
rose
Mr. Speaker 12:30 p.m.
Hon. Minority Leader -
Mr. Bagbin 12:30 p.m.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, just to -
Nana Akomea 12:30 p.m.
Is it a point of order?
Mr. Bagbin 12:30 p.m.
Yes, point of order.
Parliament is not a constitutionally independent body; Parliament is not. We are not a constitutionally independent body in the performance of our functions; it is different from the Electoral Commission, which is said to be an independent body in the performance of its functions. In legislation, we legislate with the President - that is constitutional. In our composition, there is fusion of Parliament and the Executive, that is why it is the hybrid. So it is a different thing from the Electoral Commission that we are talking about.
Mr. Speaker 12:30 p.m.
Hon. Member for
Okaikoi South - [Interruptions] - You were on your feet or are you yielding to the hon. Minister for Education and Sports?
Nana Akomea 12:30 p.m.
Yes.
Mr. Osafo-Maafo 12:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker,
the clause 10 which was quoted is just misleading all of us. It reads:
“The Minister may give directives to the Board of a general character relating to the performance of functions of the Authority that appear to the Minister to be required
Mr. Mpiani 12:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, it looks
as though we are all looking at just the negative aspect of saying that the Electoral Commission should not be taking data from the National Identification Authority. We should look at an Electoral Commission, which will decide that they want to take data from the service central point, and we believe they should be there to know how these things are done.
Do not let us look at the negative aspects that the Electoral Commission will not go into this, it will prepare its own electoral roll and whatnots. The Electoral Commission in its wisdom may decide that this is a credible thing so let us go and take data from there. We believe that the Electoral Commission should have representation. Apart from giving this Authority the knowledge, its know-how, it should be there to see how things are done by the Authority. So I believe it should be
left there.
Mr. Speaker 12:30 p.m.
Hon. Member for Jirapa, you raised this amendment, do you wish to pursue it?
Mr. Edward Salia 12:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker,
Mr. Speaker 12:30 p.m.
I just want to be sure if
you want it; and I will put it.
Mr. Salia 12:30 p.m.
I stil l stand by my
recommendation and I would suggest that we consider it in the interest of their own independence and any suspicion that they might have about the relation with the Authority.
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:30 p.m.
Mr.
Speaker, much as I share the concern raised by my hon. Colleague -- he says he is articulating the position of the Electoral Commission -- I believe that making a representation of the Electoral Commission a member is only meant to allow for proper interfacing. We are talking about getting a credible identification system. Mr. Speaker, if they are there, they will complement the efforts of the rest, such that what comes out will become very credible.
In any event Mr. Speaker, the article quoted by my hon. Colleague for Tamale South, which says that in the performance of its duties, the Electoral Commission shall not be subject to the control or direction by any authority or person -- that is the position of the Constitution. Mr. Speaker, what in this Bill makes the Authority the Electoral Commission, such that a policy guideline or directive of a general character to that body should be construed as a directive to or control of the Electoral Commission?
Mr. Speaker, the argument is neither here nor there. Indeed, for getting a very credible identification system, that is why the Bill seeks to make a representative of the Electoral Commission part of this Board. Mr. Speaker, I believe that we should maintain the status quo and vote on this.
Mr. Bagbin 12:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, actually,
the concerns of the Electoral Commission are not being addressed. They are saying that a directive of whatever nature to the Authority by the Minister could - could -- that is the thing they are raising - could affect the functions of the Electoral Commission. That is what I am reading from the Report. [Interruptions.] I am reading from the Report. I thought that there should not be a directive of a general nature that will have the nature of affecting the functions of the Electoral Commission, because that is what is stated here.
Their fear is that if they are part of the Board and a directive is given to the Authority and that directive is such that it will affect the performance of their functions, it will be compromising their independence. That is what is raised in the Report. That is their concern. They are not saying that that directive to the Authority is a directive to the Electoral Commission, but the nature of the directive could affect their functions at the Electoral Commission. I thought my

hon. Colleagues would be addressing that issue, that there will be no directive of a general nature that will be affecting the functions of the Electoral Commission. That is what we should be looking at.

Mr. Speaker, we will not have any guarantee. Somebody can just say it here, but as Ministers, they sit there and give directives and that directive will be such that it will be talking about the functions of the Electoral Commission, which are mainly as itemized in the law and the Constitution. That is their fear. I do not think that we should compel them to be part of it. I do not think so, because even the perception that they themselves are having is that “you want to compromise our independence”; and that is being created. I think that even if it is a perception, we should not encourage it and we should not allow it, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker 12:40 p.m.
Hon. Members, I am putting this Question.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 12:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker,
could you allow me to make a small intervention before you put the Question, sir? [Pause.] Mr. Speaker, when we met the EC and they gave us this petition, I went to discuss it with Mr. Sarfo Kantanka and I was informed that the fear he was expressing was even the main reason why they have their representative on the Board so that if any directive is given to the Board which may affect them, they would know and use the Constitution as their shield to protect themselves.
After all, the Constitution guarantees their independence. Nobody can take that from them. So that if the Minister gives any directives which traverses into
the domain of the EC they can protest; and the Constitution is there. Their being there is not what will prevent or what will compromise their independence. Therefore, their fears are unfounded. I pointed it out to them and I believe that as said by the Minister for Education and Sports we would be losing a lot if we leave out the EC. We need their expertise there and they have to serve the general interest.
Question put and amendment agreed to:
That subclause (1) (b) delete “Electoral
Commission”.
Clause 3 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clause 4 -- Tenure of office of members
of the Board.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 12:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, may
I ask for a clarification on the Question you just put? Are we maintaining or deleting “Electoral Commission”? I do not get it clearly.
Mr. Speaker 12:40 p.m.
But I have given a ruling
already on that. [Pause.] Chairman, go ahead, Clause 4, there is an amendment.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 12:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I
asked for a clarification on clause 3(1), amendment proposed by -
Mr. Speaker 12:40 p.m.
The ‘Ayes' had it.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 12:40 p.m.
I thought the
Question was on clause 3 as variously amended. [Pause.] Mr. Speaker, was the Question put on clause 3 as a whole, as variously amended, or on - [Interrup-tion]
Mr. Speaker 12:40 p.m.
Mr. Chairman, we have
voted on it already.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 12:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I
will come back to it again.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, clause 4 (5) delete. Mr. Speaker, there is no need for clause 4 (5).
Mr. J. Y. Chireh 12:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, under clause 4 (1), I proposed an amendment to the Committee which was accepted. If you look at clause 4 (1),
“A member of the Board other than the Executive Secretary of the Authority shall hold office for a period not exceeding three years and is eligible for reappointment, but a member shall not be appointed for more than two terms.”
I proposed an amendment to the effect that we should add - if you look at clause 3 (c), “The Executive Secretary of the Revenue Agencies Board” because his position is ex officio. You can have somebody who is quite young and he is made head of the Revenue Agencies Board but after two terms, he cannot be reappointed. I was saying you should add that to the first and the Executive Secretary of the Revenue Agencies Board in clause 4 (1), and it was accepted by the Committee.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 12:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, really I cannot recollect the Committee accepting that. But Mr. Speaker, we do not also envisage such a situation where one person would sit on the Board for 10 years, 15 years. Much as I get his point, I do not seem to agree with him. I will prefer that we rather amend the clause 3 (c) instead of putting it there to make the Executive Secretary of the Revenue Agencies Board a permanent member of the Commission. Mr. Speaker, that will not be desirable; it will be defeating the purpose and therefore I do not agree with his amendment. He may have to fine-tune it, and perhaps come back again under clause 3 and find something there.
Mr. Chireh 12:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I
Mr. Kojo Armah 12:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I seem to get the drift of the argument being made by my hon. Friend. If you go back to clause 3 (b), it says “one representative not below a rank equivalent to Director in the Civil Service”. [Interruptions.] No, I am just making it for argument' sake. I believe that the Revenue Agencies Board could have a representative on the Authority, not necessarily the Executive Secretary, so that if the representative is there, he must be of such a rank that he could perform the functions expected of a member of the Authority. In that light I think his argument can be taken care of and we can be on safe grounds. I think we would rather amend the Executive Secretary and
a Representative of the Revenue Board.
Mr. Bagbin 12:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, we are talking about membership of the Board and I do not know why we want to do away with experience. Somebody is there for two terms and by law he is disqualified from being reappointed to the Board. What is the good reason for that?
If the President sees that this person is very good, very experienced, the Board is benefiting from that experience and expertise and wants to reappoint him, why should he by law be prevented from doing so, because the person has served two terms? Membership of a Board does not give him such an authority that one would want to prevent him from continuing to be in office as though it were like the terms for President - a President has so much authority.
We are talking about vision there. It is not the same as the Board. So that provision, I feel strongly we should delete from “but a member shall not be appointed for more than two terms” and just leave it there that he is eligible for re-appointment. Mr. Speaker, therefore the proposal of my hon. Colleague, the Member of Parliament for Wa West should be accepted; that we delete the clause starting from “but a member shall not be appointed for more than two terms”, so that the new clause 4 (1) will now read:
“A member of the Board other than the Executive Secretary of the Authority shall hold office for a period not exceeding three years and is eligible for reappointment”.
Mr. A. O. Aidooh 12:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I rise to support the proposal by the Minority Leader. I think that it is well thought out and must be supported.
Mr. Owusu-Ansah 12:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I support the proposal submitted by the hon. Minority Leader, that we should delete the words “but a member shall not be appointed for more than two terms”. If he becomes eligible at any time that he is eligible, the appointing Authority shall have the authority and right to appoint him as many times as is possible. Therefore I support the amendment.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, once he has agreed to delete (5) then we may have to look at (4), because (4) says
“a member who is absent from three consecutive meetings of the Board without sufficient cause ceases to be a member of the Board”.
Mr. Mpiani 12:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I do not know whether we have voted on (5) or not, but that is the only way the President can revoke a member's appointment. If you do not write to the President, how does he revoke it?
Mr. Speaker 12:50 p.m.
Hon. Minister, we have already deleted subclause (5). We are now dealing with subclause (4).
Mr. A. O. Aidooh 12:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am inclined to support the amendment proposed because if you look at clause 4 (2), wherever a vacancy exists in the Authority the Minister notifies the President, except in (4) where there is a vacancy the President is notified for the

vacancy to be filled. That is why the hon. Member is suggesting that we add these words “.. . and that the President shall be notified accordingly”, so that he will make the necessary arrangements to fill the vacancy. That is why I support the amendment.

Question put and amendment agreed to.

