Debates of 26 Nov 2010

MR FIRST DEPUTY SPEAKER
PRAYERS 10:50 a.m.
VOTES AND PROCEEDINGS AND THE OFFICIAL REPORT 10:50 a.m.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 10:50 a.m.
Hon Members, Correction of Votes and Proceedings of Thursday, 25th November,
2010.
Page 1…11 -
Dr Anthony A. Osei 10:50 a.m.
Mr Speaker, the Committee on Finance met yesterday but there is no record of it here.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 10:50 a.m.
Hon
Members, we are on page 11.
Some Hon Members 10:50 a.m.
It is there.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 10:50 a.m.
Page 12
. . . 19 --
Jonathan Nii Tackie-Kome: Mr Speaker, page 19, Committee on Trade, Industry and Tourism, the first paragraph; there is an omission of the word “met”. The correct sentence should read as follows:
“The Committee met on Thursday, 25th. . . ”
The word “met” is not there.
Prof. (Emeritus) Samuel K.
Amoako: Mr Speaker, still on page 19, under 2 (xi), the name there is “Mr Gifty

Ohene-Konadu”. I think it is supposed to be “Mrs Gifty Ohene-Konadu”.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 10:50 a.m.
Page 20.

Hon Members , the Votes and Proceedings of Thursday, 25th November, 2010 as corrected is hereby adopted as the true record of proceedings.

Hon Members, we have the Official

Report of Friday, 19th November, 2010.

Any correction?
Dr Ahmed Y. Alhassan 10:50 a.m.
Mr Speaker,
on column 1349, paragraph 4, the last but one sentence, there is a motto in Dagbani, “Dani' Suma ni Suglo”. The Suglo is spelt S-u-g-l-o, not “S-u-g-i-o”, and there is an apostrophe after the “i” in the “Dani” which is ‘D-a-n-i'”.
Dr A. A. Osei 10:50 a.m.
Mr Speaker, column
1323, the second line, it says: “I do appreciate the power…”
It should read as follows: “I do appreciate the time constraints” and not the “power”.
The word “power” should be changed to “time”.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 10:50 a.m.
Very well.

Hon Members, in the absence of any further correction, the Official Report of Friday, 19th November, 2010 as corrected, is hereby adopted as the true record of proceedings.

Item 3 -- Business Statement for the

Seventh Week - Chairman of the Business Committee.
BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE 10:50 a.m.
Majority Leader/Chairman of the Business Committee (Mr Cletus A. Avoka) 10:50 a.m.
Mr Speaker, the Committee met on Thursday, 25th November, 2010 and arranged Business of the House for the Seventh Week ending Thursday, 2nd November, 2010. I say Thursday because Friday, 3rd December, is the National Farmers' Day; it is a statutory public holiday and we ought to observe it as such. So, next week, we will end proceedings in the Chamber on Thursday, 2nd of December.
Mr Speaker, the Commit tee accordingly submits its Report as follows 10:50 a.m.
Arrangement of Business
Question(s)
Mr Speaker, in view of the fact that we have some serious business to do in terms of the Budget and the Petroleum Revenue Management Bill, we tried to de- emphasise the invitation to Hon Ministers to answer Questions in the Chamber but for next week, we have programmed only three (3) Hon Ministers. So the following Ministers will answer Urgent Questions asked of them during the week:
No.
of Question(s)
i. Minister for Roads and Highways -- 1
ii. Minister for Foreign Affairs and Regional Integration -- 1
iii. Minister for Local Government and Rural Development -- 1
Total number of Questions -- 3
Mr Speaker, in all, three Hon Ministers are expected to attend upon the House to respond to three (3) Urgent Questions during the week.
Statements
Mr Speaker may allow Statements duly admitted to be made in the House.
Bills, Papers and Reports
Mr Speaker, Bills may be presented to the House for consideration and those
already before the House may be taken
through the various stages. Papers and
committee reports may also be laid.
Motions and Resolutions
Mr Speaker, Motions may be debated
and their consequential Resolutions, if
any, taken during the week.
Post-Budget Workshop
Mr Speaker, the Business Committee
Mr Speaker, the Commit tee accordingly submits its Report as follows 10:50 a.m.
wishes to remind Hon Members that a post-budget workshop arranged for Leadership, Chairpersons, Ranking Members of Committees and Committee Clerks will be held from Friday, 26th through Sunday, 28th November, 2010.
Mr Speaker, Hon Members are once again informed that Chairpersons and Ranking Members of Committees responsible for the consideration of annual estimates of Ministries, Departments and Agencies, as provided for in Standing Order 140 (4), are to attend the post- budget workshop, that is, all the Select Committees and the following Standing Committees:
(i) Judiciary;
(ii) Special Budget;
(iii) Gender and Children; and
(iv) Finance.
Furthermore, Chairpersons and Ranking Members of Committees on Government Assurances, Poverty Reduction and the Public Accounts Committee are also expected to participate in the post-budget workshop.
Debate on the Budget Statement and Economic Policy of the Government
Mr Speaker, debate on the Economic Policy of the Government of Ghana for the year 2011 was expected to commence on Monday, 29th November, 2010. Mr Speaker, it is now intended that debate on the Budget will start next week Wednesday. Let me make a correction. Item number 4, page 2, the debate will
not start on Monday, 29th November, 2010 because the Petroleum Revenue Management Bill, 2010 is still outstanding and we are going to look at it today, Monday and Tuesday.
We hope that by Tuesday, we would have the Third Reading of the Bill. So we start the debate on the principles of the Budget on Wednesday, 1st of December. We hope that we will debate that for two to three days and then we will go into the committees dealing with the Ministries, Departments and Agencies (MDAs).
The Business Committee accordingly urges Hon Members to avail themselves for the debate.
Reporting schedule on estimates of MDAs
Mr Speaker, presentation of reports by committees on estimates of Ministries, Departments and Agencies is expected to commence on Wednesday, 8th December, 2010. In view of the limited time at the disposal of the House, committees are entreated to take note and work within the time frame. A schedule in this regard is attached for the attention of Hon Members. It is important that committee Chairmen and Hon Ranking Members look at the schedule we have attached to know how the reports will be laid in the House.
As time goes on, it is possible to modify this, so that if any committee is able to expeditiously complete its report, we might be able to lay it out of turn, so we are very flexible.
It is important that Hon Members attend to their committees at this stage, so that they will have an input in their reports.
Public Holiday
Mr Speaker, Friday, 3rd December, 2010 is a National Farmers' Day, a statutory holiday and it is expected to be observed as such. Therefore, we are losing one valuable day as a working day. This calls for an extra effort on our part to be able to discharge our responsibilities.
Conclusion
Mr Speaker, in accordance with Standing Order 160 (2), the Committee submits to the Honourable House, the Business of each Sitting of the week and the order in which it shall be taken during the week.

Statements

Presentation and First Reading of Bills --

(a) General Health Services Bill,

2010.

(b) Health Co-ordinating Council Bill, 2010.

(c) Veterans Administration, Ghana Bill, 2010.

(d) Data Protection Bill, 2010.

Consideration Stage of Bills --

Petroleum Revenue Management Bill, 2010.

[Conclusion] Committee Sittings.

Statements.

Motion --

Third Reading of Bills --

Petroleum Revenue Management Bill, 2010

Committee Sittings.

Urgent Questions --
Mr Joseph Boahen Aidoo (Amenfi East) 10:50 a.m.
To ask the Minister for Roads and Highways what immediate measures are being taken to remedy the Tarkwa-Wassa Akropong- Ayanfuri stretch of the Takorad --Kumasi trunk road which has deteriorated so badly.
Mr Kwasi Ameyaw-Cheremeh (Sunyani East) 10:50 a.m.
To ask the Minister for Foreign Affairs and Regional Integration the effort(s) Government has made or is making to secure the release of and airlifting over 640 Ghanaians in detention in Libya for allegedly attempting to stowaway from Libya to Europe.
Mr Kwasi Ameyaw-Cheremeh (Sunyani East) 10:50 a.m.
To ask the Minister for Local Government and Rural Development what accounted for the indefinite postponement of the District Assembly Elections originally slated for 26th October
Mr Kwasi Ameyaw-Cheremeh (Sunyani East) 10:50 a.m.
2010.
Statements
Motions --
That this Honourable House approves the Financial Policy of the Government of Ghana for the year ending 31st December, 2011.
(Moved on Thursday, 18th November, 2010 by the Hon Minister for Finance and Economic Planning, Dr Kwabena Duffuor.)

Committee Sittings.

Statements

Presentation of Papers --

Report of the Committee on Works and Housing on the Engineering Council Bill, 2010.

Report of the joint Committee on Finance and Health on the Financing Agreement between the Government of Ghana and Opus7 s.r.o. Limited of Austria for an amount of four hundred and forty-two million euros (€442,000,000.00) for the supply of 200 ambulance cars, 50

mobile clinics, 2 air ambulances, 10 educative mobile units, construction of 12 district hospitals and technical training in Ghana.

Report of the joint Committee on Finance and Health on the request for waiver of tax and duties amounting to US$20,794,637.00 on goods and services to be implemented in the AngloGold Ashanti (Ghana) Malaria Control Project in the three northern regions.

Report of the Finance Committee on the Export Credit Facility between the Government of the Republic of Ghana and Unicredit Bank Austria AG (Bank Austria Creditanstalt) for an amount of seven million, three hundred thousand euros (€7,300,000.00) for the supply of steel bridge components for the construction of bridges on Wa-Walewale Network of roads and Twifo Praso.

Motions --

That this Honourable House approves the Financial Policy of the Government of Ghana for the year ending 31st December, 2010.

(Moved on Thursday, 18th November, 2010 by the Hon Minister for Finance and Economic Planning, Dr Kwabena Duffuor)

Committee Sittings.

PUBLIC HOLIDAY (National Farmers' Day)

Mr Speaker, before I resume my seat,

let me take the opportunity to inform the august House that two of our Hon Colleagues who made it to the Hajj this year have returned gracefully to join
SPACE FOR TABLE -- PAGE 10:50 a.m.
Prof. Christopher Ameyaw-Akumfi 11 a.m.
Mr Speaker, for those of us who are seriously contemplating going to Mecca, may I advise the Hon Majority Leader, that before they take off, this House gets to know so that we start praying for them even as they air-borne. You do not wait till they come back before you tell us to congratulate them. So in future -- and I hope you would include Hon Members on the other side of the House and I would be the first person for the next Hajj. But I think properly, the House should be informed about those who are risking their lives to go to Mecca.
Mr Avoka 11 a.m.
Mr Speaker, let me correct
an impression. For the avoidance of doubt, it is not the Hon Majority Leader or the Leadership of the National Democratic Congress (NDC) Caucus in Parliament that sent them; they went on their own; they paid and went on their own.
To give the impression that we are selective on this subject, is not correct.
It is a wrong impression that we ought to correct. If the Hon Member is minded to go and wants assistance from the generality of this august House, we will make “NCNC” contributions, then give it to him to go next year.
Mr Hackman Owusu-Agyemang 11 a.m.
Mr Speaker, with the utmost of respect, I think the Hon Leader has goofed. This is because there is no way under the issue that we are discussing -- Business Statement - that this will come. He could have come under Statements Announcements, or what have you. But when you incorporate it into the Business Statement of the House, then we are right in assuming that this was an officially sponsored trip.
He has to tell us whether it was semi -official or quasi-official or whatever official. But next time, the important thing is, he should make it open so that as Hon Ameyaw-Akumfi wants to become a Sheikh, he might as well also join the group.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11 a.m.
Hon
Members, we are on the Business Statement for next week. I also add my voice in welcoming our Hon Brothers back from Mecca.
Dr A. A. Osei 11 a.m.
Mr Speaker, since
you said we were on the Business Statement, I had another matter but I crave your indulgence that after the Business Statement you allow me to bring it up so that we deal with it.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11 a.m.
We are
on the Business Statement.
Dr A. A. Osei 11 a.m.
Yes, Mr Speaker.
The Hon Majority Leader talked about a change on the date that the debate of the Budget is going to start. I want to bring his attention to the fact that once that date is changed -- as of now, we only have two days. So if he can take note of that because Friday will be a holiday and I think that the Budget deserves more than
Mr Dominic B. A. Nitiwul 11:10 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I see that the Business Committee has tabled three Questions to be answered next week. If you look at the Agenda for this Meeting, the oldest Question is in my name, Question No. 113. This Question was asked in July, 2009; that is precisely more than a year now. I was asking the Hon Minister for Finance and Economic Planning to tell us the quantum of fuel that had been consumed and the amount consumed at the Office of the President. I want to find out from him as the Hon Chairman, why that Question is not coming up to this time.
Mr Avoka 11:10 a.m.
Mr Speaker, until Questions are ready to be taken in this House, they do not become the property or they are not yet owned by the Business Committee. I am unaware of the Question that he has asked. So, until it is ready, and the Answer has come back from the Ministry and the Table Office draws the attention of the Business Committee to it, we would be unable to programme it. Now that he has raised the issue, we will investigate and find out what is delaying in the presentation of that Answer before this House.
Mr Emmanuel A. Owusu-Ansah 11:10 a.m.
Mr Speaker, the Hon Majority Leader has asked committees to consider the estimates of their sector Ministries and submit their reports as early as possible for debate in the House. I am speaking for the Judiciary Committee of which I am the Hon Ranking Member.
Three days ago, a communication from His Excellency the President was laid before the House. As we speak now, nobody has seen the document. So, it is going to be very difficult for us to meet as

