Debates of 11 Jun 2015

MR FIRST DEPUTY SPEAKER
PRAYERS 11:05 a.m.
VOTES AND PROCEEDINGS AND THE OFFICIAL REPORT 11:05 a.m.
Mr Fist Deputy Speaker 11:05 a.m.
Hon Members, correction of Votes andProceedings for Wednesday, 10th June, 2015.
  • [No correction was made to the Votes and Proceedings of Wednesday, 10th June, 2015]
    • Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:05 a.m.
    Hon Members, we have one Official Report which is dated Friday, 5th June, 2015.
    [No correction was made to the Official Report of Friday, 5th June, 2015].
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:05 a.m.
    Hon Members, no Statements have been admitted.
    At the Commencement of Public Business; Hon Majority Chief Whip?
    Alhaji Mohammed-Mubarak Muntaka 11:05 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, we would be grateful if item number 7 on the Order Paper is taken; University of Environment and Sustainable Development Bill, 2014.
    Thank you, Mr Speaker.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:05 a.m.
    Hon Members, the University of Environment and Sustainable Development Bill, 2014 at the Consideration Stage.
    STAGE 11:05 a.m.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:05 a.m.
    Hon Members, there is no advertised amendment to clause 1.
    Clause 1 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
    Clause 2 -- Aims of the University.
    Chairman of the Committee (Mr Mathias Asoma Puozaa) 11:05 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 2, subclause (1), paragraph (a), the second occurrence, delete.
    Mr Speaker, there has been a repetition for subclause 2 (a) in (b). So, we would just want to delete one of the subclauses.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:05 a.m.
    Hon Chairman, why do you say they have been repeated? Where do these issues appear?
    Mr Puozaa 11:05 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, subclause 2 (a):
    “Higher education shall be made equally accessible to all persons…”
    Mr Speaker, if you go down, there is another subclause 2 (a) immediately after subclause 2 (b), which also reads the same:
    “Higher education shall be made …”
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:05 a.m.
    Very well, I now understand.
    So, Hon Members, I would put the Question.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Hon Chairman of the Committee, clause 2 again.
    Mr Puozaa 11:05 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 2, subcluase (1), paragraph (b), the second occurrence, delete.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:05 a.m.
    Very well.
    I would put the Question.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Mr Puozaa 11:05 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 2, subclause (2), paragraphs (a), (b), (c), (d) and (e), delete and insert the following:
    “(a) Schools, Faculties, Institutes and Centres relating to environ- ment, agro-business and sus- tainable development
    (b) any other related programmes as may be determined by the Council”.
    Mr Speaker, this is to ensure that the Council has the authority to bring in whatever programmes they wish, and not to be dictated to; as to what should be established.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:05 a.m.
    Very well.
    Hon Members, I would put the Question.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Clause 2 ordered as amended to stand part of the Bill.
    Clause 3 -- Campuses of the University.
    Mr Puozaa 11:05 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 3 delete and insert the following:
    The University shall be established in Somanya with campuses in Donkorkrom and any other place as the Council may determine”
    Mr Speaker, the Committee believes that this is better than what is contained in the original Bill which read:
    “The University shall be established in Somanya and shall have
    (a) its first campus in Donkorkrom and any other place in the Eastern region;
    (b) other campuses in any other place as the Council may determine.”
    Mr Speaker, it is tidier the way the Committee has submitted.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:15 a.m.
    Very well.
    Hon Members, I would put the Question.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Clause 3 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
    Clauses 4 to 6 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
    Clause 7 -- Establishment of Committees
    Mr Puozaa 11:15 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 7 subclause (1), line 3, delete “of the Council or non-members” and insert the following:”or non-members of the Council”
    Mr Puozaa 11:15 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 10, add the following new sub- clauses:
    “(3) The Council may nullify a decision taken in which the interested member participated to the extent necessary;
    (4) The Council shall enact Statutes for the effective implementation of this section.”
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:15 a.m.
    Can you give us the rationale behind this proposal?
    Mr Puozaa 11:15 a.m.
    The Committee felt that, the way the original subclauses in the Bill stand we believe it would not be right just to nullify all that has taken place at a meeting.
    So, we believe the relevant areas that are concerned should be effected with the necessary corrections.
    Secondly, we felt that the University's own Statutes should spell out the extent to which such issues should be dealt with.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Clause 10 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.

    Hon Members, before we come to Clause 11, this last amendment which had been taken with regard to clause 10 (4), the language does not appear smooth, so I direct that, the draftpersons assist us to formulate it the way it should be.

    Hon Members, there are no advertised amendments to these clauses.

    Clauses 11 to 21 ordered to stand part of the Bill.