Clause 4 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Clause 5 ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Clause 6 - Disclosure of interest.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 12:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would like to withdraw that amendment for the meantime.
Amendment by leave withdrawn.
Clauses 7 to 13 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clause 14 - Funds of the Authority.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 12:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, clause 14, paragraph (c), delete “gifts” and insert “grants”. Mr. Speaker, the reason is that the Minister will not approve of gifts to the Authority but grants and moneys that are approved by the Minister for Finance and Economic Planning.
Mr. Bagbin 12:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I think he has just realized the mistake, because the proposed amendment is talking about grants, aids . . . but when he was moving the motion he only spoke about grants. He did not add the aids; that is why I was rising to ask. But he has now added the “aids” there. So the amendment will be
“(c) grants, aids and moneys that are approved by the Minister
responsible for Finance”.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Clause 14 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clauses 15 to 17 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clause 18 - Regulations.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 12:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, clause 18, subclause (1), add a new paragraph as follows: “to prescribe user interface rules”. Mr. Speaker, we want to expand the issues provided in the regulations.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Mr. Speaker 12:50 p.m.
Chairman, there is a further amendment. You may wish to move it.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 12:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, again, I beg to move, clause 18, subclause (1), add a new paragraph as follows:
“to prescribe mechanisms for redressing grievances arising from breach of confidentiality of personal data”.
Mr. Speaker, this is to protect the citizen from his personal data being used wrongfully.
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, before we take the vote on that, I realize that the Committee proposed an amendment that is relating to confiden- tiality; clause 6, where they say “the privacy of personal data is guaranteed under this Act”. They have taken it away, so what are they talking about now? I thought the Committee was relocating that amendment elsewhere. If that one had been done, then we could talk about
the new addition that he is talking about. But without it, I do not see the relevance of what he is proposing now.
Mr. J. A. Ndebugre 1 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I think what this means is the taking away of the amendment to clause 6 and the inclusion of the amendment in clause 18. It is in order, because what the Committee is saying is that instead of amending clause 6 which will be out of place because clause 6 deals with disclosure of interest of Board members, it has nothing to do with the privacy of individuals.
The amendment proposed in clause 18 says that to deal with the misuse of information or wrongful use of information the Authority will be empowered to make regulations to deal with breaches of confidentiality which is part of misuse of information. You do not need to have guarantee of - before you make rules.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 1 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, clause 18 of the Bill is giving the Minister power, on the advice of the Board, to make regulations in the form of legislative instruments. Clause 18 captures the areas this should cover, and what the Committee is saying is that we should include a mechanism to address the grievances of people whose confidentiality would be breached. Mr. Speaker, I do not see why somebody is saying that it should be captured somewhere in the parent Act before that can be made. The power to make that regulation is the one given in clause 18 and therefore it is part of the Bill.
Mr. A. O. Aidooh 1 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I support the view that there is the need to provide in the Bill for regulating confidentiality of data. Then, you could proceed to give the Minister powers to make regulations relating to that. I think that clause 6 that was stood down - that proposed amendment which reads as follows:
“The privacy of personal data is guaranteed under this Act” -
If this is taken on board, then we can give the Minister the powers that are being sought to be given under clause 18. Otherwise, there will be a lacuna of a sort. Therefore, I support the proposal to have confidentiality provided for in the Bill before we proceed to give the Minister the authority to regulate it by regulations. And if the Chairman cares, he may want to go back to clause 6 and have that taken on board before we proceed to clause 18.
Mr. Speaker 1 p.m.
Chairman of the Committee, what is your wish?
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 1 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I have no objection. I said that for the meantime, I was withdrawing clause 6 because it was misplaced. Where it was put under clause 6 was wrong, so I said that I was withdrawing it for the meantime. But that will not stop us from - [Interruptions.]
Mr. Speaker 1 p.m.
Chairman, I am putting the Question.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 1 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I sought your permission to stand down clause 6 for the meantime. But I believe that that will not stop us from taking clause 18 -
Mr. Speaker 1 p.m.
Mr. Chairman, you are talking about clause 6? We have dealt with clause 6.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 1 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, can I go back to it now? I said that for the meantime, I was withdrawing it because we had to put it at the proper place. Where it was put was wrong, that was why I withdrew it. But I believe that, that should not stop us from putting clause 18 in. The issue at stake now, clause 18 (1) reads,
“To prescribe mechanisms for redressing grievances arising from breach of -”
Mr. Speaker 1 p.m.
Chairman of the Committee, the point you are making is that you are seeking leave of the House to withdraw clause 6?
Mr. Osei-Preempeh 1 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, we have dealt with clause 6. I sought your permission to withdraw it for the meantime. That was what I said. My hon. Friends are saying that without clause 6, clause 18 cannot stand in the regulations, and I am saying that we can do that. When we come to the Second Consideration Stage, we can put clause 6 there under an appropriate heading. That is what I am saying.
Mr. Bagbin 1 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, it is clearly the case that there must be some basis for regulations in an Act; and the regulations that they are prescribing now have no basis in the Act. The basis can be found in the proposed amendment to clause 6 which was withdrawn. So they will have to find a way of bringing it back into the Act so that it can have basis in these regulations. I support that.
Mr. Speaker 1 p.m.
Chairman of the Committee, you are withdrawing your withdrawal of clause 6. Is that what you are doing?
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 1 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I just wanted it to be stood down. Otherwise we can take it so that we leave the draftsperson to put it at the appropriate place. [Interruption.]
Mr. Speaker 1 p.m.
No, I want to get the records straight.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 1 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am withdrawing my withdrawal of clause 6. [Interruptions.]
Mr. Speaker 1 p.m.
That is indeed what you are doing. In other words, you are moving clause 6 - [Interruptions.] Chairman, you are therefore moving clause 6.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 1 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I therefore move, that clause 6, add a new clause as follows:
“The privacy of personal data is guaranteed under this Act.”
Mr. Speaker 1 p.m.
Hon. Members, we are going back to clause 6 and the amendment is for the consideration of the House.
Mr. A. O. Aidooh 1 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, on the same issue. I am wondering whether “confidentiality is not better than “privacy”. I will propose that we delete the word “privacy” and insert “confi- dentiality”.
Mr. Speaker 1:10 p.m.
Chairman of the Committee, do you agree to that, that the word “privacy” should go and then we rather insert “confidentiality”?
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 1:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I have no objection to it.
Mr. Speaker 1:10 p.m.
Hon. Members, the amendment is for the consideration of the House and that is clause 6, add a new subclause as follows: “The confiden- tiality of personal data is guaranteed under this Act”-- [Interruption.]
Mr. Ndebugre 1:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, as I was saying earlier, if we look at clause 6, it deals with disclosure of interest of Board members. So it is out of place to go and propose an amendment dealing with protecting the confidentiality of persons who have been registered. That was what informed the Chairman in proposing
Mr. Speaker 1:10 p.m.
Hon. Members, let us therefore at this stage stand these two clauses down whilst we continue -- clauses 6 and 18. We will go to clause 19. We are standing these clauses down for further consideration.
Alhaji Sumani Abukari 1:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, even though it concerns this, I was going to suggest that it should rather come under clause 2 and not clause 6.
Mr. Speaker 1:10 p.m.
No, I said we should kindly stand these two clauses down; we will come back to them.
Alhaji Abukari 1:10 p.m.
Yes, Mr. Speaker, but it means that we will not consider clause 2 any longer when it comes to it. Because I think that in that amendment, the Chairman was just - [Interruption.]
Mr. Speaker 1:10 p.m.
Hon. Member for Tamale North, are you taking us back to clause 2?
Alhaji Abukari 1:10 p.m.
No, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker 1:10 p.m.
Which clause?
Alhaji Abukari 1:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, it is about this amendment on privacy. If it should come at all it should not be clause
6.
Mr. Speaker 1:10 p.m.
We are talking about clause 6.
Alhaji Abukari 1:10 p.m.
It should not be under clause 6; my contention is that it should be under clause 2 and not clause 6. It has nothing to do with clause 6 at all.
Mr. Speaker 1:10 p.m.
All right, whatever it is, let us stand these clauses down, we will come back to them.
Clause 19 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clause 20 -- Transitional provision
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 1:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, clause 20, delete. Mr. Speaker, clause 20 talks about the repeal of NRCD 129, but that was repealed by the Electoral Commission Act (Act 451) and therefore it is not an existing law.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Clause 20 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clause 21 -- Repeal and savings
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 1:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, clause 21, delete and insert
“All legislative instruments issued pursuant to the Identity Cards Decree 1972 (NRCD 129) are hereby repealed.”
Mr. Speaker, the parent Act was repealed in 1993 and we believe that all instruments on it have also elapsed and need to be repealed.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Clause 21 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
The Long Title ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Mr. Speaker 1:10 p.m.
Hon. Members, we have stood down two clauses, 6 and 18.
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, the Short Title, “The National
Mr. Speaker 1:10 p.m.
We now come back to clauses 6 and 18.
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 1:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would still want to withdraw clause 6 and amend clause 2 (2) (b).
Mr. Speaker, “ensure the accuracy, integrity, confidentiality and security of data collected by the Authority”, so that we do not put in the clause 6.
Mr. A. O. Aidooh 1:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, “security and confidentiality” are not the same things. If we - [Interruption.]
Mr. Osei-Preempeh 1:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, we are adding “confidentiality”.
Mr. A. O. Aidooh 1:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, if we are adding it then that is fine, but I thought he was removing one.
Mr. Speaker 1:10 p.m.
Chairman of the Committee, for purposes of the records, let us go through gradually. In respect of clause 6 - [Interruption.]
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 1:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am withdrawing clause 6 and seeking your leave to amend clause 2, subclause (2) (b) to now read, “ensure the accuracy, integrity, confidentiality and security of data collected by the Authority”.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Clause 2 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clause 6 by leave of the House withdrawn.
Mr. Speaker 1:10 p.m.
Then what about clause
18?
Mr. Osei-Prempeh 1:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, clause 18, subclause (1) add a new paragraph as follows:
“To prescribe mechanism for redressing grievances arising from breach of confidentiality of personal data.”
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Clause 18 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Mr. A. O. Aidooh 1:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, we ask for permission for the Deputy Minister for Finance and Economic Planning to move this for us.
Suspension of Standing Order 80 (1)
Deputy Minister for Finance and Economic Planning (Prof. G. Y. Gyan- Baffour (on behalf of the Minister for Finance and Economic Planning): Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, that not- withstanding the provisions of Standing Order 80 (1) which require that no motion shall be debated until at least forty-eight hours have elapsed between the date on which notice of the motion is given and the date on which the motion is moved, the motion for the Second Reading of the Customs, Excise and Preventive Service (Management) (Amendment) Bill, 2006 may be moved today.
Mr. Kwadwo Agyei-Addo 1:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to second the motion.
Question put and motion agreed to.
Resolved accordingly.
BILLS - SECOND READING 1:20 p.m.

BILLS - CONSIDERATION STAGE 1:20 p.m.

Alhaji Sumani Abukari 1:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I also support the amendment on the floor. Mr. Speaker, fortunately for the committee, the three top officials of CEPS were at the Committee's meeting to brief us on the problems they have on the present arrangement. In fact, they wanted a blanket extension or an amendment that will give them a blanket extension but after some deliberation, we said that we should limit the extension to 31st December to give them such period that would enable them to decongest the port.
Mr. Speaker, fortunately, I had the opportunity of going through the report of the Committee for Roads and Transport and some of the vehicles there are no more vehicles; they are just skeletons of vehicles; and some of them which could have been disposed of if the proper arrangement had been made are still there. So firstly, there are no more
vehicles; secondly, they are causing a lot of congestion; thirdly, Mr. Speaker, those which would have been disposed of are there, they have not been disposed of because the hands of the CEPS officers are tied.
So we said that we would free the hands of the CEPS officers so that they can make arrangements to get rid of such vehicles, sell them away so that the State will earn some income. Income that should be earned by the State is being wasted there at the port.
Mr. Speaker, we think this amendment is appropriate and by the end of 31st December, we envisage that this House should relook at that CEPS Law to see whether we could not refashion it to enable some measures to be put in place to contain the importation of over-aged vehicles. I think the idea of over-aged vehicles should be relooked at completely.

So Mr. Speaker, this amendment would last until the 31st of December, by which time a proper law should be brought in place to take care of these problems at the port. Mr. Speaker, fortunately, this morning when I was coming to the House I heard of measures being taken today to decongest some areas of the port which are really very congested and I think that the port authority ought to be commended for their swift action. But all the same, we need this amendment to help in these three areas that I have already enumerated.
Mr. Lee Ocran 1:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, whilst I seem to agree to the amendment, I have a little problem. My problem is, if we want to decongest the port because there are too many over-aged vehicles, why do we not call the owners of the vehicles to come and collect their vehicles instead of going
to auction the vehicles? Auction them to whom? Whilst somebody has imported his vehicle you charge him an over-age penalty, he cannot pay, the vehicle is there and it is getting rotten -- If you want to decongest, you should call him to come and collect his vehicle - [Laughter] -- instead of going to sell.
Yes, because he cannot buy his auctioned vehicle. Allow him to buy his own auctioned vehicle and take his vehicle away. But this idea of trying to let customs officials go and auction vehicles to themselves is not fine. Let the owners of the vehicles get their vehicles; if they cannot pay for their vehicles then of course we think of something else.
Alhaji Abukari 1:30 p.m.
On a point of order. Mr. Speaker, I think my hon. Friend is completely misconstruing the intent of this amendment. Mr. Speaker, in fact, what we said was that the owners of those vehicles, when they are revalued, should not be allowed to buy them because the prices would have come down. So we cannot bring it and impose a fine of say ¢10 million and then when this exercise is being implemented, the price comes down to ¢8 million and then that same owner comes back to buy it. We said that should not happen. So the owners of the vehicles would not be allowed to buy the vehicles. It is other citizens who would be allowed to buy the vehicles so that people do not come and leave their vehicles, knowing that after two years they can go back and buy it at a cheaper price. That would not be allowed.
Some hon. Members -- rose -
Mr. Speaker 1:30 p.m.
Hon. Members, we are only dealing with this amendment. It seems as if we are going beyond that, but one more.
Mr. Osafo-Maafo 1:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I
Mr. Osafo-Maafo 1:30 p.m.


really support this amendment. We must know where we are coming from in respect of this amendment. Earlier on, the law said that if you brought in an over-aged vehicle it would be seized and sent to the Tema Steel Works for smelting.