a committee and submit a report to meet his timing. So, the Hon Majority Leader will do us a great favour if he would speed up the submission of the communication from His Excellency the President to us as early as possible.
Mr Avoka 11:10 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I appreciate that, and to add that it is not only in respect of the Judiciary Committee, the Estimates for the other Ministries, Departments and Agencies (MDAs) have not actually reached this House yet. Yesterday or two days ago, I drew the attention of the Hon Minister for Finance and Economic Planning and his Deputy to the fact that we needed the Estimates as early as possible before we can start work.
Indeed, they were to link up with the Director of Budget and to be able to let us have the Estimates. So, your point is well made, and I will take this opportunity to urge -- Fortunately, one of the Hon Deputy Ministers for Finance and Economic Planning is in the Chamber. I wish to urge them to provide us with the Estimates so that the committees can start their work.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:10 a.m.
Hon
Majority Leader, the Estimates of the Judiciary have actually reached the House. It was laid and that is what he is talking about. If it had not reached here, we would not have laid it. So, that of the Judiciary has reached the House and I have --
Dr A. A. Osei 11:10 a.m.
Mr Speaker, maybe, it
has reached your office and the rest of us - It has been laid, so we were expecting that it will be distributed to us.
More importantly, I think the point that my Hon Senior Colleague should have added was that, for that of the Judiciary, they are supposed to be two sets of Estimates -- the one originally sent by the Judiciary and the recommendations of the President. It is possible that we have
the one coming from the Office of the President but the recommendations -- We have not seen any of them, so I want you to keep that in mind. They must be two; one originally sent. As of today, I do not know if any Hon Member, at least, on this side, has received it.
Mr Owusu-Ansah 11:10 a.m.
Mr Speaker, a
point of correction. We are not expecting two sets of Estimates for the Judiciary. We expect that the same one which was transferred from the Judiciary to His Excellency the President should be transmitted to us with whatever recommendation that he will choose to make; so it is only one.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:10 a.m.
I am
telling you that I have received the communication from the Office of the President and I have forwarded it to the Clerk's Office.
Dr Matthew O. Prempeh 11:10 a.m.
Mr Speaker, the first issue has been partially addressed; the fact that we need direction and time for Hon Members who want to debate the principles of the Budget to speak -- I did not hear from the Hon Leader of the House what he intends actually doing; he did not respond to the Hon Member for Old Tafo when he asked that because next week Friday is a public holiday; as you rightly said, and Monday and Tuesday, you yourself said that we were not going to start the principles of the Budget, I was expecting that he would come back to this House or come back and tell us how many days we are going to debate the principles of the Budget. He has glossed over that but it would be very important for the House to know. If it is Friday, then it means it is travelling and you have to respond to that appropriately.
Secondly, Mr Speaker, I realised that on Thursday, 2nd December, 2010, certain Papers were presented. Obviously, these
are the ones that were referred to the joint Committee on Finance and Health, but conspicuously missing from those that are supposed to be reported on is the 391 Capital Projects list.
I would like to find out from the Hon -- There were three Papers that were referred to the joint Committee on Finance and Health; one is omitted from the one that we are supposed to report on. Besides, the Ministry of Finance and Economic Planning has not been able to convene or help us assist the joint Committee to even start discussing these.
Mr Speaker, we realised that the Leader of the House spoke about those who have gone to Mecca. We congratulate them for doing the honourable pilgrimage.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:10 a.m.
Hon
Member, I thought that we had finished that matter.
Dr Prempeh 11:10 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I am
coming back to the particular point. Those of us who have also done the pilgrimage to Jerusalem need to be congratulated because that is also a pilgrimage to a holy site. My Hon Colleagues and I who have gone there, because we also come with titles, deserve to be congratulated so that we encourage other Christians here to all go on these pilgrimages to enhance and deepen their faith.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:10 a.m.
What is your title? [Laughter.]
Dr Prempeh 11:10 a.m.
Hon Speaker, my title
is a “Jerusalem Pilgrim” (JP) and I have been given a certificate to attach as initials. I am looking forward to becoming a Rabbi and a good one very soon. [Interruption.] I have not finished.
Mr Speaker, my substantive point is that, once this Agenda has been written to us, increasingly, Hon Members are feeling that their Questions and responses are getting either mismatched or lost in the system. So, we implore the Business
Mr Joseph B. Aidoo 11:10 a.m.
Mr Speaker, the
Report is silent on the issue relating to the University of Ghana Act, 2010.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:10 a.m.
Hon
Member, we held a meeting this morning and I am supposed to make a statement on that matter. We started yesterday. The Hon Majority Leader was in the Office of the President yesterday and in the evening we held a meeting with the Leadership of both sides of the House. This morning we held another meeting with Justice V.C.R.A.C Crabbe and others from the Attorney-General's Department on this matter and we got a representation from both sides of the House.
The Hon Minority Leader was not in that meeting but we had representation from the Minority side and we will make a statement on that matter by Monday.
Mr J. B. Aidoo 11:20 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I was
just drawing the attention of the House because that statement is -
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:20 a.m.
Yes. I mean to say that we are working seriously and we have done a lot of work on this matter. This morning we met on this issue and Monday we may make a statement on this matter.
In fact, because of the nature of the issue, I thought that Madam Speaker herself should be in the seat to make the statement; otherwise, I would have made the statement on the matter today.
Mr Simon Osei -Mensah 11:20 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I think last week, I raised an issue concerning communication between the Ministry of Finance and Economic Planning and the Controller and Accountant-General and between the Controller and Accountant-General and the Governor of Bank of Ghana on the District Assemblies Common Fund (DACF) -- transfer for the third quarter, 2010 - [Interruption] -- Please, please. Oh! -- Please. That the Governor should appear before the Committee of the Whole to brief us on why the money has not been transferred. This is because the letter from the Ministry of Finance and Economic Planning was dated 30 th September, 2010 and the one from the Controller and Accountant-General to the Director, Banking Division of the Bank of Ghana was on October 6, 2010. Nothing had been heard from the Central Bank transferring that money.
We know the difficulties the District

Assemblies are going through as a result of delays in transfers to them from the DACF. The Hon Majority Leader promised that he was going to brief us before the end of the week and the week is ending today and nothing has been heard from him. So if he could tell us when he found out, and if he actually did, what was the response?

My second issue is, Mr Speaker, quite surprisingly, it looks as if Questions that are tabled to be answered by the Ministry of Finance and Economic Planning unduly delay. I have a Question that has been outstanding and I have complained in this House; this is the fourth time. It has been standing for more than one and a half years; more than eighteen months, and other Hon Colleagues also have similar Questions.

Again, even when you pose some of the Questions, they do not advertise them. You go and complain; they would tell you they would do it and they never act on these things. So they should let us know why Questions to the Ministry of Finance and Economic Planning unduly delay.

Maj. Derek Y. Oduro (retd): Mr Speaker, a couple of weeks ago, I asked the Hon Leader of the House why a Question I posed since June this year, an Urgent Question, has not come. Up to date, this Question is still hiding somewhere. We do not know where the Question is hiding.

The Question was directed to the Hon Minister for Local Government and Rural Development on the revocation of nine members of Nkoranza North District Assembly; an Urgent Question and it is hiding somewhere. Mr Speaker, I want to know why. This is the Business Statement for the seventh week and we are about going home. It was captured in the

Agenda for the Third Meeting and that was Question No. 693, an Urgent Question. So Mr Speaker, I want to find out.
Mr Mathias A. Puozaa 11:20 a.m.
Mr Speaker, this is just a comment or a question on a comment you have already made on the University of Ghana Act. If you are trying to review it, at least, without challenging the authority of the Leadership, I feel that the leadership of the Committee on Education should have been, at least, invited to know what is happening --
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:20 a.m.
Yes, you would be briefed accordingly; the Chairman and the Ranking Members would be briefed accordingly.
Ms Esther O. Dappah 11:20 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I have two Questions which were to appear today. They are not on the Order Paper. So I am wondering what has happened to them. Can I get an explanation when they would appear?
Prof. (Emeritus) Samuel K. Amoako 11:20 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I am referring to the schedule for Wednesday, item 3, (i), Urgent Questions. The Hon Member for Sunyani East had an emergency call and had to leave the House but asked me to crave your indulgence and make a correction in the Urgent Question; if I may do so.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:20 a.m.
Hon Member, the Question has been submitted, admitted and sent to the Ministry-- advertised, so it is too late in the day for us to do an amendment on the floor of the House. When the time comes for the Question, we can pick it up from there; we would see what we can do.
Prof. (Emeritus) Amoako 11:20 a.m.
Mr Speaker, it is not about the content of the Question, it is just a grammatical correction. So if I may get your permission to --
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:20 a.m.
Hon
Member, get in touch with the Table Office.
Prof. (Emeritus) Amoako 11:20 a.m.
Thank you, Mr Speaker.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:20 a.m.
Hon Independent Member for Bekwai.
Mr Joseph Osei-Owusu 11:20 a.m.
Mr Speaker, the comments on the Business Committee Report reveal a large amount of complaints about Questions that have been filed and have not been brought to the floor, Questions that have not appeared at all, and some that have been advertised, the Hon Minister is not appearing to answer them.
Mr Speaker, my worry is not the occasion of these -- rather - I am trying to be very diplomatic - these mishaps, so to speak. My worry is the Hon Leader of the House's answer. It does appear that the Hon Leader says the Hon Minister has not answered it; it has not come here; so what can we do? If we Sit here and say the Minister has not answered it, the Question does not come here, so we cannot do anything, then I think we would be losing or not taking advantage of our constitutional right to supervise the Executive.
These attitudes would make the Executive continue to take the House for granted. I think that we should assert ourselves; we have the constitutional right to supervise. There are so many things going on; we have Ministries that we give budgets to; another year is coming; they are coming to ask for another money. Nobody asks them what they did with the money we gave them. It does not appear anywhere.
We have an Assurances Committee of the House and we have respective committees in the House. Nobody finds
out what has been done and reports to the House. Mr Speaker, I think it is time the Leadership made us assert ourselves.
Mr Avoka 11:20 a.m.
Mr Speaker, with regard to the issue of the invitation of the Government of the Bank of Ghana -
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:20 a.m.
Leader, are you going to die?
Mr Avoka 11:30 a.m.
Not now. [Laughter.] Not in the foreseeable future too.
Mr Speaker, with regard to the issue on the DACF, the monitoring money and the invitation of the Governor of the Bank of Ghana, if the Hon Member were here on Wednesday, we held a joint caucus meeting in this Chamber and I informed Hon Members that the Hon Minister for Finance and Economic Planning had taken up the matter and that he was going to direct the Governor of the Bank of Ghana to meet the obligations of the DACF through the other accounts that they have. I explained that in this Chamber. Maybe, the Hon Member was not here that day, but when we held the joint caucus meeting, I explained this at length and therefore, in the not too distant future, the obligations under the Monitoring Fund would be met. We have explained that one.
With regard to the Urgent Question that the Hon Member for Nkoranza raised, Mr Speaker, my attention has not been drawn to it. There are different departments. Unless the Table Office submits before the Business Committee, these Questions that have been attended to by Hon Ministers, it would be difficult for the Business Committee to be able to know that the Question has been asked and therefore, it is due for an Answer.
Indeed, when they ask their Questions -- you know they file these Questions, they do not give copies to the Business Committee to know that a Question has been asked on this day and therefore, within the three weeks as stipulated by the Standing Orders, they ought to have come.
Be that as it may, Mr Speaker, I will take note of the concern of Hon Members. Fortunately, the Clerk and his staff are also here. They should try to draw the attention of Leadership to outstanding Questions that have been sent to the Ministries and whose Answers have not yet been brought to this Chamber, so that we can follow up to the respective Hon Ministers and ensure that they bring the Answers timeously.
Mr Speaker, I ought to have apologized or informed the House earlier that the Hon Minister for Roads and Highways was supposed to have answered some Questions this morning but later in the evening they called to inform me that the Hon Minister had to inaugurate the commencement of work on some projects somewhere in the country that are of urgent nature, and where international partners have also come to witness it, and therefore, he prayed that the matter be postponed till Monday for us to address.
So, it is unfortunate that the Questions were advertised and they are not coming on this morning but we will make sure that sometime next week, those Questions are before the House for the Hon Minister to Answer.
Dr A. A. Osei 11:30 a.m.
Mr Speaker, with respect, I am hoping that the Hon Leader did not mean what I thought he was saying, that because the Hon Minister had to go and inaugurate the commencement of work on a road, it is more urgent than coming to this House to answer our Questions.

Mr Speaker, as my Hon Junior Colleague said, the Standing Orders said “he shall”. What is more urgent than going to inaugurate the commencement of work on some projects?

Mr Speaker, I hope that Hon Ministers be advised that coming to answer Urgent Questions here is more important than going to inaugurate the commencement of work on projects and that if that does not happen, we would advise ourselves whether or not; how to deal with them. This is too serious.

This is an Urgent Question that has been sent to him and he thinks that it is more important to go and inaugurate the commencement of work on some urgent roads; that cannot be more urgent. Anybody can go and inaugurate the commencement of work on those roads but a Hon Minister ought to avail himself to this House so that we can be seen to be doing our Business.