    Clause 22 -- Director of Finance.
    Mr Puozaa 11:15 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 22, subclause (2), line 1,after “Finance”, insert “is responsible for financial resource mobilisation and”
    Mr Speaker, the Committee felt that, with that department, the Director should be empowered as much as possible to mobilise resources for the University, so we felt that it should be embedded in the Act. So we suggest that, it should be --
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:15 a.m.
    Yes, Hon Deputy Minority Leader?
    Mr Dominic Nitiwul 11:15 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think he should give a better explanation because he has already stated that, ‘Director of Finance shall perform functions as prescribed in the Statutes of the University'. Now he has decided to prescribe one function in the Statutes, what if the University decides that they would take that function and give it to another body?He should explain exactly what he really want us to do.
    This is because he has already said that the University can give that function out but now he is directing the University that, the Finance Director should be in charge of resource mobilisation and there are some Universities which do not give that function to the Finance Director.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:15 a.m.
    Yes, Hon Chairman of the Committee how do you respond -- very well, before you respond, let us hear from the Hon Member for Wa West.
    Mr Joseph Yieleh Chireh 11:25 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I am totally opposed to this amendment. The reason is simple. Financial resource mobilisation or resources for the University cannot be mobilised by the Finance Director.
    The Director of Finance is in charge of specific duties spelt out in his letter of appointment. The issue of raising resources for the University goes beyond an officer of the University. Indeed, it has to be led by the Chancellor, Vice- Chancellor and all the key people.
    But talking to the Hon Chairman early on, I got the sense that they have intentions to emphasise resource mobilisation. So, I would prefer that -- the Statutes already allows the University to create these departments. Therefore, they should create a department for resource mobilisation and assign an officer who would coordinate all the efforts of the various parts of the University, in terms of resource mobilisation but not assign these duties to a Finance Director.
    A Finance Director cannot go and be raising resources beyond the Vice Chancellor and other people. Would he, if we put it in the law, be referring to anybody before he performs his functions? An individual; when he goes to raise the funds
    and he decides to pocket some, what are you going to do?
    So, Mr Speaker, they should let us leave it as this. The sense of the House would be conveyed to the University to make their own statutes establishing a resource mobilisation unit, department or office where somebody would be --
    I know that it is important these days because every university now needs resources. They are now in competition. They have set up consultancies already, if it is not already in the law but we have ways to raise the funds and I think that should be the case. I think they should not bring the proposal. He should withdraw it and get the sense of the House. I am leading the crusade against this amendment.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:25 a.m.
    Hon Members, I would want to make a pro- posal. I think that resource mobilisation, properly speaking, should be vested in the office of the Vice Chancellor or the Chancellor. Since we have already dealt with those provisions, can we remind ourselves, so that we take it at the Second Consideration Stage?
    We leave it out of the Finance Officer's ambit and then introduce it when we come to the Vice Chancellor or the Chancellor, whichever you think is appropriate.
    Yes, Hon Deputy Minority Leader?
    Mr Nitiwul 11:25 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, if you look at the existing universities and you look at the structure and the way they work, the Council itself really takes serious interest in resource mobilisation.
    We are getting to a situation where many of the universities are becoming very autonomous in terms of financial matters. Government is gradually, I would not use the words ‘washing-off its hands', but gradually ceding a lot of resource
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:25 a.m.
    Very well, I understand you.
    Can we also couch it in such a way that we would say that ‘the Vice Chancellor, in consultation with the Council.'? Because if you leave it with the Council it is so amorphous but at least, the “Vice Chancellor in consultation with the Council.” So, let us look at it at the Second Consideration Stage.
    So, this amendment is withdrawn.
    Hon Chairman of the Committee, can you formally withdraw this amendment?
    rose
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:25 a.m.
    Yes, Hon Member?
    Mr Boamah 11:25 a.m.
    Thank you, Mr Speaker.
    I was just drawing your attention to clause 6 subclause (d) and (e) on the
    Functions of the Council. Subclause (d) talks about
    “The Council shall control the finances of the University and determine the allocation and proper use of funds”.
    Subclause (e) talks about:
    “The Council shall ensure the conservation and augmentation of the resources of the University, specifically in relation to matters affecting income or expenditure.”
    So, if the Council has been allocated such functions then I believe it would be out of place to further ask the Director of Finance to go and mobilise funds for the University. I think that function has been placed firmly under the University Council and we must maintain it as such. That is my humble view, Mr Speaker.
    Thank you.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:25 a.m.
    Very well.
    Hon Members of the Committee, please take a look at it and when you come for the Second Consideration Stage we can look at it.
    Hon Chairman of the Committee?
    Mr Puozaa 11:25 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think it is just safer for us to withdraw this and then reconsider the very idea during the Second Consideration Stage.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:25 a.m.
    Very well. Leave granted.

    Hon Members, we move to clause 24 --

    Hon Members, let me put the Question with regard to clause 22.

    Clause 22 ordered to stand part of the Bill.

    Clause 23 ordered to stand part of the Bill.

    Clause 24 -- Internal organisation of the University.

    Hon Chairman of the Committee?
    Mr Puozaa 11:25 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 24, subclause (1), paragraph (a), lines 5 and 6, delete “in the Eastern region and other campuses of the University elsewhere in the country” and insert “as the Council may determine”
    Once more, we would want to give the Council the right to select wherever they want the next campus to be.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:25 a.m.
    Yes, Hon Deputy Minority Leader?
    Mr Nitiwul 11:25 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, even when we were doing the first clause about the campuses of the University, I wanted to find out from him but when I saw “in Eastern region” I really did not bother, because I thought that the University could put it at a place like Koforidua which is the regional capital. All the other university campuses that were set up in a particular region without a university, the first point of call was always the regional capital. So, if you set up at Somanya and then you say Donkorkrom -- when you said Eastern Region, I thought that maybe they would set up another one and I would not have any problem.
    I would want to find out, did the Committee really find out from the Hon
    Minister the rationale behind the location at Somanya and Donkorkrom? Did they find out? This is because I would propose that we further amend the amendment because, the regional capital; Koforidua, there is no public university there. It will not be fair that if you look at all the other universities that have been set up, all of them were set up firstly in the regional capital before they moved to any other place.
    That is why I would want to get the reasoning behind that and then we can move; whether I would support that amendment to take out Eastern Region and say any other part of the country.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:25 a.m.
    Yes, Hon Chairman of the Committee?
    Mr Puozaa 11:35 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, we are aware that Koforidua is the capital and should be considered. But already there is a very important university sited in Koforidua, a private university. There is a Polytechnic over there and there is no reason we should cramp everything in one place. For instance, the choice of Donkorkrom has a main reason and that is the special facilities for agriculture that exists there. We have water for fishing, good land and what not.
    So the simple reason it has been selected for a campus is because it has the facilities, it is naturally endowed.
    As we have given the University Council the right to locate a campus anywhere, it could do so with time. As we know, the University of Education, Winneba, has campuses all across the country; it is in the Brong Ahafo region, in Ashanti Region and others. Therefore, we believe that,the University of Environment and Sustainable Develop- ment could also in the future even go to
    Mr Puozaa 11:35 a.m.