Mr. Speaker, the cost of dismantling the vehicles and taking the metal parts from the non-metal parts is about ¢550,000 and whenever we sold the metal we had about ¢250,000 so the State was losing revenue. An Amendment law was brought here, still bearing in mind that it is not the intention of the Government to encourage the importation of over-aged vehicles into the country.

They cause environmental havoc, et cetera. So we impose a penalty on vehicles above 10 years to discourage people from importing over-aged vehicles to Ghana. The punishment is to importers and therefore we should look at the owner matter. If you import a vehicle that is over- aged you are penalized by law; and that we should admit. Now if for whatever reason we are not able to sell the vehicle by adding the importation fee then the one who imported it should not benefit from it. He should suffer the penalty thereof for breaking the law and bringing into this country an over-aged vehicle. [Hear! Hear!] Earlier on, the punishment would have been complete seizure and smelting of the vehicle. That was the law.

Mr. Speaker, I think we have a problem; some of us have lived with the problem for sometime and I think we should clear our ports. We cannot allow those vehicles to clog the ports. We need to use that space for something else and we need to penalize importers for bringing in over- aged vehicles. Therefore, let us combine the two and approve this amendment; it is necessary.
Mr. Speaker 1:30 p.m.
We have come to the end of the Consideration Stage of the Customs, Excise and Preventive Service (Management) (Amendment) Bill, 2006.
Item 14, hon. Minister for Finance and Economic Planning?
Suspension of Standing Order 131 (1)
Deputy Minister for Finance and Economic Planning (Prof. G. Y. Gyan- Baffour): Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, that notwithstanding the provisions of Standing Order 131 (1) which require that when a Bill has passed through the Consideration Stage, the Third Reading thereof shall not be taken until at least twenty-four hours have elapsed, the motion for the Third Reading of the Customs, Excise and Preventive Service (Management) (Amendment) Bill, 2006 may be moved today.
Mr. Agyei-Addo 1:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to second the motion.
Question put and motion agreed to.
Resolved accordingly.
BILLS - THIRD READING 1:30 p.m.

Mr. Speaker 1:30 p.m.
Hon. Member for Ningo/ Prampram and Deputy Minority Whip, you intended to remind me of something, please go ahead.
Mr. E. T. Mensah 1:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, even though it has been passed I was going to suggest that instead of auctioning these vehicles to individuals we should rather allocate them to institutions. The District Assemblies, they need vehicles, the Police and the schools need vehicles all over the country and so I think that that would rather go a long way to support them and also ensure transparency. Otherwise, we are going to allow some auctioneers and customs officers to do their own thing as they have been doing all along.
Mr. Speaker 1:30 p.m.
I do hope the hon. Minister would take your suggestion and others into consideration. Item 16 --
Mr. A. O. Aidooh 1:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, may I suggest that we take motion No. 22.
MOTIONS 1:40 p.m.

Chairman of the Committee (Mr. Kwadwo Agyei-Addo) 1:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, that notwithstanding the provisions of Standing Order 80 (1) which require that no motion shall be debated until at least forty-eight hours have elapsed between the date on which notice of the motion is given and the date on which the motion is moved, the motion for the adoption of the Report of the Finance Committee on the Loan Agreement between the Government of Ghana and Social Security and National
Insurance Trust (SSNIT) for an amount of US$20 million (cedi denominated) for the financing of Government Equity Shares in Ghana International Airlines Limited may be moved today.
Mr. Kwadjo Opare-Hammond 1:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I rise to second the motion.
Question put and motion agreed to.
Resolved accordingly.
Loan Agreement between the Government of Ghana and SSNIT for Financing Government Equity Shares
in Ghana International Airlines Limited
Mr. Agyei-Addo 1:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, that this honourable House adopts the Report of the Finance Committee on the Loan Agreement between the Government of Ghana and Social Security and National Insurance Trust (SSNIT) for an amount of US$20 million (cedi denominated) for the financing of Government Equity Shares in Ghana International Airlines Limited.
Mr. Speaker, in so doing I wish to present the Report of the Committee. Mr. Speaker, with your indulgence, I would want to read only the Conclusion, and request that you direct the Hansard Department to capture the whole body of the report as having been read in this House and in its entirety.
1.0 Introduction
The above Loan Agreement was laid in the House on Thursday, 9th March 2006 and referred to the Finance Committee for consideration and report in accordance with article 181 of the Constitution and Order 169 of the Standing Orders of the House.
To consider the Agreement the
Mr. Agyei-Addo 1:40 p.m.


Committee met with the Minister for Presidential Affairs and Chief of Staff, hon. Kwadwo O. Mpiani, two Deputy hon. Ministers for Finance and Economic Planning, Dr. A. Akoto Osei, Prof. G. Y. Gyan-Baffour, Board Chairman of Ghana International Airlines Limited, Mr. G.A.M. Azu, officials from Ghana International Airlines, SSNIT and Ministry of Finance and Economic Planning and accordingly reports as follows:

2.0 Background

Mr. Speaker, the House will recall that the Government in seeking to restore the National Airline took a strategic decision in the interest of the nation to acquire the needed shares in Ghana International Airlines (GIA).

The request consists of 2 components. The first amount of $5 million (cedi denominated) is to purchase equity shares and the balance of $15 million (cedi denominated) is for operational purposes. It is anticipated that when the Airline's operations become sustainable, the Government will offload its shares partly or wholly on the Ghana Stock Exchange. 3.0 Financing Terms and Conditions

A. Loan Amount -- US$5million

Interest Rate --

BoG prime rate +100 basis points

per annum

Grace Period --

0 years

Repayment --

2 years

Maturity Period --
Mr. Agyei-Addo 1:40 p.m.


(8) Members wanted to know why the two facilities amounting to US$20 million had two different terms and con-ditions.

The officials from SSNIT explained that the US$5 million facility is a short-term facility

(granted) to be paid in two (2) years whilst the US$15 million is a long-term facility for seven (7)-year period and thus accounted for the differences in their terms a n d condi-tions.

(9) In meeting the request by the hon. Members of the Committee on the status of

the Ghana International Airlines (GIA), the officials presented to the Committee the following documents:

1 . C e r t i f i c a t e t o Commence Business

2. Shareholders' Agreement

3. C o m m e r c i a l A i r Carriers Licence to Operate.

(10) The officials informed the eg-

Committee that the Airline is yet to acquire the Airlines Operating Certificate (AOC) which requires that the Airline must have its own Aircrafts for its opera- tions. However the officials assured the Committee that they are working hard to obtain the AOC which is the final Certificate required for an airline's operations.

(11) On the Airline's ability to make profit in current times where the airline business is risky, the officials presented to the Committee their Business Plan which showed that the Airline is a viable venture.

(12) On the issue on why Govern-ment contracted and utilized US$5 million from SSNIT without Parliamentary approval in contravention of Article 181 of the Constitution, the Minister for Presidential Affairs and Chief of Staff explained that

Respectfully submitted.
Mr. Opare-Hammond 1:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I rise to second the motion and in doing so I want to urge all hon. Members here present to support it and to vote massively for it.
Mr. Speaker, Ghana International Airlines Limited must be supported because it caries the national flag; it is the national pride of Ghana.
Question put and motion agreed to.
RESOLUTIONS 1:40 p.m.

THIS HONOURABLE HOUSE 1:40 p.m.

H E R E B Y R E S O S LV E S A S 1:40 p.m.

Minister for Public Sector Reform (Dr. Paa Kwesi Nduom) 1:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, that notwithstanding the provisions of Standing Order 80 (1) which require that no motion shall be debated until at least forty-eight hours have elapsed between the date on which notice of the motion is given and the date on which the motion is moved, the motion for the Second Reading of the Millennium Development Authority Bill may be moved today.
there was an urgent need for the fund during the period when Parliament had not even composed Committees at the time. The Government took the loan for use with the view of bringing it to Parlia-ment for ratification.
(13) The Committee noted that the credit facility is exempted from withholding tax and any other taxes. Article 13.1 states that if at anytime any tax is imposed on the loan, the borrower shall simultaneously pay to the lender whatever additional amount is necessary to ensure that the lender receives a net sum equal to the payment it would have received had no deduction or withholding been made.
5.0 Conclusion
The Committee after carefully examining the loan and finding its importance to Ghana International Airlines Limited respectfully recom- mends by consensus to the House to approve by Resolution the loan amount of US$20 million between the Govern- ment of Ghana and Social Security and National Insurance Trust (SSNIT) for the financing of Government Equity Shares in Ghana International Airlines Limited in accordance with article 181 of the Constitution and section 7, of the Loans Act, 1970 (Act 335).
Mr. Agyei-Addo 1:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to second the motion.
Question put and motion agreed to.
Resolved accordingly.
BILLS - SECOND READING 1:40 p.m.

Minister for Private Sector Reform (Dr. Paa Kwesi Nduom) 1:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, that the Millennium Development Authority Bill be now read a Second time.
Mr. Speaker, the Mi l lenn ium Development Authority Bill is presented as a vehicle that Government proposes to use in implementing the funds that will come from the Millennium Challenge Account Programme proposed by President George Bush of the United States of America Government and other programmes that will be directed as such by His Excellency the President.
Question proposed.
MR. FIRST DEPUTY SPEAKER
Mr. Agyei-Addo 1:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to present the Report of the Joint Committee on Employment, Social Welfare and State Enterprises, Finance and Poverty Reduction Committees.
Mr. Speaker, I would want, with your permission, to read the Introduction and the Conclusion, but having done that I would wish that you request the Hansard Department to capture the whole Report as having been read.
1.0 Introduction
The Mil lennium Development Authority Bill was laid before the House by the Minister for Public Sector Reform, hon. Dr. Paa Kwesi Nduom on Tuesday, 14th March 2006 and referred to the Joint- Committee in accordance with Order 125 of the Standing Orders of the House and articles 103 and 106 (4) of the Constitution for consideration and report and the Joint- Committee having so considered the Bill reports as follows:
1.1 Reference
The Joint-Committee made references to the following documents during its work:
1. The State Lands Act, 1962 (Act 125)
2. The State Property and Contract Act 1960 (C.A. 6)
3. The Constitution of the Republic
4. The Standing Orders of the House.
1.2 Purpose
The Bill seeks to establish the Millennium Development Authority which will be charged with the responsibility of supervising, managing and ensuring the implementation of the Ghana Government Programmes under the Millennium Challenge Account of the Government of the United States of America.
The Authority so established will also continuously pursue the eradication of poverty through overseeing and managing other national development programmes of similar nature funded by the Government of Ghana, Development Partners or by both.
1.3 Background
The USA Government under the leadership of H.E. President George W. Bush instituted the Millennium Challenge Account in 2002 in its resolve to finding alternative sources of funding development in developing countries. This system of funding which is administered by the Millennium Challenge Corporation, unlike others, permits beneficiary countries to propose their own programmes to receive funding.
Criteria for selection of countries to benefit from the fund were on the basis of the following principles:
1. Governing justly;
2. Investing in people; and
3. Encouraging economic freedom.
Ghana is among sixteen countries in the developing world and one of the only seven African countries to have been selected, in the first instance, to benefit from the fund.
Ghana has submitted a proposal for a grant of approximately US$500 million which is to be used to help reduce poverty through growth which proposal is currently under review by financial and technical experts of the Millennium Challenge Corporation and will be due for the Compact-signing by end of July 2006.
1.4 Acknowledgement
The Joint-Committee is grateful to the Minister for Public Sector Reform and officials of the Ministry who attended upon the Joint-Committee to assist in its deliberations.
2.0 Delebrations/Observations
The Joint-Committee held two sittings to deliberate on the Bill and made the following observations:
2.1 Accountability
The establishment of an entity that would be accountable is a requirement by the Millennium Challenge Corporation. The Joint-Committee observed with satisfaction that the Government, in fulfilling this requirement rather chose the option to set up the Authority by an act of Parliament and thus, making it accountable to the House.
The recourse to Parliament in seeking to establish the Authority by an Act of Parliament was also in compliance with the Subvented Agencies Act which was recently passed into law. The Joint-Committee again found this to be commendable.
2.2 Benefit to the State
The Joint-Committee observed that the Bill when passed into law will enable the Government of Ghana draw funds from the Millennium Challenge Account. This will ultimately impact favourably on the economy as it would not only increase incomes of the rural food-crop farmers but will also reduce poverty significantly while generating employment in all sectors of the economy.
The Committee was informed that in the infrastructural sector, the Tetteh Quarshie-Mallam road will be expanded and upgraded into a six-lane road while over thousand kilometres of feeder and trunk roads will be rehabilitated and improved to facilitate movement of goods and services in the country.
2.3 Cost of Administering Project
The Joint-Committee observed with satisfaction that the administration cost
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 1:40 p.m.
Any contribution? Hon. Members, it appears that there is consensus on this matter and not that you are tired.
Minority Leader (Mr. A. S. K. Bagbin) 1:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I support the motion. I believe strongly that the establishment of an authority will clear doubts of politicization of the utilization of the money and that an authority of this nature will ensure that the money is judiciously utilized. Mr. Speaker, I happen to be at the committee meeting and we had a very extensive deliberation of the Bill and I believe that at the appropriate time, a number of amendments would be moved to the Bill.
Minority Leader (Mr. A. S. K. Bagbin) 1:50 p.m.
But Mr. Speaker, before I get to that stage, let me say I was stunned, completely surprised that money that is being given to us unfettered for the purpose of poverty reduction will have only a passing involvement of the three northern regions. I was shocked because my impression before I got to the meeting was that a lot of the districts from the northern part of Ghana were going to benefit from the Millennium Challenge Fund.