Mr Speaker, I think this is too serious a matter; you ought to advise them.
Mr Abdul-Rashid Pelpuo 11:30 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I, hundred per cent, agree with my very outspoken Colleague. But it is also true that the Hon Minister “shall” appear to answer Questions if they are scheduled or if he is scheduled. In this case, from the Business Committee's Report or from the Hon Majority Leader's Report, he said that the Hon Minister had not been scheduled because of -
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:30 a.m.
Hon Member, they advertised the Question yesterday, according to the Hon Member. According to the Hon Member, the Question was advertised for this morning and that is the point.
Hon Majority Leader, in future when you have these challenges, let the Hon Member in whose name the Question
Mr Justice J. Appiah 11:30 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I tabled an Urgent Question on the road tolls, how much money has been collected so far -
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:30 a.m.
Hon Member, the Hon Leader says that they are going to take up all the outstanding Questions with the -
Mr Appiah 11:30 a.m.
But Mr Speaker, it has kept long and anytime I ask, I am told that it is in the pipeline.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:30 a.m.
Hon Member for Ablekuma North, the Hon Majority Leader has responded to all the issues raised about Questions and he says he is going to liaise with the Table Office and take up all those matters. So it goes with that.
Mr Yaw Owusu-Boateng 11:30 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I am worried about Hon Ministers not coming, or even if they are scheduled, we expect the Deputies - There are so many times that Hon Deputy Ministers have come here to answer Questions. So even if the Hon Minister has something to do, the Deputy Ministers could come and take over and answer the Questions. But when the Deputies are not coming, substantive Ministers are not coming, it is an affront to the House.
Mr Avoka 11:30 a.m.
Mr Speaker, in my opinion, I appreciate that. But it is this same august House that sometimes has reservations about Deputy Ministers coming to answer Questions. Today, we say this; tomorrow we say a different thing. It is the same Hon Members of this august House who ask “where is the Minister and the Deputy is coming?” It is the same Hon Members.
Besides, Mr Speaker, sometimes we programme some of the Hon Ministers without alerting them. It might appear on the Order Paper just because they have brought Answers from the Ministry. I have insisted that before we programme an Hon Minister to come and answer Questions, we should find out from him about his itinerary. Sometimes he has a commitment one month ahead and by the time he knows, on the Order Paper, he is supposed to come and answer Questions, when he has a commitment on that day. So we will try to rationalize it and ensure that they do this.
But let us also note that we compel Hon Ministers to come here and sometimes when the Hon Ministers are here, those who asked the Questions are not available; most of the time, many Hon Members are also not available. And we get up and beg for permission to ask Questions on behalf of our Colleagues; it has been happening. So we should not overstretch this matter, Mr Speaker.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:30 a.m.
The last comment on the Business Statement.
Mr Kwaku Agyeman-Manu 11:30 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I just wanted to correct the impression the Hon Leader is actually coming up with. The idea of Deputy Ministers coming to the House was never rejected by this House. The understanding of the House was that it was becoming perpetual habits of some of the Hon Ministers to always send their Deputies. If an Hon Minister comes three, four times and then occasionally he sends a Deputy Minister, I do not think that is what the House is talking about.
We were trying to stop Hon Ministers who would not come here at all but always send Deputy Ministers. That is what we understood should be the case, but not that Deputy Ministers should not come here
for that matter.
Thank you, Mr Speaker.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:30 a.m.
Very well. That brings us to the end of the Business
rose
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:30 a.m.
Yes, Hon Member for Old Tafo -
Dr A. A. Osei 11:30 a.m.
Mr Speaker, I crave your indulgence. This morning, when I was coming to work, I heard some very sad news and I thought that as a former Member of Parliament (MP) -- we the current Members of Parliament may, upon your advice, at least, have a one-minute silence for Hon Theresa A. Tagoe. The news was that she expired yesterday. I seek your guidance on that matter.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:30 a.m.
Normally, we do it when the tribute is paid. When the tribute is paid, then Hon Members contribute to the tribute, comment on the tribute and then one minute of silence is observed in her memory. That is the practice of the House. Otherwise, we would be doing it two times - the one without a tribute and then the one with a tribute. And I would advise that when everything is arranged, I mean a proper tribute be paid in her memory - she was a three-term Member of this Honourable House.
Mr Avoka 11:30 a.m.
In addition to that Mr Speaker, I think the House will have to be officially informed and then we take action.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:30 a.m.
Very well.
PAPERS 11:30 a.m.
- 11:30 a.m.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:40 a.m.
Hon Majority Leader, what is the status with regard to item number 6, the Motion?
Mr Avoka 11:40 a.m.
Mr Speaker, with regard to Motion number 6, I am in consultation with the Minority Leader and he needs to do one or two more consultations.
So hopefully, Monday or Tuesday, we will take this Motion. But let me state that those who have already been designated to chair various committees, particularly with regard to the Majority caucus are deemed to be available for the weekend Leadership meeting in Koforidua on the Budget. Those who have been designated as Committee Chairmen, et cetera are deemed to attend that meeting.
Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:40 a.m.
Very well.
Thank you very much.
BILLS - CONSIDERATION 11:40 a.m.
STAGE 11:40 a.m.
  • [ R e s u m p t i o n o f d e b a t e f ro m 25/11/2010]
    • Mr James K. Avedzi 11:40 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, we will continue the debate on clause 3 and the Hon Deputy Minister for Finance and Economic Planning, Hon Seth Terkpeh needs to give us a clarification on the percentage that is being proposed by Hon P. C. Appiah-Ofori.
    Mr Seth Terkpeh 11:40 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I was to consult with the Ghana Revenue Authority (GRA) with respect to clause 3(2) and clause 3 (3). Clause 3 (2) begins the period for the payment of the tax due. Mr Speaker, yesterday, some Hon Members were of the view that the period of 15 days allowed was too liberal, and that the payment of the tax should be shorter or immediate.
    Mr Speaker, the GRA, as I indicated yesterday, is of the view that payment of an assessment normally follows the compilation of records by the taxpayer and also the completion of the tax returns by taxpayers. Normally, they allow reasonable time for these events to take place before they file the returns and determine the tax due and then make the payment.
    Therefore, it is their view that the 15 days allowed in the Bill is reasonable, considering that for most income taxes, payments take place -- if I may be specific, in the case of withholding tax on wages and salaries, employers who withhold are required to pay within 15 days.
    Other income taxes are payable within a month or 30 days after the date on which the assessment takes place and in the case of provisional assessments, normally, for businesses, it is paid quarterly in arrears.
    I also wish to indicate that the VAT and excises, one month after the month in which the assessment has taken place -- It is against this background that they advised that the 15 days is reasonable under the circumstances.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:40 a.m.
    Hon Deputy Minister for Finance and Economic Planning, the 15 days is subclause (2) but we are on subclause (3).
    Mr Terkpeh 11:40 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I explained that I was to clarify in respect to subclause
    (2)
    With respect to subclause (3), which is the penalty, 5 per cent daily, again, it is deemed by the GRA to be quite punitive because the penalties under the Income Tax Act are normally levied annually and they range between 10 and 30 per cent. So to impose a tax at 5 per cent daily is quite punitive already and may not be increased.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 11:40 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, so what he is saying here is that, he is recommending to the House to reject my amendment raising it from 5 per cent to 10 per cent. I do not see why we will now try and be sympathetic with those who actually make an attempt to defraud the State. I do not know why? If it is punitive, and so what?
    What we are trying to do is to make sure that national interest is protected, and if that will scare the people, which will serve as a deterrent, so that people will not do that, why do we say that it is punitive, so we should stop it? I do not know. It is now left to the House to decide whether because it is punitive, we should discard it.
    Mr Avedzi 11:40 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I do not know
    what is magic about the 10 per cent that Hon Appiah-Ofori is raising; why not 50 per cent or even 100 per cent if he wants it to be punitive? I think we need to bring a percentage that can be applicable -
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:40 a.m.
    You too, how did you determine the 5 per cent?
    Mr Avedzi 11:40 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, we think that if an annual rate ranges between 10 and 20 per cent, charging 5 per cent for a day, which is about 150 per cent for a month, is too punitive and that could be enough to deter people from misbehaving; so why 10 per cent? It will make its application very difficult.
    Dr A. A. Osei 11:40 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think
    yesterday I made my case. We are trying to invite investors to come and invest in our country. By all standards, even 1 per cent per day is very punitive. We are talking of amounts in hundreds of millions. I do not believe any rational person would want to keep the money, because they are not likely to go and earn that type of return anywhere. If there is, I am not aware. I do not see any place where in a day you can earn 5 per cent on any asset you have. So this is punitive enough.
    I do not know the basis my Hon Senior Colleague is coming from with the 10 per cent. But I believe we have to be cautious. We do not want to give the signal that these people are being criminalized even before - It is not in their interest to keep it for a day because of this sanction. So I plead that we are a bit cautious here and, maybe, call the Question on this matter at this point.
    Mr Joseph B. Aidoo 11:40 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, the 5 per cent is already substantial. So to increase it to 10 per cent, honestly, will be too harsh a provision.
    Mr Speaker, apart from that the Hon Member is seeking to replace “liability” with “obligation”. Yesterday, we discussed this matter.
    An obligation is a sense of duty but then “liability”, we are talking about legal liability and legal liability means that
    there is that legal responsibility. Legal responsibility -
    Dr A. A. Osei 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think that something is not captured correctly. Yesterday, we voted on the liability part, and it is only the 10 per cent part that was left. We voted on the part of the liability, so it should have been reflected that -
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    Very well. So it is the second leg of the amendment?
    Question put and amendment negatived.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I
    thought the way you put the Question was ambiguous. [Laughter.] You see, my amendments were two -
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    No! They have voted on the first leg of the amendment, on the liability and obligation part, that is my information. When they raised the point, you did not challenge it.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, no, not so; this one is on the 10 per cent and not on the penalty.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    Yes.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 11:50 a.m.
    And not on the penalty. That one is all right, but the 10 per cent, you do not like it? All right, leave it. [Laughter.]
    Mr J. B. Aidoo 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, yesterday, what we voted on, that is, the first leg of his amendment which was in respect of clause 3 (2), the last line, that is, “entities liable to make the payment.”
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    Do you agree on “liable”?
    Mr J. B. Aidoo 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, but here we are talking about liability which is clause 3 (3), so it is a different matter.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    But it is the same liability anyway; it is consequential.
    The amendment is lost.
    Clause 3 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
    Clause 4 -- Payment with petroleum in place of cash.
    Mr Avedzi 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move clause 4, subclause (1), delete --
    “(1) Where Government elects for payment in petroleum instead of cash, the US dollar equivalent of the petroleum on the day the petroleum is received by or on behalf of the Government shall be reported and recorded by the Ghana Revenue Authority as the payments for the Petroleum Holding Fund.”
    Mr Speaker, this amendment is to have a proper rendition of the intention of the clause that, where Government elects to receive payment in the form of petroleum, the day of the transaction, the value of the petroleum shall be recorded as the value of that transaction.
    Mr William O. Boafo 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, the reasons for the amendment is what has just been explained by the Hon Chairman of the Committee, so I support the amendment.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I
    thought that this had been deleted. Is it still there?
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    No! You will withdraw your amendment?
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, if the whole of the clause had been deleted, then the amendment is not necessary. Has it been deleted? If it has been deleted, then the amendment is not necessary.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    It is deemed withdrawn.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 11:50 a.m.
    Yes. I have not withdrawn it but it had been withdrawn by itself. What I am saying here is that since the first amendment proposed by the Committee has been carried, this nullifies mine because it is not there. That clause is no more there.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    Yes, so it is deemed withdrawn.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 11:50 a.m.
    It is all right.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    Yes.
    Mr Avedzi 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, the amendment in clause 1 that has just been passed renders his proposed amendment -
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    I asked you to move the amendment standing in your name.
    Mr Avedzi 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, that clause 4, subclause (2), lines 1 and 3 delete “crude”.
    Mr Speaker, the “petroleum” here covers the oil, the gas and other petroleum products, so adding “crude” to it is limiting it to only one are, a so we are deleting “crude” so that ‘petroleum' which has been defined in the Interpretation column covers all the petroleum products.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 4, subclasuse (2), line 1, after “proceeds” delete “of” and insert “from”. “ Proceeds from” and not “proceeds of.” “Proceeds from the sale of the crude and petroleum shall” but not “proceeds of the sale of the crude”. So it is for consideration; it should be “from” money coming out of that.
    Mr Avedzi 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I oppose the proposed amendment. We are talking about sales and what comes out of the sales is the proceeds. So, proceeds “of” the sales not “from” the sales. So I oppose it.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    Hon Members, is it proceeds “from” or proceeds “of”? It is “proceeds from”.
    Dr A. A. Osei 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, on this matter, I beg to differ with my Hon Chairman. Hon Appiah-Ofori is a very good English person, so this one, of the few times that I agree with him, it
    should be proceeds “from the sale of”, not “proceeds of”. So I go with Hon P. C. Appiah-Ofori.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Mr Avedzi 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 4, subclause (3), delete. The allowable marketing cost which shall be reimbursed to the National Oil Company is going to be taken care of by ceding of a percentage of the participating and carried interest to the National Oil Company. So allowing this to be allowed again here will be allowing the National Oil Company to double receive that cost. So this is no more needed once we are going to cede a portion of the carried interest to the National Oil Company.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Mr Avedzi 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, subclause (4), delete and insert the following:
    “Where payments are made in petroleum, the US dollar equivalent of the payment on the date of receipt shall for the purpose of reporting be shown as a receipt into the Petroleum Holding Fund.”
    Mr Speaker, the purpose of this amendment is to have a proper rendition of the whole subclause as we have in clause 4.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move clause 4, subclause (4), line 3, delete “an asset of” and insert “a credit balance in”.
    The entries in accounts are not -
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    Hon
    Appiah-Ofori, have you seen the new rendition?
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 11:50 a.m.
    Has it been deleted - where is it?
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    It is on (vii) on the Order Paper that has just been carried.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 11:50 a.m.
    Then it is deemed withdrawn.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    Very well. Hon Members, I will now put the Question.
    Mr J. B. Aidoo 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, before you put the Question, I have just checked Google again and the indication is that, it is “proceeds of a sale” and not “proceeds from a sale”. I have checked and I am quite sure of that. It is ‘proceeds of a sale' and not ‘proceeds from a sale'. I have shown it to him.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    You have shown it to who?
    Papa Owusu-Ankomah 11:50 a.m.
    It is English. Mr Speaker, you can say “proceeds from the show”, but when it is a sale, it is “proceeds of the sale”, of a commodity.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    Today, our English teacher, Hon Balado Manu - [Laughter.]
    Papa Owusu-Ankomah 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker,
    that is the problem when we try to amend grammar; it is always a problem; if we could leave them to the draftspersons, then they would correct it. In English Language, the expressions we have been using, assuming that that are the correct ones, grammatically, are not correct. That is it.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    Very well. Hon Members, we may have to relax the rules and just do the right thing so that we do not push this to the Second Consideration Stage, even though that is the strict interpretation of the rules.
    Yes, Hon Appiah-Ofori, move your amendment again and let me put the Question.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, which of them?
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    (V)
    Dr A. A. Osei 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, did you say you are relaxing the rules temporarily?
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    Yes.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 11:50 a.m.
    Is it clause 4 (2)?
    Dr A. A. Osei 11:50 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, if we allow him to repeat his amendment, we will go back to the problem that he has just brought. So someone else should be moving that amendment and not him, because he is using “from” and he has just been told that it is incorrect . So he is standing down his amendment; is that it? Is he standing it down? We will defeat it.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    Very well.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 11:50 a.m.
    The amendment is withdrawn, that is all.
    Clause 4 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
    Hon Members, I will defer clause 5. I have been briefed by those who were at the winnowing and move straight to clause 6.
    Clause 6 - Petroleum Holding Fund Receipts.
    Mr Avedzi 11:50 a.m.
    There is the first amendment proposed by Hon Appiah- Ofori.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:50 a.m.
    Hon Members, I thought that we would do the first thing - yesterday, we agreed that it should be consequential. Where we see “Petroleum Account”, it should be “Petroleum Holding Fund”. So there is no need to do any amendment. I want the Table Office to take note of that.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 12:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 6, subclause (1), line 1, delete “form” and insert “be paid gross into” and after “Accounts” delete “gross receipts”.
    So that the whole thing will read as follows:
    “The following shall be paid gross into the Petroleum Holding Fund.”
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:10 p.m.
    Hon Appiah-Ofori, Hon Members want an explanation for your amendment.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 12:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, the
    language is preferable. This is preferable to the sentence, “The following shall form . . .” It is the word “form” that I hate. I do not want it there; it should be “paid gross into” the account. There should not be any deductions; the whole amount accruing to the State should be paid in full to the State.
    This is what I mean.
    Mr Avedzi 12:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think the amendment will not change the substance of that particular clause. I think it is just to have a better rendition of what we have here. So I think we should carry it.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:10 p.m.
    No, I am not getting it clear.
    Hon Appiah-Ofori, how will the sentence now read?
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 12:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, it will read as follows:
    “The following shall be paid gross into the Petroleum Holding Fund
    . . .”
    Then the payments to be paid without deduction include royalties, any amount received, et cetera up to (e) and that ends it. So, what I am saying here is that there should not be any deduction; when it is accrued to the State, the whole amount should come in full.
    Dr A. A. Osei 12:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I
    understand the principle that he is talking about and his problem is with the word “form”. We are trying to define what constitutes “receipt” and I think if he does not like the word “form”, he should say “the following constitutes” as supposed to “paid gross into”. So, I plead with him that - I understand what he is trying to say.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:10 p.m.
    Hon
    Appiah-Ofori, they are describing the components of the Petroleum Holding Fund. That is what they are describing here.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 12:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, let us
    read what is there:
    “The following shall form the Petroleum Account gross receipts.
    . .”