    Koforidua to site a campus if they see it as a need in the pursuance of their goals. We are not restricting it to Somanya and Donkorkrom, but they could be given the first place of choice.
    Mr Nitiwul 11:35 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I think the Government's goal is to establish a public university in all regions. So, if he is talking about a private university, I do not think that is an argument that I would accept at all; that since there is a private university which is doing well in Koforidua -- What if the man -- It is a private university. He is doing his private business, he can decide today that he is taking it to Accra. That could be done, and it is up to the person's discretion.
    But I am saying that, if the Act says ‘in the Eastern Region and in any other place,' then we are sure that, whatever the case might be, in future, other campuses could be sited in the Eastern Region.
    In another way, it could have decided that it should be in Donkorkrom and Somanya and any other part of the country. The Council could decide that, since the Northern Region is an agricultural belt, let us cite it there; the Eastern Region is finished, and the capital town does not have, I do not think it is a good argument.
    I cannot fault the policy makers for choosing Somanya. Maybe, I would not have done that. If I were the policy maker, I would have started with the regional capital, but the policy makers have decided that it should be Somanya and Donkorkrom, I would not fault them since that is the policy. I am however saying that, taken the Eastern Region, then one would not compel the council to put the campus in the region.
    I think it would not be fair to the regional capital especially, for government
    to say that, because there is a private university there, they would not put it there, I do not think it is good.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:35 a.m.
    Very well. Before I come to the Deputy Minister's response, I saw the Hon Member for Wa West up. I do not know whether he has abandoned it. After that, we would come to the Hon Deputy Majority Whip and then the Hon Deputy Minister could have the floor.
    Mr Joseph Y. Chireh 11:35 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I support this amendment because, it allows the Council to determine where to site these, looking at the current universities and the way they open campuses. For instance, the University of Cape Coast has campus in Wa and other places. So, it would depend on where they see the need, if there is the need for university in a community.
    Once we have mentioned two places in the Eastern Region already, let us free the University Council to determine the locations in terms of need and where it should be located. It is not a political situation.
    The policy issue is that, each region should have a public university, and the two places mentioned, even in the Act,are in the Eastern Region. One does not need to put the Eastern Region again.
    If it is more profitable for them to go and establish one in Kumasi, and that to them, they are offering courses that the people of Kumasi want, they should be able to go to Kumasi and establish campus there. That is why they are removing the “Eastern Region” --. And even restricting them to the Eastern Region is not the best thing. This is because, two places have already been mentioned in the Bill early on as we have approved.
    I think that is better and we should support the amendment.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:35 a.m.
    Yes, Hon Majority Chief Whip? Otherwise, then the Deputy Minister, you have the floor.
    Mr Samuel O. Ablakwa 11:35 a.m.
    I am most grateful for this opportunity.
    Mr Speaker, the Hon Deputy Minority Leader in his earlier submission had suggested that, all the public universities were established in regional capitals, and that is going on the record. I just would want to state on record that this is not accurate, and that, in the Western Region, the public university is in Tarkwa; the University of Mines and Technology. It is not in Takoradi, which is the capital of the Western Region.
    Having said that also, I thought that I should draw the attention of the Deputy Minority Leader to the fact that, the polytechnics would soon be elevated to become technical universities. So, Koforidua would have a technical university; which is the Koforidua Technical University, and it is taking off in September, 2016, the take-off date by the technical committee.
    I would want to also add to what the Hon Chairman of the Committee has said, that the selection process was contained in a report presented to His Excellency the President by a technical committee chaired by Prof. Benny and the convenor being Dr Christine Amoako Nuamah.
    So, a lot of technical considerations have gone into the choice of Somanya and Donkorkrom. It was not a whimsical political decision, but expert technical people, looking at the concept of the University and the focus areas, decided that Somanya and Donkorkrom were the best places, and also looking at the availability of land, agriculture and
    environmental matters and all which the university would principally be focussing on.
    All of these considerations have been made, and Somanya and Donkorkrom were selected. So, I would appeal to the Hon Chairman, that we should leave the provision as it is, especially as nothing stops the Council on the new amendment that has been made.
    Moving forward, the University Council could so decide that it wants a satellite campus in Koforidua or in Accra or Kumasi. Nothing would stop the University Council. Koforidua has not been debarred from hosting a campus of University of Environment and Sustain- able Development. So I think we are really on a good path and should continue in this way.
    I am grateful, Mr Speaker.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:35 a.m.
    Yes, Hon Member?
    Mr Boamah 11:35 a.m.
    Thank you.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:35 a.m.
    Please, address the Chair.
    Mr Boamah 11:35 a.m.
    Thank you very much, Mr Speaker.
    So, I would want him to explain to us the rationale behind leaving out a campus like Bunso Cocoa College. If the purpose of the university is for the environment
    Mr Boamah 11:35 a.m.