Mr. Speaker, I only saw the names of five districts from the Northern Region -- only five districts; out of the 25 districts, it is only five districts. Upper East -- zero, Upper West -- zero, Northern Region -- five districts out of 25 districts. Western Region -- zero, Central Region, they have, Volta Region they have, Greater Accra, they have, Brong Ahafo, they have.

Mr. Speaker, we are talking about poverty reduction, I believe strongly that definitely, I know there is poverty everywhere, but it is more endemic in some areas and those areas involve the three northern regions, the Central Region, the next region being Western Region. Mr. Speaker, I am surprised that it is rather those regions that are not receiving anything. At least some are getting a bit, like Central Region, but Western is not getting, Upper East is not getting, Upper West is not getting. It is surprising.

I think that the Minister will have to explain to convince us, because I will contest it and I will raise a lot of issues even with the corporation, because of the way the money is being earmarked. I believe that these regions should get something and that it should not all be

concentrated there. The initial impression I got was that - [Interruption] -- Mr. Speaker, we are in an honourable House and I expect hon. Members to behave honourably. I am here representing not only Ghana but also a constituency and I have to air the views of the constituency, and that is what I am doing.

Mr. Speaker, we have no problem with establishing an Authority to oversee the utilisation of the fund and as I stated earlier on, the fine-tuning can be done when we come to the Consideration Stage. But it is important that in looking at the distribution, we have to take a second look at the issue of poverty reduction because the fund is for poverty reduction and growth.

Mr. Speaker, I think only five districts of the Northern Region are there. Central Region is -- I think two areas and Western -- zero.Volta is in two areas. The majority is in Greater Accra, Brong Ahafo; and the list is there, Afram Plains -- so Mr. Speaker, we have to reconsider this issue and let us have an equitable -- I do not say equal -- equitable distribution of this fund. Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Joe Kwashie Gidisu (NDC - Central Tongu) 1:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, as a Member of the Committee, issues being raised by my hon. Colleagues have been taken on board during our discussion.
Mr. Speaker, as noted, the focal point for the project is poverty reduction through growth and the estimated amount of $500 million grant is to be used to help reduce poverty through agriculture. Mr. Speaker, as noted, three major areas have been identified and within these three major areas, the whole country has been broken into segments -- the northern sector, the southern sector as well as the Afram Plains.
Mr. Speaker, it is quite disturbing when one reflects on those areas that have been selected for inclusion or that have been identified with the projects. The explanation given was that this was an initial project and there is the possibility of adjacent districts being taken on board alongside those districts that have been identified.
Mr. Speaker, but it is quite worrying when one looks at those districts that have been selected in those regions that people have talked about. Incidentally, one can say empirically that those districts that have been chosen under the projects are better endowed when we come to examining the level of poverty within those areas. It is in that wise that it is quite very necessary for us to look at the criteria. Though it has been explained, there is the need to look at the criteria once again so as to talk about that equitable distribution.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.
Hon. Members, let us have a little silence as we listen to the hon. Member.
Mr. J. K. Gidisu 1:50 p.m.
One area that people expressed concern during your Committee's meeting was the need for the setting up of an Authority to supervise the project because there was the argument that if we are talking about agriculture, already we have institutionalised - [Interruption.]
rose
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.
Hon. Member, are you on a point of order?
Mr. Asiamah 1:50 p.m.
Yes, Mr. Speaker, I am on a point of order.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.
But before
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.