    The Petroleum Account receipts being paid without deduction. This is what it means. But I am saying that we should say that the whole amount accruing to the State shall be paid to the State without any deduction and that is why I used the word “gross”.
    Dr A. A. Osei 12:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I do not believe that the current rendition says that it is net. On the contrary, the gross receipt is at the end. I think we are trying to define what makes up this account, what will qualify it. So if we do not like the word “form”, let us just say “the following shall constitute. . .” and then it will cover that. It still goes.
    Mr Avedzi 12:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think the
    new rendition that the Ranking Member is proposing makes it a bit clear, so that the new clause 6 (1) will read as follows:
    “The following shall constitute the Petroleum Holding Fund gross receipt. . .”
    Then the (a), (b), (c) and (d) will follow.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think this new rendition is better, except that we should have a re- engineering of that construction. It will read as follows:
    “The following shall constitute the gross receipts of the Petroleum Holding Fund.”
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:10 p.m.
    Hon
    Appiah-Ofori, did you see the re- engineering of that?
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 12:10 p.m.
    It is all right.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:10 p.m.
    Then let us have it moved properly now, the
    compromised rendition.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:10 p.m.
    Mr
    Speaker, it shall read as follows:
    “The following shall constitute the gross receipts of the Petroleum Holding Fund.”
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:10 p.m.
    Hon Members, it reads as follows:
    “The following shall constitute -”
    So we are deleting ‘form' and substituting it with ‘constitute' and then we will bring “gross receipt” to qualify the Petroleum Holding Fund.”
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Mr Avedzi 12:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to
    move, clause 6, subclause (1), paragraph (a), delete “initial carried interest.”
    Mr Speaker, the “initial carried interest” will be ceded to the National Oil Company and therefore, it will not form part of the receipt into the Petroleum Holding Fund. So it should be deleted here.
    The amendment is just deleting it and it will be brought under a separate heading.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Clause 6 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
    Clause 7 - Participating Interest.
    Mr Avedzi 12:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg
    to move, clause 7, Heatnote, before “Participating” insert “Carried and”.
    So, the Headnote will now read as follows:
    “Carried and Participating Interest.”
    Mr Speaker, this is because we have deleted the “initial carried interest” in clause 6 and we are bringing it to clause 7.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I just want to be clear. The “initial carried interest” stands alone and then we have “participating -”
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:10 p.m.
    It has
    been deleted from clause 6 (a).
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:10 p.m.
    I know
    it. And then we have additionally -- the additional “participating interest”. I need clarification. When you put the two together, would you still have to put the interest in singular or it comes in plural because you are talking about the carried interest and the additional participating interest?
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:10 p.m.
    It says “carried and participating interest”.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:10 p.m.
    Is it “interests” or “interest”? That is the clarification I want.
    12.21 p.m. -- MR SECOND DEPUTY SPEAKER
    Mr Avedzi 12:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think we
    should have the plural “interests”. Because we have the “initial carried interest” and we will be having “Participating Interest”.
    Question put and amendment agreed
    to.
    Mr Avedzi 12:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to
    move, clause 7, subclause (1), delete and insert the following:
    “Revenue due from the direct
    or indirect participation of the Republic in petroleum operations, including the initial and additional participating interest shall be paid into the Petroleum Holding Fund.”
    Mr Humado 12:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, the Hon Chairman made an earlier amendment on the Headnote and inserted “carried” but in the new amendment that he has just mentioned, I have not seen “carried” after “initial”. I think it should read :
    “Revenue due from the direct or indirect participation of the Republic in petroleum operations, including the initial carried and additional participating interests shall be paid into the Petroleum Holding Fund.”
    This is to justify the earlier amendment to justify the earlier amendment in the Headnote.
    Mr Avedzi 12:20 p.m.
    Well, Mr Speaker, I think we will add “initial”. So it will be:
    “initial carried and additional participating interests shall be paid in the Petroleum Holding Fund”.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:20 p.m.
    Chairman of the Committee, if you could read the entire rendition for the avoidance of doubt.
    Mr Avedzi 12:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move,
    clause 7, subclause (1), delete and insert the following:
    “Revenue due from the direct or indirect participation of the Republic in petroleum operations, including the initial carried and additional participating interests, shall be paid into the Petroleum Holding Fund.”
    Question put and amendment agreed
    Mr Avedzi 12:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 7, subclause (2), delete and insert the following:
    “ (2) The payment in to the Petroleum Holding Fund shall be net of:
    (a) the equity financing cost, including advances and interest of the carried and participating interest of the Republic; and
    (b) the cash or the equivalent barrels of oil that shall be ceded to the National Oil Company out of the carried and participating interest recommended by the Minister and approved by Parliament.”
    Mr Speaker, here, the amendment is seeking to cede a portion of the “initial carried and participating interests” to the National Oil Company to fund it in order to be competitive in the petroleum sector. So the main idea here is just to cede a portion of the revenue to the National Oil Company.
    Dr A. A. Osei 12:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I just want to see if the Hon Chairman will include this slight modification. It is really consequential. Anytime you have the “carried”, I believe the word “initial” should precede it for the avoidance of doubt. Wherever we have “carried”, the word “initial” should come before it and then after that, when you have “carried and participating”, the “interest” should be plural. If the Table Office will note that.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:20 p.m.
    Hon Chairman of the Committee, you are agreeable?
    Mr Avedzi 12:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I agree to the proposed amendment.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:20 p.m.
    So the proposed amendment stands, save that, it should be “out of the initial carried and participating interests”, and that “interest” should be plural and for it to be well noted that in all these cases, it should be “initial carried interests” to flow throughout the Bill.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Mr Avedzi 12:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 7 add the following new subclause:
    “(3) For a period not exceeding fifteen
    years after the commencement of this Act, the cash barrels of oil equivalent ceded to a National Oil Company shall --
    (a) not exceed fifty-five per cent of the net cash flow from the carried and participating interests after deducting the equity financing cost under paragraph (a) of sub- section (2); and
    (b) be reviewed every three years by Parliament.”
    Mr Speaker, the new subclause as explained earlier, is to cede a portion of the initial carried and participating interests to the National Oil Company to fund that company to become competitive. And the part (b) of the amendment is to review that percentage every three years, so that we either increase or reduce the percentage if the need be. Then after 15 years, we believe that the National Oil Company will become strong enough to stand on its own.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 12:30 p.m.
    Mr
    Speaker, this matter was raised at the winnowing yesterday and we agreed to have this construction. And also in order to strengthen the oversight responsibility of Parliament on the operations of Ghana National Petroleum Corporation (GNPC), it became imperative to do this. But Mr Speaker, additionally, we agreed that every year, after the allocation, GNPC will have to justify the need for such capitalisation, so Parliament will be positioned to know exactly what they are applying the money .
    Mr Speaker, subject to that, I think we all agreed that that should be the rendition and I support the amendment.
    Mr Moses A. Asaga 12:30 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I rise to support the amendment and to follow the path of Hon Kyei-Mensah- Bonsu, especially, for the words “not exceeding 55 per cent”. In my opinion, it is a very good rendition. So that if GNPC should come to Parliament and they are requiring a certain financing, we should be able to say, for example, this year, you need 40 or 45. But if it were fixed “shall be 55”, then even when they come and we do not see the need, then it becomes difficult for us. So I am very happy for the range of 50 to 55 per cent.
    Dr Prempeh 12:30 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, two quick points. The English “cash barrels of oil equivalent” -- [Interruptions.]
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:30 p.m.
    Order! Order!
    Dr Prempeh 12:30 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, “cash barrels of oil equivalent” is not right. Maybe, we need a better construction.
    Secondly, Mr Speaker, what the Minority Leader was proposing -- what he just said is not what is reflected here. There is no where that says “every year”, the National Oil Company should come like Hon Moses Asaga and the Minority Leader are saying; it has not reflected in this amendment. So if they are proposing a further amendment, they should let us

    know.

    Thirdly -- [Interruption] -- that was what the Minority Leader said, that was what he was supporting; maybe, he was not listening to him.