    and the niceties that he mentioned, then I think he should have started from Bunso where we always have the facilities available. But he is talking about a proposed amendment to take care of something that they have forgotten. That is my worry. Was it an oversight or there was some motive behind it? That is what I would want him to explain to the House.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:35 a.m.
    Very well, Hon Chairman or the Deputy Minister, whoever is in the position to respond, could we hear from you?
    Mr Ablakwa 11:35 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, we believe that the provisions as they stand now are well informed. He talked about conversion of Bunso Cocoa College. There was no indication that they were willing to offer their institution to be converted, and that is also an important criteria. As has been said, as we move on, nothing stops the Council of the University of Environment and Sustainable Development of establishing campuses anywhere they so decide.
    We also have to bear in mind that, in this country, many public universities as I pointed our earlier,have been sited outside the regional capitals. I have talked about the University of Mines and Technology and the University of Education, Winneba. I think that, really, we are on the good path, looking at what the technical committee presented to the Ministry. We have no cause to deviate from the Prof. Benny Committee.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:45 a.m.
    Yes, Hon Deputy Minority Leader?
    Mr Nitiwul 11:45 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I already stated that the policy makers decided to
    site the University at Somanya and the satellite campus at Donkorkrom. That is the policy and it cannot be argued. I already stated that nobody can argue about that. So that one would be put aside. It is gone.
    Mr Speaker, the argument I put forth is that, Koforidua is the regional capital and I thought they should have started from there. But the argument he is putting forward is sound. For the Hon Deputy Minister for Education to say that, because there was no indication that they were offering their campus -- It is a public institution and if Government decides today that they want to convert Bunso Agriculture College into a university, the authorities there have no right to say that they would not offer it.
    They are working and serving on behalf of the people of Ghana, it is not a private institution for them to decide that they have the right to say they are offering it or not. Let the Government take that political decision that they want to convert it into a satellite campus of the new university. That is why I said that we should leave the words Eastern Region in it. Tying the hands of the University Council --
    Mr Speaker, at least, the people of the Eastern Region are hopeful that places like Bunso or Koforidua would have a university.[Interruption.] It is no more at the discretion of the University to decide whether they would add another campus in the Eastern Region or not. That is what I am saying. I say so because, in the amendment they are making, they are taking out the “Eastern Region” completely and putting in”any other part of the country”.
    It invariably still includes the Eastern Region. But I am saying that the “Eastern Region” must stay so that the University Council knows that the Eastern Region would be part. It is not the “if”, they know
    that it would be. There is a difference between knowing that I have something and hoping that I would get something. That is why I am pointing out that they have the facilities at Bunso already. Koforidua is the regional capital. They deserve it so we have to give it to them. That is what I am saying.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:45 a.m.
    Hon Deputy Minority Leader, I would have thought that when we talk about any part of the country, it includes Eastern Region. So, I do not think it would cause any harm -- [Laughter]
    Mr Nitiwul 11:45 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, it would. I think and I am insisting that we should not take out the “Eastern Region”. Let the “Eastern Region” be there and add “any other part of the country.”This is because I feel strongly that Bunso and Koforidua deserve it but the policy makers decided that it must be Somanya and Donkorkrom and I have no argument with that.
    But I still think that Bunso and Koforidua deserve it, so Eastern Region must be included then we can add “any other parts of the country.” But the moment they say “any other part of the country”, they can decide to put it in the Northern Region or any other place. So, Eastern Region does not deserve it any longer? I do not think that is right.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:45 a.m.
    Very well. Hon Deputy Majority Chief Whip?
    Mr Ahmed Ibrahim 11:45 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I wanted to go against what my Hon Deputy Minority Leader was saying, that let the Government have the political will to say that it is converting the Bunso facility into the Eastern regional university. That is not the political will we are talking of. We are talking about technical decision.
    Siting a university should not be just a political will. That is why there is a Technical Committee to take into consideration so many technical facilities. It is not just the infrastructure.
    Mr Speaker, here is a case that the Hon Deputy Minister has stated that by September, 2016, the Koforidua Polytechnic is going to be converted. Are we foreseeing the problem whereby all three universities would be sited in the regional capital? Are we taking into consideration, rural-urban migration? Are we taking into consideration a situation where all the universities would be there and the students would be going to Donkorkrom because the lake or river is there for their practicals?
    Mr Speaker, let us go by the information that the technical committee has brought up. When we set up committees and they bring their findings, we should not go against them just because of political reasons. Let us abide by the technical reasons and make sure that one of the facilities is at Somanya and the other at Donkorkrom. There is still an opportunity. Later, when that flexibility time comes, whether it is Koforidua or the conversion of these, it would still be advised by a technical decision. That is what we should go for.
    Thank you very much, Mr Speaker, for the opportunity.
    Alhaji Amadu B. Sorogho 11:45 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I really want to thank the Government for being bold enough to take the political decision. The political decision has been taken and now we are talking about a technical decision.
    Mr Speaker, the political decision was taken long ago so my Hon Colleague, in trying to say that we must have political will -- the political will was there, leading

    to a political decision and now we are talking about the technical decision.

    Mr Speaker, technical decision does not lie in my pocket or my Hon Colleague's pocket. We have professional men who have the knowledge to be able to decide and they just do not sit down and decide. They take so many factors into consideration. They have brought their Report and we are sitting down here saying that there must be a political will to establish a university in the capital. I do not think it is right.