you do so, let me inform the House that we are going to have extended Sitting, so be informed.
Mr. Asiamah 1:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, did I hear my hon. Colleague say that some areas are endowed with poverty?
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.
Hon. Member, you are out of order. Continue, hon. Member for Central Tongu.
Mr. J. K. Gidisu 1:50 p.m.
These young ones will have to grow. Mr. Speaker, the point I am making is that when talking about an Authority to supervise the whole project, during the discussions at the committee level, there was the concern that if we are talking about the main thrust of the project which is agriculture, there are other Agencies and Ministries already in the system to have supervised the projects, but the explanation was given that it is very important for us to get a more coherent focal point like an Authority which should be directly under the President so as to speed up the process of co-ordination, supervision and whatever might have been going on within the project.
Mr. Speaker, what is worrying is the need to look at perhaps the operational cost of the amount that will be going into servicing the Authority, and I think at the Consideration Stage, it might be necessary for us to look at the other details. But these are very genuine concerns that other Members have raised and it is important for us as a House to look at these issues and see how best we would be able to get under control.
With these few comments, Mr. Speaker, I want to say that, yes, it is a very welcome Bill for us to look at in terms of how to reduce poverty across board in the country but not in a very focal point as the selected
districts now seem to portray. I am very grateful for the opportunity.
Mr. E. T. Mensah (NDC - Ningo/ Prampram) 2 p.m.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I rise to support the Bill and also speak to the issue that my hon. Colleagues have spoken to. There is so much poverty in Greater Accra, when you travel outside for just about 30 km away. When you go to Dangbe West and Dangbe East, the vegetation, the landscape is just like the Northern Region.
Even in Bukom here, there is poverty, at the heart of Accra. You have farmers in my area as well. We have been paying lip- service all the time to poverty reduction and poverty alleviation, but then when they step out there to give monies, they give five hundred thousand or one million cedis maximum. What does it mean to a farmer in any of these areas?
These days, if you want a tractor to plough for you, you pay so much. So whatever is going to be doled out, I want the Minister to take note of the fact that if he is going to give out one million or less, he is wasting his time. He should forget about the huge impact, the way the Report has put it - that the Joint Committee observed that the Bill when passed will enable the Government of Ghana draw funds from the Millennium Challenge Account and this will ultimately make an impact favourably on the economy of the country, increase the incomes of the rural people and alleviate poverty --
We should not be that optimistic if we are going to dole out money like we have been doing -- one million, half a million cedis. We have water problem in these areas, the Dangbe areas, they need dugouts, even water to drink is a problem. So we need to make sure that whatever
we are going to give out will make sense so that at the end of the day, we will increase the incomes of the poor people so that we can come here again and say poverty is being reduced. I do not know when poverty is going to be alleviated anyway. Perhaps we are going to scratch the surface.
Many people collect their five hundred thousand cedis and then they go and use it to pay off previous debts and nothing happens. So Mr. Speaker, the Minister will have to go back to the drawing board, taking on board all the concerns that have been expressed.
I also want to suggest that the Ministers responsible for Agriculture and Fisheries and what have you should organize outreach programmes. Many of the officers out there went to school abroad and others went to big schools and do not know even their own areas. Take them on outreach programmes to see areas like Dangbe West Districts, Ningo Traditional Area. Let them move out and see along the coast.
Mr. Speaker, I urge the Minister for Fisheries to just drive them from one end of the coastal line to the other in Greater Accra alone for them to come face to face with the realities so that when they are planning in their offices, they will know what they are talking about. It is better than just leaving them out there in the offices and that is the end of it; they will not know anywhere. I tried it once and it was quite interesting. Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker, for your attention.
Mr. Lee Ocran (NDC - Jomoro) 2 p.m.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I think the Millennium Challenge Account is one of the best things that has come from the Bush Administration of the United States, but the way they are approaching the issue here, I doubt whether we will achieve the results or the objectives for which the Account has been established.
In the Bill, I can see the country divided into three zones, the Afram Basin, the Southern Horticultural area and the Northern Horticultural area. The Bill does not go further to explain what the Northern Horticultural area is supposed to mean and what the Southern Horticultural area means. I looked through the Report but it is not there. But I assume that they are talking of vegetation.
Mr. Speaker, those who wrote the Report and those who are going to implement the Report need an excursion to have a proper encounter with poverty. They do not know what poverty is; they should have a proper encounter with poverty. When they have, they will go back and rewrite their report.
In the Western Region, Juabeso-Bia is one of the most deprived districts in the whole country. Juabeso-Bia is one of the most deprived and yet Western Region has not got a single district in this Report. Why? Have we been eliminated from poverty? Not so. If any region or any regions were to benefit from this, it should be the three northern regions the Central and then some districts from the Western and Brong Ahafo Regions.
Anybody who has taken a trip along the central coastal region will see what poverty is. Go to Anomabo, go to the coastal areas and you would realize that once the fishing season is over, there is nothing for the people to do. The soil is bad, people cannot engage in any proper agriculture and there is serious poverty. There were times, two years ago, when people were stealing soup on fire because they were poor and hungry. They were stealing soup sitting on fire and so if you had soup on fire you had to keep a watch.
Mr. S. K. B. Manu 2 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, the hon. Member is seriously disgracing the people of the Western Region.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2 p.m.
Why do you say so?
Mr. Manu 2 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, how can you say in Parliament House that people of Western Region were stealing soups on fire? What is he saying? What kind of picture is he painting of the people of the Western Region? I am not from the region but I do not think we should accept this on the floor of the House. It is very, very serious. I think he should withdraw and apologize to the people of the Western Region, a citizen of which he is.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2 p.m.
Hon. Member, you are out of order.
Mr. Joseph Boahen Aidoo 2 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I think the hon. Member has generalized the whole incident. If it is his constituency, he should specify it. But to generalize for the whole of Western Region is unfortunate. For that reason, he should withdraw. In fact, it is very serious. If people have been stealing soup in the Jomoro constituency, he should tell us.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2 p.m.
Hon. Member for Jomoro, your hon. Colleagues are saying that what you have said amounts to - in a way -- degrading Western Region. They think that it may be your constituency that people steal soup you have generalized it but then. Maybe you want to reduce it to specifics.
Mr. Lee Ocran 2 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, it is very unfortunate we have some few Members who have ear problems and will not listen
Ms. Christine Churcher 2 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, my hon. Friend is making a general statement which needs to be clarified. There are many constituencies in the Central Region. If he says it is a place in the Central Region, on the floor of the House, he should be able to specify which place, lest it be said that all people do that in the Central Region. Mr. Speaker, I insist that for the sake of those of us who represent Central Region, hon. Lee Ocran should specify.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2 p.m.
Hon. Member for Jomoro, will you react to the sentiments that have been expressed by the hon. Member for Cape Coast now that you have shifted grounds? Indeed, you said that it is not in the Western Region but rather in the Central Region.
Mr. Lee Ocran 2 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, my wife is from the Central Region. I have visited the Central Region and I know what I am talking about. Somebody stole my soup, the soup in our own house in the Central Region - [Laughter.] If one person goes to steal a goat in one town, does that make the whole town's people thieves? I am talking and saying what I know - [Interruption.]
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
Order! Order! Hon. Members, let us have a little order.
Mrs. Gladys Asmah 2:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am very, very disturbed about the statement that has been made by my hon. Colleague who also attended school in Cape Coast. He has been asked to specify
where the people steal soup sitting on fire. Mr. Speaker.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
He has already said that it was in his wife's house - [Interruption.] Order! Order! He said in his own house.
Mrs. Asmah 2:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, the hon. Member does not come from the Central Region; he is from the Western Region. So where in the Central Region does he say people steal soup?
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
I believe he did say that the incident - I am only saying what I have heard. He said the incident might have occurred in his own house; and the wife comes from the Central Region. That was what he said - [Interruptions.]
Ms. Christine Churcher 2:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, although hon. Lee Ocran is saying that this happened in his own house, for the sake of clarity and better understanding, we want to know which part of the district houses his own house. Mr. Speaker, on top of it, it might be interesting to know whether the one who did the stealing was a man or a woman.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
Hon. Members, let us get a little bit more serious. Yes, hon. Member for Jomoro, can you continue now?
Mr. Ocran 2:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am surprised that the mere mention of soup has agitated so many people. If they want soup, they should go outside and get soup to buy. Why should soup agitate them so much? Why? [Interruptions.]
Mr. S. K. B. Manu 2:10 p.m.
On a point of order. Mr. Speaker, he is trying to trivialize the issue. It was the same NDC whose President went to Cape Coast to insult the
people of Cape Coast - [Interruptions.] Yes, and today another one is insulting the people of the Central Region and when we raise the issue he trivializes the matter. It is a very serious matter and we have to look at it seriously. He either has to withdraw and apologize to the people of the Central Region or we will take him on - [Uproar.] They can shout, they can cry; I am stating a fact - [Interruptions.]
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
Order! Order!
Mr. Manu 2:10 p.m.
I mean what I am talking about.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
Hon. Manu, please take your seat; take your seat.
Mr. Manu 2:10 p.m.
I am very serious.
Some hon. Members: “Shame! Shame!”
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
Hon. Members, let us have some order, please. Will you stop shouting “shame”, “shame”. Let us have some order, please. Hon. Minister for Fisheries, I have realized you are still on your feet.
Mrs. Asmah 2:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, my hon. Colleague from Jomoro is saying that the people from Anomabo are the ones who steal soup sitting on the fire. Mr. Speaker, my grandfather comes from Anomabo. Anomabo is an ancient great town that has raised people like the Kwegyir Aggreys, the Fergusons, the Gardeners, the Laings - Mr. Speaker, I want to assure my hon. Colleague that the people of Anomabo will take him on. The Omahaene will be duly informed that he said that the people of Anomabo steal soup sitting on the fire. And he will be taken on and - [Interruption.]
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
Hon. Minister, you raised a point of order; he has reacted. He has made it specific that it was in his own house; as to who did it or not, it is not the issue. I would ask that we continue with what we are doing. Hon. Minister, as I said, I have given the floor now to the hon. Member for Jomoro to continue - [Interruptions.] Hon. Member for Jomoro, will you continue?
Mr. Ocran 2:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, hon. Manu made statements which should not be allowed to go unanswered. This is a man who is suffering from - [Interruptions.]
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
I ruled him out, hon. Member. Would you make your point now - [Interruptions.]
Mr. Ocran 2:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I want to continue. Mr. Speaker, when people are suffering from political hallucination they engage in all sorts of antics. What I was trying to do, and what I was trying to say - I was trying to demonstrate the level of poverty at certain times and I was a witness to the incident I was talking about. I am not saying the people of Central Region - After all, my grandfather comes from the Central Region so what - [Interruption.]
Mr. Manu 2:10 p.m.
If you do not train your children well and they are stealing soup, you bring it to Parliament - [Interruptions.]
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
Hon. Balado Manu, you are an old Member of this House.
Mr. Ocran 2:10 p.m.
Balado is a cheap boy - [Interruptions.]
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
Hon. Manu, you know the rules of this House. I have given the floor to an hon. Member and if - The Speaker is speaking, please would you take your seat. You know the
Mr. Ocran 2:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am speaking for the poverty endemic areas and I was just illustrating a point that there are times - After all, in Accra people steal; people do all manner of things. People steal in my region, people steal in my hometown, people steal in my home. I was just giving an example and I do not see why people should be so excited to the extent that people who come from so far away from the Central Region should start to make noise. You are so far - too far - [Interruptions.]
Mr. Speaker, all that I am trying to say is that the Committee should have a second look, the Minister should have a second look at the Report so that all regions would benefit from this fund. That is all that I am saying. Thank you for the attention.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
I did say that that was the last contribution on the matter, but I will take two more.
Minister for Fisheries (Mrs. Gladys Asmah) 2:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, thank you for the opportunity to contribute to the debate on the floor. Mr. Speaker, I think the Millennium Challenge Account (MCA) is one of the best things that can happen to the people of this country. Here is a country that for years gone by had seen not much improvement. Mr. Speaker, with the injection of this capital the poor people would be better cared for; it is not just by mouth but properly cared for.
Mr. Speaker, certain districts have been identified and I believe that is the first phase of the Millennium Challenge Account (MCA) programme that will be placed at the disposal of the people of this country. Mr. Speaker, we know that there are certain poverty-striken areas; we are aware of them. And as the Minister for Fisheries, I know that there is some degree of poverty along our beaches and that is why the Government of the day has put in place a Ministry, a whole Cabinet Ministry responsible for Fisheries, to look at the problems of the fishers sector and address them; and this is being done.
Mr. A. S. K. Bagbin 2:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, the debate is on a motion dealing with Millennium Challenge Account. Now, the emphasis on her Ministry and fisheries and the rest is not what we are talking about - [Laughter.] And we are talking - Because she is wasting a lot of time responding to the issue of soup -- [Interruption.] No, we are talking about the Millennium Challenge Account.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:20 p.m.
Yes, hon. Minority Leader, what I believe the hon. Minister was trying to imply is that this House should welcome the Bill and she is promising that her Ministry will definitely support it; so allow her to continue.
Mrs. Asmah 2:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, we are
Mr. Bagbin 2:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, the hon. Minister is aware that I am from a fishing area. I even discussed with her about fishing on the Black Volta in my constituency and we are asking for this thing. So she is aware I am from a fishing area. How can she say I am not from a fishing area?
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:20 p.m.
Point well made, hon. Minister, continue; he says that he also comes from a fishing area.
Mrs. Asmah 2:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, my hon. Colleague, the hon. Member for Jomoro talked about the sea and that is what I was saying. Mr. Speaker, all communities will be taken care of on both sides and I am very, very happy for such an account to be coming into the country. I hope that all of us here will give our support to this Bill that has come, for us to be able to benefit from it. I thank you, Mr. Speaker, for the honour.
Mr. Haruna Iddrisu (NDC - Tamale South) 2:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I thank you for the opportunity to associate myself with the motion on the floor relating to the Millennium Development Authority Bill and the establishment of an authority to supervise the use of money to accrue from the Millennium Challenge Account which is an initiative of President George Bush of the United States of America (USA).
In particular, Mr. Speaker, around March 2002, the President of the USA had cause to say that this initiative under the MCA was to reward governments with
policies of good governance and I think that as a nation we can pride ourselves that over the period we have deepened the process of good governance. And in particular, it was remarkable that on 14th March the President of the USA had cause to say that this is a reward for nations that will fight corruption, nations that will commit themselves to the respect for fundamental human rights and then ensure a commitment to the rule of law; and in particular investing in people and investing in healthcare.
But Mr. Speaker, if you take the Committee's Report and you also take the development agenda which was presented to the USA authorities and to the Committee, I think that there are very serious fundamental gaps that we need to address.
Now, the primary aim of this facility is to ameliorate poverty. Mr. Speaker, it is a fact that there are four deprived regions in this country, even by available statistics whether from the Ministry of Finance and Economic Planning or from the World Bank. We have four deprived regions as far as the incidence of poverty is concerned. These regions are the Upper East Region, the Upper West Region, the Northern Region and the Central Region.
Therefore, any development agenda which wants to deal with poverty must necessarily focus on these four areas. Mr. Speaker, if you look at the Committee's Report, not even a single district from the Upper West Region is being considered under this programme; not a single district from the Upper East Region is being considered under this programme. In the Central Region we have a few, just two or three.
Mr. Speaker, I think that there is something wrong with this request. I have no problem with us approving the Bill but
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:20 p.m.
You should be landing; I gave you one and a half minutes.
Mr. H. Iddrisu 2:20 p.m.
I will be landing, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, our country's proposal to the MCA does not capture, in essence, areas that are most affected by poverty and areas that ought to be benefiting; and I think that our inability to include the Upper East and Upper West Regions in particular is a very unfortunate development. It does not reflect our quest - In fact, Mr. Speaker, the Directive Principles of State Policy enjoin us to ensure equity and regional balance and I think that in dealing with poverty we cannot pretend -
I do not want to believe that this is discriminatory, but we cannot pretend that we do not know the rate and incidence of poverty in the most affected areas. I am calling on hon. Members that, it is about time that we adopted the Central Region, Upper East, Upper West and Northern Regions because this -- [Interruption] -- and some parts of Western and Greater Accra Regions; they will come under urban poverty -- [Interruption.]
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:20 p.m.
Yes, hon. Member, I am going to cut you off if you would not land.
Mr. H. Iddrisu 2:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, in conclution, I appreciate the other regions that are being mentioned. But I am dealing with the incidence of poverty as the statistics show -- where there is hard core poverty and extreme poverty.
We know we have committed ourselves to achieving the Millennium Development Goals. If we do have poverty in those areas we cannot achieve holistic and sustainable development and that itself will be negative on our development agenda.
With these few comments, Mr. Speaker, I associate myself with the Bill.
Dr. Paa Kwesi Nduom 2:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I want to draw my hon. Colleagues' attention to the fact that what is on the floor now is the Millennium Development Authority Bill. It is the Bill to set up the Authority and so I just would not like to be drawn into too much of some of the other discussions that have taken place on the floor. However, Mr. Speaker, it is important that we clarify certain points.
Mr. H. Iddrisu 2:30 p.m.
On a point of order.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:30 p.m.
I believe
you heard what the hon. Minister said.
Mr. H. Iddrisu 2:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, he
disagreed.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:30 p.m.
He says
Ghana was mentioned among the 16 countries in 2004.
Mr. H. Iddrisu 2:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, that
was not what I also said. I said that the initiative was launched in 2002 by the United States President and I have facts to support it; I can quote them.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:30 p.m.
So what
is your point then? You are driving at a different point, he is also driving at a different point; so what is your point of order?
Dr. Nduom 2:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, as I
mentioned earlier, it is important to clarify certain points. The hon. Member should know. I was there in Montreal, Mexico, when President Bush first announced that he was going to set up a Millennium Challenge Account. I was there.
Mr. H. Iddrisu 2:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, when?
Dr. Nduom 2:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, that was in
2002. [Interruption.] That was when he announced that he was going to set this initiative up. It was in 2004 that the account was set up and indeed it was in 2004 that 16 countries were announced, including Ghana. So it has not taken us four years to get to this stage; it is an important point to make.
Indeed, Mr. Speaker, there are some countries that have signed compacts ahead of Ghana, but I also know that a number of those countries are having difficulties in actually getting disbursements from the Millennium Challenge Corporation because they have not done the kind of detailed work that we are doing at this
Mr. Bagbin 2:30 p.m.
On a point of order. Mr. Speaker, I am just rising on a point of order to correct the erroneous impression, that it is because those countries have not done detailed work that is why they are having difficulties in accessing the programme. That is exactly not the case. The case is that they are having difficulty in complying with the fundamental principles of governing justly, investing in people, and encouraging economic freedom.
This is because if you do not do detailed work you will not get the approval to access the fund. But as you get that, they still continue to measure your performance as a country in terms of democracy and the other basic principles. That is the reason; it is not because they have not done detailed work.
Dr. Nduom 2:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, once again, I think we should get some things straight. First of all there is one thing, to become qualified. To become qualified is where the United States Government applies those three principles. That was not what I was talking about. I was talking about those who had qualified among the 16, who had actually signed compacts and have not been able to get disbursements. That is where I was referring to the fact
Mr. Bagbin 2:30 p.m.
On a point of order. Mr. Speaker, it is the same thing that I was saying, that until you do a detailed work you would not get them to sign the compact. That is what I am saying; that you must do a detailed work before they sign.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:30 p.m.
I believe you are speaking at cross-purposes. Your position is that you must qualify in terms of good governance, et cetera, even in the course of assessment. He is making the point that that is the first qualification. As to whether you would be allowed to access the funds the way you want it, it is based on some detailed work. You may disagree but let him continue.
Dr. Nduom 2:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, it is also important for us to understand that selection of districts is not included in the Bill that is in front of us. I do appreciate the comments that have been made and the discussions. We have taken them into account but that is not what we are doing here on the floor today. We are here to create the Authority.
Mr. Speaker, I also heard one hon. Member talk about sharing ¢500,000, ¢1,000,000. There is nothing in our programme that talks about sharing ¢500,000 here and there or ¢1 million here and there. What we have proposed is a comprehensive programme that involves road construction.
Indeed, over 1,000 kilometres of roads are included. It has got water development included; it has got agriculture component
Mr. E. T. Mensah 2:30 p.m.
On a point of clarification. Mr. Speaker, I want the hon. Minister to clarify whether the 1,000 kilometres of roads that he is talking about would be laterite or bituminous roads.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:30 p.m.
Hon. Member, you are out of order. Let him continue.
Dr. Nduom 2:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, again, as I mentioned earlier on, we are trying to create the Authority and there is a lot of work that is still to go into finalising the design of our proposal. Indeed, I hope that within the next three weeks or so we would have the opportunity, if Parliament so wishes, to provide some detailed briefing about this important programme that we are talking about here today.
Mr. Speaker, finally, it is important for us to know that the kind of money we are talking about is unprecedented in its coming, and also in terms of the size of it. We are talking of, at least, $500 million that is not a loan, but which is a grant, and a grant to the people of Ghana that we can all be proud of because it recognises ruling justly or governing justly; it recognises investing in people and also recognises encouraging economic freedom, which not every country in the world has been able to qualify for.
Mr. Speaker, I have taken all the comments that have been made and I thank my hon. Colleagues for all of their suggestions.
Question put and motion agreed to.
The Millennium Development Aut- hority Bill was accordingly read a Second time.