    Mr Speaker, I am a bit worried that for a period not exceeding fifteen years, we are going to allow GNPC or the National Oil Company to retain as much as 45 per cent of the net oil proceeds.
    Mr Emmanuel Armah-Kofi Buah 12:30 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, a point of order. I think the Hon Member is misleading the House. It is not the net oil proceeds; we are talking about the carried interest and participating interests. So I want the Hon Member to correct that. We are talking about 55 per cent of the carried and participating interests and not the net oil profit as has just been stated.
    Dr Prempeh 12:30 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, he was not listening. I said the English phrase, “the cash barrels of oil equivalent” is not neat. What does it mean?
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:30 p.m.
    Hon Member, if you could please assist us with a relatively neater rendition.
    Dr A. A. Osei 12:30 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, the point he is making there, he is right. The second line should read; “The cash or the equivalent barrels of oil”, just like in the previous amendment. So in that sense, he
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:30 p.m.
    Definitely, it sounds neater. Hon Dr Prempeh, are we looking at --
    “a period not exceeding 15 years after the commencement of this Act, the cash or equivalent barrels of oil ceded to a national oil company shall”?
    Dr Prempeh 12:30 p.m.
    Thank you, Mr Speaker. That makes it neat and I accept it. Further to that, Mr Speaker, when you go to clause 8 (a), it comes back to the cash “not exceed 55 per cent of the net cash.” That is why I am saying that that figure is too large and it has to come down because when you say - [Interruption.]
    Dr Prempeh 12:30 p.m.
    Mr Asaga, do you want to speak alone here? You make reference to the Speaker.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:30 p.m.
    Hon Member on your feet, you will address the Chair.
    Dr Prempeh 12:30 p.m.
    Thank you, Mr Speaker.
    Mr Speaker, I propose that “not exceeding 55 per cent” should come low to “not exceeding 45 per cent”.
    rose
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:30 p.m.
    Hon Moses Asaga, I recognize you.
    Mr Asaga 12:30 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, thank you
    very much.
    I think the proposal he is making here now is like a very new one.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:30 p.m.
    The Hon Member is making?
    Mr Asaga 12:30 p.m.
    Yes, I mean the Hon Member.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:30 p.m.
    Yes, say so.
    Mr Asaga 12:30 p.m.
    Yes, because we were all given the opportunity to make amendments. So even though it is not against our rules, he is doing it at the spur of the moment when it even did not go through the winnowing stage. This is because we decided that -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:30 p.m.
    Hon Asaga, if a thing stands to reason, that is the quintessence of a Consideration Stage.
    Mr Asaga 12:30 p.m.
    I know.
    rose
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:30 p.m.
    Hon Chairman of the Committee, I recognize you.
    Mr Avedzi 12:30 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I oppose the amendment coming from the Hon Member. Mr Speaker, the 55 per cent, it is arrived at after taking the numbers into consideration. And looking at the position of the National Oil Company and where we want it to reach by fifteen years time-- So it is not a matter of we did not do any computation before we arrived at that figure. We actually looked at the numbers before we looked at the 55 per cent.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:30 p.m.
    And in any case, I think “not exceeding 55 per cent”, Parliament can settle at 10 per cent or even 2 per cent or any other percentage
    provided it does not go beyond 55 per cent in its wisdom.
    Mr Kobina T. Hammond 12:30 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I am looking at the clause 7 and the second amendment. That is one with three, the new subclause (3) and then it goes on to talk about the percentage. Mr Speaker, let us go back to - [Interruption.]
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:30 p.m.
    Order! Order! Hon Members, let us hear the Member on his feet.
    Mr Hammond 12:30 p.m.
    Let us go back to the first one. Clause 2 says that the payment into the petroleum holding, shall be net of (a) and (b). Mr Speaker, the (b) makes it clear that the payment shall be recommended by the Minister and approved by Parliament. Having done that, the addition of the percentage is completely unnecessary.
    The amount, I do appreciate it because I do know the GNPC is struggling to get money to pay for its participation and all the other things. So that has been covered by the first provision over here, saying that those monies would be recommended by the Minister and Parliament shall approve it. We would decide how much of it should go in there.
    We are now given an artificial cap - we are talking about a certain period, fifteen years. Why are we talking of fifteen years when we know the oil thing might run for twenty to twenty-five years or thirty years, and then we are talking about 55 per cent and whatever? Let the Minister bring the figures to the floor and then Parliament, on the basis of what it is required at the material time, would approve it. So this is artificial, Mr Speaker. I speak against it and I want it deleted.
    Mr Buah 12:40 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, this provision is informed by the original request of the GNPC. In fact, at the Committee, it was extensively discussed. GNPC had
    originally requested, based on their own numbers, based on their own projections of funding that they require about 65 per cent. The Committees met and made this provision and actually, they also wanted to even cap it at 55 per cent. But I think the provision as it stands, allows Parliament to make the provision based on the number, whether it is 10 per cent - depending on the year, and how much projection has been. I think Parliament has the flexibility as it stands in this provision to make those decisions.
    But the argument has to be made that it is very, very important that in this argument, we understand the source of where we get enough money from the oil industry. It has to be that the National Oil Company must be well-funded enough to be able to explore for oil, to produce oil, so that we do not get 10 per cent but to get 90100 per cent.
    I think that the provision as it stands, allows the National Oil Company to be in a position to explore and produce oil for Ghana, so that Ghana can get more money and that is the attempt that is being made. It allows Parliament also to be in control of how much funding would be provided to the National Oil Company.
    Mr Avedzi 12:40 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, what we are seeking to do is to set the ceiling beyond which we cannot allow GNPC or the National Oil Company to be given -- So it is not a matter of whether the 55 per cent is too much or too small. We are only trying to set the cap, so Parliament on yearly basis, can decide that 2 per cent or 15 per cent or 30 per cent is needed for GNPC. It is not automatic that we should give 55 per cent to them every year. So I think we are only trying to allow Parliament to set the ceiling, the upper case, beyond which we cannot give GNPC.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:40 p.m.
    Hon
    Mr Buah 12:40 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, GNPC would be with other oil companies and there is something we call “cash calls”, that they would be required to come out with some funds immediately for certain production to take place. Yes, under certain circumstances, GNPC would find themselves in a position where they could come back to Parliament to require certain funding and it could be 60 per cent.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:40 p.m.
    But at this juncture - Can I ask you so that you can help us?
    Mr Buah 12:40 p.m.
    Yes.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:40 p.m.
    If we all see that it would be in the national interest to provide for 60 per cent, then we would have to go and amend this law before we do so. If we were not to provide any percentage, do we not simply set the criteria and then Parliament in its wisdom, would consider an application and provide?
    Mr Buah 12:40 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think GNPC, based on the projections they made, based on the blocs we have, based on the oil finds we have and the possible funding requirements in the future, accepted that a cap of 55 per cent would really allow them to be able to operate very well, allowing Parliament to control the funding levels depending on the particular year and how they go forward.
    Dr A. A. Osei 12:40 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, as I recall, in Koforidua, this issue was debated for a long time. GNPC had come with a number of about 65 per cent and the technical experts who were advising us said that
    best practices around the world -- the number 55 was the most reasonable from what they have seen. So this is how the Committee came to accept it.
    But in talking to the leader, perhaps, if people are worried about the 55 per cent and we keep it, then we are proposing that in (b), we add a slight provision that -- provided that every year, Parliament shall approve the programmes and activities of the National Oil Company. For 2 (b), I am saying that first, unless we want to dispute the work of the experts and I have no reason to dispute them. They have been advising us.
    But for the avoidance of doubt, if we add this, then we know that they would have to come here for us, as it is said -- provided that every year, Parliament shall approve the programme or activities of the National Oil Company, as part of this new amendment. So that at least, we know that we are working with expert advice, and this would also assure us.
    Mr Hammond 12:40 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, there was this time when - [Interruptions.]
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:40 p.m.
    Order! Order!
    Mr Hammond 12:40 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, when Gen. Collin Powell was the Chief of the Joint Staff in the American Defence Force - [Interruptions] -- He made this statement -- there was this argument and he simply said: “Trust me”. Collin Powell said he should be trusted. Dr Akoto, at the time when he was in the Finance Ministry would recall occasions when I had gone literarily on my - [Pause.]
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:40 p.m.
    Hon Deputy Minister.
    Mr Hammond 12:40 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I have not finished. He got up and I was not sure -- that was why I kept quiet. Can I complete my statement, please?
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:40 p.m.
    Hon K. T. Hammond, I thought you had decided not to pursue -
    Mr Hammond 12:40 p.m.
    I beg your pardon, no, Mr Speaker.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:40 p.m.
    I had not called anybody else.
    Mr Hammond 12:40 p.m.
    I am very sorry. Mr Speaker, I understood that I got his name wrong.
    Hon Dr Akoto Osei, yes, when he was there we recall days that we would struggle and plead with them to comb through the Budget and get some money for us to give to GNPC.
    On one occasion, when I called the GNPC guys to the office, when I had got all the moneys through his kindness, he had gone through and given us, the response that I had, Mr Speaker, is re- enforcing the argument I am making today. And I am insisting that Mr Speaker, the other clause, the third clause is otiose, it is unnecessary, it does not add anything to the first one -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:40 p.m.
    Which
    - 12:40 p.m.
    Mr Hammond 12:40 p.m.
    The (3), you see clause 7, there is an added one here. The first one, as I said, (a) and (b), you have that one there, and then you go on to the (3). The cap is completely uncalled for, Mr Speaker; it is unnecessary. The reason I have already advanced -- The Hon Minister, who is going to approve it, would not just go through, and just conjure some figures from Heaven or magical figures.
    The Minister would go through the computation that GNPC presents. Then they would then come to this House and lay the figures and then we go through, approve them and that would be the same. You asked him the question, on what occasion would there be need for about some 60 per cent? He tried to explain.
    Mr Speaker, if there is the need for that, that again would come to this House. So
    this cap of not exceeding 55 per cent of net cash -- all right, they put it at 54 per cent they are within it, what do we do? There is no need. Mr Speaker, the House should look at the actual figures and decide to approve them, because trust me, I know what I am talking about.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:40 p.m.
    Hon Members, I want us to take into consideration, the possibility that GNPC may want 60 per cent and it has been advised that it may be in the national interest to give them that 60 per cent, and if so, it would not be useful to leave percentages as part of the law.
    Alhaj i Mohammed-Mubarak Muntaka: Mr Speaker, the reason the second additional subclause is relevant is that, like they mention -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:40 p.m.
    Hon Muntaka, you would do well to avoid your hands.
    Alhaji Muntaka 12:40 p.m.
    All right. Thank you Mr Speaker.
    The best practices around the world is that we do not use more than the 55 per cent. We should remember that the rest of the money is going to a fund for development, which is also very critical for our country. So it is important that this one is there. What it does and what Hon K. T. Hammond is saying, which makes some sense is that, every year, you have the opportunity of looking at the whole of the formula to approve through the Ministry of Finance and Economic Planning. I agree.
    But the issue of the 55 per cent is what you are tagging against the three years, so that every three years, you would look at the environment vis-à-vis your development as a country to decide whether that 55 per cent, you want to either send it up or bring it down. So both of them are very, very important, even
    Mr Terkpeh 12:50 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, within the budgetary - [Interruptions.]
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:50 p.m.
    Order! Order! I gave some people all the time to make their arguments and it appears those people would not like to do that for others. So Hon Deputy Minister for Finance -
    Mr Terkpeh 12:50 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, within the annual budgetary framework, the entire allocation of petroleum revenues would be coming before this House annually and there will be the opportunity, even in spite of the ratios that are fixed - whether it is going to the annual budget fund, going to the stabilisation or the heritage funds, if this House should approve them - they would be coming on a periodic basis to the House.
    Mr Speaker, I think that this provision must also be put in the context of the GNPC's strategic planning framework in which it is important that they plan within 3 to 5-year period and give the adequate and proportionate signal to the market for purposes of planning.
    Mr Speaker, I think this House would be conveying to the financial world that the purpose of this clause is not necessarily to constrain GNPC from assessing the market or constraining its operations. I think within reasonable framework of the years indicated here and the percentages, I think GNPC would be able to prepare
    these strategic plans that are needed to assess the market in a long term because the financial requirements are long-term.
    So it is in this context that I urge that the House takes the amendment proposed.
    Mr Buah 12:50 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think the point has been made but one point that I want to add to it is that, the cap of 55 per cent is what would clearly - and what has happened in the past to GNPC in assessing the financial market - has been the assurance that there is some guarantee that there is some allocation of funds for them in their operations. And I think the cap is very important as a signal to the financial market, to institutions that would deal with the National Oil Company that there is a provision made for it. I think that is very, very important.
    Dr A. A. Osei 12:50 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, a point of correction. Part of the reason that the Hon Minority Leader was offering the provision of “provided that they come here”, is because we have taken out the original clause 7 (2). Originally, they were going to come through the normal budgetary process. We have amended it, so there is no guarantee even though the Hon Minister has mentioned the number; there is no guarantee now in the Bill for them to come here.
    This is why it is important to say that “provided that we approve their programmes and activities.” So once we have taken out the normal budgetary process, we need something to ensure that Parliament looks at it.
    Now, as to the strategic thing about GNPC, I agree. But if GNPC knew that 55 per cent was reasonable, why did they come and ask for 65 per cent? You see why people get worried? You said “given the normal practices, 55 per cent is enough” and then they come to Koforidua and they say they want 65 per cent. This

    is the worry. If 55 per cent - we were convinced by the experts - [Interruption] - let me finish.

    You are saying that you think that the cap 55 per cent is enough and I am asking, why did GNPC make a request for 65 per cent when in actual fact, they knew that 55 per cent was the optimum? What is the 10 per cent for?

    So for them to come here every year for Parliament to review their programmes and activities, would make us comfortable. If it turns that it is 25 -- but at least, as I recall, the experts told us - unless I am mistaken - that they have looked round and the best practices, the numbers seem to average around 55 per cent. But the request from GNPC, you remember, was

    65 -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:50 p.m.
    Very well. Hon Dr Akoto Osei, will you want to retain the 55 per cent or what? Because the solution also helps the argument.
    Dr A. A. Osei 12:50 p.m.
    On my part, and as a member of the Committee, I will want to retain 55 per cent because it was based on expert advice.
    Dr A. A. Osei 12:50 p.m.
    I want to add a proviso at the end of that second -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:50 p.m.
    Please, go ahead.
    Dr A. A. Osei 12:50 p.m.
    “Provided that every year, Parliament shall approve the programmes and activities of the National Oil Company.”
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:50 p.m.
    So Hon Dr Osei, the (b), which is a three-yearly review - would you want it to be yearly, in effect? Or what?
    Dr A. A. Osei 12:50 p.m.
    It should be reviewed
    every three years.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:50 p.m.
    Very well.
    Dr A. A. Osei 12:50 p.m.
    But the specific year, they will come -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:50 p.m.
    So that will be in addition to (a) -- Dr Akoto Osei, if you would look at the Chair, it will help us -- not people who may want to destruct the point. When that is clear, I will also ask for other views. But at least, I want us to know exactly where we are at any given point. So how would you render that, please?
    Dr A. A. Osei 12:50 p.m.
    Mr Speaker,
    “7 (3) (b) “shall be reviewed every three years by Parliament provided that every year, Parliament shall approve the programmes and activities of the National Oil Company.”
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:50 p.m.
    So you mean to say subclause (3) should begin with what?
    Dr A. A. Osei 12:50 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, aside from the correction that Hon Dr Prempeh made, everything stays the same - the new amendment 3 (a) to take care of Dr Prempeh's amendment.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:50 p.m.
    So Dr Akoto Osei, if you would kindly read over the rendition that you proposed, taking into account - yes, starting from the whole clause 7 (3) - “For a period not exceeding” -- you will have or equivalent of oil -- that one is clear. Dr Prempeh's amendment, so please, go ahead.
    Dr A. A. Osei 12:50 p.m.
    “For a period not exceeding 15 years after the commencement of this Act, the cash or equivalent balance of oil ceded to the National Oil Company shall:
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 12:50 p.m.
    Chairman of the Committee, let us get to know where exactly we are. Dr Prempeh's amendment is carried on board; not to exceed 55 per cent is carried on board; at the end of it all, provided that every year Parliament shall approve the programmes and activities of the National Oil Company as a security and guarantee. Yes -
    Mr Avedzi 12:50 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, the concluding part is where I have a difficulty; where we are asking Parliament to approve the programmes and activities of GNPC or the National Oil Company every year -- it is where I have a difficulty.
    Mr Speaker, the National Oil Company is a corporate entity, which has a board which has a strategic plan, which would have been approved for a period of three or four years. Why then are we going to be approving their programmes and activities again every year? That is where I have a difficulty. Every year, we will approve their programmes and activities, after approving their strategic plan, which runs for a period of three or four years. So that is where I have a difficulty. Apart from that, I am comfortable with the new rendition.
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think initially, people were worried about the cap of 55 per cent and
    the understanding is that indeed, in these very initial years, the revenue that will be trickling in will not be much and so, we need to peg them at not more than 55 per cent. When we have sufficient revenue in the kitty and when we plateau, it may be necessary to bring that cap down. But these are early days yet, so we can agree with the 55 per cent. It does not necessarily mean that they even have to hit 55 per cent.
    Mr Speaker, we are saying that that one, we have to look at every three years to review it, whether to bring it down or perhaps, even to scale it up. That is, every three years. Now, pursuant to that, even though we have not come thus far, in anticipation of the fact that Parliament was going to approve of it, the Minister for Finance and Economic Planning has given the National Oil Company money. Are we saying that Parliament should not be told how the money is going to be used?
    Mr Speaker, if we look at the original Bill, it has provided that they should justify same in every budgetary allocation so that Parliament was going to look at it. But that provision has been amended and in the amendment, we have not taken care of Parliament's oversight. So it is important that we reinstate that. That is it. And that is taken care of by the new rendition that we are given. I do not know if it is clumsy and we would want to have a separate paragraph, maybe, a (c ) for that, I do not mind. But the principle should well be understood by all of us, otherwise, Parliament is allocating money and then abandoning its oversight responsibility. Mr Speaker, that is the gravamen of it.
    Mr Asaga 1 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think that the proposal being made is in the right direction because this is a public corporation and the shareholder is Ghana Government. I think that when such things come, they will go to the Committee on
    Energy and they will sit and look at them and make the recommendations to the plenary.
    So I think it is in the right direction and I think we must accept the rendition for both (a) and (b) and then the final one that we are adding, where clause 3 (a) should still read “not exceeding 55 per cent of the net cash.”
    The fifteen years is the fact that we do not want to grandfather Ghana National Petroleum Coporation (GNPC) forever. We want to put a performance target for GNPC to know that within fifteen years, they should be on their own just as Sonangol is on its own in Angola.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1 p.m.
    It is very, very clear now. I do not think we have any more doubts in our minds.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Clause 7 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
    Clause 8 - Transparency and accountability of petroleum receipts.
    Mr Avedzi 1 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 8, susbclause (1), line 1, delete “records of and in line 3, delete “national” and insert “State-owned” and further in line 4, delete “no more than thirty working” and insert “within thirty calendar. . .”
    Mr Speaker, the new rendition will then read 1 p.m.
    “For the purpose of transparency and accountability of petroleum receipts in whatever form, shall