    Mr Speaker, already, it has been made clear - And I was shocked to hear my Hon Colleague say that, it must be Eastern Region. I am shocked that today, he is not crying that there must be a campus in his constituency, where it is so much needed. I know how my Hon Colleague can fight for his constituents. And for the first time, he is disappointing me by kicking against the law that could enable him take advantage and get a campus sited in his place. I am surprised.

    Mr Speaker, the technical men have given their advice; let us go by it and then at the right time, he himself or myself could also have the authority to say that campuses should be sited at our ends to help our people. We have one Ghana; Eastern Region is not the only region. We have so many other areas.

    Mr Speaker, University for Develop- ment Studies is sited in Tamale. We had a campus in Wa, so if we were to apply the same thing, it means that we are going to restrict siting of campuses only to Tamale in the Northern Region. Is that what he is trying to say? I do not think it is right. Let us move ahead and make progress.

    Thank you, very much.
    Ms Sarah A. Safo 11:45 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, I am very happy that the Hon Member admitted that there has been a political decision that has been taken but whether it is in the interest of nation in general is another question. If the argument being proffered now is that, once a technical team has done its findings and taken into consideration all the technical aspects of the project, we should just endorse what we are arguing now in Parliament, then that is where I have a problem.
    Mr Speaker, the fact that a technical team has been set up does not necessarily mean that, that technical team would do a good job in the interest of the whole nation. So, the reason it has come here is because, this House is a fair representation of the various constituencies and the interests of our people. So, if the argument is being made and Hon Members are asking why not the Eastern Region, we have every reason to probe into that matter.
    But to say that the technical team has come up with a report and what Parliament has to do is just to rubber stamp, that is an indictment on our integrity.
    Mr Speaker, I think they should welcome all suggestions and submissions being made by Hon Members of Parliament on the side of the Minority. This is because we have the interest of our people at heart and so right reasons have to be given; not necessarily just political and technical reasons.
    Mr Speaker, I think for that matter, they should come again on why the project was not sited in Koforidua. [Uproar.]That is what we are talking about.
    Thank you.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:45 a.m.
    Order! Order!
    Yes, Hon Member for Sekondi.
    Papa Owusu-Ankomah 11:45 a.m.
    Mr Speaker, thank you very much. I wish to comment on the amendment proposed by the Committee in clause 24.
    Mr Speaker, I am the first to concede that Ghana is a unitary State and we should always bear this in mind as a House, when dealing with any matter relating to this country.
    Of course, we should also look at the genesis of Bills that come to the House. I remember that often times, some members of this Government have stated that it is important and it is a matter of policy that every region must have a public university.
    I understand that this Bill was to as it were, concretise the vision of Government to have a university established in every region of this country. Of course, a university once established is national. We can have campuses everywhere, but really, having regard to the generality of the Bill, I am wondering why this amendment has been considered necessary.
    This is because I would have thought that even in clause 3, a town or a community would not be stated, that that is where the university would be established. They could have said that the Eastern Region and not Somanya or anything. Then this in my view, would make eminent sense.

    Please, please, I am contributing and conjuncting this proposed amendment with clause 3, the amendment that probably has already been taken. It says the university shall be established in Somanya”, and I am saying that if we are

    talking about setting up a university for every region, then there is no need even to state the particular place in the Eastern Region where the university has to be established.

    So, if we then decide to propose an amendment in clause 24 to give the power to establish campuses anywhere in the country, we may then be defeating the very purpose of setting up a university in the Eastern Region.

    So, I would have thought that if really this amendment could carry weight, then probably at the Second Consideration Stage, we would look at clause 3, so that the university is established in the Eastern Region and not any particular community in the Eastern Region.

    Having said this, I believe that in the context --
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:45 a.m.
    Hon Members, you would have the oppor- tunity to speak, please.
    Papa Owusu-Ankomah 11:45 a.m.
    In the context of clause 3, this amendment would defeat the purpose and the essence of clause 3 of the Bill. I therefore -- even though I am a Member of the Committee, urge this House to reject the proposed amendment in clause 24, so that clause 24 (1) may stand as it is:
    “Subject to this Act, the Council may make arrangements as it considers appropriate for the internal organisation of the University including:
    (a) establishment, variation and supervision of academic divisions, Faculties, Schools Centres, Departments, Institutes, hostels and other bodies in the campus established at Somanya, Donkorkrom and any other place in the Eastern Region…”
    Papa Owusu-Ankomah 11:45 a.m.