Suspension of Standing Order 128 (1)

Minister for Private Sector Reform

(Dr. Paa Kwesi Nduom): Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, that notwithstanding the provisions of Standing Order 128 (1) which require that when a Bill has been read a Second time it shall pass through a Consideration Stage which shall not be taken until at least forty-eight hours have elapsed, the Consideration Stage of the Millennium Development Authority Bill may be taken today.
Mr. Kwame Osei-Prempeh 2:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to second the motion.
Question put and motion agreed to.
Resolved accordingly.
BILLS - CONSIDERATION STAGE 2:40 p.m.

Mr. Paul Okoh 2:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to
move, clause 2, paragraph (c), lines 1 and 2 between “programmes” and “funded” insert “of similar nature”.
Question put and amendment agreed
to.
Clause 2 as amended ordered to stand
part of the Bill.
Mr. Okoh 2:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move,
clause 4 delete.
Mr. H. Iddrisu 2:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, this is to
support the Committee's recommendation that that particular provision be deleted. The President as the fountain of honour and Chief Executive of the land, even without mention, is a patron to many of these institutions; and we need not add that to the piece of legislation. With that I think I support the amendment.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:40 p.m.
Hon.
Chairman, do you agree to it?
Question put and amendment agreed
to.
Clause 4 as amended ordered to stand
part of the Bill.
Clause 5 - Management of similar
programmes.
Mr. H. Iddrisu 2:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg
to move, clause 5 delete.
Mr. Speaker, if you look at clause 5 it is more or less a saving provision. It is intended that even when the management of the Millennium Development Challenge programme is over, this Authority could as well manage similar programmes. Mr. Speaker, that is inconsistent with the very purpose of this Bill which is captured in the opening paragraph of the memorandum which states, and with your permission I quote:
“The purpose of the Bill is to put in p lace by s ta tu te , an Authority to oversee and manage the implementation of the Ghana
Government Programmes under the Millennium Challenge Account of the Government of the United States of America.”
I cannot see how any future programme would be the same in character, form and nature. This one is at the initiative of the US Government and future programmes may entirely be different. So I cannot see how we can extend the mandate of this Authority to cover some future programmes that we do not know, and whose character and form is unknown to us. Whenever it is necessary this House would have opportunity to deal with this, so I urge hon. Members that the whole of clause 5 be deleted.
Mr. A. O. Aidooh 2:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I rise to oppose the amendment. Mr. Speaker, if you look at clause 2 as amended, it states that the Authority will oversee and manage other national development programmes of similar nature founded by the Ghana Government. That is the new law now. For that reason the amendment is completely misplaced and I oppose it.
Mr. J. A. Ndebugre 2:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker,
I also rise to oppose the amendment. I think my good younger Brother from the other side has misinterpreted “similar” to mean “the same”. The operative word there is “similar” -- programmes of a similar nature, not programmes of the same nature. I will give an example. This one is a programme under the US Government or a programme initiated by the US Government. We know that the British Government also, at least, the British Prime Minister has also been talking about Africa's woes.
Let us imagine that in the next two weeks or months Prime Minister Tony Blair also puts aside some money for further reduction of poverty. Does he want
us to come again and pass another Bill to deal with such a situation? I think it is in anticipation of such programmes that this clause has been put there; and it ought to remain there. On these grounds I oppose the amendment.
Question put and amendment negatived. Clauses 5 to 7 ordered to stand part of
the Bill.
Clause 8 - Governing body of the Authority.
Mr. H. Iddrisu 2:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, clause 8, subclause (1), paragraph (b), delete and insert the following:
“one representative each of the Ministries of Agriculture, Finance, Local Government and Rural Development, Energy and Women and Children's Affairs.”
Mr. Speaker, with your indulgence, I am proposing an amendment. If you look at the original thinking, clause 8 (1) (b) provided for one representative each of not less than four Ministries. I think that we can be specific and with your indulgence, Mr. Speaker, I would like to make a further amendment to include the Ministry of Women and Children's Affairs.
And the argument is that, Mr. Speaker, the implementation of this agenda is multi-sectoral and we do know the roles that many of these Ministries play. For instance, Local Government and Rural Development will be integral to its implementation. Ordinarily, this will be run by the Ministry of Finance and Economic Planning; that we know.
We do know that the Ministry of
Women and Children's Affairs now has a focus in particular to deal with poverty, which is the thrust of this whole Millennium Challenge Account issue; and I do frankly think that hon. Members should let us be specific. Instead of saying not less than four - we do not know - we can name the Ministries one after the other; and I propose that we accept the said Ministries that I have mentioned.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:50 p.m.
Yes, hon. Chairman of the Committee, what is your position on that matter?
Mr. Okoh 2:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I oppose that amendment. Mr. Speaker, if you read clause 8 (b),
“one representative each of not less than four Ministries, Departments and Agencies whose functions are of direct relevance to the objectives and functions of the Authority” --
Mr. Speaker, if we have to mention specific Ministries, we tie the hands of the Authority because the functions may change. These are not permanent functions. They may change, as we go along, because other relevant things will come in; and this is why we must not tie the hands of the Authority, so that when the relevance of that Ministry comes in, then that Ministry will be given that authority.
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 2:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I also rise to oppose the amendment. Mr. Speaker, indeed, I must say that I appreciate the principle, the motive underpinning the amendment proposed by my hon. Colleague, except that we should be realistic. Here, we may even redesignate Ministries, as we have been doing; the focus of certain Ministries could change. Let us face it, water resources is very paramount and consideration of water issues are very germane to reducing poverty in the Northern Region.
Why is he not saying that even now we
Mr. Edward Salia 2:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I believe that it is the way my hon. Colleague chose “Ministers”. I think that if we were to use “Ministries with the responsibility for Agriculture, Local Development and Rural Development, Women and Children - [Interruption.]
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:50 p.m.
So hon.
Edward Salia, what is your position? His proposal seeks to limit it to five Ministries. Now, what is here is just “relevant Ministries, departments and agencies”. So what is your position?
Mr. Salia 2:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, my position
is that I support his amendment to the effect that specific Ministries should be mentioned.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:50 p.m.
And
limited to the five that he is proposing?
Mr. Salia 2:50 p.m.
Well, here the proposal is
four.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:50 p.m.
He has
added one to it.
Mr. Salia 2:50 p.m.
So I agree with him that
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:50 p.m.
I think
you are coming out with a new proposed amendment to his amendment.
Mr. Salia 2:50 p.m.
So those are the five; water
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:50 p.m.
Hon.
Member for Jirapa, I think we want to be consistent and focused. What we are saying is this; he has made his proposal, if you agree with him, be very specific that you agree with him or not. But you are coming up with your own proposal.
Mr. Salia 2:50 p.m.
I have agreed with him on
the number of Ministries - five. But I disagree with him on one Ministry, that is, Energy. Because in this particular instance, the direct relevance of energy is - So it should be deleted. So it is a further amendment.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:50 p.m.
You
make our work difficult. You are moving a further amendment to his amendment?
Mr. Salia 2:50 p.m.
I am moving a further amendment to his amendment by saying that I agree with the specific five Ministries, but I disagree with one; and I am replacing it with Road Transport because transportation is germane in this particular exercise.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:50 p.m.
It makes
the issue a bit more confusing, as I said. Hon. Minister, what do you say to that?
Dr. Nduom 2:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I rise to
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:50 p.m.
Which
amendment are you opposing?
Dr. Nduom 2:50 p.m.
I am opposing both
amendments that have been proposed.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 2:50 p.m.
At the
moment we have one amendment on the floor, that is, the one proposed by hon. Haruna Iddrisu.
Dr. Nduom 2:50 p.m.
I am opposing the
amendment proposed by the hon. Member for Tamale South on the one that talks about a representative each from the Ministries of Agriculture, Finance, Local Government and Rural Development and Women and Children's Affairs. That is the amendment I am opposing.
Mr. Speaker, I want to draw the hon. Member's attention to the point that we have just gone over which says that this Authority is not being limited to just one compact or one investment; that it will continue and will carry on to do work of similar nature in the future. So the next compact even could be all about tourism and in that case we will be talking about the Minister for Tourism and others.
So we cannot be very specific here. Indeed, when the other hon. Member talked about energy, electricity is a significant component of what we are going to do here. So electrification is part of what we are looking forward to doing. So it is important that we do not tie our hands or the hands of Government to anybody by being too specific in naming specific Ministries or Ministers in what we are doing here.
Mr. John Ndebugre 3 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I also oppose the amendment. If we look at clause 10 which deals with the tenure of office of members, you will realize that the tenure is different for voting members of the Board as against members or representatives of NGOs, and it is like this -
“The chairperson and the other voting members of the Board shall hold office for a period of five years except that the representatives from the Private Sector and of NGOs shall hold office for a period of two and one-half years and shall upon the expiry of that period be replaced by new members for the same period.”
Mr. Abdul-Rashid Pelpuo 3 p.m.
On a point
of order. Mr. Speaker, it appears the hon. Member is going out of order.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3 p.m.
Why do
you say that?
Mr. Pelpuo 3 p.m.
In matters of relevance, we are specific now on the amendment - there is an amendment on the floor, specific to a particular clause yet he is bringing an issue which is exactly not what we are discussing, about the representations that are going to come from the Ministries. So I think he is out of order.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3 p.m.
Well, I do not appear to agree with you but it is all right; you have made your point.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3 p.m.