    simultaneously be published by the Minister in the Gazette and at least, two State-owned daily newspapers within thirty calendar days after the end of the applicable quarter.”
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I believe the principle is well understood. I had advised that the Chairman would have deleted the entire subclause and then inserted this new construction. That would have made it tidier. But he struggles rather laboriously to achieve the same. But I think that the principle is well understood.
    Dr Prempeh 1 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I support the amendment being proffered. Mr Speaker, we are talking about transparency and accountability and we omitted “that should be given to Parliament as well.” Because when you go to the subclause 2, it said it should be published on the website of Parliament.
    Mr Speaker, if we are talking about transparency and accountability, no matter where else you are going to publish or display it, that Report should come to Parliament for the sake of us being the oversight body in this country. I know that there is an amendment to delete that one, but no, that should come to Parliament. I am just drawing the Chairman's attention to it.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1 p.m.
    In other words, you want it to be published in the newspapers and also brought to Parliament? At least, you wanted to get his view, point clear.
    Mr Avedzi 1 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, the concerns of the Hon Member is addressed by subclause (2); there is a proposed amendment. Apart from publishing it in the State-owned dailies, it will be delivered to Parliament as well.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1 p.m.
    Delivered to Parliament is a bit different from publishing on the website. Once it is delivered to Parliament, we know the process of bringing it to the attention of the House through the Clerk and so on. It is different from website publication.
    Dr A. A. Osei 1 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, the problem is that, somebody cannot on his own publish something on Parliament's website. It is Parliament that must put something on its website.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1 p.m.
    How does it get to Parliament for Parliament to put it on its website?
    Dr A. A. Osei 1 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, the amendment coming takes care of that. Presented to Parliament, then Parliament can decide whether or not - So there is an amendment taking care of that. But if we allow some strangers to be publishing things on our website, we may have some strange things on our website.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1 p.m.
    Yes, but the information must be made obligatorily to Parliament before any publication can be made.
    Dr A. A. Osei 1 p.m.
    There is an amendment coming up. If you can just let the Chairman -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:10 p.m.
    Can you make reference to that so that there can be a holistic approach?
    Hon Dr Prempeh, does that satisfy your query?
    Dr Prempeh 1:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, thank you.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:10 p.m.
    Thank
    you very much.
    Chairman of the Committee, so final rendition? And I must say -
    Mr Kwasi Amoako-Attah — rose —
    Mr Avedzi 1:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker for the purpose -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:10 p.m.
    Hon Chairman of the Committee, just give us a moment and let us hear from the Hon Member of Parliament.
    Mr Kwasi Amoako-Attah 1:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, in the proposed amendment, subclause 1 (1), line 1, I do not understand why “records of” should be deleted. Clause 8 is talking about transparency and accountability and to establish transparency and accountability can only be deduced from established records and the processes. So if anybody at all wants to challenge that the process is not transparent, it can only be deduced out of the established records. If we have to delete “records of”, then on what basis are we going to assess the transparency and the accountability of the process?
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:10 p.m.
    So that “records of” should be retained?
    Mr Amoako-Attah 1:10 p.m.
    Precisely so.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:10 p.m.
    Is there any specially good reason the “records of” should not be retained?
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 1:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, “records of” should be retained; it is like accounts. If accounting records are there, then you will be able to look at the accounts and see whether fraud is being perpetuated. But if there are no records, how do you check fraudulent practices? If there are no documents, if there is nothing - So we should not rush and make mistakes. The “records of” should be retained.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:10 p.m.
    I thank you.
    Hon Chairman of the Committee, in order for us to make progress, can you have -
    Prof. (Emeritus) Amoako 1:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I was going to attack the whole rendition on purposes of grammar. It is the “records” which is the subject and if you take out the “records”, the whole rendition does not make sense. We have to retain the “records”. That is the subject of the -- [Interruption.]
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:10 p.m.
    I think there is a general consensus on that.
    Chairman of the Committee, if you will simply take note of that and bring your rendition and let us go.
    Mr Avedzi 1:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, the Headnote is talking about transparency and accountability of petroleum receipts, so the emphasis here is on the petroleum receipts.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:10 p.m.
    Hon Chairman of the Committee, it is records that show what receipts are. So I will be glad if you will simply let us make progress.
    Mr Avedzi 1:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, we are limiting this information to only the receipts of petroleum transactions, not any other record. “Records” connote more than receipts. We are laying emphasis on receipts of petroleum transactions so that is why we said, “petroleum receipts in whatever form, shall simultaneously be published . . .”
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:10 p.m.
    Hon Chairman of the Committee, we read clearly here “the records of petroleum receipts”, so please, if that is the essence of it, “petroleum receipts”, whatever is the record thereon, for which matter we have data, an established base, to check and to re-check or whatever, let us just make
    sure and progress. So, with “records of petroleum receipts” established, shall we now go on to other amendments -- delete “national” and insert “State- owned” and further in line 4, delete “not more than thirty working” and insert “within thirty calendar . . .”
    Mr Avedzi 1:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, the “thirty days” is not “working days” but thirty calendar days”.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:10 p.m.
    With that, I will put the Question -
    Mr Kyei-Mensah-Bonsu 1:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I am one of the sponsors of this amendment and I thought it was for good reason. But on second sight, I just want to ask why we have omitted the word “probity” because that is the language of the Constitution. “Probity, transparency and accountability,” that is the language of the Constitution. But not to fight over it though -
    Mr Avedzi 1:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I am not sure whether he is comfortable with “probity”. Is he comfortable with “probity”? -- [Interruption]
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:10 p.m.
    Order!
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 1:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 8, subclause (1), line 2, delete “petroleum” and insert “crude petroleum outputs and . . .”
    Mr Speaker, if we want to prevent fraud and cheating, we should look at two issues -- both revenue and ouput. If the quantity is reduced, revenue is also going to be reduced. But if you know the quantity, if you know the output, the output multiplied
    Mr Avedzi 1:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, earlier, we did not take his amendment to include “crude petroleum”. “Petroleum” has been defined in the Bill to cover both crude oil and gas, so adding “crude” to “petroleum” will not serve the purpose. “Petroleum”, as I said, is defined in the definition column as “crude oil, natural gas or both”. So, it is not proper that we add “crude” to the “petroleum”.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 1:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, if he is saying it is not proper to add “crude”, what about “outputs and” after “petroleum”? This is because I am talking about quantity and value, unless -- You cannot control and prevent fraud if you do not know the stock you are selling and therefore, the accountability people should know the quantity you have produced. Having known the quantity, then we should know the value but you do not say this is the amount without knowing the
    source of this. You do not have to create the opportunity for people to defraud the State. I do not know what prevents them from agreeing with me.
    Dr A. A. Osei 1:10 p.m.
    I do not know if my Hon Senior Colleague is thinking that “petroleum” only means, it must be in crude form. We have defined what “petroleum receipts” are in clause 6 --
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:20 p.m.
    Dr Akoto Osei, I think we have gone beyond that in view of the response given by the Hon Chairman of the Committee and he is only making one -- Hon Appiah-Ofori, if you will make the second leg of the argument, so that it is clear and then we proceed.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 1:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, this
    is what I am saying: I have conceded to the Hon Chairman's explanation that the “crude” should be deleted.
    Having done that, I am saying that we should not end with “petroleum” but we should say, “petroleum outputs and receipts”, so that we are controlling two items -- the quantity and the value. In accounting, unless you know the quantity, you cannot know the value. So even if you are preparing a balance sheet, you take stock and then the value, but if you do not do so and you are talking about value, where did it originate from? Where did he get it from? But if you know the quantity and you know the unit price and when you multiply the quantity by the unit price, you arrive at the value, then you compare and see whether you are being cheated or not.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:20 p.m.
    All that the Hon Member is saying is, let us add “the output” so that we know the quantity before we know the value. Very well. Some of these things, some may think are irrelevant but in actual fact, if they will lead to avoidance of doubt, we will want to be protective.
    Mr Joseph B. Aidoo 1:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I am strongly inclined to go with Hon Appiah-Ofori, but then I will wish that instead of using all those words, we simply say “petroleum resources” because in the Interpretation “petroleum resources” has been defined as “oil and gas in their natural state and the revenue, other entitlements accruing to Government.” So this will encapsulate the receipts, as well as the -- [Interruptions.]
    Dr A. A. Osei 1:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, with respect, I do not mean to belabour this point. Mr Speaker, we have done clause 6, where we have specifically defined what constitutes “petroleum receipts”. You cannot just add any other definition that you want. A “royalty” cannot be defined in the way that he is defining it.
    That is why I am saying that, if he adverts his mind to clause 6 and he knows what constitutes “petroleum receipts”, the issue he is raising shall not arise. That is why I am saying that he must keep in mind that it is well defined. The issue is not output. No, income tax. Income tax has nothing to do with crude petroleum.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:20 p.m.
    Hon Dr Osei, thank you very much. At the Consideration Stage, whatever we consider very important, we can even go forwards and backwards.
    Assuming that we think the Hon Member is making a valid point by drawing the attention of this Honourable House to the issue of output, so that we should be very, very certain about output; this is the time we could use our good minds to see how best we will provide for that, so that we do not talk only about receipts and some day some people will think this Honourable House did not look at it all holistically -- but also we will look at outputs.
    Mr Avedzi 1:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, as said by
    the Hon Ranking Member, “petroleum

    receipts” which is being required here to be published has been defined in the Bill, which includes royalties, taxes -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:20 p.m.
    Kindly
    read. For the avoidance of doubt, please read. We all have it here but read for the benefit of the House.
    Mr Avedzi 1:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, page 28
    “petroleum revenue includes:
    (a) royalty in cash or in equivalent barrels of oil or equivalent units of gas, payable by a licensed producer, including the National Oil Company or a company under a production sharing agreement or other agreement.”
    This is the receipt that we want the Hon Minister to publish. We are not referring to what quantities that have been produced. By adding quantities or outputs, you are introducing a new thing altogether, which changes completely, the intention of this particular clause. All that have been received by the Hon Minister in the form of royalties, in the form of taxes and whatever, should be published by the Hon Minister at the website for Ghanaians and everybody to read.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:20 p.m.
    Hon Chairman of the Committee, has this concern been taken care of elsewhere in this Bill? Or, you think it is not a concern worthy of consideration? Is it somewhere else provided for? Is it provided for elsewhere be so that when we draw our attention to that, we simply leave it from here? Is it something that is not worthy of consideration and then we proceed? Is it something that is worthy of consideration for which matter we will now think of how we can best capture it if not here then elsewhere and I think this is the quintessence of such an exercise?
    Mr Avedzi 1:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, it is something worth looking at; that is why the Petroleum Exploration and Production
    Mr Avedzi 1:20 p.m.