    That is consistent with the existing clause 3. This amendment is not consistent with clause 3, except of course, we all bear in mind or consider that when it comes to a Second Consideration, Stage we would amend clause 3 and make it “ established in the Eastern Region” and leave out where it would be established and so forth to the discretion of the implementers of this Bill.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 11:45 a.m.
    Hon Deputy Minister, let us hear from you.
    Mr Ablakwa 12:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I am most grateful. I would just like to point out to Hon Papa Owusu-Ankomah that we have already amended clause 3, so the proposed amendment for clause 24 is consistent with the new rendition of clause 3.
    I would also like to place on record that this House has been consistent. When the University of Health and Allied Sciences Act was passed, we specified the specific towns, Ho and Hohoe. When we passed the University of Energy and Natural Resources Act, we also specified, that is Sunyani, Fiapre and Dormaa Ahenkro.
    So, we have been consistent, and I would like to believe that we can continue on that consistent trajectory.
    I would also like to use this opportunity to point out that, the policy to have a public university in a region is not tied to capitals. The very principle of having a public university in every region -- It is equity that informs that principle.
    So, if we have a situation where some regional capitals have a considerable
    congestion of tertiary institutions -- Private universities and polytechnics which are soon going to become technical universities -- We want to still go and site our new public universities in those same locations, meanwhile the very principle of equity, wanting to spread out so that every Ghanaian living everywhere in every part of a region can have a chance, I think we would be defeating the very principle of equity if we become too sentimental about capitals.
    I did make the point earlier that we sited public universities in this country but we did not site them in capital towns. For example, University of Mines and Technology (UMAT) in Tarkwa and University of Education Winneba (UEW).
    I also believe what we are doing now, the Eastern Region is very privileged. This is because if we look at what we have done in the past, satellite campuses -- For example, when the Kwame Nkrumah University of Science and Technology (KNUST) was established, its satellite campuses were in other regions, its forestry campus was in Brong Ahafo Region, its mining campus was in the Western Region and they have now sited a new campus in the Greater -Accra Region.
    When we take University for Develop- ment Studies (UDS), its satellite campuses are in other regions; Wa in the Upper West Region and Bolgatanga in the Upper East Region. When we take the UEW, all of its satellite campuses are outside the Central Region. We have the Kumasi campus in the Ashanti Region and Mampong campus in the Ashanti Region.
    I believe that what we are doing, we are being fair to the Eastern Region; Somanya and Donkorkrom both are in the Eastern Region. I hope that Hon Sarah Adwoa Safo would take note that Donkorkrom and Somanya are in the Eastern Region and not outside the region.
    With this new amendment, which freezes the hand of the University Council to select satellite campuses in any part of Ghana, including the Eastern Region, I believe it is fair.
    Finally, Mr Speaker, I would also want to draw the attention of the House to the fact that, in modern trends in university establishment, the focus is not only on brick and mortar; it is not only on physical campuses. We now have vir tual campuses where students can be in other jurisdictions and pursue their academic careers. So, we should not be fixated on just geographic locations and physical structures. I think we would be limiting the scope if we focus in that direction.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:05 p.m.
    Hon Members, I will take two more contribu- tions and then I will put the Question.
    Yes, Hon Member for Sekondi?
    Papa Owusu-Ankomah 12:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I do not know. I think the argument of the Hon Deputy Minister is rather confusing -- [Uproar.]
    Mr Speaker, he is talking about virtual campuses, yet, he said that locating public universities in regions is in line with the principle of equity. If there ought to be virtual campuses -- Mr Speaker, as we go forward, we should also bear in mind that as of now, we have problems with even our universities and their focus. This is because, we have universities which are supposed to be engaged in certain aspects of education spreading out.
    So, if we restrict campuses to regions, it compels these new universities to focus on certain areas of academic work and even research.
    Mr Speaker, as for virtual campuses, a person can access the university without having a campus anywhere; that is what
    virtual campus means. A person can access a university without having a campus anywhere at all. That is why I am saying that the argument of the Hon Deputy Minister is rather confusing. For a virtual university, there is no need to have a campus anywhere in Ghana. The campus may be anywhere. There are people in Ghana who are engaged in doctoral programmes with universities in China, Russia and Iceland. They are not on campuses. So, virtual university itself is not part of this mainstream university.
    Thank you.
    rose
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:05 p.m.
    Yes?
    Mr Terlabi 12:05 p.m.
    Thank you very much.
    Mr Speaker, the virtual universities have addresses. The university must have an administrative office and that is what would be sited at Somanya. So, virtual universities -- Yes, the Hon Member just mentioned Russia and China, they have addresses, but a person can access them from Ghana. It means that the university is in China --[An Hon Member: And so?]-- It has an address. So, what is the Hon Member's problem with a university having its head office at Somanya?
    When you read, it say that -- [Interruption] -- no, the administrative office would be in Somanya, and we would have campuses at Donkorkrom and anywhere the council will decide. The university would have its head office at Somanya. It must have an address otherwise, it does not exist.
    rose
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:05 p.m.
    Yes, the last contribution and then I will put the Question.
    Yes, Hon Deputy Minority Leader?
    Mr Nitiwul 12:05 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I am glad that the Hon Deputy Minister said that we must be consistent with what we do in this House. It therefore means that, we must be fair to all regions on the laws we pass concerning the siting of universities.
    Mr Speaker, when this House -- I will not even use this House -- When the University of Ghana was to be sited in Greater Accra, it was sited in Accra; the capital town.When the first university was to be sited -- Most satellite campuses were converted into universities. When a university was supposed to be sited in the Central Region, it was sited in Cape Coast -- I am not talking of Winneba.
    When a university was to be sited in the Ashanti Region; it was sited in Kumasi.
    When a university was to be sited in the Volta Region; it was sited in Ho, with a satellite campus at Hohoe.When a university was supposed to be sited in Northern Region, it was sited in Tamale with satellite campuses at Navrongo and Wa. When a university was supposed to be sited in Brong Ahafo, it was sited in Sunyani, even though Mr Speaker, we had a Polytechnic and the Catholic University there.We have polytechnic in Ho but a university was sited there.

    Mr Speaker, the UMAT was a university college affiliated to KNUST, then it was converted -- [Interruption] -- So, it was a satellite campus that was converted.

    Mr Speaker, it is just like UDS today. If we have decided to convert the satellite campuses of UDS, then obviously, it is sited in Navrongo so, we have to convert it. But when a fresh university is going to be sited in the Upper East, for example, the capital will be Bolgatanga. That is what we are talking about.