We are talking about specific Ministries and your point about private NGOs and private sector and so on and so forth are not relevant to the motion on the floor. Can you react to that and let us continue.
Mr. Ndebugre 3 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I appreciate his difficulty because he is not learned in the law. In law when we are dealing with a Bill, we read it as a whole in order that you can collect the intent. We are now dealing with the intent so I am saying that precisely because NGOs are so many they do not have to count specifically say this particular NGO in the water sector; this NGO in the health sector. Because of that their representation has not been fixed.
For the same reason or for a similar reason, it is not wise to fix specific Ministries, and I was about to develop the argument that even I do not agree that you can isolate certain Ministries that are dealing with poverty reduction while others are not dealing with poverty reduction.
All Ministries indeed are dealing with poverty reduction because we are HIPC and all our Ministries are struggling hard to get out of this position. So it is not wise for us to specify Ministries and the difficulty has become clear because even as hon. Salia agrees in principle with the amendment, he disagrees with ‘energy' being included. In his view, ‘energy' does not contribute to poverty reduction. I do not agree with him. I may talk about tourism and so on. So it is better to fix the number and not specify the Ministries.
On these grounds, I oppose the amendment not because I always want to oppose whatever hon. Haruna Iddrisu says.
Mr. J. A. Tia 3 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I rise to support the amendment jointly proposed by hon. Haruna Iddrisu and hon. Edward Salia. [Interruption.] He proposed and
he further amended it and put it before the House so that was why I said so. Mr. Speaker, if you look at the provision, clause 8 (b) where they are talking of the representatives of Ministries, the Chairman of the Committee has stated and the Bill itself has rightly captured the reason why some Ministries must be chosen and maybe given responsibility for this Bill.
The relevance of the Ministry is very important and to say now that we cannot identify those Ministries whose responsibilities have relevance to poverty alleviation in this country means that we are not serious with ourselves. Mr. Speaker, agriculture is very relevant to poverty - [Interruption] - nobody said so. Please, let me make my point. Sit down; when I finish you can raise your point.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3 p.m.
Hon. Member, speak to the Chair.
Mr. Tia 3 p.m.
Yes. So they have mentioned Ministries with relevance to the Authority and hon. Haruna's amendment cited Agriculture - [Interruption.]
Mr. Okoh 3 p.m.
On a point of order. Mr. Speaker, my hon. Friend is misleading the House because nobody has said that those Ministries that have been mentioned now do not have any relevance to poverty reduction. We are saying that presently they may but later on when other things come into focus, they may not be relevant Ministries at that time. So there is the need for us not to give specific Ministries so that if we give the number as and when a Ministry's activity becomes relevant then that Ministry would be nominated.
Mr. Tia 3 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, the Chairman has rather reinforced my argument. I am saying that if we in this House and as a nation also say that at this time we cannot identify Ministries whose duties are relevant to poverty reduction, then
Mr. Kwadwo Adjei-Darko 3 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I think the whole point is very simple and clear. At any particular point, you would have a specific Ministry in even a specific location which may be relevant to poverty reduction. If we want to identify Ministries now, then perhaps because we have decentralization as a - [Interruption.]
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3 p.m.
Hon. Adjei-Darko, wait for your turn. I thought you were rising on a point of order; if you want to make a contribution wait for your turn.
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3 p.m.
On a point of order. Mr. Speaker, my point of order relates to the statement made by my hon. Colleague on the other side, that we cannot identify the Ministries which are related to poverty reduction. Mr. Speaker, that is not the argument at all. That is not the strand of the argument. My hon. Colleague from Tamale South (Mr. Haruna Iddrisu) is saying that we need to be specific. That is the argument and we are saying that, yes, we agree with him that these Ministries relate to poverty reduction or if you like, eradication but we are saying that the focus could change. Ministries could be redesignated.
So we are saying that we should not pin ourselves down to specifying the Ministries for now even though you and I know which Ministries for now relate to
these issues that we are raising. Nobody has said that they cannot identify the Ministries. Nobody has said so.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3 p.m.
Hon. John Tia, you still have the floor.
Mr. Tia 3:10 p.m.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am very glad with his intervention. That is the point that I am making, that once we can identify them, as the hon. Member's point is, let us do it now. You are saying that because some other Ministries might also have some -- in future when their status change -- But we have a situation where Ministries have been redesignated in this House and we have accordingly reassigned them their responsibilities or redesignated their duties in our Standing Orders and in our everyday practice here. So we can do it now. Anytime any Ministry's role changes and it has relevance to poverty and this Bill is called to order, they will change it accordingly.
What we are saying is that we cannot leave it like this because for us, if tomorrow somebody sits somewhere and decides that Ministry of Women and Children's Affairs is not having anything to do with poverty issues, who can challenge that fellow? If tomorrow, someone says that Ministry of Road Transport has nothing to do with poverty alleviation, who can challenge that fellow? So we must be specific now. If at any time any Ministry's role changes and it has relevance to poverty issues, then the amendment can be made accordingly. That is all that we are saying but to leave it open is to say that we do not know what we are doing.
Question put and amendment negatived.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:10 p.m.
We are still dealing with clause 8. Hon. Iddrisu --
Mr. H. Iddrisu 3:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, even before I move this amendment, I would like to draw your attention to Standing Order 109 (1). Mr. Speaker, as important as the Millenium Challenge Account and its authority Bill are, I think that it is also important that this House is duly represented and properly constituted. With your indulgence, I would like to quote, Mr. Speaker, Standing Order 109
(1) --
“No Question for decision in the House shall be proposed for determination unless there are present in the House not less than one-half of all the Members of the House and, except otherwise provided in the Constitution, the Question proposed shall be determined by the majority of the votes of the Members present and voting.”
Mr. Speaker, I do not think that this House is properly constituted.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:10 p.m.
All right, you have drawn my attention, you may take your seat. [Pause.]
Mr. H. Iddrisu 3:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, clause 8, subclause (1), paragraph (c), delete and insert the following: “a representative each of the Private Enterprise Foundation and Association of Ghana Industries”.
Mr. Speaker, it is further provided under 8 (c ) that there shall be two persons representing the private sector. I find the “private sector” as a very broad and wide institution and my proposition is that we should be specific.
We do have the Private Enterprise
Foundation which is spearheading and stimulating debate on strengthening the public sector. We also do have the Association of Ghana Industries. My amendment is that we should recognize these two bodies as representatives of the private sector in this direction.
Mr. Speaker, I therefore so move that we delete and substitute the following 3:10 p.m.
“a representative each of the Private Enterprise Foundation and Association of Ghana Industries”.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:10 p.m.
Hon. Members, we will now move on to clause 8, subclause (1), Chairman of the Committee.
Mr. Okoh 3:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, clause 8, subclause (1), paragraph (c ) after “sector” insert “nominated by the Private Sector”.
Mr. Kojo Armah 3:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, looking at the amendment here and taking a cue from what hon. Iddrisu said, that the Private Sector is a very broad and nebulous organization for which reason he wanted to desegregate them, my question here is, when we say “nominated by the private sector”, which organization representing the private sector is doing it? Is it the Private Sector Foundation, the Association of Private Industries, Ghana United Traders Association? All of them are in the private sector. Which organization is nominating who on behalf of the private sector?
If the Chairman of the Committee can clarify that situation for us we will look at the two amendments together.
Mr. Okoh 3:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I think there
was an omission over there. Mr. Speaker, insert “nominated by the private sector which has the relevance”. [Pause.] Mr. Speaker, it is just like the other one that we have already dealt with.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:10 p.m.
Which other one?
Mr. Okoh 3:10 p.m.
Clause 8.
rose
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:10 p.m.
Do you
want to come to his aid?
Mr. Abayateye 3:10 p.m.
Yes, Mr. Speaker. I
am a member of the Committee and I want to help the Chairman.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:10 p.m.
Yes, I will
hear you.
Mr. Abayateye 3:10 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I think
we said “two representatives representing the private sector nominated by the private sector of direct relevance”. There are various private sector organizations involved. But those which are directly involved.
rose
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:10 p.m.
Hon.
Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu, I can rely on you on this matter.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:20 p.m.
Hon. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu, can you go over it?
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, what I said would be in tandem with what obtains in clause 8 (1) (b).
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:20 p.m.
I want you to repeat it, not in tandem.
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker,
“two persons nominated by the private sector whose functions are of direct relevance to the objectives and functions of the authority.”
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:20 p.m.
Chairman of the Committee, is that what you wanted?
Mr. Okoh 3:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, that is so.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:20 p.m.
Hon. Members, the proposed amendment is for your consideration. Hon. Kojo Armah, you raised that issue.
Mr. Armah 3:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, it is not clear. There must be some clarity and certainty in what we are doing. We are not too certain what that particular clause is meant to be. Who is doing the nomination and on which private sector's behalf? We need to be very clear with what we are doing so that we do not leave anything in doubt. Otherwise, somebody would give his own interpretation.
Dr. Nduom 3:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, once again, we need to guard against being too specific. I support the amendment that has just been proposed for the simple reason that for example, if we are talking about horticulture there are private sector associations and groups which can nominate representatives. If the focus shifts to tourism, for example, there are tourism-based private sector organi-zations who would then nominate representatives. So I do support the amendment that is on the floor at the moment.
Mr. Adjei-Darko 3:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I rise to oppose the amendment. Mr. Speaker, if you talk about “nominated by the relevant private sector”, I think the private sector we are talking about here is an amorphous body. If it is agreed for example, there
Mr. Okoh 3:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, clause 8, subclause (1), paragraph (d), at end add “nominated by the NGOs”.
Mr. Abayateye 3:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, again, I think the amendment could not capture -- because we said there were so many NGOs but at a specific time those whose functions are related, are of relevance. I think that amendment too goes with that -- NGOs whose functions are of relevance - I think it has to be captured well.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:20 p.m.
You are also making a proposal that what has been advertised we should insert or add - “NGOs whose functions are relevant to the objectives of the authority”. Hon. Chairman, do you agree to that?
Mr. Okoh 3:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I think I would go with the hon. Member.
Mr. Ndebugre 3:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I rise to oppose the amendment for the same reason that hon. Adjei-Darko raised in the previous one. It is worth while for NGOs because the NGOs are being formed almost on a daily basis so when we say “nominated by the NGOs . . .”
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:20 p.m.
By the NGOs whose functions are relevant - [Interruption.]
Mr. Ndebugre 3:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, but we do not have a specific number of NGOs. NGOs are being formed everyday. So I think the discretion should be given to the Minister to nominate persons to represent the NGOs. It would be difficult to organize a forum to which NGOs will choose representatives.
Mr. A. O. Aidooh 3:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I think that we are losing focus. Mr. Speaker, the Bill talks about one representative of NGOs. If we say one representative of NGOs, we do not know how they are chosen, that is why we want to have the NGOs play a role. We want to amend it to say “one person nominated by the NGOs”. Otherwise, we will go back to where we were that one representative of NGOs and anybody can appoint them as just a representative. We want to have the nomination done by the NGOs. It is not the amorphousness of the subject but the purpose is to have the nomination done by the NGOs so that nobody sitting anywhere can just choose anybody to come and be there for the NGOs. That is the idea.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:20 p.m.
So how do you go over that problem?
Mr. A. O. Aidooh 3:20 p.m.
Therefore, we must support the amendment.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:20 p.m.
Which amendment?
Mr. A. O. Aidooh 3:20 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, the amendment of the Chairman. We may add
the words “with relevance to the objects of the Authority” but it should be nominated by NGOs whose functions are relevant to the authority. So that is the purpose of the amendment.
Question put and amendment negatived.
Mr. Okoh 3:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, clause 8, subclause (3), paragraph (b), line 2, delete “initial”.
Dr. Nduom 3:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, indeed, this amendment and the next one should really come together. That is that; the amendment should be deleting “initial” and all the words after “investment”.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:30 p.m.
Well, let us move one after the other. What has been proposed is that, we should remove from the second line of that paragraph the word “initial”. That is the first proposed amendment.
Mr. Bagbin 3:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am trying to support the Chairman of the Committee. We are proposing that the word “initial” be deleted because the initial thinking has changed. It was just for the Millennium Challenge Account, a period of five years; we are anticipating that the Authority will stay longer than that and that we are expecting further moneys which will be extended to other areas. So if we talk about only “initial”, then when it is extended to other areas we will still be compelled to use the representatives of the initial investment, which we think is not right. That is why we are proposing that the word “initial” should be deleted.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Mr. Okoh 3:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, that clause 8, subclause (3), paragraph
(b), line 2, delete all the words after “investment”.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Clause 8 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clause 9 -- Functions of the Board.
Mr. Okoh 3:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, clause 9, subclause (2), paragraph (d), line 1, delete “annual”.
Question put and amendment agreed to
Clause 9 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clause 10 -- Tenure of office of members.
Mr. H. Iddrisu 3:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, clause 10, subclause (1), line 2, delete “five” and insert “four”.
Mr. Speaker, I propose that with your indulgence and since we are considering this with the suspension of some of our Standing Orders, I further crave your indulgence to make an additional amendment. Apart from “delete five”, the tenure of office in my view should be four years and the sentence should end, so that from the sentence beginning “except” must entirely be deleted up to the end of the period.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:30 p.m.
Hon. Member, hold on and move a little slowly. What you are proposing is that apart from the deletion of “five” -- Which words are you proposing that we add?
Mr. H. Iddrisu 3:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, that the word “five” be substituted for “four”
Mr. H. Iddrisu 3:30 p.m.


so that the tenure of office for all the chairpersons and the voting members of the Board shall be four years. That is the first amendment. I think that five years is unduly long for the membership of that Board. And the second one is that, you will see that there is a discriminatory provision under, where representatives of the NGOs and others are to serve only two and a half years.