    Bill which talks about the output sharing is taking care of this particular issue. But this one is about the revenue that is coming out of it and how the revenue is being managed; how it is being accounted for; that is what we are dealing with. The issue of quantity is taken care of in the Petroleum Exploration and Production Bill.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:20 p.m.
    So that
    you do not think it is worthwhile worrying about how much oil there is before we even worry about how much money and how to manage it?
    Mr Terkpeh 1:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I just
    wanted to add that there is also going to be a reporting requirement for all the output in the Petroleum Exploration and Production Bill.
    Dr Prempeh 1:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I know
    that Members of the Finance Committee and the Energy Committee have done a lot of work but they should exercise patience for some of us.
    Mr Speaker, the whole issue about clause 8 is transparency and accountability in petroleum receipts. If you do not know how much petroleum has been produced and you are just given the receipts of the money that the Government has received -- record of the receipts -- you said we should even delete the record, you just said so --
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:20 p.m.
    Just
    for the benefit of doubt and for the Table Office, “record” is kept.
    Dr Prempeh 1:20 p.m.
    Thank you, Mr Speaker.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:20 p.m.
    Just for the avoidance of doubt.
    Dr Prempeh 1:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I will give you a scenario where the two issues are
    rose
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:20 p.m.
    Hon
    Asaga, please. I am sorry but please. I will call you - I have called you more than four times, so please, let us exercise patience; I will call you.
    Dr Prempeh 1:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, why is Hon
    Asaga so intolerant?
    Mr Speaker, clause 8 is very, very
    different from clause 6 or clause 7. Clause 8 talks about transparency and accountability in the receipts so far produced or received and all my Hon Friend is saying is that, yes, the records of the receipts, you are going to show us, but let us also know the corresponding petroleum output against which receipts you have produced. Just juxtapose them. What is wrong with that? What have you got to hide? There are transparency laws that we have acceded to.
    Mr Speaker, the Hon Deputy Minister just told us that there are reporting requirements. Yes, it is true there are reporting requirements in the Petroleum Exploration Bill -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:20 p.m.
    Hon
    Member, if you say, “what have you got to hide?”. are you being futuristic or -- I do not think any Hon Member has anything to hide at this stage. It is a matter of different views - withdraw that statement.
    Dr A. A. Osei 1:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think
    he should withdraw that statement. [Inerruption.] This is a Committee's Report and he is imputing motives.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:20 p.m.
    Hon
    Dr Osei, you are out of order.
    Dr A. A. Osei 1:20 p.m.
    This is unacceptable, Mr Speaker.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:20 p.m.
    I have
    just advised the Hon Member to do what you are purporting to do while you are out of order.
    Dr Prempeh 1:30 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I withdraw those statements because I am not imputing any ulterior motives to anybody.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:30 p.m.
    Proceed
    then.
    Dr Prempeh 1:30 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I know
    that the Committees has done a lot of work but this clause 8 is about transparency and accountability in the receipt; so Cabinet told us, and we are saying that it should be reported in the national papers; it should be published. That is the purpose of this whole clause. So, if you are going to publish the receipt and somebody is saying that before you publish the receipt, juxtapose it with the output, what is wrong with it? It is actually going to reaffirm and deepen -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:30 p.m.
    That is
    one view, and I think that the view that we should not publish it is also well known. This is another view, so let us go on.
    Mr Terkpeh 1:30 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I wish to reiterate the point made by the Hon Ranking Member and the Hon Chairman of the Committee that this Bill is about petroleum receipts. Moreover, it may
    be onerous to include quantities, for example, where in relation to corporate income taxes where the Ghana Revenue Authority (GRA) will be dealing primarily with profits that are declared as corporate income tax in relation to the industry and which flows into the petroleum receipts. I do not know if stretching the requirements for output will require GRA to specify the outputs for the companies and others.
    Mr Speaker, as has been indicated by my Hon Colleague, I think that in terms of national output coming from the industry as a whole, the Petroleum Exploration and Production Bill could take care of those requirements so that we restrict ourselves to the receipts.
    Mr Asaga 1:30 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think that
    when we are dealing with the laws, we also should bear in mind that there are standard practices and standards. My Hon Colleague was just talking. For example, when we talk of cocoa receipt in the Budget and the line for cocoa receipts, we do not add in that Budget, the receivable, that we produced 1,000 - [Interruption.] Oh!, I am coming. Please -- [Interruption.]
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:30 p.m.
    Order! Order!
    Mr Asaga 1:30 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, so what we
    are saying is that, the output in terms of quantities is definitely going to be stated in the Budget that for this particular year, this was the total production from the fields in Ghana and therefore, it then also will reflect what is in the revenue proceeds. We do not go to say that if we announce that cocoa receipts for this year amount to 10 million, then somebody will say, “But you have not put it in the Budget line that it is 10 million times 2,000” -
    I believe that he is a profession of medicine and this is a profession of accounting and finance, so he should not
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:30 p.m.
    Hon
    Asaga, every Hon Member of Parliament is supposed to be versatile from archeology to zoology, and you will not go into that line of argument.
    Mr Asaga 1:30 p.m.
    No, Mr Speaker. That line,
    I have ranked him that he is a good doctor; I am trying to say he is -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:30 p.m.
    Some good doctors know more accounting than some accountants per se. So, please, let us leave that out. Hon Asaga, please, go on a serious note and end on a serious note.
    Mr Asaga 1:30 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I have
    agreed to what you are saying. But on a more serious note, I think that my Hon Colleague should also know that his gesticulations and interruptions should also respect Hon Members, who are serious --
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:30 p.m.
    Hon Asaga, that matter which has been dealt with by the Chair, you cannot go back to it. So, please, if you have finished with your contribution, you may sit down.
    Mr Asaga 1:30 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, in my opinion,
    I do not think that output here is relevant; it is highly irrelevant and I will not vote for it.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:30 p.m.
    One thing we all know is that, whenever they tell us about cocoa receipts, they tell us also of total tonnage for the year.
    Hon Deputy Minister for Energy --
    Several Hon Members - rose --
    Mr Asaga 1:30 p.m.
    No, no, please. But how? But why would the Chair mislead us? [Interruption.] Because he is debating; the Chair is debating.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:30 p.m.
    Hon
    Majority Leader, if you would please advise the Hon Member on his feet what to do -- Order! Order! All other Hon Members should resume their seats for the Hon Deputy Minister for Energy.
    Mr Buah 1:30 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think what
    we are talking about are provisions that are adequately catered for in the current PNDC Law 84, requesting the Minister responsible for Energy, for example -- Even the oil companies and GNPC are required to provide information on the discovery and quantities within thirty days and reporting procedures, are all laid down in PNDC Law 84.
    So, we have those provisions in the Petroleum Exploration and Production Bill that will be brought to this House shortly - [Interruption.] All right, I will not talk about it.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:30 p.m.
    Order! Order! Hon Deputy Minister, you have the floor.
    Mr Buah 1:30 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I just want to
    make the point that we are discussing issues that can be discussed in the Petroleum Exploration and Production Bill.
    I am making the point that there are clear reporting procedures on output in PNDC Law 84 as it even stands. So, I will really let us make a clear distinction between the current Petroleum Revenue Management Bill -- The purpose of this Bill was clearly stated; it was clearly to address issues of the revenues that we will get. I think that the whole purpose was about transparency and how we will manage revenues but this is dealing with receipts.
    The issues of outputs are important but they are adequately addressed in the Petroleum Exploration and Production Bill.
    Mr Joseph K. Adda 1:30 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I
    think what my Hon Colleague opposite has just said brings to mind what Hon P. C. Appiah-Ofori said to this House, that we should look at the Petroleum Exploration and Production Bill before we come to this level. If indeed, we had done that, then we will be very clear in this clause what we are talking about.
    But Mr Speaker, having said that, let me come to the clause itself. If you look at the clause very carefully, we are talking about transparency and accountability, we are talking about gazetting the information at the end of every quarter. What is wrong with simply stating the figures in terms of, shall we say the dollar value or monetary value, and also the output that has come to give us that monetary value? I do not see anything wrong with that, Mr Speaker.
    We are talking about transparency, so if we really want to be transparent, let us be transparent with the quantities as well as with the financial figures.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 1:30 p.m.
    Mr Speaker,
    this particular provision is meant for the Committee on Accountability. They are going to use this information. So, if you are telling them the revenues that have accrued to you and they do not know the source, how this was generated, how are they going to hold people accountable? It is not a general thing but it is meant for a specific institution and you have to give them enough information to enable that institution to do its work.
    Now, assuming the provision is in the Petroleum Exploration and Production Bill, then we should stop discussing this Bill and that Bill should come first for us to look at it, and give approval before we continue with this. This is because we cannot give approval to this while we are
    not sure that the quantity to be produced would be made accountable and you will be able to monitor.
    Mr Speaker, I am very worried about it because I have seen this in Nigeria before and that is why I am very, very cautious. I know how people in positions of responsibility were duping the country, carrying the resources out of the country to go and sell in the United States of America (USA) and pocketed the money. The nation was losing the revenue. So, if by the grace of God, we are getting this, do we make an opportunity for people to defraud us? Why do we not put controls to prevent all these? What are we losing? I do not know what they would lose by inserting this one there.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:40 p.m.
    Hon Members, I think we must be very, very cautious. It is we who say Nam pii nsei nkwan, which means “Too much meat does not spoil the soup”. If this is something that will not hurt, and it will only reinforce, and it will re-enforce transparency and so you know both the output and the receipts, please, it is a matter of crafting. Let us craft it and make progress.
    Mr Owusu-Agyemang 1:40 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, my people will not be very happy; it is New Juaben North. In fact, you have virtually taken the words out of my mouth. [Interruption.]
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:40 p.m.
    Order!
    Mr Owusu-Agyemang 1:40 p.m.
    By saying that out of the abundance of caution and for the avoidance of doubt, if these statistics are going to be published elsewhere, what is the problem in bringing it together? I am not a lawyer but I know we have several laws in this country - the Criminal Law will be the one against the women in this country -- they all eventally come to the
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:40 p.m.
    Sometimes the formulation is what creates difficulties, so shall we have some formulation so that we can put it against what is existing and then decide on it? Hon P. C. Appiah-Ofori, can you give us a rendition because a rendition vis a vis the present one will make us see which is right or not?
    Mr Avedzi 1:40 p.m.
    Mr Speaker -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:40 p.m.
    Please, when I hear from him, I will come to the Hon Chairman of the Committee.
    Mr Avedzi 1:40 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, he is going
    to give a rendition to include the “output”

    which we have not agreed to.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:40 p.m.
    Yes,
    then we have two competing view points, sure, which Hon Asaga agrees with. We may end up with two renditions. Who says we cannot do that? So, please, go ahead. The Hon Chairman's rendition is still there; we may have another rendition. Hon Asaga, are you inclined towards helping with a rendition that would include “output”?
    Mr Asaga 1:40 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I thought that
    you said Hon P. C. Appiah-Ofori should give the rendition, so he should give his new rendition.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:40 p.m.
    Yes, so
    starting from “petroleum”.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 1:40 p.m.
    Mr Speaker,
    starting from “petroleum”, I am saying that “petroleum outputs and receipts”.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:40 p.m.
    So that
    even from the heading -- Is that not so?
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 1:40 p.m.
    Yes. The heading
    too should change -- “Transparency and accountability of petroleum outputs and receipts”, that is what I am saying. And then we say --
    “petroleum outputs and receipts in whatever form, shall simultaneously be published by the Minister in the Gazette”.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:40 p.m.
    So,
    for example, we should be sure that for clause 8 (1) --
    “For the purpose of transparency and accountability the records of petroleum outputs and receipts . . .”
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 1:40 p.m.
    Good. Praise
    God.
    Some Hon Members 1:40 p.m.
    Hallelujah.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:40 p.m.
    So one
    includes “petroleum outputs and receipts” and one simply says “petroleum receipts”.
    Mr Avedzi 1:40 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, “petroleum
    receipts” have been defined in the Bill, which I read on page 28, which includes “royalties”, includes “corporate taxes”, includes “initial carried interests”, “additional oil entitlements, dividend from the National Oil Company, investment income and surface rentals”. These are receipts which have been defined.
    Now, Mr Speaker, what is the definition of the “output”? We do not even know what constitutes the “output”, and if you want the “outputs and receipts to be published vis-a vis -- It does not look very simple that we are producing one million barrels and Government is getting four hundred million barrels, therefore, multiplying four hundred by the rate, you get these receipts. The receipts are in a form of royalties, taxes and so many other things. How can you relate the receipts to the outputs he is talking about?
    Mr Speaker, we are treading on a dangerous ground.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:40 p.m.
    So, we can easily put into the definitions what we mean by “petroleum output” and so at the appropriate time, when we get to that side, we will take care of what an “output” is. But I believe that every Hon Member of this Honuorable House knows what the output of cocoa or whatever.
    By the way, is there any contribution from there?
    Mr Owusu-Agyemang 1:40 p.m.
    Mr Speaker,
    the point that I want to raise is that, the Hon Chairman's point is very difficult
    to accept because at any material time output of any enterprise is defined. It can be anything; it can even be litres, it can be barrels, it can be buckets, and it can be Milo tins. So, I do not know what the Hon Chairman's problem is; he is not even listening. I do not know what the Hon Chairman's problem is, that if we do not know what output is, then there is a problem.
    There is no problem because this nation statically would have determined that for us the unit of output is this or that. I do not see the point that -- If the Hon Chairman has any argument, let him make but not to say that because we do not know what an output is, we cannot go. It can be barrels, it can be litres or it can be anything. But that will be defined without doubt at the time that is done. Mr Speaker, that is what I wanted to say.
    Mr J. B. Aidoo 1:40 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I will want Hon P. C. Appiah-Ofori to further add prices so that it is not just output, but the output, the prices and the receipts. This is because, eventually, the receipts would be influenced by the prices prevailing at any point in time.
    Mr Speaker, Hon Members are trying to
    attribute clause 8 to just receipts; clause 8 is not just about receipts. Clause 8 is talking about transparency and accountability of outputs, prices and then receipts. The heading there can be changed; the heading there is not conclusive. If we are truly talking about transparency, then we ought to know the quantity that has been produced, the prevailing price, so as to get total receipt.
    So Mr Speaker, I will even urge Hon P. C. Appiah-Ofori to add “prices”.
    Mr Isaac Osei 1:40 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I am a
    little worried about the trajectory of the debate. The fact of the matter is that, all of us have to understand that; there is an inter-temporal dimension between production and receipts; we have to really
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.
    Very well.
    Hon Member, will you be able to give a solution, to conjecture a solution? This is because it will help. That would be more of a positive contribution.
    Mr Isaac Osei 1:50 p.m.
    My view is that, the
    original position which had been taken is, perhaps, not the popular one but it is the right one.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.
    Very
    well.
    Mr Samuel A. Akyea 1:50 p.m.
    Mr Speaker,
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.
    Order!
    Hon Members, I do not see why we cannot
    debate this one after the other so that we come to - But somehow, there is passion, why? I think, let us be passionate and just come out with view points. After all, this is a service we are doing to our nation. Hon Member, you may continue.
    Mr Akyea 1:50 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I hold the
    humble view that this is not a fetish. If you are producing crude oil anywhere --every quantity of crude oil can be measured. The price of crude oil is known the world over so that if you are asking for transparency and data, why do we not address the whole gamut of the operation -- how much we produce, the price for every barrel and then your receipt so that it would be very comprehensive. It will be proper accounting if we know how much the output is, how much the world market price was and then how much was received, then you are making accounting sense. But for him to say that let us address the receipts but we should not know the outputs, it is incongruous.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.
    Order!
    Order!
    Mr Buah 1:50 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I do not think
    there is any argument here at all. We are talking about resource management against revenue management. I have made the point that all the concerns on output -- those provisions are adequately catered for in the current Law 84. Quite frankly, this House has a rare opportunity to even revisit that matter in the Petroleum Exploration and Production Law.
    The purpose of this Bill, Mr Speaker, says and with your permission, I beg to quote:
    “The purpose of this Bill is to

    provide for a framework that will guide the efficient collection, allocation and management of petroleum revenue . . .”

    Revenue management and resource management --

    Mr Speaker, there should not be any confusion. We need to address all the transparency issues on revenue management. I think we have a rare opportunity to address all those resource issues.
    Prof. Y. Gyan-Baffour 1:50 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, this Bill that we are trying to pass here is about the revenue that will accrue to Government; it is not about the revenue that will accrue to the company, the Government or to everybody else. It is the one that is accruing to Government only. Output would be the totality of all, including what is coming to Government and what is actually coming to the companies.
    So right here, what is really needed is just the receipts. But it looks like the concerns of Hon Members are that, in the absence of a law that will allow us to publish the output and then the prices, maybe, we should smuggle that one in here. That is what they are saying. I do not think there is any problem with publishing those figures.
    Indeed, if it will appear in another law, I do not think that if we put it here and it becomes redundant -- the redundancy is actually putting us all on the side of caution. So, let it be redundant, if even it will appear in another law somewhere. But at least, the perception is that, let us know the output. You cannot link it directly with the receipts anyway, but at least, for their information, they want to know the output to the country and the prices. I think that is where they are
    coming from, but as far as this law is concerned, I do not think it really belongs in this Act.
    Mr Asaga 1:50 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think that
    Mr Isaac Osei 1:50 p.m.
    On a point of order.
    Mr Speaker, I never talked about cocoa please; I beg him.
    Mr Asaga 1:50 p.m.
    I am talking of his
    knowledge in receipts and production, and I think it makes sense. Hon Prof. Gyan- Baffour has also reiterated my position.
    I want to further also put on record that, you cannot at any particular moment link production with receipts because one is in transit and one is finite and known, and we are not talking of estimates. What comes to the petroleum account now called the “Petroleum Holding Fund” is a known figure. Therefore, you cannot be reporting a futuristic figure of production linked to a known figure.
    Mr Speaker, my final point is, if you take our own Budget, where they talk about cocoa receipts, they give -- For example, let me quote page 258 and they are saying “exports”; And they say “Export is GH¢62 million”. They did not say “export” here means “one thousand tonnes times this”. So, the capturing of receipts is different from the capturing of the total output. And the total output would be mentioned in the Budget by the Hon Minister for Energy.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.
    Thank
    you very much.
    Hon P. C. Appipah-Ofori?
    Very well, by way of a point of order,
    Hon Prof. Gyan-Baffour.
    Prof. Gyan-Baffour 1:50 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I
    am not saying that we should not publish the output and the prices, that is not what I am saying. What I am saying is that, when
    Prof. Gyan-Baffour 1:50 p.m.