    Mr Speaker, we have never sited a fresh public university outside the regional capital. Never, not in this country, not in this House. This is the first time that we are doing it, and I think we should correct that anomaly. If the policy makers decided to make that mistake, we should correct it. That is why I am insisting, Mr Speaker, that this amendment should be thrown out, so that Eastern Region will still be there, with Koforidua hoping -- [Interruption]-- Why all these noise --
    An Hon Member 12:05 p.m.
    We will site it where we want.
    Mr Nitiwul 12:05 p.m.
    The House should throw out the amendment, with Koforidua still hoping that they would not be cheated. It is as simple as that Mr Speaker. [Interru- ption.]
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:05 p.m.
    Order! Order!
    Mr Nitiwul 12:05 p.m.
    We have never --
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:15 p.m.
    Hon Members, I think we are losing focus. We have already dealt with the clause which sited the university at Somanya and Donkorkrom.
    We are now talking about satellite campuses. That is where we are; clause 24, which is only dealing with satellite campuses. Indeed, the original rendition was as follows -- If you look at the amendment proposed, the original rendition says that we should delete “in the Eastern Region and other campuses of the University elsewhere in the country” and insert “as the Council may determine”.
    In my view, the end product is the same. So, Hon Members, I would put the Question.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Clause 24 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:15 p.m.
    Hon Members, clause 25 --
    Mr Nitiwul 12:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I would want to put on notice to the Committee, that we would consider a Second Consideration Stage for clause 3 and clause 24. [Interruption.] I am just telling you, so that next week, we would consider that when we come back.
    Alhaji Muntaka 12:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, my Hon Colleague knows the rules of this House. All he needs to do is to wait, when we announce that the Consideration Stage is ended and we are doing Third Reading, then he arrests the process and try to introduce it.
    Sending notice to us and Mr Speaker would not change anything. So, he should wait. When the time comes, let us see whether he would succeed in doing that.
    Clauses 25 to 30 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
    Clause 31 -- Funds of the University
    Mr Puozaa 12:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, we have a little typographical error there. I beg to move, clause 31, subclause (3), line 3, delete “from” and insert “form”.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:15 p.m.
    Hon Member, what is the correction that you are talking about?
    Mr Puozaa 12:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, clause 31, subclause 3, line 3, is a typographical error.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:15 p.m.
    So, what should it be?
    Mr Puozaa 12:15 p.m.
    So, Mr Speaker, it should be “form, instead of “from”.
    Therefore it should read:
    “For the avoidance of doubt, moneys received by or standing to the credit of a Faculty, School, Centre or an Institute of the University shall form part of the funds of the University, as defined under this Act”.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Clause 31 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
    Clauses 32 to 39 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
    Clause 40 -- Transitional provisions
    Mr Puozaa 12:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, clause 40, subclause (5), line 2, before “University” insert “public” and further delete “two” and insert “three”.
    Mr Speaker, it would therefore, read as follows 12:15 p.m.
    “The University shall be guided in its operations by accredited public Universities in Ghana for a period of not more than two years”.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:15 p.m.
    Hon Member, can you give us the rationale behind it?
    Mr Puozaa 12:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, sorry. It continues, delete “two” and insert “three”. So, instead of a “period of two years”, it should be a “period of three years”.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:15 p.m.
    So, are you seeking leave to amend what has appeared on the Order Paper? It is still there. Very well.
    I asked for the rationale behind the proposed amendment.
    Mr Puozaa 12:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, many of the universities, especially, the private ones have been arguing that when we establish other universities, we do not give them that same period of mentoring so they have been suffering. So, we felt that the two years was a bit short, and so we should add another year to give them a longer period of mentorship.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:15 p.m.
    Very well. Hon Members, I would put the Question.
    Question put and amendment agreed to.
    Clause 40 as amended ordered to stand part of the Bill.
    The Schedule, ordered to stand part of the Bill.
    The Long Title ordered to stand part of the Bill.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:15 p.m.
    Hon Members, this brings us to the end of the Consideration Stage for today. [Pause]
    Yes, Hon Majority Chief Whip?
    Alhaji Muntaka 12:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, we would be grateful to take the Addendum Order Paper that was distributed.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:15 p.m.
    Yes, Hon Members, the Order Paper Addendum --
    At the Commencement of Public Business -- Presentation of Papers, by the Chairman of the Committee.
    Alhaji Muntaka 12:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I would take your permission and that of the House to present the Paper on behalf of the Chairman of the Committee, of which I am a Member.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:15 p.m.
    Yes, Hon Minority Deputy Whip?
    Mr Dan Botwe 12:15 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, this was discussed yesterday, so I have no objection.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:15 p.m.
    Very well.
    PAPERS 12:15 p.m.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:25 p.m.
    Yes,Second item, Motion.
    Alhaji Muntaka 12:25 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I would want to crave your indulgence and that of the House to do this on behalf of the Hon Chairman of the Committee as earlier applied.
    MOTIONS 12:25 p.m.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:25 p.m.
    Any seconder?
    Mr Daniel Botwe (NPP -- Okere) 12:25 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to second the Motion.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:25 p.m.
    Hon Members, I think this is a procedural Motion, I would put the Question.
    Question put and Motion agreed to.
    Mr First Deputy Speaker 12:25 p.m.
    Yes, item number (3) Motion, Hon Chairman of the Committee.
    Report of the Committee of Selection on the Re-composition of Committees
    of the House
    Alhaji Muntaka 12:25 p.m.
    Mr Speaker, I beg to move, that this Honourable House adopts the Report of the Committee of Selection on the re-composition of Committees of the House.
    Introduction
    In line with Standing Order numbers 151 and 152, the Committee on Selection met and considered re-composing the Standing and Select Committees of the House.
    The re-composition became necessary as a result of some Members being appointed by His Excellency, the President as Ministers and Deputy Ministers.The resignation of the Member of Parliament for Talensi as a result of his enskinment as a Paramount Chief is another reason.
    In furtherance of this, the Committee met and discussed the re-composition of the Committees of the House based on the ratio of 55:45 as approved by the House.
    In line with the letter and spirit of Order 193 of the Standing Orders and consistent with the practice of the House, the Majority and Minority Caucuses, after due consultations presented their reviewed lists of the membership for the Standing and Select Committees in accordance with the approved ratio to the Committee of Selection.
    List of Committees
    The list of the Standing Committees and all the Select Committees of the House are as follows:
    Standing Committees
    (1) Standing Orders Committee
    (2) Subsidiary Legislation Committee
    (3) Special Budget Committee
    (4) Public Accounts Committee
    (5) Privileges Committee
    (6) Committee on Judiciary
    (7) House Committee
    (8) Government Assurance Committee
    (9) Committee on Gender and Children
    (10) Judiciary Committee
    (11) Finance Committee
    (12) Appointments Committee
    (13) Business Committee
    (14) Committee on Members Holding Office of Profit
    Special Or Ad-Hoc Committee
    Committee on Poverty Reduction Strategy
    Select Committees
    1. Lands and Forestry
    2. Food, Agriculture, and Cocoa Affairs
    3. Local Government and Rural Development
    4. Works and Housing
    5. Constitutional, Legal and Parliamen- tary Affairs
    6. Health
    7. Communication
    8. Roads and Transport
    9. Defence and Interior
    10. Foreign Affairs
    11. Youth, Sports and Culture
    Alhaji Muntaka 12:25 p.m.