I think that we should treat them as members of the same Board. All of them should enjoy the four- year period as members of the Authority. Therefore, the word beginning “except” must be deleted up to the end of the word “period”, so that we will just have four years for all the members of the Board. I urge hon. Members at least, for the first time, to support this amendment.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:30 p.m.
Well, that is the proposed amendment. Chairman of the Committee, what do you say to that?
Mr. Okoh 3:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I oppose his amendment. Mr. Speaker, the Committee deliberated at length on this clause and we came to the realization that whilst we are -- [Interruption.]
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:30 p.m.
Chair-man of the Committee, for me to follow what your argument will be, the hon. Member has proposed two amendments. First, he said, the year “five” should be reduced to “four”. Beside that, he is saying that instead of “two and a half years” for some representatives and so forth, all those words should be deleted and made it applicable to all. That is, all members of the Board should enjoy a period of four years. That is what he is proposing. Which one are you against? Are you against everything or some part?
Mr. Okoh 3:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am against both.
Mr. Okoh 3:30 p.m.
Yes, all, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:30 p.m.
Go ahead.
Mr. Okoh 3:30 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am saying that because we took into consideration the length of time of the five years and we deliberated on it for a long time and we decided that the five years is very good, in the sense that we are saying that there is the need for continuity in all these things that we are doing -- In fact, we would want the governing board to have five years so that its lifespan will be longer than that of the NGOs.
This is because we have a lot of NGOs and we would want to give them the chance -- two and a half years, so that one NGO comes on for two and a half years, and the other comes in for two and half years. That will make up for the five years that the Board will also have and that is why we considered that. I think it is proper.
Mr. Akwasi Afrifa 3:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I also support the Chairman that we retain exactly what is there. Basically, the activities of the Millennium Challenge Corporation are going to be on agriculture and we have to take the gestation period of the various crops that would be cultivated in those areas into account. Therefore, the five years would be all right before we can assess the existing Board, whether they have been able to achieve the objectives or not. Secondly, for the case of the two and a half years, we have to give -- [Interruption.]
Mr. H. Iddrisu 3:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, on a
point of order. Mr. Speaker, hon. Afrifa is the Chairman of my Committee; he is not
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:40 p.m.
You are
Mr. Afrifa 3:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, this is my
boy and he knows I am the one coaching him. I am his mentor; he does not know what he is talking about. I would coach him outside.
Mr. Speaker, we have to give the opportunity to the various non- governmental organisations (NGOs) to also serve so that they would all gain experience. I support the idea that we retain exactly what the Chairman said, in the existing provision.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Mr. Bagbin 3:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I am
contesting the voice vote.
Question put and amendment negatived.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:40 p.m.
Hon.
Members, I realize that I made a mistake and the hon. Minority Leader drew my attention to it. I believe there is leadership in this House. So please, let us continue.
Clauses 10 to 16 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clause 17 -- Functions of the Chief Executive Officer
Mr. Armah 3:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to
move, clause 17, paragraph (b), line 1, delete “assistants” and insert “assistance”.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:40 p.m.
Hon. Chairman, somebody is asking why -- Would you convince the House?
Mr. Armah 3:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, it is a wrong
word.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:40 p.m.
Very well,
I think it is grammatical.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Clause 17 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clauses 18 and 19 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clause 20 -- Management of the Fund
Mr. Armah 3:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to
move, clause 20 -- Head Note, delete and insert “The Fund and its Management”.
Question put and amendment agreed
to.
Mr. Armah 3:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, clause 20, subclause (1), line 1, delete “is” and insert “or any other programme under this Act are”.
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:40 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, it is just a little amendment because the Chairman of the Committee himself has instituted the scheme and that is in respect of line 2, of 20 (1).
Mr. Speaker, in-between “and” and “achievement”, there should be the word “the” -- “and the achievement of his objectives”.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:40 p.m.
Go over
it again; I did not hear you properly, hon. Member.
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:40 p.m.
Mr.
Speaker, it is a minor thing, I thought the draftpersons could take charge of it.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:40 p.m.
And what
did you say?
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:40 p.m.
Mr.
Speaker, I am proposing that there should be “the” between “and” and “achievement”.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:40 p.m.
Which word?
Mr. Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 3:40 p.m.
“The performance of the functions and the achievement of its objectives.”
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:50 p.m.
So you are proposing that “the” should be inserted after “a”? That is another amendment.
Question put and amendment agreed
to.
Clause 20 as amended ordered to stand
part of the Bill. Clause 21 ordered to stand part of the
Bill.
Clause 22 -- Accounts and audit
Mr. Okoh 3:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move,
clause 22, subclause (4), line 1, delete “six” and insert “three”.
Mr. Speaker, this proposed amendment is for the purpose of bringing the reporting requirement of the Auditor-General to Parliament in line with the spirit and letter of the Constitution; that they have to bring the report to Parliament.
Question put and amendment agreed
to.
Mr. Okoh 3:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, clause 22, subclause (5), delete and insert the following:
“The Board may, with the approval of the Auditor-General, appoint an external auditor for the purpose of this section.”
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Clause 22 as amended ordered to stand
part of the Bill.
Clauses 23 to 26 ordered to stand part
of the Bill.
Clause 27 -- Interpretation
Mr. Okoh 3:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move,
clause 27, add the following: “NGO” means non-governmental organization.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:50 p.m.
That is, at the end of all the proposed, the Interpretation, we should add the words ‘‘‘NGO' means non-governmental organization”. Chairman of the Committee, is that what you are proposing?
rose
Mr. Okoh 3:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, that is so.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:50 p.m.
Hon. Members, for clause 27, the proposed amendment is that the words “‘NGO' means non-governmental organization” be added. Hon. Member for Zebilla?
Mr. Ndebugre 3:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I thought I heard you say that -- [Pause] -- and the Chairman agreed that it would be after “Minister”, not at the end of the words interpreted -- [Pause.] The amendment should come after the word “Minister”.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:50 p.m.
Which one are you talking about?
Mr. Ndebugre 3:50 p.m.
I am talking about where to insert the meaning of NGO -- [Interruption.]
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:50 p.m.
That is clause 27 -- for interpretation. [Interruption.]
Mr. Ndebugre 3:50 p.m.
And I am saying that they ought to be inserted after the meaning of “Minister.”
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:50 p.m.
Well, it is still for interpretation and it is for the purposes of drafting. I have just been prompted so it would be taken care of.
Mr. Ndebugre 3:50 p.m.
Very well, Mr. Speaker.
Question put and amendment agreed to.
Clause 27 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
The Long Title ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:50 p.m.
That brings us to the end of the Consideration Stage of the Bill.
Mr. A. O. Aidooh 3:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, Motion No. 20; it is just Third Reading, more or less consequential.
Suspension of Standing Order 131(1)
Dr. Paa Kwesi Nduom 3:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move, That notwithstanding the provisions of Standing Order 131 (1) which require that when a Bill has passed through the Consideration Stage, the Third Reading thereof shall not be taken until at least twenty-four hours have elapsed, the motion for t he Third Reading of the Millennium Development Authority Bill
may be moved today.
Mr. Ndebugre 3:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I wish to move for a Second Consideration Stage -- [Interruption] -- [Some hon. Members: No] -- just to make some small -- [Interruption.]
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:50 p.m.
Hon. Member, you are out of order. There is a motion on the floor, either you second it or you make -- [Interruption.]
Mr. Ndebugre 3:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I was up but I did not catch Mr. Speaker's eye. It is very important because it is going to make the final product look very fine.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 3:50 p.m.
Hon. Member, wait, we will come to that when we are going through that. There is a motion for the suspension of the relevant -- Yes, I want somebody to second the motion.
Mr. Okoh 3:50 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to second the motion.
Question put and motion agreed to.
Resolved accordingly.
Mr. Ndebugre 4 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I beg to move for a Second Consideration Stage just to make two small corrections that will make the final product look more sensible. I so move.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 4 p.m.
You have
moved; give your reason.
Mr. Ndebugre 4 p.m.
I beg to move for a
Mr. Ndebugre 4 p.m.
Clause 11, the sub-
title, instead of “Meetings of the Board” it should be “Meeting of the Board”.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 4 p.m.
I think
you missed it completely. It has been changed already.
Mr. Ndebugre 4 p.m.
And clause 15, instead
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 4 p.m.
Hon.
Members, please allow. I agree with you; he is moving a motion. I agree; unfortunately he has spread it over two or three clauses, but let me listen to him. He is a Member of the House; let me listen to him.
Mr. Bagbin 4 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, on a point
of order. He has to move for the Second Consideration Stage of the Bill. When that is taken then he can go from clause to clause. The way he is combining it is the problem.
Mr. Bagbin 4 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, he has to
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 4 p.m.
He
did say that he is moving for a Second Consideration of the Bill but he was going ahead to give his reason -- [Pause.] Go ahead, I am listening to you.
Mr. Ndebugre 4 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, I would
not make sense if I just say I move for a Second Consideration of the Bill.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 4 p.m.
Hon.
Member, I have given you the floor. Please, you are moving for the Second Consideration -- [Interruptions.] You are moving for the Second Consideration in respect of the clauses that you are mentioning.
Mr. Ndebugre 4 p.m.
It appears Mr. Speaker
has drawn my attention to the fact that clause 11 has already been corrected. So I seek leave to withdraw my amendment.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 4 p.m.
Very well,
hon. Member.
Mr. Ndebugre 4 p.m.
Then clause 15,
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 4 p.m.
Hon.
Member, indeed I have just even been prompted. Honestly, it had escaped me but the headache that you have got is a drafting problem; they do not form part of them. So you do not even move for the Second Consideration Stage.
Mr. Ndebugre 4 p.m.
Very well.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 4 p.m.
Hon.
Members, now you have moved for the suspension of the relevant Standing Order and then you want to move the motion itself, that is the Third Reading of that Bill.
BILLS -- THIRD READING 4 p.m.

Mr. A. O. Aidooh 4 p.m.
Mr. Speaker, before we adjourn, may I seek your indulgence to go back to Laying of Papers. And if you will permit us, we will have two
documents laid on behalf of the Ministers by the Minister for Public Sector Reforms.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 4 p.m.
Very well.
PAPERS 4 p.m.

Mr. First Deputy Speaker 4 p.m.
Yes, hon. Deputy Majority Leader, we have finished with the business?
Mr. A. O. Aidooh 4 p.m.
Yes, you may now adjourn the House.
Mr. First Deputy Speaker 4 p.m.
Hon. Members, thank you for your endurance and patience. The House will stand adjourned till tomorrow at 10.00 o'clock before noon.
ADJOURNMENT 4 p.m.

  • The House was adjourned at 4.07 p.m. till 17th March, 2006 at 10.00 a.m.