    you take the output and multiply it by the price, it is bigger than -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 1:50 p.m.
    In any
    case, Hon Member, in view of the state of business in the House and the time, I direct that Sitting be held outside the prescribed period.
    Please, continue.
    Prof. Gyan-Baffour 1:50 p.m.
    What I was
    saying was that, the output times prices would be bigger than receipts, because it includes the output times prices that are going to the production company. But the people want just for transparency purposes, a publication of the output and prices at which it was sold. So how we will do it, is up to the House.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 1:50 p.m.
    Mr Speaker,
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 2 p.m.
    So if you are talking about transparency, and you are saying the quantity should be known and people are saying, no, it should not be known, then it means there are some people who have something to hide; they are going to make money out of it; they want to sell and declare little amount of money.
    So what is good for this country is what you should sit down here for; we are not brought here to come and do something inimical to national interest. So if it is in the interest of Ghana, for us to provide
    the quantity produced, together with the revenue, what is wrong with it? Why do you not want us to do it? So I want to appeal to everybody to place national interest above any consideration and allow it to go.
    Thank you very much.
    Dr A. A. Osei 2 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, we have to be careful when we are dealing with these matters, not to reduce matters so simplistic that we begin to impugn motives. I do not know anybody in this room who would not want output produced. If there is anyone, let them raise their hands. I do not know anybody. In fact, otherwise, why are we here? We are the people's representatives.
    Mr Speaker, let us look at the amendment in the context of what it proposes to do. It is not necessary here. That is why I adverted your mind to the fact that, first, you have to know the totality of what receipts are. Receipts are not just about our income tax; where is the output from income tax? Royalties, where is the output from royalties?
    In fact, if you go to clause 4, Mr Speaker, you would notice that in clause 4, we have defined specifically how you relate outputs to receipts, by saying that on the date of the receipt, the GRA would record the value. The word “value” implies price and quantity. There is no way GRA can record the cash equivalent of - [Interruption.] You want me to read to you? I have not read clause 4 -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2 p.m.
    Hon Member, you will address the Chair.
    Dr A. A. Osei 2 p.m.
    Yes Mr Speaker, with respect - [Laughter] -- where a payment is made with petroleum. In other words, most of the time the Government is going to be dealing with cash. But the Government is allowed to elect to receive quantity; that is one. At that time, there is no way GRA can report the cash
    equivalent without adducing price and quantity. It is not possible.
    Now, if people want to know the total production, that is a different matter; we are not arguing about that. But the receipt consistent with that crude oil must come with price and quantity. There is no other way of doing that valuation, and to begin with -- that is why I am saying, look at the amendment with respect to where it is -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2 p.m.
    Hon Dr Osei, you said the total may be acceptable?
    Dr A. A. Osei 2 p.m.
    No, Mr Speaker. I am saying if people want to know the total output of crude production in this country, it is a different matter. This is dealing with what comes to Government, as my good Friend said. And it is only when Government elects to receive petroleum, that is when the receipts become a problem. But GRA is being required that, if you receive petroleum, value it on the date of receipt - I am saying, Mr Speaker, you are the lawyers; valuation cannot be possible without price and quantity. If there is any other way, let me know. It is not possible.
    So, by implication, we would know the quantity and the price of that portion that we are receiving. But beyond that, what we are interested in is not only that. Mr Speaker, that is why the Chairman defined clause (6). We are going to be getting revenue in terms of royalty. Where is the output relating to royalty? Corporate income taxes, initially carried interest, additional dividends. Mr Speaker, I am saying that it is only when Government receives petroleum, that is when the particular quantity is important.
    So if you break the word “output”, there, you may be causing a mess; the mischief that you are trying to cure, I think you will be creating more mischief. This
    word “receipts” has been defined globally such that there is no way you cannot report “output.” If you bring the word “output” somebody would be mischievous and say since you mentioned “output”, I am only to go to the parts - because income tax does not have output.
    The tax that is recorded, you cannot have the output. So this way, you catch any and everything that you want. If you break the word “output”, there you are going to make a mess of what you hope to achieve. That is why the receipts -- As he said, we are forcing GRA to match -- If you receive it today -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2 p.m.
    As which Hon Member said?
    Dr A. A. Osei 2 p.m.
    Hon Member for Subin (Mr Isaac Osei), we are forcing GRA to say, “if you receive it in petroleum, we do not care what you do with it later. Value it today.” Mr Speaker, as soon as you value it today, unless you are God; we are human beings. The only way we know how to value is to attach price to quantity, and that is what is being required. So that -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2 p.m.
    Thank you very much.
    Hon Boafo.
    Mr Boafo 2 p.m.
    Mr Speaker --
    rose
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2 p.m.
    Some clauses are more crucial than others; at least, by the very contribution of Hon Members and I think it is very, very important for us to recognize that.
    Yes, Hon Boafo -- Otherwise, Hon P. C. Appiah-Ofori.
    Mr Boafo 2 p.m.
    Oh! Mr Speaker, I am ready.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2 p.m.
    Hon P. C. Appiah-Ofori.
    Hon Boafo was not keen.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 2 p.m.
    Yes, he was not keen. Thank you very much.
    Clause 54 deals with objects of the accountability committee and subclause (c) states - [Interruptions.] -- I am just saying something. Shut up! What is wrong with you? I am not playing here. [An Hon Member: Who is playing?] Do not make me angry -- [Interruption.]
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 2 p.m.
    I am just saying it to buttress my point. Mr Speaker, it says the “Accountability Committee”, the objects are:
    “To provide independent assessment on the use and management of the petroleum revenue and resources to assist Parliament and the Executive in the oversight of and performance of related functions.”
    You see, Parliament has oversight over this issue and the Accountability Committee provides information to Parliament to do that. And if it is not armed with enough information, how can Parliament perform its oversight function to prevent fraud against the State if crude oil is being diverted for other purposes?
    So at all times, the Accountability Committee should have knowledge about the quantity and the value, so that if it is informing Parliament of anything, it is sufficiently armed so that we get enough information to fight for the national interest. What is wrong with providing this one there, so that the Accountability Committee can sufficiently be armed to protect the national interest? So I do not see why people do not seem to understand this.
    Mr Boafo 2 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, the clause that we are dealing with, primarily, concerns transparency -- [Interruptions.]
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2 p.m.
    Order!
    Order!
    Mr Boafo 2 p.m.
    Transparency is not an event, it is a process. And in the process, we do comparisons and evaluation and in this case, what are we going to compare and evaluate before we conclude that there has been transparency? So what we need to compare and contrast requires a comprehensive - [Interruptions.]
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2 p.m.
    Order! Order!
    Mr Boafo 2 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, in this case,
    one cannot say that the receipts which have been provided could help us in ascertaining transparency, unless we get something to indicate that the receipts that we are getting, as much as possible, match with the output. If there is any difference, then there would be a room for explanation. That is what we need to establish so far as this process is concerned. So Mr Speaker, I think that the expression “output and prices” must be included in that particular clause.
    rose
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2 p.m.
    Majority Leader, I will call you, but I think I will call -- then I will call you too.
    Mr Avoka 2:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I just want to intervene and say that we have had enough; we have had enough of this. For the past forty-five minutes, we have been on one clause. There is nothing new to hear from anybody, so put the Question. [Interruptions.]
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
    Hon Majority Leader, incidentally, I decide if there is something more to do.
    Mr Alfred W. G. Abayateye 2:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, Hon P. C. Appiah-Ofori used the words “shut up!” The words are unparliamentary and he has to withdraw them. He used the words on me.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
    Order! Order! Hon P. C. Appiah-Ofori, the expression “shut up” is unparliamentary, if you would kindly withdraw it and we make progress.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 2:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, do you sincerely believe that if you tell somebody to shut up -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
    Hon P. C. Appiah-Ofori, you will not ask questions.
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 2:10 p.m.
    All right, if he says it is unparliamentary, I do not believe it. But he says it is unparliamentary, so I withdraw it.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
    Hon P. C. Appiah-Ofori, once I have ruled, you withdraw it. You do not tell us about what -
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 2:10 p.m.
    This is what I said. That once you say so, I withdraw it.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
    Thank you very much.
    Hon Members, this is a very, very important part of the Bill. I think it would be appropriate to defer putting the Question on this at this stage.
    There is a further amendment to clause 8 --- Chairman of the Committee -
    Mr Avedzi 2:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I was thinking that, we had an amendment proposed by -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
    A counter -amendment. And Hon Chairman of the Committee, I have listened to your amendment and counter-amendment and I think it is a very crucial matter that needs to be deferred. It would be taken tomorrow. Shall we make further progress?
    Mr Avedzi 2:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, this is
    an amendment proposed by Hon P. C. Appiah-Ofori, that is xix - that is one amendment proposed by Hon Appiah- Ofori. There is no counter-amendment; we are either taking this amendment or we oppose it.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
    We are going to debate it further. So we defer the debate on this. Any further - there is a further amendment - there will be nothing more to say about this ruling; I think it is fair and proper to debate it further. I do not see why anyone would want to shy away from the debate. Is there any further amendment? There is a further amendment to clause 8 -- xx.
    Mr Avedzi 2:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 8, subclause (2), line 1, before “Information” insert “The” and in lines 2 and 3, delete “on the website of Parliament effective the publication date” and insert the following:
    “presented to Parliament on the date of gazette publication”.
    So Mr Speaker, the new rendition will
    read as follows:
    “The information required will be made public, shall also be published online on the website of the Ministry and presented to Parliament on the date of gazette publication.”
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
    Thank you very much, Chairman of the Committee.
    Hon Members, I do not think it is in the best practice to be asking the Speaker to put the Question. I mean, it is like you are directing me; it is not in the very best taste. The amendment is for the consideration of the House and I can see Hon Boafo -
    Mr Boafo 2:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I rise to support the amendment proposed by the Hon Chairman of the Committee.
    Mr Boafo 2:10 p.m.


    Mr. Speaker, the first amendment which seeks to insert the definite article “the” is only consistent with the preceding paragraph where the type of information has been identified. So the word “the” is necessary to make it specific, and the other amendment is to go by the practice and procedure of Parliament how communication to Parliament should be dealt with. That is, by presenting whatever we agree to, whether output and receipts or only receipts to Parliament.

    Then the internal arrangement from Parliament will determine how it reaches the floor of this House. We would like to avoid the situation where we give the licence to other personalities to post materials which we have not cited on our website - it may lead to some dangerous precedence.

    So Mr Speaker, I support the proposed amendment.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
    Thank you; yes, Hon Member -
    Mr Kofi Frimpong 2:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I have found it very difficult to catch your eye. I have been on my feet for quite a long time. The issue relates to a statement made by a certain Member of the House - an experienced and long serving Member of the House. To the extent that -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
    Hon Member, is your contribution in relation to xx - Clause 8?
    Mr Frimpong 2:10 p.m.
    Yes, I know -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
    If it does not relate to that, then you are seriously out of order.
    Mr Frimpong 2:10 p.m.
    It is a point of order, about the sanity that should prevail in the House.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
    Any other contribution?
    Yes, Hon Dr Prempeh -
    Dr Prempeh 2:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I thought on your advice we would have stood the whole of clause 8 down -
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
    Not necessarily.
    Dr Prempeh 2:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, yes, because I would like to advert all our minds to the fact that throughout the Petroleum Exploration and Production Bill, which my Hon Friends are alleging to and quoting and referring to, there is not a single provision there for transparency and publication of any result. It is not - as presented to this House. Maybe, we may proffer amendments when we get there but Mr Speaker, I would like to support this amendment because I have already stated it and I stood it down because it is reflected here.
    Mr Speaker, I would like to draw your attention to the fact that time is far spent and I do not think this House reaches the quorum for us to proceed.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
    XXI. In fact ‘B' it would be the last consideration for today. There is an amendment in the name of Hon P. C. Appiah-Ofori -
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 2:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 8, subclause (2), line 3, after “effective” insert “from”.
    Dr A. A. Osei 2:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, with respect, I think that he should advert his mind to the amendment that has just been made to see if this is needed. Mr Speaker, he should look at the amendment, he may want to stand it down. [Interruption.] He should check the amendment.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
    Hon Appiah-Ofori, are you abandoning the amendment?
    Dr A. A. Osei 2:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I was going to ask Hon Appiah-Ofori to advert his mind to the amendment that has just been made and maybe, after that, he may stand his down.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
    So shall it be deemed withdrawn, Hon Appiah- Ofori?
    Mr Appiah-Ofori 2:10 p.m.
    No objection.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2:10 p.m.
    Thank you very much.
    Well, this will bring us to the end of Business and Hon Majority Leader, just in case you have something special to tell us.
    Mr Avoka 2:10 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, subject to your indulgence, I thought that we could just spend the next five minutes to do clause 9 which is not controvercial.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2:20 p.m.
    Thank you very much.

    Clause 9 - Management of the Petroleum Reserve Accounts Expenses.
    Mr Avedzi 2:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move clause 9 - delete.
    Mr Speaker, the entire clause is being deleted because as captured in Schedule 2, all the management and petroleum reserve account expenses would be taken care of under the Operational Agreement between the Bank of Ghana and the Ministry of Finance and Economic Planning, so there is no need to have the clause 9.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2:20 p.m.
    Hon Majority Leader, are you happy at this stage?
    Mr Avoka 2:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I would just want to seize the opportunity to thank
    Hon Members for their endurance and co-operation.
    Today is Friday and we have been here up to 2.00 p.m.; that is commendable and I hope we can keep up with that spirit.
    Let me remind committee Chairmen, Ranking Members and Leadership that our next venue is Koforidua for the Budget.
    Mr Second Deputy Speaker 2:20 p.m.
    Hon Minority Leader, any indication for the sake of reciprocity?
    Dr A. A. Osei 2:20 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I am standing in for the Minority Leader. I am not the Minority Leader.
    Mr Speaker, I think that I agree with the Majority Leader except to say that he, having noticed that Chairmen, Ranking Members and others have been sitting here all day and today is Friday, I was hoping that he would add additional statements that will make Hon Members more willing to go to Koforidua -- maybe, we shall meet in Koforidua.
    Mr Avoka 2:20 p.m.
    I have been informed that there is lunch. [Laughter.]
    ADJOURNMENT 2:20 p.m.
  • The House was adjourned at 2.24 p.m. till Monday, 29th November, 2010 at 10.00 a.m.