    12. Education

    13. Mines and Energy

    14. Environment, Science and Technology

    15. Employment, Social Welfare and State Enterprises

    16. Trade, Industry and Tourism

    Please find attached herewith, the various Committees and their recomposed membership.

    Conclusion

    The Committee respectfully recommends to the House to adopt this Report and approve the attached list of the various Committees.

    Respectfully submitted.

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    - 12.25P.M.

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    - 12.25P.M.
    APPENDIX - STANDING COMMITTEES 12:25 p.m.
    FINANCE 12:25 p.m.
    GOVERNMENT ASSURANCE 12:25 p.m.
    PUBLIC ACCOUNTS SUBSIDIARY LEGISLATION 12:25 p.m.
    HOUSE COMMITTEE 12:25 p.m.
    MEMBERS HOLDING OFFICES OF PROFIT 12:25 p.m.
    SPACE FOR NAMES - PAGE 12:25 p.m.
    PRIVILEGES PRIVILEGES 12:25 p.m.
    SPACE FOR NAMES - PAGE 12:25 p.m.
    GENDER AND CHILDREN JUDICIARY 12:25 p.m.
    SPACE FOR NAMES - PAGE 12:25 p.m.
    POVERTY REDUCTION STRATEGY SPECIAL BUDGET 12:25 p.m.
    SPACE FOR NAMES - PAGE 12:25 p.m.
    STANDING ORDERS COMMITTEE 12:25 p.m.
    SELECTION COMMITTEE 12:25 p.m.
    SPACE FOR NAMES - PAGE 12:25 p.m.
    SPACE FOR NAMES - PAGES 12:25 p.m.
    BUSINESS COMMITTEE APPOINTMENTS COMMITTEE 12:25 p.m.
    SPACE FOR NAMES - PAGE 12:25 p.m.
    LANDS AND FORESTRY 12:25 p.m.
    APPENDIX - SELECT COMMITTEES 12:25 p.m.
    FOOD, AGRICULTURE AND COCOA AFFAIRS 12:25 p.m.
    LOCAL GOVERNMENT AND RURAL DEVELOPMENT 12:25 p.m.
    APPENDIX - SELECT COMMITTEES 12:25 p.m.
    WORKS AND HOUSING 12:25 p.m.
    SPACE FOR NAMES - PAGE 12:25 p.m.
    CONSTITUTIONAL, LEGAL AND PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS 12:25 p.m.
    APPENDIX - SELECT COMMITTEES 12:25 p.m.
    COMMITTEE ON HEALTH 12:25 p.m.
    SPACE FOR NAMES - PAGE 12:25 p.m.
    COMMUNICATIONS 12:25 p.m.
    APPENDIX - SELECT COMMITTEES 12:25 p.m.
    ROADS AND TRANSPORT 12:25 p.m.
    SPACE FOR NAMES - PAGE 12:25 p.m.
    DEFENCE AND INTERIOR 12:25 p.m.
    APPENDIX - SELECT COMMITTEES 12:25 p.m.
    FOREIGN AFFAIRS 12:25 p.m.
    SPACE FOR NAMES - PAGE 12:25 p.m.
    YOUTH, SPORTS AND CULTURE 12:25 p.m.
    APPENDIX - SELECT COMMITTEES 12:25 p.m.
    EDUCATION 12:25 p.m.
    SPACE FOR NAMES - PAGE 12:25 p.m.
    MINES AND ENERGY 12:25 p.m.
    APPENDIX - SELECT COMMITTEES 12:25 p.m.
    ENVIRONMENT, SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY 12:25 p.m.